Can We Stop Saying Yasuo Is OP And The Such, Here A Breakdown (Super, Super Long Breakdown)

boss10000··7 votes·16,651 views

First yes, i main Yasuo, no i'm not a salty Yasuo main just defending him.

So i'm getting really tired of browsing the boards and constantly seeing Yasuo OP, needs nerfs and counter everyone in the game.

So lets look at some of the things that everyone seems to love to go on about all the time:


The Passive

So the is two parts to his passive the shield and the double crit chance, so lets split them:


Shield

RESOLVE: Yasuo generates 1% of his maximum Flow for every 59 / 52 / 46 units he travels by any means, requiring a total of 5900 / 5200 / 4600 units travelled to obtain maximum Flow. At maximum Flow, the next instance of champion or monster damage against Yasuo consumes all of his Flow and shields him for 100 - 510 (based on level) damage for up to 1 second.

So what does this mean, basically if Yasuo takes any form of damaeg from a 1 damage Trundle pillar to a 1,000 damage Syndra ult it will pop his shield and shield him for X amount of damage.

Now everyone make this to be "Impossible to poke him down or damage him at all" except its probably if you look one of the worst shields in the game for the simple reason: He has 0 control over it.

You can have any ranged champion fire off 1 AA and its gone, take 1 tick of damage from a champion its gone, its probably one of the easiest thing in the game to play around in lanning phase, he walk to get farm you AA him once and its gone.

Recharge Time

This has always annoyed me when people make out like its back up in an instant, so he's the actual math behind his passive:

So he generates 1% flow for every 59 units travelled (early game, pre 6) so lets do math her 59 x 100 = 100% and 5,900 units of map travel.

Summoners Rift from end to end is: 19,000 so 19,000 / 5,900 = 32.20% of the map, so basically its 1/3 of the map

That for people that don't know is from fountain to between mid's two towers, that takes about 20 - 25~ secs (depending on MS), so his passive effectively has a 20 second cooldown for most of the early game. think how many other shields in the game have that sort of cooldown?

If you can't poke him down or attack him within 20 secs your doing something wrong.


Double Crit Chance

INTENT: Yasuo's critical strike chance is doubled, but his critical strikes deal 90% damage, reduced to 75% damage on Steel Tempest.

So this basically means he get double crit chance? well no, the key part to notice is:

But his critical strikes deal 90% damage, reduced to 75% damage on Steel Tempest.

So he suffers reduced damage this means compared to other champions, people also forget it not 190% its 180% due to the doubling of the crit, this also means and a critical strike with Infinity Edge deals 225% damage instead of 250%, so he has lost 20% - 25% of his damage compared to other champions.

Now its even worse with Steel Temepest (Q) Which has 0.75 * 200 so 150% on normal crits and 187.5% on IE crits,

So what does this actual equate to it means that:

Yasuo's Q after 333.33 AD (or 266.67 AD if Yasuo has purchased Infinity Edge) critically striking basic attacks will do more damage than critically striking Steel Tempest due to the 25% damage penalty.

266.67 AD to make his Q nothing more than an AA reset, that literally two AD items, (IE and BT + base stats) and his Q does less damage than an AA, is there any other champion in the game that gets the ability made near useless by building AD and getting items?

Also

No really Yasuo will ever come to lane with any crit chance so technically this part of his passive is completely useless until his first back, so it leaves him open to being bullied early.


(Q) Steel Tempest

ACTIVE: Yasuo thrusts his sword forward, dealing physical damage to all enemies in a line. Steel Tempest can critically strike and will apply on-hit effects to the first enemy hit.

PHYSICAL DAMAGE: 20 / 40 / 60 / 80 / 100 (+ 100% AD)

Hitting an enemy grants Gathering Storm Gathering Storm for 10 seconds. At 2 stacks, Yasuo's next Steel Tempest is empowered and will consume all stacks.

EMPOWERED: Steel Tempest unleashes a whirlwind that travels an extended distance, dealing the same damage and Airborne icon knocking airborne all enemies hit. Yasuo can cast Steel Tempest during Sweeping Blade to change the area of effect a to circle about him, which does not benefit from Empowered's extended range.

The cooldown and cast time of Steel Tempest is reduced by 「 0.6% for every 1% bonus attack speed 」, down to a maximum 66% reduction.

So first take into consideration the crit breakdown form above for his Q and then this part also:

So his Q is basically a longer AA at 475 range and scales off of AS instead of CD (till 1.33 secs), now most people don't have a problem with this first part they have the main issue with his 3rd Q:

His 3rd Q gets 900 range, and knocks up whoever it hits, now for a skill shot this seems rather fair as it doesn't do anymore damaeg than a AA(less even, see above) and can be dodged or side stepped, now i see people complain alot about the fact he can hold onto it for 10 seconds, and how this lets him zone alot, well yeah duh? what do you want him to do have to instantly do 2 Q's and then jump on someone within 3, 4 5 sec? do you know how little Yasuo would ever get to us his ult if that happened, it would literally be never used except in team combo's.

