I love how Meta and balance changes is forcing us to forgot about undercover over powered champions

ValiantKiller·Oct 4, 2019·39 votes·14,967 views

We going to buff and and make him toxic pick slowly so you forgot about and on bot side.

While on the main time let's buff up so people slowly forgot that is still big problem that can sustain in lane, bully you and scale super hard while just right click you to death and isn't much better .

And as we buff don't forget that still require no brain or skill, just farm and press R die and repeat while just being a toxic jungler.

And on mid side, wait mid is always toxic

83 Comments

Baby GhoulOct 4, 20197 votes

Bot lane is completely miserable after the Blitzcrank buffs.

If you ban Blitzcrank, then they pick Pyke. The other laner partner doesn't listen and is usually an auto fill anyways.

We end up under tower waiting to get dived while top lane is losing hard after getting all our pressure from our jungler because they got counter picked. I'm just sick of this meta and can't wait for the season to be over.

The only reason I can think of for that profoundly stupid Blitzcrank buff is so that people stop permabanning Pyke.

[sg-lulu]

ValiantKillerOct 4, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Baby Ghoul,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sIR4EO5E,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2019-10-04T09:22:44.025+0000)

Bot lane is completely miserable after the Blitzcrank buffs.

If you ban Blitzcrank, then they pick Pyke. The other laner partner doesn't listen and is usually an auto fill anyways.

We end up under tower waiting to get dived while top lane is losing hard after getting all our pressure from our jungler because they got counter picked. I'm just sick of this meta and can't wait for the season to be over.

The only reason I can think of for that profoundly stupid Blitzcrank buff is so that people stop permabanning Pyke.

[sg-lulu]

And that is the whole point of this post, how they just shove more toxic shit in our throat in hope we forgot about others

KeiagaOct 4, 20195 votes

Or you're just mad at everything and will complain no matter who's strong or meta.

You'll even keep complaining about champs like Akali even after she got nerfed into the ground and is statistically one of t he 5 worst champions in the entire game.

Cotten Eyed JoeOct 4, 20197 votes

{quoted}

Or you're just mad at everything and will complain no matter who's strong or meta.

You'll even keep complaining about champs like even after she got nerfed into the ground and is statistically one of t he 5 worst champions in the entire game.

Imagine thinking Kayle is broken lol

WoonStruckOct 4, 201917 votes

imagine ignoring her high winrate and moderate pickrate lol

After you look at that, take a look at the fact that she's negative resources into the majority of match-ups along with average negative kills in every match-up at 15 mins, and that her worst match-up is 49% winrate for her.

ValiantKillerOct 4, 20194 votes

{quoted}

imagine ignoring her high winrate and moderate pickrate lol

After you look at that, take a look at the fact that she's negative resources into the majority of match-ups along with average negative kills in every match-up at 15 mins, and that her worst match-up is 49% winrate for her.

Right people going to defend her even when numbers say it, not me.

KeiagaOct 4, 20192 votes

~~theres a lot of champs that are still very popular that have been awful for a long time because they USED to be overpowered. Or people just think they're fun despite being unable to win with them.~~ LeeSin Ezreal Lucian ~~for example.~~

~~Those are some weird stats. where'd you get them? post a link~~

~~Because according to this her hardest matchups have more of a 39% winrate for her~~

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/counters/akali~~

WoonStruckOct 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

theres a lot of champs that are still very popular that have been awful for a long time because they USED to be overpowered. Or people just think they're fun despite being unable to win with them. for example.

Those are some weird stats. where'd you get them? post a link

Because according to this her hardest matchups have more of a 39% winrate for her

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/counters/akali

We're talking about kayle, not akali, my dude.

KeiagaOct 4, 20191 votes

Well shoot, that's what I get for checking out and not even taking the time to read closely.

CyanSolution247Oct 4, 20195 votes

if she is one of the 5 worst champions then why is she still played?

ValiantKillerOct 4, 20195 votes

{quoted}

if she is one of the 5 worst champions then why is she still played?

