why am i seeing 4 adcs per game

Mody bird·Feb 22, 2016·132 votes·7,955 views

Usually its only 3 ADCs but I had a game with 4

Lucian bot Corki mid Graves jungle Quinn top

and the funny thing is, they stomped us. Wtf is this shit

204 Comments

Kal Vas FlamFeb 22, 201683 votes

Because death is the best form of crowd control Because range is the best form of defense Because ADC's were reworked to also be burst in addition to DPS Because you no longer have to build glass cannon ADC to be a high damage ADC Because ADC can now assume just about any role with their new items Because there are too many OP ADCs to not grab as many as you can Because there are a whopping two counters for ADCs in the game and they're weaker than they used to be

S6 - no one will remember the tank meta by the time we're through.

HyperSMBFeb 23, 201622 votes

{quoted}

Because death is the best form of crowd control Because range is the best form of defense Because ADC's were reworked to also be burst in addition to DPS Because you no longer have to build glass cannon ADC to be a high damage ADC Because ADC can now assume just about any role with their new items Because there are too many OP ADCs to not grab as many as you can Because there are a whopping two counters for ADCs in the game and they're weaker than they used to be

S6 - no one will remember the tank meta by the time we're through.

This man deserves this quote. The truth has been spoken.

The thing people are forgetting though...the MAGE update is coming soon...

Be afraid of Mobility Malzahar who can throw his voidlings like Syndra balls!

AkesgerothFeb 23, 20168 votes

mobility Malzahar

Right. He'll throw voidlings for half the damage of his E and in exchange his ult will slow you instead of suppress you and his Q will no longer silence.

Go on, fucking do it. Give me an excuse to quit.

AninLegions777Feb 23, 20163 votes

Suppression is an unhealthy form of CC. Definitely shouldn't exist.

Lord BoltrixFeb 23, 20167 votes

I politely disagree.

Sometimes people want to watch the world burn.

Sometimes, the world needs YOU to burn.

AninLegions777Feb 23, 20162 votes

Still not a valid argument to why it isn't unhealthy. I mean the bloody CC can't be removed by Cleanse. It's just unhealthy.

Auz the RipperFeb 23, 20162 votes

It pays the price for its power with the fact it can almost alway be interrupted because in all but one case it's tied to a channel.

It's the only CC your teammates can remove for you without items, so it gets to be stronger in a 1v1 scenario.

Skarner is an exception but he pays for it by having his autoattacks disabled for the duration instead.

AninLegions777Feb 23, 20164 votes

That's not a good enough price. Look at WW. His ult + Skirmishers + Q can delete the enemy ADC. It's unhealthy. Malz's Q leaves you helpless unable to attack. It's only in lategame where 1v1s are rare that suppresses gain disadvantages. But in the early - mid game, they are too unhealthy. Also skarner can still use his Q which has a relatively low CD.

Auz the RipperFeb 23, 20162 votes

WW has his own problems that are only tangentally related to supression.

Malzahar's Q is extremely easy to dodge.

a significant amount of Skarner's damage comes from Sheen proccs which require autoattacks and his Q has a minimum cooldown of 1.5 with 40% without autoattacking so it can be used maybe twice over the duration if he times it right.

warmcorntortillaFeb 24, 20162 votes

Malz's Q has a long delay, and it's easy to just walk out of it. It doesn't leave you helpless, it still allows you to move away from him, and use some summoner spells, too. It's his longest range ability so even if you get picked by it you can just walk away from him in lane. WW brings him on top of your face. If you want to kill somebody you have to get the whole combo off early game, or else you will be stuck with no dependable crowd control against fizz/lb/zed/yas the only lanes you bring him in. if he can't reliably 1v1 those assassins, why the fuck play him at all?

like, yeah, ww and malz are not tanks. they are able to kill squishy targets with their abilities. Literally what mid-laner can't solo-kill an adc??

AkesgerothFeb 24, 20162 votes

It exists specifically for that reason. Notice how all suppresses are ults.

If suppresses get removed, then cleanse should be removed as well.