It's also super advertised so you can honestly if you want back off or be ready to dodge it when you see its up.


(W) Windwall

ACTIVE: Yasuo creates a gust of wind that travels forward to form a wall in front of him. The wall slowly drifts forward 50 units over 3.75 seconds, blocking all enemy projectiles with the exception of turret attacks.

Holy heaven if this one isn't controversial, so it blocks all projectiles that hits it for 3.75 secs, everyone makes it out like he puts this down and destroys every skill shot on the map for 5 minuets straight,

When in reality it allows him 1 maybe 2 good blocking chance in a fight, in all honesty when you actually play Yasuo the windwall is not even that important, its a nice thing that useful every now and again, but in all honesty when ever i play against a Yasuo i find it so easy to bait out or play around the windwall.

Lets not also forget it has a 26 sec cooldown so 26 - 4 (3.75) and you have 22 seconds where its down, if you wan't do anything to Yasuo within a 22 second window or use it to zone, bully, poke etc him, your doing something completely wrong.


(E) Sweeping Blade

ACTIVE: Yasuo dashes a fixed distance in the direction of the target enemy, dealing magic damage and marking them briefly. The speed of the dash scales with Yasuo's bonus movement speed. 「 MAGIC DAMAGE: 70 / 90 / 110 / 130 / 150 」 (+ 60% AP) Each cast increases the next dash's base damage by 25% for 5 seconds, up to 50% bonus damage. 「 BONUS DAMAGE: 17.5 / 22.5 / 27.5 / 32.5 / 37.5 」 Yasuo cannot use Sweeping Blade on a marked enemy.

ON-TARGET COOLDOWN: 10 / 9 / 8 / 7 / 6

So basically it lets Yasuo dash to a enemy or neutral unit, and then has a cooldown before you can dash to that unit again, this means that you use it on the same opponent for so long, it also adds a major sticking point for Yasuo, needs units to use it,

Honestly what can i say, half the time you see people run away from a Yasuo through there minion wave the act surprise he caught them, don't run through minions people its rather simple, its about pathing and positioning.


(R) Last Breath

ACTIVE: Yasuo blinks to the nearest visible Airborne icon airborne enemy champion to the cursor, instantly generating maximum Flow. Upon arriving, he Stun icon suspends all nearby Airborne icon airborne enemies for 1 second and deals them physical damage. PHYSICAL DAMAGE: 200 / 300 / 400 (+ 150% bonus AD) For the next 15 seconds, Yasuo ignores 50% of his targets' bonus armour. Casting Last Breath clears all stacks of Gathering Storm Gathering Storm.

So its a damaging ability that requires a knock-up which depending on the team comp can either be incredibly easy to do (Hello Alistair and Malphite) or a pain Yasuo (forever alone), im going to look at it as a Forever alone balance.

So its requires Yasuo to:

A) Land a skillshot on his opponent, in which case you should of dodged it or he aimed it really well.

B) Dash to the enemy and point blank E, Q, in which case why did you let him get close?

With both of theme it comes down to you either got hit by a skill shot so either he did a good job or you let it hit you, or you let a melee based champion get close to you, either via position so pick a champion that punishes that fact.


The Pro Argument

So lets look at Azir: Here is a champion that is so good at the highest level that even when statistics say he should lose, or has a shit as hell win ratio <45% that the players that have got so good at him, he is able to carry and rek games.

Now look at Yasuo, if he truly was this OP god tier champion that if you can become that good at that nothing will beat you, or you can outplay everyone, why do we rarely if ever see him played in pro games, and even then his has a awful KDA and W/L ratio in pro play

http://lol.esportswikis.com/wiki/Yasuo/Match_History

Looking at his last 30 games his W/L is 9/21, that is awful for any champion. now how are these "Best Players" managing to do so badly on a champion that is obviously OP and broken right? maybe its one of those things that players are not taking the time to go and play Yasuo for say 25 games then go back and post on how they think he is.

People all ways judge by that one god tier player that they vs'ed on that champion, if i played against the god of Urgot and got reket and seemed like there was nothing i could do, would i be right in saying Urgot is OP and broken, hell no.


In the end people: can he be annoying to play against, for some Yes.

Does he take incredible skill to play to a even or good standard, even more Yes.

If people honestly think Yasuo is OP and the moment i would love to hear what they think of Sona, Malz, Vladmir, cause they must be insta win, surrender at 1 min into the game.


If anyone want to reply with genuine reasons they think Yasuo is OP or broken i will be glad to offer counter arguments and the such.

