Idea for the new AD Caster item

Pierce The Veal·Dec 2, 2015·1 votes·641 views

Riot has mentioned that they would release a new AD caster, so here is what I think would be a good AD caster item:

75 AD 10% or 20% cdr Unique passive: animations on auto attacks and abilities are sped up; has no interaction with attack speed. Unique passive: Physical damage is increased by 10% and 30% of all physical damage is converted to true damage (does not deal bonus true damage, just makes a portion of your damage true instead of physical). Critical strikes do not apply this passive. Unique passive is the same as infinity edge's unique passive and does not stack with its passive.

Caulfields Warhammer + BF sword + some amount of gold.

In case the % damage passive is too strong, it could be made so that you have to kill 100 minions or 10 champions to achive the same effect.

15 Comments

Critmaster GarenDec 2, 20151 votes

not gonna happen with that passive.

besides. what would stop marksmen from picking this item to turn 30% of their auto attack damage into true damage?

if there are to be more ad caster items in this game, they should be designed like cleaver and work with on spell effects.

not to mention, a lot of ad casters are assassins and focus on killing squishy targets. true damage is usually more effective against tanks and bruisers who are actually stacking resistances.

flat armor penetration on all of their damage would be much more useful to them.

Pierce The VealDec 2, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Critmaster Garen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=xEKG4NBF,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-12-02T06:16:47.636+0000)

not gonna happen with that passive.

besides. what would stop marksmen from picking this item to turn 30% of their auto attack damage into true damage?

if there are to be more ad caster items in this game, they should be designed like cleaver and work with on spell effects.

not to mention, a lot of ad casters are assassins and focus on killing squishy targets. true damage is usually more effective against tanks and bruisers who are actually stacking resistances.

flat armor penetration on all of their damage would be much more useful to them.

And I quote:

"Critical strikes do not apply this passive. Unique passive is the same as infinity edge's unique passive and does not stack with its passive."

Flat armor penetration doesn't cut it when the enemy adc can build a GA and be done with itemzing against you, or even a zhonya's on ap carries. This way, there is no need to implement total armor penetration while giving a similar effect that only really helps people who stack AD and don't like to crit that much. Flat armor penetration is needed in too large amounts if the enemy squishy buys a little armor. Those same amounts would make all of their damage effectively true damage if the squishy bought 0 resistances.

And now I guess ad casters would be slightly better at hurting tanks and bruisers, while also simultaneously being able to replace the lossof last whisper.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 3, 20151 votes

Oh yea another thing Kalista, Ashe, Vayne(If shiv+firecannon was nerfed into the same unique passive already), and kog either don't build much crit or crit at all (Ashe alone) so they could abuse this item.

Pierce The VealDec 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Oh yea another thing Kalista, Ashe, Vayne(If shiv+firecannon was nerfed into the same unique passive already), and kog either don't build much crit or crit at all (Ashe alone) so they could abuse this item.

Vayne has to build no crit at all to use it properly. We can sinply make it so Ashe's autos count as a crit for the sake of this item. Kalista already deals reduced damage on auto attack, if she builds this item she will deal 99% of her AD and do a little less than 30% of her AD as true damage. Also has to not build any crit to really benefit from item. Meaninig no attack speed item other than berzerkers and botrk.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 3, 20151 votes

For cases of usability what about patheon and other guaranteed crit champs on ability

Would this item be usable on them especially patheon who could really use something like this

And one champ who could go broken from this: GP'S barrels

GP's barrels, which you can crit on, the damage done from barrels is not actually a crit there's really no way you could fix that without allowing his barrels to work as a crit which would allow essence reaver gp to regain all his mana in 1 shot.

Pierce The VealDec 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

For cases of usability what about patheon and other guaranteed crit champs on ability

Would this item be usable on them especially patheon who could really use something like this

And one champ who could go broken from this: GP'S barrels

GP's barrels, which you can crit on, the damage done from barrels is not actually a crit there's really no way you could fix that without allowing his barrels to work as a crit which would allow essence reaver gp to regain all his mana in 1 shot.

The answerr to that is simple. GP's barrels' damage will be considered crit damage for the sake of this item.

And depending on whether it breaks Pantheon or not, we could just make it so that his "crits" don't count as crits for the sake of this item. And if he buys IE? Well then, since this item's passive is shared with IE, he will only get one of the passives.

So, depending on how we want it implemented, we could make it so that buying IE+ this item would make it so you benefit from IE's bonus damage when you crit, but don't benefit from from this item except on normal attacks, or, preferably, we can just make it so that one passive outright overrides the other.

Now this brings up another problem, how would this interact with spell vamp and lifesteal? There are two possible solutions for this:

Autos/abilities apply standard spell vamp, lifesteal, and physical vamp on both the true and physical damage.

