Warrior is the only pure stat stick Enchant Left. Let's bring back Elder Lizard! (sorta)

Kingsgrave··17 votes·1,165 views

So what made Lizard good? It applied a DoT that allowed every Physical Damage oriented champion to clear at relatively the same faster speed, much like Cinderhulk and Runeglaive do now, and provided a way to deal with Armor stackers without just outright giving you Penetration.

It also gave Health and Mana back by clearing, but that was far too powerful and made the top percentage of AD Junglers better than literally everyone else.

Amping up the DoT and removing the sustain would allow us to bring this item back.




Enchant: Dragon Hunter (for best results use JarvanIV Pantheon Dragon Slayer skins)

Builds out of Wyvern’s Bane http://i.imgur.com/MRz5STD.png + 300g

http://i.imgur.com/MRz5STD.png gives 30 AD, builds out of 2 Longswords and costs 1100g

WB passively deals 2.5%+1.25%*Level AD True Damage over 4 seconds upon dealing Physical Damage. This amount is doubled against Monsters and cannot stack but will refresh.

Dragon Hunter gives 50 AD

DH passively deals 5%+2.5%*Level AD True Damage over 4 seconds upon dealing Physical Damage. This amount is doubled against Monsters and cannot stack but will refresh.

8 Comments

Only Play Darius7 votes

What's wrong with stat sticks?

Most people hate the new AP jungle item since the old one was just fine and worked on ALL AP junglers, not just the ones who synergize with item 3057 procs.

Teridax684 votes

That's a slightly different issue, I think. Runeglaive is unpopular because it's too specific for a lot of AP champions, and doesn't seem to fit builds well or feel powerful in its own right. By contrast, item 3725 is a significant improvement over its predecessor, which was a stat stick, and still catered to all tanks while being really strong. I personally dislike stat sticks because they don't expand on gameplay in any way: becoming statistically more powerful is something already innate to all itemization, and specializing in high-end items should also allow you to tailor and refine your power towards specific goals (e.g. choosing between Cinderhulk or item 3718 as Udyr for better AoE damage and tankiness or better on-hit synergy).

While I agree that item 3707 needs to expand into something more interesting, I'm not sure if Spirit of the Elder Lizard's old passive is the way to go. So far, the new souped-up enchantments have been implemented to address the issues with the classes who picked those items (tanks cleared too slowly and didn't feel tanky enough, mages have serious mana and clear problems, autoattackers on live don't have a clear endgame fantasy and don't transition well from farming the jungle to contributing more widely to the game), and I think it would be worth doing the same for Warrior. Imo, the big issue with both Warrior and most AD junglers (namely bruiser and assassin junglers) is that their power curve is heavily lopsided: champions like LeeSin and Evelynn are brutal in the early game, and Warrior's flat penetration just exacerbates that by adding another heavy early power spike, yet both those champions and the enchantment fall off heavily later in the game. It would be nice to have an AD enchantment that still encourages an aggressive playstyle, but that also shifts some of that power later on, so that assassin- and caster-type AD champions would still be encouraged to actively seek out champions to kill or expose for their team.

GhostOfShrimpmas3 votes

If there's one thing I've learned from Guild Wars 2, it's that people will absolutely lose their shit if you call it the Dragon Hunter.

Saianna2 votes

Any item idea that gives us Lizards DoT back is good idea :D

I really miss this :(

Variks the Loyal2 votes

One of the issues I see is the lack of ArP and CDR, which Warrior currently provides.

I agree that Warrior should be updated, but not at the cost of removing the ArP, and especially not the CDR. Good name ideas, though.

commit an hero2 votes

I'd really not like a true damage tick again. It was annoying enough when Elder Lizard was a thing.

Hard4Hamsters1 votes

What are the other stats of the item? Is it just AD? or does it have CDR? Any armor pen?

If it has any of these extra stats I think it gives too much AD. And on the other side of it, I think if it didn't give any other stats, it is lacking. Give the item 10 CDR and reduce the AD to 35-40 and it might be okay. Not sure about True Damage as well. Magic or Physical damage over time would probably be better (magic would make for better clears whereas physical damage would scream BUY BLACK CLEAVER). True damage would probably be okay, but I think it's trickier to balance as true damage can't be reduced so you might end up with something that has to be weak to make it balanced. Unlike Skirmisher's Sabre, the true damage over time on hit would always be on and not gated by a cooldown, but used in conjunction with Skirmisher's Sabre, you have a lot of true damage over time to deal with that cannot be reduced so I feel like it couldn't actually be a strong passive without being overbearing..

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