Like god look at MonkeyKing and Trundle play rate to Akali

LordGeovanniOct 5, 20191 votes

Trundle and wukong are weak numbers wise but kit wise are still strong.

ValiantKillerOct 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Trundle and wukong are weak numbers wise but kit wise are still strong.

Kit wise they useless , Trundle is complete shit in this meta against dashing around champions along Wukong who being just pure bad champion with outdated kit that have no damage or defensive hence why both of them numbers are low.

LordGeovanniOct 5, 20191 votes

Thats not bad on their kits but brokeness on other champions kits.

ValiantKillerOct 5, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Thats not bad on their kits but brokeness on other champions kits.

And that is the point, other broken champions make older champions useless, forcing riot to make older champions more broken and cycle keep going.

FSREROct 4, 20193 votes

{quoted}

Or you're just mad at everything and will complain no matter who's strong or meta.

You'll even keep complaining about champs like even after she got nerfed into the ground and is statistically one of t he 5 worst champions in the entire game.

Statistically? Show these statistics because you got me really curious.

KeiagaOct 4, 20191 votes

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/builds/by-winrate

Magnesium14Oct 4, 20195 votes

I disagree with you about Kayle but I agree with you on every other single choice. Mundo, Karthus and Graves have more of a design problem than a balance problem though. Mundo is kinda 50-50 either he does really well or he dosen't. Karthus just runs into you and spams R, not a healthy paystyle and Graves is dumb. The jungles in my opinion that should be balanced are Rengar, Kha zix and Lee Sin

ValiantKillerOct 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

I disagree with you about Kayle but I agree with you on every other single choice. Mundo, Karthus and Graves have more of a design problem than a balance problem though. Mundo is kinda 50-50 either he does really well or he dosen't. Karthus just runs into you and spams R, not a healthy paystyle and Graves is dumb. The jungles in my opinion that should be balanced are Rengar, Kha zix and Lee Sin

That they want to buff so they become op and then we get in same cycle

JaspersOct 4, 20192 votes

The Graves thing, you know there was a time just before DH was changed and he could walk out of jungle and oneshot with A DH stack, Stormrazor crit and Duskblade on one auto?

Well he just got another buff putting him back to those base AD levels, plus 3 other buffs this season. How long do you think it will take for people to notice, they again get on the bandwagon of complaining? I'm thinking a few appearances at worlds?

RagnaveilOct 4, 20192 votes

I doubt it. With this burst meta and how strong mages are, he's gonna get lit up like a firework before being able to wreck people with ease.

Magnesium14Oct 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

The Graves thing, you know there was a time just before DH was changed and he could walk out of jungle and oneshot with A DH stack, Stormrazor crit and Duskblade on one auto?

Well he just got another buff putting him back to those base AD levels, plus 3 other buffs this season. How long do you think it will take for people to notice, they again get on the bandwagon of complaining? I'm thinking a few appearances at worlds?

Still tho Graves is like Jhin play a game against him and he is just OP one shot, but play as him and you realize that he is just toxic to play not OP.

GilxeNOct 4, 20194 votes

If u have problems playing against Ahri it's time to use mouse and dodge skill shots [zombie-brand-clap]

Because I have zero problems playing against Ahri besides that she always using ult to escape from death (safety), but if I play perfectly and CC'ing her right direction pretty much Ahri is done.

BackdoorPrincessOct 4, 20198 votes

{quoted}

If u have problems playing against Ahri it's time to use mouse and dodge skill shots [zombie-brand-clap]

Because I have zero problems playing against Ahri besides that she always using ult to escape from death (safety), but if I play perfectly and CC'ing her right direction pretty much Ahri is done.

Ahri is a frustratingly designed champ. She has innate sustain, mana costs arent' super high thanks to manaflow/bluebook, she has long range and wide hitboxes, triple-dash ult that has a not too long cd, and her only source of cc, a charm of all things, also increases all damage she does to the target she hits with it's morgana-q-esque hitbox. Oh, and her q hits twice, with the second proc being true damage. And goes through minions without damage dropoff, so standing behind minions she will heal more and hit you, whereas standing off to the side and you are now open to charming.

