Suggestion to balance Lucian

HalcyonDweller·Mar 29, 2017·25 votes·908 views

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't it go a long way toward preventing on-hit item abuse if his passive applied its 50% damage reduction to the on-hit effect just like it does to his auto attack damage?

18 Comments

EedatMar 29, 20175 votes

I'm not sure if there is some sort of coding limitation because that would have fixed KogMaw too.

Is there any instance where the damage from on-hits are only partially applied on autos in the game? Seems like there may be something going on behind the scenes thats preventing it.

The ony thing I can think thats close is the move speed from item 3044 being different for ranged/melee. However thats a buff that gets cast on the champion though so it's probably easier to do. Actual Damage might be different. No clue, just something I noticed.

Hinagiku33Mar 30, 20172 votes

Pretty sure it's a coding limitation.

Riot stated in the past that things like Pantheon's passive block and old Fiora's parry couldn't block on-hit effects from the auto-attacks they blocked because they literally could not code it in (or at least not without breaking something). They actually said that they wanted Fiora to be able to block CC and extra damage by correctly parrying the right auto-attacks too. Jax dodge works differently because the auto-attacks just never connect, but since Fiora and Pantheon need an auto-attack to actually hit them to proc their block effect they couldn't code the extra on-hits to not take effect. That's why they gave Fiora an "avoid all damage" style parry in her rework.

It's possible that since on-hits can't be coded to miss when the auto-attack they are attached to is blocked, they also probably can't reduce the effect of the on-hit if the auto-attack is reduced.

...or Riot just thinks the only way to make on-hit builds work is to apply them at full effect and let the extra effects do all the work while reducing the base damage of the auto-attack.

Troll for TrumpMar 30, 20171 votes

Make him build Triforce again

HalcyonDwellerMar 30, 20172 votes

{quoted}

Make him build Triforce again

Players will choose to build their character whichever way they want. How could that be made into a choice that players would want to make?

Troll for TrumpMar 30, 20172 votes

Cleaver ->Melee only Youmuus->Melee only Duskblade->Melee only

HalcyonDwellerMar 30, 20171 votes

Ok, that is doable, but it seems a bit extreme when plenty of other ranged champions use botrk without problem.

Troll for TrumpMar 30, 20173 votes

No one really bought botrk until the rework.

Now it's actually seen quite a bit. It might even become the next OP item, but only time can tell.

Thing is, cleaver is intended mostly for juggernauts. Assassins use it, but it hasn't been a problem.

ADCs now also use it, but, unlike assassins, they cause problems.

It's extreme, but it's the only way to kill off the build path, which is deemed unhealthy for ADCs

SilverjustMar 30, 20171 votes

or "halfed if you are ranged"

Troll for TrumpMar 30, 20172 votes

If you just halved the stats, that'd just lead to such an abyssmal gold efficiency that no one would buy it.

They'd at least have the choice to opt for it, which is good.

That works, too.

Sexy Jack RabbitMar 30, 20172 votes

Making items melee only is a pretty lazy solution tbh.

Troll for TrumpMar 30, 20173 votes

It's the most efficient, direct solution, that helps with the ADC arm pen problem while minimizing impact on the Juggernauts.

What other solution can you come up with to balance ADCs abusing assassin items?

IllegalBagelMar 30, 20171 votes

So your balance suggestion is to make the second auto not apply on hit effects?

HalcyonDwellerMar 30, 20172 votes

{quoted}

So your balance suggestion is to make the second auto not apply on hit effects?

No. His passive gives him a second auto after the first, but it deals half of his base ad instead of all of it. My proposal is to make that 1/2 multiplier apply to total damage from that auto-attack instead of just applying to the base ad.

Sexy Jack RabbitMar 30, 20175 votes

They literally didn't say that at all whatsoever in anyway????

5000000000000000Mar 30, 20171 votes

Tbh making the second hit proc spell effect instead of on hit effect would make him easier to balance.

WoonStruckMar 30, 20171 votes

Alternatively, give him animations again.

Head ConnoisseurMar 30, 20171 votes

Riot said that the animation time reduction on his w was just bringing it in line with other abilities in the game, but I think a revert on the q would be reasonable.

HalcyonDwellerMar 30, 20171 votes

I'm not sure his Q had its animation time changed. The thing that stands out to me the most about his Q is how much damage it does even early in the game.