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"Tristana is balanced."

Neriticc··7 votes·3,455 views

Gets picked in 3 lanes in pro play and nobody cares.

Stands there with 700 range right clicking everything down. Gets 110% free attack speed just for pressing a button, that is the same as Hail of Blades. Has free pushing and waveclear power. She can destroy turrets the fastest out of all champions and she also AOE's the enemy targets near the turret too. You cannot defend the turret because you take 50% of your HP aswell as your turret.

If you manage to get past her 700 range to get to her, oh wait! She has a jump that has longer range than Camille dash + she can also use it while CC'ed for some fucking reason. Also her jump resets when the gets a TAKEDOWN NOT KILL or she blows up her E, so she can jump around all over the place. Better nerf Ezreal's blink right guys.

Oh wait it gets better. Her ult can be used and she can press it on one target and it knocks back all targets in the area.

But she will escape nerfs because she is an ADC champion. For how many fucking years has this cancer been allowed like this?

16 Comments

Bârd7 votes
  1. Being versatile isn't a problem. If anything, more champions should be like this.
  2. At no point does Trist have 700 range. She caps out at 661, and that's not until level 18.
  3. No, it's not "Free". Rapid Fire takes up most of her power budget, and is the reason her passive and ult are kinda meh.
  4. Or to put it another way, "Tristana can't freeze lane". She pushes naturally, but not particularly hard. Most champions can out-push her if they want to.
  5. Laughs in Ziggs
  6. You can defend your tower by attacking Trist when she tries to charge up the bomb or by keeping your lane shoved.
  7. Rocket Jump has 900 range. Camille's two E dashes have a combined range of 1200.
  8. Trist can't use W while CC'd, she can just buffer it through CC. This is not unique to Trist, this is just how cast times work in League.
  9. Yes, resets are kinda the entire point of Tristana...
  10. Yes, she has a knockback. So what? It ain't awful, but Buster Shot isn't very good compared to other ults.
  11. Trist will escape nerfs because she's not a problem, you're just bad.
OtterlyLost1 votes

As a Trist main who has been watching the PBE anxiously, thank you. Tristana is the only thing that keeps me invested in League anymore and she's not even good right now. If they were nerf her just because of prevalence in pro play, I would honestly stop playing.

I also wish you had mentioned how Jinx does actually get 700 range at level 9 and has a much higher winrate in soloqueue.

ZT Xperimentor1 votes
  1. There's a difference between versatile and being overloaded; granted tristana isn't in the later category, but riot's design philosophy over the past several years has been to do this as a general excuse to be the former.
  2. Have you heard of the rapidfirecannon? A core critical hit item adding attack speed, movement speed, and periodic 35% increase to attack range.
  3. An instantaneous 7 second long buff that does not cost mana, and marksmen don't have a hard time stacking up to the cdr cap.
  4. Most? Half the roster can't outpush her if she's paying attention.
  5. Ziggs has more significant limitations lol.
  6. Sure try that when she can detenate the bomb within 2 seconds because she can use her Q while E is traveling, and at from farther range than most champions can reach while having an escape better than ezreal.
  7. Camille doesn't have an auto-attack range of 500+ nor does her kills/assists reset her mobility's cooldown.
  8. Which has been a problem complained about for years along with minion block, but neither have been addressed.
  9. Think you're confusing her with pyke or any team slaying assassin, when she's clearly a marksmen.
  10. Thing is her ultimate isn't used for damage (because who plays her AP anymore), it's a guaranteed targeted self-peel that includes local knockback, allowing her to launch an entire team away if they're close together. In itself it's not a problem, the problem is it's packaged with her massive repeatable mobility and high damage kit.
  11. Incorrect, there's more prominent balance problems and riot has proven incapable of significantly changing more than a two dozen champions at a time.
Bârd1 votes
  1. Trist level versatility is fine. Akali, not so much.
  2. That only applies for one attack, and literally any ranged champion can buy it for the same effect.
  3. Trist can cap her CDR (Transcendence, CDR stat shard, essence reaver) but that's a terrible build so it doesn't happen.
  4. That's a funny way of saying "Trist's waveclear is middle of the road". Looking at the other marksmen, that checks out; 9 of them have equal or better waveclear, 9 of them have worse.
  5. He can also kill towers way faster than Trist.
  6. Yes, do try. It's not that hard.
  7. And Tristana doesn't have a 4 second lockdown. I ain't the one who compared the two.
  8. This ain't a problem. The alternative is what Dota 2 has, and something tells me you wouldn't want this.
  9. Nope, Trist has been doing this same shit for over ten years now. Her and Yi were the OG reset monsters.
  10. The damage is one of the better parts of it. It doesn't scale, but a 300-500 damage nuke on a champion that needs to burst somebody down to succeed is always gonna be good. The knockback is situationally useful, but it can be outright detrimental in some situations (ESPECIALLY at rank 3, where the knockback will always put the target outside your attack range).
  11. The only champions I can think of who need fewer changes than Tristana does right now are Bard and Vel'koz.
ZT Xperimentor1 votes
  1. Hence why I said more recent years XD Don't think she's been altered outside of bug fixes since season 7.
  2. Not really since her attack speed steroid can quickly max out her attack speed, roughly letting her proc its effect every ~2.7 seconds; that's just if she's stationary auto-attacking, it also charges based on movement distance which includes abilities and displacements, such as her rocket jump.
  3. Oh I wasn't referring to masteries which of themselves can nearly max out cdr for any champion in a specific configuration, there's multiple AD items that give cdr she can easily benefit from depending on the team composition, you already listed essense reaver but that's hardly the only option; Spear of Shojin, Trinity Force, Black Cleaver, Maw of Malmortius, Duskblade of Draktharr, Death's Dance, & Youmuu's Ghostblade.
  4. Of marksmen perhaps, but that's not what I said is it? Mages will burn through mana trying to keep up, tanks will waste cooldowns, juggernauts and assassins vary champ to champ on which is their limitation, and supports have by and large been a joke at wave-clear.
  5. Only under the specific condition it's at low health, which he'll struggle with unless his opponent abandons his lane for a gank or something, few mains max his satchel charge first anyway; marksmen have always had consistently faster objective taking power, with the exceptions of ezreal and graves lol.
  6. So you're admitting she can easily chunk towers without much risk?