57 Comments

Rivuo13 votes

Yasuo has an extremely toxic and annoying kit. The same with riven. Do i think riven is op? No. Do i think shes utterly freaking retarded annoying and obnoxious to fight? Yes

Do i think yasuo is op? no. Do i think yasuo is utterly freaking retarded and annoying? Yes.

Having a windwall that completely negates an ADC from doing their job for like 4-5 seconds is a horrible skill. That should be up there for 2 not 5 And yasuo counters most mid laners because his passive absorbs any skill damage. Oh kassadin Qd me? Nope. Passive absorbed so now he has 2 skills in his rotation and one of them doesnt even do damage.

Oh diana Qd me? She got the reset but nope no damage from her Q. Only her W and R.

Oh i wanna auto yasuo to proc his passive ok here we goo-why am i dead?

boss100003 votes

I have never seen a Yasuo that can can you that fast, in lane a yasuo would have to hit your 6-10 times to kill you with AA and Q, its not like oh he dashed on me and i dies instanly its, he dashed on me AA nd Q me 10 times then i died.

If you can't from Yasuo's passive as a ranged champion (In Lane), your just playing the match-up wrong or really, really badly.

Rivuo4 votes

{quoted}

I have never seen a Yasuo that can can you that fast, in lane a yasuo would have to hit your 6-10 times to kill you with AA and Q, its not like oh he dashed on me and i dies instanly its, he dashed on me AA nd Q me 10 times then i died.

If you can't from Yasuo's passive as a ranged champion (In Lane), your just playing the match-up wrong or really, really badly.

Sorry but not a lot of people are going to agree with you . Goodluck sir

boss100002 votes

People arn't even providing facts, i literally broke down the maths behind his damaeg on AA and Q or his passive and W, what more can i do?

I like well here is millions of piece of evidence showing global warming is a problem.

"nah, i don't thinks that's true, so ill ignore it"

Where the facts, the statistics or the examples to show peoples view points.

General Dance3 votes

He gets 10% less on crits... but 100% crit chance with two items. Who cares if he only does 200% on hit damage.. still op as fuck. So that is what... with two items, 400 damage on hit? plus an auto attack, on hit proc reset?

You serious, definition of broken champ. so in e auto q auto he has done more then enough to shred health... armor pen inbuilt into the ult..

Crett9 votes

Yasuo hasn't been overpowered for a while. That's not to say he doesn't have a DOOZY of an obnoxious kit, though

Calabok6 votes

He's a good example of over tuning and given a toxic kit for the benefit of LCS

boss100004 votes

Yet he is barely if ever played in LCS so how does that logic work?

looking at it, since 2015 so 7 months hes been played 5 times in LCS almost 95% of his play is in Chinese and Korean challenger series game with a few in Wildcard regions.

But if you look at his actual played games in LCK, LPL, LMS, LCS he has: 12~ games played in top tier pro play, that since 2015 so that's how many games he could of been in what 500? 1,000? games, and he been played 12~ times.

http://lol.esportswikis.com/wiki/Yasuo/Match_History

getrektnoobsGG6 votes

Yasuo main spotted

Mal the Red5 votes

What you fail to realize is that Yasuo turns the game on it's head.

Everything you learn about the game is suddenly wrong when you face Yasuo.

And you're using "forever alone" Yasuo as your base. Which I guarantee you will only happen 20% of the time... and I'm being generous with that.

I think it's laughable that you think Sona, Vlad, and Malz are worse. They cannot turn the rules of league on their head like Yasuo can. Hell, Vlad's primary damage is actually BLOCKED by minions.

Rivuo1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mal the Red,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zhcm6zTx,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-07-25T19:21:06.457+0000)

What you fail to realize is that Yasuo turns the game on it's head.

Everything you learn about the game is suddenly wrong when you face Yasuo.

And you're using "forever alone" Yasuo as your base. Which I guarantee you will only happen 20% of the time... and I'm being generous with that.

I think it's laughable that you think Sona, Vlad, and Malz are worse. They cannot turn the rules of league on their head like Yasuo can. Hell, Vlad's primary damage is actually BLOCKED by minions.

His windwall pisses me the hell off

boss100002 votes

So does Lissandra, they whole sit behind minions, or Xerath or Varus etc all make you think differently about bas knowledge hide behind minions.

Sona, Vlad etc are way worse, there a reason there sitting at 55% win ratios (base) and have stupidly high ban ratios, even a Yasuo with 125+ games at best has 53.33%

http://champion.gg/champion/Yasuo/Middle

Try playing Yasuo into a malz, oh look your in range of malz R and your Dead with no chance to do anything.

Hyperiön4 votes

Malz is also his number 1 counter because every ability Malz has doesn't get blocked by his fucking wind wall. Yasuo counters probably 90% of the mid laners, because of his mobility and shield. Take that away and he will be fine.

boss100001 votes

No, he wouldn't he would die, if he counter all these mid laner's why don't we see him picked in pro games all the time?

