like which champ exactly broke this for us? back when nidalee could lane. this was a VERY good item on her because she could stack it with kitty form abilities. but now half her kit cant stack it.
this isn't really fair considering the item is pretty much a must buy for every mid laner now
i would like to consider building this on 
again as it was a core item on her back in the day, but it is kinds dumb to when i can only stack it with 3 abilities.
Mysticman892 votesIs this a recent change I'm missing, or are we lamenting over something old?
I want to say it was transforming champs (nid and jayce) who could stack for free or twice as fast as more conventional users that they targeted a tear change at once upon a time, but I feel like that was many seasons ago.
So if memory serves, it was precisely because they don't want you to do what you want to do there.
SwiftKitten881 votesIs this a recent change I'm missing, or are we lamenting over something old?
I want to say it was transforming champs (nid and jayce) who could stack for free or twice as fast as more conventional users that they targeted a tear change at once upon a time, but I feel like that was many seasons ago.
So if memory serves, it was precisely because they don't want you to do what you want to do there.
so u mean the people the item was originally built on.
also IIRC 
abilities costs mana in both forums.
Mysticman893 votesThe transform itself doesn't cost mana though.
The idea isn't that those champs shouldn't build it, it's that they should have to deal with the mana costs of stacking it like anyone else who might want it. All the other tear users get by with 3/4 mana abilities to stack, so they could too in principle.
Digging into it, it was something explicitly fixed as a bug in 8.1.
Champions with manaless abilities (such as Elise or Nidalee in Cougar form) can no longer stack Tear of the Goddess with their manaless abilities Energy or resourceless champion—such as Riven or Yasuo—can no longer stack Tear of the Goddess. Their allies can still stack tears, however.
Sagee Prime2 votesThey already nerfed Nidalee, Jayce, and Elise by making it so Their R transform didn't proc Tear. I have no idea why they decided to hit their manaless abilities too since they don't have a relatively quick way to stack it otherwise. This was literally a direct nerf to Nidalee and just Nidalee for no real reason. You could stack tear just as fast as some of the other tear users when you could use cougar and maybe a little faster than the average user but without cougar it's a abysmally slower.
You won't see elise build tear and this doesn't effect Jayce at all.
SwiftKitten881 votes[{quoted}](name=Sagee Prime,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xV5L80ji,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-04-09T04:35:06.846+0000)
They already nerfed Nidalee, Jayce, and Elise by making it so Their R transform didn't proc Tear. I have no idea why they decided to hit their manaless abilities too since they don't have a relatively quick way to stack it otherwise. This was literally a direct nerf to Nidalee and just Nidalee for no real reason. You could stack tear just as fast as some of the other tear users when you could use cougar and maybe a little faster than the average user but without cougar it's a abysmally slower.
You won't see elise build tear and this doesn't effect Jayce at all.
this.. hammer forms costs mana still,
this was a complete needless gut of 
on nidalee.
i mean it would be stupid easy to fix... just make nid's kitty abilities cost .01 mana.
you're done
i mean granted that would be a shitty cheap-ass spaghetti-code way to do it. rather than properly coding them to work with the item. but hey.. w/e works... and its not like riot has ever been exactly opposed to spaghetti-code
Sagee Prime1 votesthis..
you're done
i mean granted that would be a shitty cheap-ass spaghetti-code way to do it. rather than properly coding them to work with the item. but hey.. w/e works... and its not like riot has ever been exactly opposed to spaghetti-code
Nidalee's cougar form is gated by her ability to utilize her human form properly including the mana cost gating. in essence you get cost free cougar abilities but if you want empowered abilities it costs mana and the empowered abilities are immensely better than the regular ones. There was nothing wrong with her stacking tear with cougar
SwiftKitten881 votes[{quoted}](name=Sagee Prime,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xV5L80ji,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2018-04-10T22:47:59.257+0000)
Nidalee's cougar form is gated by her ability to utilize her human form properly including the mana cost gating. in essence you get cost free cougar abilities but if you want empowered abilities it costs mana and the empowered abilities are immensely better than the regular ones. There was nothing wrong with her stacking tear with cougar
ignoring the point what we agree with each other and yet you still seem to be trying to argue with me.