{quoted}

  1. Rocket Jump has 900 range. Camille's two E dashes have a combined range of 1200.

Yes you did, her and leesin were the first champions to do the 'shurima shuffle' before azir existed; however you were talking about their mobility, and perhaps confused the two since I brought up tristana's mobility & ultimate lines apart. 8. Thing is both bugs happen but it depends on latency differences to see which commands get buffered first on the server. In itself is a collection of issues between network providers and league stability, so it's not all riot's fault, however why people complain about it is because they don't try to do anything about it or at least show they're trying. 9. Pffhahahaha, the game hasn't even been running 11 years and I highly doubt you've been around since the beta given your patchy knowledge, she's been reworked (https://na.leagueoflegends.com/en/news/game-updates/patch/patch-52-notes/#patch-tristana) not once but twice (http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=24). Not to mention the game was significantly slower (a rant of it's own) then so there was a much higher chance of shutting a game down before she could scale up. 10. Again incorrect though on a technicality, it's scaling by rank, and with ability power items bought, which is why I quipped about her rare AP builds; it's only detrimental if you misjudge it as a kill shot, or they clip a corner stopping earlier than anticipated, like I said before it's one of the best self-peels in the game for a squishy champion. 11. Champions who need fewer changes? An interesting question you've proposed, could only be a few as you've suggested or half the roster, it's part of why I'm thinking it'd be easier to drag the outliers into line first and see how balance settles after that. Some obvious problems have been sticking around for patches without changes that I'd say should be addressed first, but riot's been more of the drag their feet and play favorites kind of developers in recent years. If anything were to be changed on tristana I'd say just some number nudging, you know, like a few extra seconds tacked onto a cooldown or something; alternatively change the rocket jump reset requirement from takedowns to kills, so she can't pop-off so easily in teamfights by leaching assists, more of a lone-wolf markswoman to make her more unique in the lineup without crippling her.