If he is this big counter-play champion, why don't teams wait till last pick and pick him as a counter?

Hyperiön4 votes

Do you even watch the LCS? Look at the current mid lane Meta, Cass, Viktor, Malz, Vlad... All of them are counters to Yas. And look at last season, Yasuo was picked, just got shot stomped every time he would go to split push. Same with Zed.

Asayake 5150glow4 votes

You were inaccurate about his building up his shield.

59000 units(charge distance required) / 345 units (Yas's base movespeed) = 17.1 seconds, not the 20~25 you said.

Once he gets to 410 or so, it's 14 seconds.

Also: One of your points on his ult is that you shouldn't let him get close.

So... if he can't get close, how the fk is he playable?

And are you just gonna let him zone you immensely every time he has his third stack? (You failed to mention that... but I guess it's a given). Especially if you're in lane and he has minions to dash to?

boss100001 votes

I did use ~ for a reason but still 17 seconds early game, and i was talking fully early game as in pre-6 as i stat, and late game fair enough its up much more, it should be.

17.1 secs is still a super long time, think about how many full rotations you could get off for most champions in that time 2 maybe 3 for some?

balbraaksel3 votes

That walking takes 20 seconds to recharge the passive doesn't mean that it takes 20 seconds for him to recharge the passive because he has his dash. A 10% crit damage reduction doesn't mean a 20-25% damage reduction with Infinity Edge, that's poor math, it still remains on 10% less crit damage.

Yasuo is fairly easy to dominate with, all you need to do is Q incoming wave, Q again, dash through wave and Q enemy laner. That isn't hard at all. A good Yasuo hardly ever misses then and if the enemy laner retaliates he has his shield and windwall. He also can abuse the windwall to force you to miss on CS, one CS/wave is 40 CS in 20 minutes which translates to about 800 to 1100 gold.

boss100001 votes

No the math is correct its what his wiki says and all the stats say, its not 10% reduction its 90% effectiveness so with 200 x 0.90 = 180 and 250 x 0.90 = 225, thats how it works, you can look it up.

And you Q wave dash through it etc, then your opponent should punish you for that, you make it seem like well lets just let him farm, the same can be said for so any champions, do you realise how easy it is for other champions to farm compared to Yasuo?

balbraaksel1 votes

I know that, but the end result is still 10% crit damage reduction. A crit with 100 AD for 225% crit damage is 225 damage, a crit with 100% and 250% crit damage is 250 damage. 225 damage is 10% less damage than 250 damage.

ZapMyHeart1 votes

{quoted}

You left out important math for Yasuo.

His W at max rank has a cooldown of 18s, which means you only get a 14s window to punk him. However, any decent Yasuo player is not going to burn their wall prematurely anyways, so it might as well be up permanently.

Keep in mind, other shield-types similar to his has various drawbacks, whereas his is way less.

Nocturne & Siver has a 1.5s duration and eats 1 ability. Morgana is 5s, but only blocks magical damage (and CC) and can be shattered and is single target.

Yasuo's W blocks pretty much every skillshot over a particular area for the next ~4s with not much counterplay.

boss100001 votes

I was talking about in lane so for lane its 26/22.

and if after him using it to block 1 skillshot why would you keep firing into it?

Either:

A) run through it and there its no problem B) Kit back for it to go C) Ignore it and change target or wait

There nothing stopping you playing around the timing on it, its not like a big stop nothing goes past her for 4 seconds.

ZapMyHeart2 votes

{quoted}

I was talking about in lane so for lane its 26/22.

and if after him using it to block 1 skillshot why would you keep firing into it?

Either:

A) run through it and there its no problem B) Kit back for it to go C) Ignore it and change target or wait

There nothing stopping you playing around the timing on it, its not like a big stop nothing goes past her for 4 seconds.

Actually, no, you weren't talking about lane. Plus, balancing just doesn't take into account just the laning phase.

You didn't even read the last part. There's no counterplay to it.

A) Running through it isn't going to solve the issue of your skillshot being blocked or for the next 4s, especially when Yasuo can dance around it.

B) Kiting isn't a solution. Yasuo simply just runs away.

C) You cannot ignore it or just change targets, especially when Yasuo can wreck your face while you do so.

Again, there is no counterplay to it.

Reducing it to 1.5s or making it shatter gives counterplay and makes Yasuo actually think about using it (like Nocturne, Sivir, and Morgana would have to do).

balbraaksel3 votes

And that last thing you said, I completely disagree on that. His combo leaves for immobile champions very little to no counterplay unless you play Malzahar or something. I've spectated high ranked matches and seen the same stuff happen, was just one match I spectated though that was with Yasuo doing this but still, enlighten me then how to counterplay that, preferably with a video because to me you seem very baised especially with this thread where you put down everything of Yasuo's kit like he's some pathetic and underpowered champion which he's not.

boss100002 votes

Well some champions he is going to beat, thats just fact, but the same can be said for most matchups, if i pick Yasuo into an Annie i am making a bad draft and poor pick decision, its the same as picking a Varus into a Yasuo that just bad drafting and poor decision.