BUT WAIT, THERES MORE: Any other champs mere presence makes it 10x easier to hit you with her charm, which at that point is a death sentence, and since most junglers have some form of cc or slow, a single gank will put you behind. In the midlane. The most accessible lane. But wait, if your jungler comes, you have to a) hope that's not warded, b) hope that you can land some form of cc, or they can, before she dashes out, c) hope that the two of you have enough damage to kill her within that cc time, d) stay outside of turret range or eat a charm, and this is all while hoping that you are ranged and not melee, otherwise you're getting double harassed all game.

She has been S/God tier for so long on so many sites, for being as safe as she is, that quite frankly she does need a nerf. There's a reason up until this season riot played with her numbers so much and kept trying different types of damage empowerment on her charm, because she is either entirely useless as a sustain/push--bot, or she is nuking people with 3 get-out-of-jail-free cards, which can be partially used to chase down then escape if she wants. Once upon a time it took deathfire grasp for her to be able to onecombo people, which meant she had to charm-dash-dfg-w-q-r-r, unless ridiculously fed, or if she got them from a bush it was dfg first. That item went away, they added damage-ramp to her charm, then almost immediately took it away because "hey she does way too well for almost drawback". None of this is even factoring when she abuses glacial, same as neeks.

She may not be Riven/Kai/jax levels of needing tuned, but she definitely isn't be a pretentious douche level of not strong that you seem to imply. You also say just use your mouse, when matchmaking is evenly matched (hue), the opponents prediction should match your ability to dodge, and that doesnt even get into better positioning/pressure and whatnot. The same reason that fiddles fear was lowered drastically alongside a shitload of other easy cc (AHRI'S CHARM WAS ONE OF THEM) was that it was too punishing for how easy it was to land, same as nid's spear damage, and the reason that people are outraged over zoe's q.

Actually, looking at your match history it makes sense why you say you have no problem playing against her. You play Lee mainly in the jungle, you don't deal with her unless you have to, and I didn't even see a single enemy one in your match history, and honestly Lee is rarely the enemy worth charming unless he's in my face. Although you landing a q is a garen-teed charm if you decide to use it.

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20193 votes

{quoted}

Ahri is a frustratingly designed champ. She has innate sustain, mana costs arent' super high thanks to manaflow/bluebook, she has long range and wide hitboxes, triple-dash ult that has a not too long cd, and her only source of cc, a charm of all things, also increases all damage she does to the target she hits with it's morgana-q-esque hitbox. Oh, and her q hits twice, with the second proc being true damage. And goes through minions without damage dropoff, so standing behind minions she will heal more and hit you, whereas standing off to the side and you are now open to charming.

BUT WAIT, THERES MORE: Any other champs mere presence makes it 10x easier to hit you with her charm, which at that point is a death sentence, and since most junglers have some form of cc or slow, a single gank will put you behind. In the midlane. The most accessible lane. But wait, if your jungler comes, you have to a) hope that's not warded, b) hope that you can land some form of cc, or they can, before she dashes out, c) hope that the two of you have enough damage to kill her within that cc time, d) stay outside of turret range or eat a charm, and this is all while hoping that you are ranged and not melee, otherwise you're getting double harassed all game.

She has been S/God tier for so long on so many sites, for being as safe as she is, that quite frankly she does need a nerf. There's a reason up until this season riot played with her numbers so much and kept trying different types of damage empowerment on her charm, because she is either entirely useless as a sustain/push--bot, or she is nuking people with 3 get-out-of-jail-free cards, which can be partially used to chase down then escape if she wants. Once upon a time it took deathfire grasp for her to be able to onecombo people, which meant she had to charm-dash-dfg-w-q-r-r, unless ridiculously fed, or if she got them from a bush it was dfg first. That item went away, they added damage-ramp to her charm, then almost immediately took it away because "hey she does way too well for almost drawback". None of this is even factoring when she abuses glacial, same as neeks.