Bârd1 votes
  1. Yup.
  2. If Trist is in a state where she can continuously auto attack you, Rapid Fire Cannon isn't making any difference (at least as far as range goes).
  3. Maw (and DD, kinda) is a good situational item, but everything else here is suboptimal at best.
  4. Marksmen are the most relevant ones, since they're the ones Trist is gonna be laning against 90% of the time. Most mages have better waveclear than Trist, albeit with a mana cost, but Mana is only an issue for a very small group of champions. Not many tanks can match her waveclear, and if they try they'll take a lot of harass... but then you're getting into Tristana Top, which is very weird territory.
  5. It ain't just his satchel, his passive chunks towers and he's known for picking up Lich Bane to kill a tower in seconds.
  6. How the hell did you get that from what I said? I literally said "Yeah, do try to punish her if she walks up and starts whacking your tower. It's not hard." She has to extend really damn far to stack a bombed tower.
  7. Did you not read the OP? I only mention Camille because he incorrectly said that Trist jump has a longer range.
  8. It's not a bug, it has nothing to do with connection. It's the way the game works. Cast times cannot be cancelled in League (unless it's a target spell and the target is lost). It's the same principle behind every flash buffered combo in the game.
  9. I didn't say 11 years. I said over 10. She's been out for 10 years and seven months. Her first rework, which introduced Rocket Jump and Tristana's resets, came out 10 years and two months ago.
  10. It doesn't scale exactly because she doesn't buy AP. I've give you that one, I guess, but semantics.
  11. Making her reset kills only would destroy the champion, since anybody nabbing the last 50 damage on a kill she earned would rob her of her reset and leave her a sitting duck. If anything you could make it a Katarina style reset based on how long its been since you last damaged the guy, but even that's just unnecessary. Some number fudging here and there wouldn't hurt per se, but she doesn't really need it and certainly doesn't need any mechanical changes.
ZT Xperimentor1 votes
  1. (Placeholder because their auto-formating is tedious to work with.)
  2. It can enable a greater duration of threat; as she can sit on it's full charge to preemptively nail someone moving in towards her, or give her the last hit on someone trying to flee, in which case range does matter. Just look back at when kogmaw got reworked and lasted like two patches before being reverted, a notoriously immobile marksman that became insanely difficult to kill due to being able to kill anyone vaguely in his vicinity with the push of two buttons. Range has been a balance issue since season one.
  3. Yeah I agree they're situational, but there's always one being picked up every game, though usually it's death's dance for the high AD and free buffer against burst damage and physical spellvamp.
  4. Mages aren't the only ones limited by mana, tanks and most junglers are too; point is marksmen are the unlimited splitpushers with high dps at range without limitation, which is why ranged tops are widely hated because they basically require playing another marksman or an assassin type to stay relevant.
  5. Ziggs' passive scales both on level and AP, early on he ain't doing much in that regard, sure using abilities speeds up it's cooldown, but again early on he can't afford to be wasting mana if his opponent is competent. Which applies to lich bane, he's better off trying to burst down his opponent early instead and use the minions to push early.
  6. Extend yes, but if you're pushed under tower then you'll have to rely on your jungler do you not? If she's maxing her attack speed steroid she'll pop a bomb from the toss in less than 3 seconds in which case they'll back off expecting a gank unless you're already dead or left, and it's not like she has a massive escape and self-peel in case you can sandwhich her. Point is a good one isn't punishable without significant help or lag.
  7. I did but I didn't notice and it slipped my mind that he mentioned camille initially, I thought it weird you pulled her for comparison when caitlyn is closer XD
  8. It's shown up for several champions over the years in bugfixes, probably the most obvious would be darius' pull, and like I mentioned trist hasn't had any serious attention for years except for her demon skin.
  9. Heard of rounding for the sake of conciseness? Glad to see you can count, but as I said she's been reworked twice, first time was indeed before her launch to live, the second was early season 5.
  10. Semantics that's the word I was looking for, technicality sounds too much like a lawyer.
  11. Or it would separate the men from the boys, showcasing who can time their bombs and who can calculate their jump damage on the fly. Destroy? Please, if I wanted to do that I'd suggest doubling her jump's cooldown or halving it's leap range or any other number of massive alterations. Regardless it's why I said slight changes after the problems elsewhere are dealt with, to see if she actually needs them in the first place and if changed to be minimal to see if it's enough before something significant.
GhostofBacon4 votes

Ah, so we are nerfing champions based on the top 1 percent again huh? Haven't seen this gut a champion who was only decent outside of pro play. Oh wait...

Tr4shB4NSYST3M1 votes

RIP Galio :(

Madjack013 votes

{quoted}

Oh wait it gets better. Her ult can be used

Oh no. Riot did it again.

Ragnaveil3 votes

I mean, easist way to nerf her is her early wave clear and turret killing power early. Cait needs a nerf like that too for turret killing.

Eedat3 votes

Nobody gives a damn about what works in proplay. Stop gutting champs because of proplay. In soloq she is legit trash tier mid and top and not overperforming bot

Thebestllama3 votes

I dont know if trist adc is any good, but trist top lane is broken beyond belief. she does so much damage, and you cant do anything if your a tank or bruiser. i played garen into her and she rocket jump INTO ME at the start of the fight, press her attack speed and bomb button and somehow won because she hard outplayed me. once i was 6, i could beat her when she did that, but thats only because she didnt poke me down first. if she is gonna do so much damage, atleast let us kill her when as a melee champion we actually get into melee range.

Daddy Ants3 votes

Just gut her

and don't rebuff.

JackMcCarry1 votes

Stands there with 700 range right clicking everything down.

Only level 18 and not 700 range.

Gets 110% free attack speed just for pressing a button, that is the same as Hail of Blades.

Is it really free if it: costs mana, has CD and is literally taking a skill slot?

Has free pushing and waveclear power.

Im starting to think you dont know what "free" means

The only legit problem with Tristana is her resets, no adc with that much safety should also have a resetable long range jump that can be used both offensivly (slows target) and defensively (can ignore CC if buffered right like EZ), add to that mulitple ways to reset with - kills, assists and E charge - and you get assassin level mobility on a marksmen who doesnt need THAT much safety. My only issue with tristana.

The Kombinator1 votes

Ezreal is more frustrating in mid/lategame. He can jump around WITHOUT takedowns, and his Q has bigger range, and can be spammed like every second.

Tristana is strong late, but she is nothing special early. No strong poke, auto pusher, no exceptional escape until 6.

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