You wouldn't complain at a Darius being picked as a counter, why do it for Yasuo.

And what sort of immobile champions are you talking about, so i have an idea of the matchup,

balbraaksel1 votes

Ziggs, Syndra and LeBlanc, if you'd be so kind.

boss100003 votes

Ziggs

Should never be in range for Yasuo to get to him, and should be zoning him with Ziggs E so if her does dash he has to go through the minefield, making him take damaeg and get slowed, allowing you to land Q's.

If he uses WW, back off and wait for it to go down then use E and Q to weaken him down.

Use AA to bring down his passive, and if he ever gets close us W to knock him and you away form each other so you can stay safe.

Literally play the lane safe and you can just farm up for the entire lane phase with no issues at all, except maybe the odd WW to block your farming, this lane is pretty easy to Zigg's to just play safe and farm in.

Syndra

Use your Q to bully him down as its spawn it can't be blocked only dodged, use E when necessary to knock him away if hes to close as he won't have time to WW in time if hes to close.

Farm safe till 6 and bait out the windwall then get a slow with Q or W, then use R and you will probably kill him.

This is proablly the worst of the 3 but it is doable if you just play smart.

Lebalnc

You must be joking with this one right? if not.

Level 2, use AA pop passive, use Q W to deal masisve damage because he has no scaling MR, he now has got 1/2 HP or 2/3 HP or so, do it again before he hits 3 and use it to take him low.

Once hes 3 use AA to pop passive when possible and try using Q if he WW the Q then back off and use next Q then W, If he doesn't use WW just straight use W into him, dealing tons of damage.

You will almost always win lane as Leblanc into a Yasuo.

Enigma3642 votes

This method for fighting yasuo as LB doesn't work unless the yasuo has no idea what they are doing.

  1. Yasuo does far more damage then lb at level 2 or 3 unless lb can catch him with the chains (meaning he misses his WW timing) and get out with minimal trading. At level 2 if LB uses q+w combo she immediately has to jump back because an auto + q from yasuo almost does as much damage as the lb combo. Either way it doesn't matter though because to get close enough to land your w on yasuo that means that you are close enough for yasuo to dash to a nearby minion, land a AA + Q +AA (at this point yasuo has won the trade) but odds are he will also get in a follow up AA + E +AA + Q then dash back through the minions behind him. If this happens then as the Yasuo player you have done at least half of the lb's health, usually closer to 2/3. In other words, the only time that lb is really safe to go in for this combo level two is if the jungler is nearby or yasuo thinks the jungler is nearby and is afraid to go in for the trade.

Yasuo at level 2 is one of the best duelists in the game. The only good response to him at level 2 is to have hard cc, which can be used as soon as yasuo goes aggressive to try to keep him from laying down the damage

The only point in the game where yasuo is "weak" is after the first back. This is because the normal first item for Yasuo is a zeal, which isn't that powerful against the mages that he regularly sees in the mid lane because they try to keep out of his range and poke him and his crit chance isn't high enough yet for the crits to be consistent if he goes all in. On the other hand the mages will usually have either an item that allows them to trade better against yasuo because initial combat stats scale better then low amounts of crit chance.

Once Yasuo saves up enough to back the second time though usually getting either shiv or pd he now has the capability to all in most mages and win. Not to mention that his wave clear at this point is already going to be faster then almost any mage unless the mage uses their full combo on the minion wave. Giving yasuo big windows to roam or punish the enemy laner for trying to get cs. At this point you are also between level 6 and 8 so mages have to be even more wary of your tornado, because getting hit by it and the followup ult usually means that the mage takes enough damage that they have to farm from behind their turret (if they have exhaust because yasuo's kit allows for decent early tower dives) or they have to back so as not to die next time that yasuo decides to go all in.

In regards to yasuo's kit that you have tried to portray as underpowered let's talk numbers.

P: although I don't complain about either of yasuo's 2 passives by themselves it's the combination that I don't like. This isn't because they work together to well or anything like that. It's because of the Super high Gold value of the stats that Yasuo gets. Each of Yasuo's passive abilities about equal to the average amount of Gold value stats that other champions get from their passives. I would rather that they increase yasuo's base health slightly and get rid of the shield because even if you pop his shield each time it comes up with an AA (roughly 65 dmg for a mage AA) that means that over the first 6 or 7 minutes of the game the shield will have blocked somewhere around 2 AA's per minute because you aren't going to pop it instantly when it comes up that makes 12-14 AA's which is equally to roughly 780-910 damage blocked pre resistances. Most people have enough armor to reduce damage by 20% to start the game so that lowers it to 624-728. This is a huge amount of damage reduced over that time and every time the enemy tries to pop the shield with an auto that means that they are likely in range of a yasuo retaliation. Think about it. Yasuo's shield alone saves him from enough AA poke before first back that he would have been at half health with his health regen and instead can be at full health. Considering that he is a hyper late game carry he does not need this, because the early game should be difficult for someone that scales as crazy as yasuo does.