the way you say you need to pay for human skills to empower your kitty forms skills, is i guess true if you stretch the wording enough.
i mean technically yes, the abilities wont become empowered unless hunted if proced. and you can only proc them by spending mana on human skills
but that is still a really bad way to look at it. becuase you spend the mana on the skills REGARDLESS or not hunted is ever proced.
and when u say "spending mana to empower it" makes it sound like you could like just pay more mana w/e you want the ability to be empowered like you cold with the old 
.
procing hunted is based entirely around landing the spear, yes u need mana to throw the spear, but you can spend infinite mana and it wont do shit if you cant ever hit anyone with said spear.
and although traps do technically proc hunted. its pretty much worthless for anything except acting like a mini ward
becuase the changes you actaully being in range pounce in on someone who stepped on a trap is next to zero.. and the chances of you WANT to pounce in on someone who stepped on a trap IS zero
i think since nidalee's rework 4 years ago i had got to pounce in for the kill TWICE because they stepped on a trap.
and i have MANY more people with the traps THEMSELVES traps back when they did % max hp.
and i have also killed one person since the gutting of traps but they were also taking other forms, it was just the trap DOT tick that did the killing blow.. my teammate would have killed them regardless
Sagee Prime1 votesignoring the point what we agree with each other and yet you still seem to be trying to argue with me.
the way you say you need to pay for human skills to empower your kitty forms skills, is i guess true if you stretch the wording enough.
i mean technically yes, the abilities wont become empowered unless hunted if proced. and you can only proc them by spending mana on human skills
but that is still a really bad way to look at it. becuase you spend the mana on the skills REGARDLESS or not hunted is ever proced.
and when u say "spending mana to empower it" makes it sound like you could like just pay more mana w/e you want the ability to be empowered like you cold with the old
procing hunted is based entirely around landing the spear, yes u need mana to throw the spear, but you can spend infinite mana and it wont do shit if you cant ever hit anyone with said spear.
and although traps do technically proc hunted. its pretty much worthless for anything except acting like a mini ward
becuase the changes you actaully being in range pounce in on someone who stepped on a trap is next to zero.. and the chances of you WANT to pounce in on someone who stepped on a trap IS zero
i think since nidalee's rework 4 years ago i had got to pounce in for the kill TWICE because they stepped on a trap.
and i have MANY more people with the traps THEMSELVES traps back when they did % max hp.
and i have also killed one person since the gutting of traps but they were also taking other forms, it was just the trap DOT tick that did the killing blow.. my teammate would have killed them regardless
I'm simply saying that unlike Jayce, who's abilities can be used in any number of orders and don't really have big requirements to be effective, Nidalee's kit is very binary and you really only have one effective way to utilize it to it's fullest which is proc hunt and cougar engage and then disengage or repeat the pattern again. The pattern is mana gated by an unreliable empower mechanic that you most likely take several attempts at so there's no reason to gate her cougar abilities for mana further and there was no reason to nerf her ability to utilize tear.
In short all of Jayce's abilities are reliable and can be used in any order so they all cost mana to gate that effectiveness.
Nidalee's Human form is gated by mana while her cougar is free but if you want to use cougar properly it actually is gated by human mana costs since you need hunt procs to get threatening damage and engage.
Lets just agree that tear change was a bs nerf to one champion that we enjoyed
Ixoziel1 votesI seriously have no idea why they changed it. It's one of those changes that just makes you go, "Why?"
MagicFlyingLlama1 votesI would imagine it is to make it stack with stuff like 
R?
SwiftKitten881 votesI would imagine it is to make it stack with stuff like
then they could have done "spell cast or mana expendature"
C9 Squeeky 1 votesEh well it IS a mana item and refunds mana.
The Bearded Bard1 votesIt was a double hitter change, nerfing popular transform characters like Nid and Jayce at the time while also buffing continuous mana users like Singed.