She may not be Riven/Kai/jax levels of needing tuned, but she definitely isn't be a pretentious douche level of not strong that you seem to imply. You also say just use your mouse, when matchmaking is evenly matched (hue), the opponents prediction should match your ability to dodge, and that doesnt even get into better positioning/pressure and whatnot. The same reason that fiddles fear was lowered drastically alongside a shitload of other easy cc (AHRI'S CHARM WAS ONE OF THEM) was that it was too punishing for how easy it was to land, same as nid's spear damage, and the reason that people are outraged over zoe's q.

Actually, looking at your match history it makes sense why you say you have no problem playing against her. You play Lee mainly in the jungle, you don't deal with her unless you have to, and I didn't even see a single enemy one in your match history, and honestly Lee is rarely the enemy worth charming unless he's in my face. Although you landing a q is a garen-teed charm if you decide to use it.

What a joke , her Mana pool is literally the lowest in mid lane after Fizz but Fizz can still CS with W that doesn't waste mana so her mana pool is actually the lowest, literally the lowest.

Sleeping BatOct 4, 20198 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ahri Baka,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sIR4EO5E,comment-id=000400000001,timestamp=2019-10-04T12:39:16.965+0000)

What a joke , her Mana pool is literally the lowest in mid lane after Fizz but Fizz can still CS with W that doesn't waste mana so her mana pool is actually the lowest, literally the lowest.

Say hello to my little friend item 3802

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sleeping Bat,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sIR4EO5E,comment-id=0004000000010000,timestamp=2019-10-04T12:49:35.941+0000)

Say hello to my little friend

It doesn't change much , her mana costs are still too high to actually spam spells like Zoe or most of other mages , and let's not forget how shitty it is pre item 3802

RagnaveilOct 4, 20192 votes

Corrupting, Biscuits....Am I forgetting any mana resource crutches that exist pre Lost Chapter?

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Corrupting, Biscuits....Am I forgetting any mana resource crutches that exist pre Lost Chapter?

If you buy Corrupting then you won't do damage lol.

1100 Gold Boots for 10+ Mpen. Any mr purchase after it is just trying to put the person at neutral. Why do you think someone playing Talon, running double MR runes, Hex, and Null Orb gets lit up by a sorc lost chapter Zoe? One part is the true damage, the other part is the sheer garbage scaling of MR.

First of all bringing Zoe as an example is a bad idea , she is one of the most cnacerous champions in mid lane , but even with that , if Talon can't kill Zoe then he is an extremely terrible player lol, he is her biggest counter , he can 1 shoot her before getting put in sleep. And no , item 3020 does no deny the double MR runes Hex and Nulli orb , Hashinshin please.

RagnaveilOct 4, 20195 votes

Zoe is the same champ as Ahri, with just stuff moved around and some things changed.

Also, it doesnt take Hashinshin to notice the abundant problem AP items are right now.

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

Zoe is the same champ as Ahri, with just stuff moved around and some things changed.

Also, it doesnt take Hashinshin to notice the abundant problem AP items are right now.

Nah , I can't take you seriously anymore by even comparing Zoe to Ahri , and no , I see your name a lot in boards as one of Hashinshin followers anyway.

RagnaveilOct 4, 20193 votes

I dont follow Hashinshin though? Please keep assuming such with your mage circlejerking. Also as if someone was gonna take you seriously when trying to explain how your champ is strong, because you mains always say she isn't.

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

I dont follow Hashinshin though? Please keep assuming such with your mage circlejerking. Also as if someone was gonna take you seriously when trying to explain how your champ is strong, because you mains always say she isn't.

What you're saying makes no sense at all. My mage circlejerk? what's that? people not taking me seriously? why you generalizing? I had some upvotes so there ARE some people who took me seriously , you should say that " You " can't take me seriously , generalizing is NOT a good thing.