Then there is the double crit, which isn't good early game (unless you go for the surprise cheese crit chance in Runes to try for some lucky crit trades, but this is a waste because pretty much all yasuo builds will hit 100% crit from items). Late game though yasuo is getting an additional 50% crit from this passive which is roughly 2000 gold. What champions do you know that have a passive that is worth more then 2000 gold in the late game. I haven't looked it up, but I'm certain it is a very short list.

Q: Pretty much an empowered AA reset. This ability isn't really problematic in my view but it is still a very good ability compared to other champions when you consider that it is a super low cooldown at all stages of the game compared to most AA resets that other champions have. The crit damage lost vs the 100 bonus damage on a level 5 q means that you have to have more then 400 AD to do less damage with a q then with an auto. Oh and don't forget that this ability has a range of 475 and is a AOE abilitiy. So, in my opinion, not even considering the tornado, this is the best AA reset ability in the game.

W: You mentioned most of the reasons why this ability is considered cancerous by most LOL players already but lets compare it to to the most similar ability in the game that are similar. Braum wall, roughly the same amount of duration except braum shield is smaller and only blocks from one direction whereas WW blocks everything that would pass through it from any angle. Braum sheild cooldown is 8 seconds shorter but can be repositioned by braum himself. The repositioning is really negligable in this though since yasuo can reposition around the wall and do virtually the same thing. Oh lets also not forget that windwall blocks all damage and cc coming in whereas a percentage of the damage and all cc actually get applied to braum. So to sumup it is a better version of braum's wall if you use it correctly on a roughly 30% longer cooldown. yet again, the best ability of its type in the game.

E: Infinite dashes with the cooldown being how often you can redash to a unit. This ability makes yasuo's laning phase pretty strong. Not only does it do a decent amount of damage if stacked but it makes it so that skill shots are virtually useless against a good yasuo. When we compare it to the next most similar ability you either have to compare it to a renekton slice and dice or a Kassadin ult. This ability is much more spamable then the slice and dice but does not make for a good escape ability. But this ability is also good for last hitting with. Because of this again I'd say that it is better the Slice and Dice. It obviously is not as good as Kassadin's ult, but Kassidin's is an ult, and it is gated by how much mana it costs to continue using Kassadin's dash. Yasuo's dash has no really meaningful gating mechanism that is easily understandable or visable by the opponent. While I'd still say that Kassadin's ult is better Yasuo's e isn't that far off and it isn't an ultimate.

R: High Damage, 50% bonus armor penetration, Engage from a huge range for a melee champion. Super low cooldown. This ability has nothing similar to it, which is really nice and cool. The problem that I have with this though is that it gives the armor penetration. Considering that yasuo already has the guarenteed crits from his passive it should not be free for him to do high damage to tanks. If he wants to invest into killing tanks he should have to by buying a last whisper. The hidden gold value of the 50% bonus armor penetration is worth roughly 20 gold per bonus armor the opponent has. Against the regular tank that has 200-250 bonus armor that is a huge number. Yet again hidden huge gold values in Yasuo's kit that make it so that he isn't that item reliant to do damage. This plus the double crit is why we have started to see Yasuo's with 2 tank items, because all yasuo needs to be able to kill pretty much every champion in 5 seconds or less is a shiv/pd, ie, and a bloodthirster.

Why do people think that Yasuo is too strong... Because he has huge amounts of value hidden in his kit in terms of gold value that no other champion has, on top of this, every single one of his abilities is very strong compared to similar abilities in the game.

In your original post you referenced Yasuo's low pick rate in the LCS as proof that Yasuo is not overly strong. What you don't seem to understand is the reason that Yasuo's pick rate is low is the same reason that Katarina's pick rate is low in the LCS. The two ways to stop Yasuo are: 1) have your jungler or support camp mid lane so that you can deny farm or kill Yasuo. 2) have guarenteed CC so that you can cc chain him and never let him do damage.

The first of these ways to deal with yasuo is pretty normal in the LCS now. Due to the lane swap meta if they were to pick yasuo it would not be unreasonable to expect to see 2 or 3 visits to the mid lane by either the jungler or the support or both in the first 5 minutes. This is the best counter to Yasuo, because the hidden gold efficiency in Yasuo's kit doesn't truly get unlocked until he has at least 2 full items.