Dar RaksadaFeb 24, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Still not a valid argument to why it isn't unhealthy. I mean the bloody CC can't be removed by Cleanse. It's just unhealthy.

Qss is still a thing.

Chaotic ReksFeb 24, 20162 votes

meanwhile knockups...

Velzard of KozFeb 23, 20161 votes

New Stat: Critical Splash Chance Chance to cause with ability critical splash into area, dealing 150% of the ability's damage.

New Item: Scepter of Kappa

65 AP
30% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Masscontrol: CSplash has doubled range.

New Item: Bloodborn Robe

85 AP
15% Spellvamp
50% Mana regen
20% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Carnige Flourish: CSplash heals for 15% of the damage dealt.

New Item: Soulburning Orb

100 AP
50% Mana regen
30% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Buuuuuurn!: Restores 5% of the damage dealt as Mana.

New Item: Freljord Crown

250 AP
20% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Might of the Freljord: CSplash slows affected targets by 25% for 2 seconds. UNIQUE Passive - Chilling Roar: CSplash deals 50% more damage.

Item Update: Abysall Scepter

100 AP
20% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Broken Depths: 50% bonus Magic Resistance Penetration.

Item Update: Rabadon's Hat

150 AP
10% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Gathering Corn: Increases AP by 40% and CSplash Chance by 50%.

For diversity...

HyperSMBFeb 24, 20162 votes

{quoted}

New Stat: Critical Splash Chance Chance to cause with ability critical splash into area, dealing 150% of the ability's damage.

New Item: Scepter of Kappa

65 AP

30% CSplash Chance UNIQUE Passive - Masscontrol: CSplash has doubled range.

Riot, hire this man. He can break the game with dank memes.

AbyssphereFeb 22, 201658 votes

Because it works. Quinn is your assassin, Graves is your tank, Corki is your mage and Lucian is your actual ADC. Why bother with other classes when ADCs can take their jobs and continue doing theirs at the same time.

Hell, I saw Kalista support win a while back with 3 more ADCs on her team.

ApocylipticFeb 22, 20164 votes

If only something like yi or katarina was picked... they´d lose instantly.

Sir YamazukiFeb 22, 201626 votes

{quoted}

If only something like yi or katarina was picked... they´d lose instantly.

Other than the fact they still have burst to instantly kill Kat and the support could just pick Ali for their cc to deal with Yi while he explodes even if he goes bruiser simply by how much damage they do.

ApocylipticFeb 22, 20165 votes

4 Adc's do not out burst a Katarina; she's an assassin. When was the last time you saw an Adc out burst something like Zed, Annie, Rengar, Talon, you get the point.

As for Alistar, that's still not enough. His pulverize has a cast animation, which means yi can actually dodge it with his Q if he has skills.

You wanna beat 4 Adc's? Pick an assassin. Too bad the boards hate them, always wishing they would be nerfed into the ground, as was the case with Rengar recently.

I love the Adc meta. Give me more I can kill as Udyr and Rengar... yum.

YoureSquiddingMeFeb 22, 201646 votes

{quoted}

4 Adc's do not out burst a Katarina; she's an assassin. When was the last time you saw an Adc out burst something like Zed, Annie, Rengar, Talon, you get the point.

As for Alistar, that's still not enough. His pulverize has a cast animation, which means yi can actually dodge it with his Q if he has skills.

You wanna beat 4 Adc's? Pick an assassin. Too bad the boards hate them, always wishing they would be nerfed into the ground, as was the case with Rengar recently.

I love the Adc meta. Give me more I can kill as Udyr and Rengar... yum.

Graves easily outbursts a Kat.

Sir YamazukiFeb 22, 201610 votes

{quoted}

4 Adc's do not out burst a Katarina; she's an assassin. When was the last time you saw an Adc out burst something like Zed, Annie, Rengar, Talon, you get the point.

As for Alistar, that's still not enough. His pulverize has a cast animation, which means yi can actually dodge it with his Q if he has skills.

You wanna beat 4 Adc's? Pick an assassin. Too bad the boards hate them, always wishing they would be nerfed into the ground, as was the case with Rengar recently.