RagnaveilOct 4, 20192 votes

Well how can I not generalize when most of the Ahri mains im aware of complain shes weak and not strong? Its the same problem with Riven mains. Also, a good chunk of the boards like to jerk the idea that mages are bad and assassins are the god class. Outside of Fizz, Kat, LB, and Akali, I rarely see a single AD based assassin being played.

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Well how can I not generalize when most of the Ahri mains im aware of complain shes weak and not strong? Its the same problem with Riven mains. Also, a good chunk of the boards like to jerk the idea that mages are bad and assassins are the god class. Outside of Fizz, Kat, LB, and Akali, I rarely see a single AD based assassin being played.

You know , that's something I have nothing to do with, I don't care about Ahri mains calling her weak or mages mains on boards calling mages weak , Right now what I'm simply stating Ahri is not toxic , this is not a comment about her being weak.

AhrisOct 4, 20191 votes

{quoted}

Ahri is a frustratingly designed champ. She has innate sustain, mana costs arent' super high thanks to manaflow/bluebook, she has long range and wide hitboxes, triple-dash ult that has a not too long cd, and her only source of cc, a charm of all things, also increases all damage she does to the target she hits with it's morgana-q-esque hitbox. Oh, and her q hits twice, with the second proc being true damage. And goes through minions without damage dropoff, so standing behind minions she will heal more and hit you, whereas standing off to the side and you are now open to charming.

BUT WAIT, THERES MORE: Any other champs mere presence makes it 10x easier to hit you with her charm, which at that point is a death sentence, and since most junglers have some form of cc or slow, a single gank will put you behind. In the midlane. The most accessible lane. But wait, if your jungler comes, you have to a) hope that's not warded, b) hope that you can land some form of cc, or they can, before she dashes out, c) hope that the two of you have enough damage to kill her within that cc time, d) stay outside of turret range or eat a charm, and this is all while hoping that you are ranged and not melee, otherwise you're getting double harassed all game.

She has been S/God tier for so long on so many sites, for being as safe as she is, that quite frankly she does need a nerf. There's a reason up until this season riot played with her numbers so much and kept trying different types of damage empowerment on her charm, because she is either entirely useless as a sustain/push--bot, or she is nuking people with 3 get-out-of-jail-free cards, which can be partially used to chase down then escape if she wants. Once upon a time it took deathfire grasp for her to be able to onecombo people, which meant she had to charm-dash-dfg-w-q-r-r, unless ridiculously fed, or if she got them from a bush it was dfg first. That item went away, they added damage-ramp to her charm, then almost immediately took it away because "hey she does way too well for almost drawback". None of this is even factoring when she abuses glacial, same as neeks.

She may not be Riven/Kai/jax levels of needing tuned, but she definitely isn't be a pretentious douche level of not strong that you seem to imply. You also say just use your mouse, when matchmaking is evenly matched (hue), the opponents prediction should match your ability to dodge, and that doesnt even get into better positioning/pressure and whatnot. The same reason that fiddles fear was lowered drastically alongside a shitload of other easy cc (AHRI'S CHARM WAS ONE OF THEM) was that it was too punishing for how easy it was to land, same as nid's spear damage, and the reason that people are outraged over zoe's q.

Actually, looking at your match history it makes sense why you say you have no problem playing against her. You play Lee mainly in the jungle, you don't deal with her unless you have to, and I didn't even see a single enemy one in your match history, and honestly Lee is rarely the enemy worth charming unless he's in my face. Although you landing a q is a garen-teed charm if you decide to use it.

Ahri is S tier in multiple sites because she has high playrate and above average winrate. And good enough banrate too(like 6%). The bans are mostly done because she is popular not because she is strong.

LordGeovanniOct 5, 20191 votes

If you have a high playrate and an above average win rate aka high winrate I guess that makes your champion the weakest one in the game makes sense. Shes popular because she's a strong pick because she does a ton of damage really safley on very low cooldown and because she's popular she gets skins which makes her even more popular.