  1. LCS teams always have a high amount of CC and are incredibly good at chaining those CC together.

So for the final sumup, Yasuo's kit is extremely strong and pretty overloaded with a bunch of crap that doesn't belong (extra critical chance and armor penetration are both things that any AD champion in the entire game would love to have for free). In addition in SoloQ both of the best ways to counter Yasuo are almost non-existant. It is difficult to get a jungler to camp your lane to keep him down on levels and cs and the support is stuck in bot lane pretty exclusively for the entire laning phase. CC chaining is also a non-factor in soloQ because rarely do you find a cohesive enough group to chain the CC properly in a random assortment of individuals.

Calabok2 votes

Yasuo IS OP. Don't deny it

boss100002 votes

How exactly, its like my example if i say urgot is OP cause i got beaten by the best Urgot in the world does that make it true, no.

Wheres you proof, evidence, maths, statistics.

Rivuo3 votes

{quoted}

How exactly, its like my example if i say urgot is OP cause i got beaten by the best Urgot in the world does that make it true, no.

Wheres you proof, evidence, maths, statistics.

Yes you broke down math but you also left some math out kid.

Like you saying it takes 20 seconds for his passive to recharge.. Uhhh no you know his dash also makes it recharge faster? Ive seen passives come up in less than half the time you said.

If you're going to try to lie and convince people about something atleast include the rest of the information YOU chose to leave out.

I stopped reading after i saw that.

Goodluck to you

boss100002 votes

His dash gives him flow for the distanced travelled, but it doesn't make it make it go faster, that was removed in patch 4.13.

Walking 500 units gives the same amount of flow as dashing 500 units does, just dashing is faster that walking to cover said distance.

And i even say i was talking pre-6 so of course it gets better late game.

He has to travel 1,300 units less at late game and at that point he has far more MS (about 70-80 more) so he covers that distance faster, but early game is about 20sec~ giver or take a tiny bit.

L Psy Kongroo2 votes

{quoted}

If anyone want to reply with genuine reasons they think Yasuo is OP or broken i will be glad to offer counter arguments and the such.

He is resourceless. He does not use mana, energy, rage/fury, or health, nor do his abilities have any kind of cost associated with them. This makes him objectively superior to champions with a resource.

During laning phase, he is immune to being hit by skillshots. Every minion wave has 6 minions, meaning Yasuo gets 6 free dashes every time a new minion wave arrives (7 if you count dashing to his lane opponent). If this obscene amount of mobility wasn't enough, his W ensures that he is immune to skillshots for several seconds. And don't give me that "just walk around it" crap, because Yasuo will be doing the same thing. And for some stupid reason, his W blocks projectiles that hit it from the sides and back, not just the front.

His abilities have almost no cooldown. Want to know why Yasuo is the worst champion to play in URF? Because playing normal Yasuo is basically like playing URF. Riot has nerfed several ultimate abilities already because their cooldowns were finished by the time an enemy got back to lane after being killed. Yasuo is exactly the same, except Riot conveniently "forgot" about him. His ult is up ALL THE FUCKING TIME. His Q is up ALL THE FUCKING TIME. And his E might as well not have a cooldown at all (0.1 seconds rofl).

On top of being ridiculously broken, he is not at all fun to play against. His abilities offer very little in terms of counterplay, and his build path is one of those toxic af hybird paths that lead to him dealing a shit ton of damage and being extremely tanky at the same time (Shiv > Frozen Mallet > Phantom Dancer > Deadmans > Triforce).

boss100002 votes

But:

Minions, if you playing someone with skillshots then you have either a been counter picked or went into a bad match-up by choice.

Literally pick someone with point and click, you just won lane congrats.

W last for 4 seconds so can you honestly not back off or wait, or ignore it for 4 seconds before re engaging, cause if he is attacking you then he has to be past his windwall cause you should move away from it, so either:

A) He goes past his windwall to go after you B) Sits behind it and then its gone

H has to pick one of those unless you let him kite you around it, its up to you to say, okay WW is out kite back and make him come to me and lose its protection, or wait for it to go.

As i posted above his Q literally become nothing but an AA reset that does less damaeg than an AA, so he actually sacrificing damage when he uses it over just using an AA, so how you you really complain about its CD, when it will be slower than an AA past X AS

And his E go point and click against him, how look Annie, Malz, Pantheon, Lissandra, etc all click and hes fked.

If you picking stuff like skill shot poke, he is going to avoid it, he is the counter pick, its like picking a full AD team into a Rammus, its just a bad idea and poor drafting.

L Psy Kongroo2 votes

{quoted}

But:

Minions, if you playing someone with skillshots then you have either a been counter picked or went into a bad match-up by choice.

Literally pick someone with point and click, you just won lane congrats.