OR:

Autos/abilities apply standard spell vamp, lifesteal, and physical vamp on only the physical damage. This means that ADCs will be further discouraged from buying this item because it effectively reduces their lifesteal by 23%.

Of course hextech gunblade would heal the same regardless (because 15% of all damage).

TLDR Panth can and GP's barrels can be made to not count as crits or vice versa. Vamp off of damage can also be adjusted.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 3, 20151 votes

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/yYBm9rXq-i-honestly-love-the-changes-placed-in-however-i-as-well-as-many-have-a-few-suggestions

I still think 19+20 is safer.

And true damage is for killing squishies and tanks alike what really kills tanks is % base damage.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 2, 20151 votes

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/yYBm9rXq-i-honestly-love-the-changes-placed-in-however-i-as-well-as-many-have-a-few-suggestions

19 and 20 are enough.

Pierce The VealDec 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/yYBm9rXq-i-honestly-love-the-changes-placed-in-however-i-as-well-as-many-have-a-few-suggestions

19 and 20 are enough.

Yeah those look great too. They would only be strong on people who like to kill you very fast. But then again, they would still be used on ADCs, because they can crit and deal heavy amounts of damage in less than 2 seconds, and get a kill/assist and reset it. The only benefit is bruisers wouldn't really use it.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 2, 20151 votes

I been made them in mind to not work on adcs except varus/jayce/urgot with their poke built

And if any adc aside from varus gets it they're lose a considerable amount of DPS since

Basic attack amount will apply with on-hit effects lowered the max amount of basics to 4 for ranged
Since the reset for the overtime one is for melee only if an adc gets it one cc will considerably hurt their dps the longer a fight goes one
grabbing it will force them to miss out on LW or lifesteal or a crit chance item or even ga/banshee's veil and since it only really has squishy killing power due to the longer the fight goes on the less effective it is 1 CC which adcs will tend to be the focus of will gut their dps immensly
It also mostly promotes being sneaky with your engages since in combat will lower the effectiveness so that would further hurt marksmen since people will attempt to attack them with anything anyways.

Pierce The VealDec 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

I been made them in mind to not work on adcs except varus/jayce/urgot with their poke built

And if any adc aside from varus gets it they're lose a considerable amount of DPS since

Basic attack amount will apply with on-hit effects lowered the max amount of basics to 4 for ranged

Since the reset for the overtime one is for melee only if an adc gets it one cc will considerably hurt their dps the longer a fight goes one

grabbing it will force them to miss out on LW or lifesteal or a crit chance item or even ga/banshee's veil and since it only really has squishy killing power due to the longer the fight goes on the less effective it is 1 CC which adcs will tend to be the focus of will gut their dps immensly

It also mostly promotes being sneaky with your engages since in combat will lower the effectiveness so that would further hurt marksmen since people will attempt to attack them with anything anyways.

I can still see it being built on ranged champions on occasion. But trust me, if an ADC is able to delete a tank or a squishy (depending on whether it is % pen or flat pen respectively), it might entirely be worth forgoing last whisper for it.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 2, 20151 votes

Well if any adc gets it 1 cc will gut their damage for the seconds in combat one, and the one for abilities will only work on varus/jayce/urgot (Who it's intended for) since the rest don't use abilities enough to make use of it or They have on-hit/DoT abilities. Also since magic damage abilities will count towards the passive being disabled it hurts champs with magic damage abilities even more such as corki.

Pierce The VealDec 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Well if any adc gets it 1 cc will gut their damage for the seconds in combat one, and the one for abilities will only work on varus/jayce/urgot (Who it's intended for) since the rest don't use abilities enough to make use of it or They have on-hit/DoT abilities. Also since magic damage abilities will count towards the passive being disabled it hurts champs with magic damage abilities even more such as corki.

An assassin can also be cc'ed and his damage will be gutted much more easily. In fact since assassins are melee they'll get cc'ed faster.
There are carries that don't have magic damage. Like draaaaaaaven.
Riot doesn't like it when you have to make a ton of exceptions to make an item work.

EcchiOtakuTMDec 2, 20151 votes

Draven doesn't use abilities to do damage forcing him to get the over time one which loses effectioness from 2 seconds in

Yea assassins can be cc'd easier which is why players have to choose when they want to engage like an assassin should (Have no issue of that on any assassin I ever played) They just have to practice positioning

It's not really a ton of exception:

the items are for first moments of an engage
Stuff changes for melee/range
1 for more for first few seconds and 1 for abilities cast excluding DoT
Excluding on-hits is more of a clarity like how Luden's echo shouldn't apply with on-hit effects/abilities

Don't really see any other exceptions

Pierce The VealDec 3, 20151 votes

Bamp.