RegardsKittyOct 4, 20193 votes

{quoted}

If u have problems playing against Ahri it's time to use mouse and dodge skill shots [zombie-brand-clap]

Because I have zero problems playing against Ahri besides that she always using ult to escape from death (safety), but if I play perfectly and CC'ing her right direction pretty much Ahri is done.

I have no problem with her charm, but her Q hitbox is just busted.

Ahri BakaOct 4, 20194 votes

{quoted}

I have no problem with her charm, but her Q hitbox is just busted.

It's not exactly busted but overall the animation is smaller than the actual hitbox in her Old skins and classic skin , in her new skins ( SG , K/DA and Elderwood ) her Q animation is fine' I guess Riot realized that since season 7 and started making her Q bigger in her skins but were too lazy to update that in all of her skins.

RagnaveilOct 4, 20192 votes

Idk, that problem stems from the fact she only needs one keystone and said keystone allows her to land her entire kit with ease? Are we just gonna casually ignore the problems Glacial Augment causes?

The KombinatorOct 4, 20192 votes

Reminds me of the politic parody of Family Guy, and Simpsons. Not going into details, because forum rules. But in short without concept:

We f*cked up, but we aren't going to change it back. Instead. Let's make a distraction!

We made some champions overpowered, but they are popular. Instead of nerfing them. Let's make other champions toxic as hell!

Spooky SkeletonOct 4, 20192 votes

I hate Karthus being considered toxic now because of a fucking rune. I've been playing my boi mid for like 8 seasons now and nobody complained about him, ever. He was always viable, never overpowered and never picked.

Then comes dark harvest and bam, he's an insane jungler/botlaner, so much so that riot nerfed other aspects about him that didnt need nerfing at all instead of just lowering his monster damage on Q or something.

And now he doesn't even show up anymore on midlane statistics because he's actually garbage in his intended lane/role. Thanks riot.

ValiantKillerOct 4, 20192 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spooky Skeleton,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sIR4EO5E,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2019-10-04T20:57:49.359+0000)

I hate being considered toxic now because of a fucking rune. I've been playing my boi mid for like 8 seasons now and nobody complained about him, ever. He was always viable, never overpowered and never picked.

Then comes dark harvest and bam, he's an insane jungler/botlaner, so much so that riot nerfed other aspects about him that didnt need nerfing at all instead of just lowering his monster damage on Q or something.

And now he doesn't even show up anymore on midlane statistics because he's actually garbage in his intended lane/role. Thanks riot.

DrMundo and Taliyah had the same treatment forcing them out of their role into jungle to be toxic things due to runes and champions skills changes, how lovely.

LightswornLanceOct 4, 20191 votes

Some of your stuff is right but kayle? Really man? If your laning against kayle and dont get multiple solo kills + tower platings you are not playing the game right.

WoonStruckOct 4, 20192 votes

And statistically Kayle wins the game anyway despite that happening to her.

LightswornLanceOct 4, 20191 votes

Well it would make sense in bronze and silver games where no one picks champions with cc they all pick assassins or bruiser carries that kayle can still do good.

WoonStruckOct 4, 20193 votes

You realize the statistics on the sites only includes plat+, and that she consistently performs well in diamond+ and masters+ as well, right?

But no, your argument that everyone is bad totally makes sense. /s

To further discredit your argument: in bronze and silver she performs worse than plat+, diamond+, and masters+

ValiantKillerOct 4, 20192 votes

{quoted}

You realize the statistics on the sites only includes plat+, and that she consistently performs well in diamond+ and masters+ as well, right?

But no, your argument that everyone is bad totally makes sense. /s

To further discredit your argument: in bronze and silver she performs worse than plat+, diamond+, and masters+

People still think this numbers belong to low elo, it belong to plat + elo and it clear say she just dumb champion that hit level 11 and roll right click over everyone

LightswornLanceOct 4, 20191 votes

So the sites ONLY include plat+ games but they also have bronze and silver games shown, thinking emoji.

WoonStruckOct 4, 20191 votes