W last for 4 seconds so can you honestly not back off or wait, or ignore it for 4 seconds before re engaging, cause if he is attacking you then he has to be past his windwall cause you should move away from it, so either:

A) He goes past his windwall to go after you B) Sits behind it and then its gone

H has to pick one of those unless you let him kite you around it, its up to you to say, okay WW is out kite back and make him come to me and lose its protection, or wait for it to go.

As i posted above his Q literally become nothing but an AA reset that does less damaeg than an AA, so he actually sacrificing damage when he uses it over just using an AA, so how you you really complain about its CD, when it will be slower than an AA past X AS

And his E go point and click against him, how look Annie, Malz, Pantheon, Lissandra, etc all click and hes fked.

If you picking stuff like skill shot poke, he is going to avoid it, he is the counter pick, its like picking a full AD team into a Rammus, its just a bad idea and poor drafting.

The mere existence of counters does not, in and of itself, justify a champion having a broken kit. Yes, there are champions who can do well into Yasuo. But does that make the game any more fair for the 70% of champions who can't? The excuse "just play something else" does not equal good design. Yasuo is poorly designed because he literally forces you to do something you'd rather not do before the game even begins. Then once the game DOES start, Yasuo's kit is STILL incredibly overloaded, and just because his lane opponent might have an easier time of things, what about the rest of their team?

angryhare123452 votes

Look we should all agree that both yasuo and riven are overly op and are very annoying to fight*[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]*

TheUltimateSpear1 votes

If his dashes had a limit, like a TINY internal cooldown so he has to stop for a sec, or something, just some small nerf on his dashes... I'd be okay.

But he doesn't, and frankly that's not the only part of his kit that has hilariously overloaded. He's not open, doesn't mean he's not toxic.

boss100002 votes

It does though its how many units are there, he could never dash forever, and honestly a champion such as Akali with he R would be far better at chasing or jumping onto people compared to Yasuo's e.

Rivuo2 votes

{quoted}

It does though its how many units are there, he could never dash forever, and honestly a champion such as Akali with he R would be far better at chasing or jumping onto people compared to Yasuo's e.

Ok bro you're right. Even tho there are daily posts about yasuo having a toxic kit you're right we're wrong. Yasuos not op. Definitly not. Despite the multiple threads about him everyday.

You think what you want. A majority of the people on the boards will argue yasuo is utterly fucking annoying. A lot of those people are also higher rank than you so dont even try to pull the rank card on anyone.

Hell, There was even a post on reddit by a master yasuo main saying what they could change to make him less of a nuisance.

But you're right. A yasuo main saying yasuo isnt broken.

Sick bro.

boss100001 votes

When i see Jensen, Darshan, Huni, etc, and top tier pro call him broken then yes i will agree, or he see consistent high level play.

Rivuo2 votes

{quoted}

When i see Jensen, Darshan, Huni, etc, and top tier pro call him broken then yes i will agree, or he see consistent high level play.

And none of those players said he WASENT broken either.

You know shit goes both ways right? Aatrox urgot and yorick have close to no competitve plays. So dont try to shove the ''yasuo not picked in LCS! that means hes weak!''

Yeah dude that goes fore very champ

Xillerate1 votes

bro just stop talking you're making yourself look bad the moment you said "im a yasuo main"

Nepgya1 votes

he counters about half of all champions and abilitys with his shield and double crit is fineeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee....

Lopunny7771 votes

Sorry shithead you are wrong and he is broken....stop trying to defend your main

im Scuttle Crab1 votes

For the "why isn't he in pro play" his skill ceiling doesn't reach that level.

Lopunny7771 votes

Told you broken. Banned in competitive play and like fucking said he was discovered to be overpowered. To all who said he was not broken or I was wrong can go fuck themselves and get good

LëBlänc1 votes

Lol he went in depth about the stats and how it decreases dmg by a little bit, but on the other hand no one in their right mind has seen a "non fed yasuo". Also theres a reason why he is usually a perma ban... He may not be broken but for his class and what he is, I think he is...

EBlader1 votes

There is nothing people can do about our comments about this unskilled requiring champ except to nerf him. He looks cool and I wanted to main him, but know he is unbalanced I stopped playing as him. I use champions that require skill to master like Jayce, Lucian, Nocturne and Viktor. Yasuo is op and doesn't require skill when you're fed. Also, does Yasuo have to open his mouth every time he moves?

gendro41 votes

can u explain to me how jayce and nocturne take skill

SugeMinPikk1 votes

Dude. There's no breaking the anti-Yasuo circlejerk. People were told repeatedly that Yasuo was cancer when he really was, then they never stopped saying that. Now, everyone has heard it so much that they start to believe it themselves. There's no possible way to get past that. Just ignore the silver circlejerk. Riot won't nerf something that doesn't need nerfs. This is why the only Yasuo nerfs in years have been tiny tweaks or indirect.

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