I love the Adc meta. Give me more I can kill as Udyr and Rengar... yum.

I never said a single champion would out burst them, Graves, Corki, Lucian etc have burst patterns that each can kill a squishy target at once and I more of meant with all of them focusing Kat or Yi they would just die.

Yi also can't realistically save his Q because he'll die before reaching them due to 4 carries hitting him.

Although you're going with the assumption none of them position properly, I've never died to an assassin when I played Graves even when they were fed.

ApocylipticFeb 22, 20162 votes

This isn't how it works at all. Your assuming it's a 1 v 5 situation, and its not. Katarina and Yi would have 4 other teammates, one of which probably has cc, allowing him to reach said target, not to mention the possibility of flanks, which is typically what Yi and Katarina do. They aren't just gonna walk at them in a teamfight.

You don't have to admit it, but an assassin would destroy that team with the blink of an eye if he's any good at it. When I see 3 Adc's as Rengar I'm not worried about their "brust" I'm getting ready to carry.

Sir YamazukiFeb 22, 201611 votes

{quoted}

This isn't how it works at all. Your assuming it's a 1 v 5 situation, and its not. Katarina and Yi would have 4 other teammates, one of which probably has cc, allowing him to reach said target, not to mention the possibility of flanks, which is typically what Yi and Katarina do. They aren't just gonna walk at them in a teamfight.

You don't have to admit it, but an assassin would destroy that team with the blink of an eye if he's any good at it. When I see 3 Adc's as Rengar I'm not worried about their "brust" I'm getting ready to carry.

Not assuming 1v5, carries would focus what ever is closer, guess what Kat and Yi are? Melee. It doesn't even take 5 of them to focus, just Lucian, Graves and Corki, or even Graves alone could 100-0 them. You're not even factoring in the fact there are 2 items for anti burst being used on carries.

I also think it's funny you keep saying you do this as Rengar, who has stealth to bypass a team, yet want to argue Kat/Yi can do the same thing. In the case of your Udyr, you have 6 wins 11 losses with a meh kda despite him being a 60% win rate champion so that's not exactly impressive while trying to brag about destroying people.

ApocylipticFeb 22, 20163 votes

Don't trash talk my Udyr. Last season I had 170 games with him, a 3.5 kda, and a 55% winrate, and that's only counting ranked. All in all, I've played around 320 games on him since I started playing, and decided to main him even whiling I was levling up. I know how to play him, but seeing as how he's always permabanned and I've been trying to learn other champions, his winrate is low because I almost exclusively play him when I'm tilted now. More importantly, I haven't got to play but 3-4 games since he's been deemed op with the new Runic Echos item.

Kat an Yi can basically do the same thing. Kat has aoe burst, while Rengar is single targets, and Yi has sustain and survivability. Rengar is a more a punish people for their bad positioning and being alone, while Katarina is about going into a teamfight and killing everything at the right moment, which is EXTREMELY easy against a team of 5 Adc's.

Katarina has her E as a gap closer, and yi has his not able to be slowed and just a slippery kit in general with his Q giving untargitibility.

Your arrogant and immature to attack the person rather than the argument at hand. Going for how I've recently played a champion shows you have a far way to go in life, and have much to learn to debate in general. The only thing insulting people gets you is ruining someone's day, and if that makes you happy then you've got some serious issues.

The fact that you think an Adc could take on any assassin shows you have little game knowledge though. The only adc I know of that can kind of do this is Vayne, and that reqiures exact mechanics and, usually, for the opponent to misplay as well.

Sir YamazukiFeb 22, 201614 votes

{quoted}

Don't trash talk my Udyr. Last season I had 170 games with him, a 3.5 kda, and a 55% winrate, and that's only counting ranked. All in all, I've played around 320 games on him since I started playing, and decided to main him even whiling I was levling up. I know how to play him, but seeing as how he's always permabanned and I've been trying to learn other champions, his winrate is low because I almost exclusively play him when I'm tilted now.

Kat an Yi can basically do the same thing. Kat has aoe burst, while Rengar is single targets, and Yi has sustain and survivability. Rengar is a more a punish people for their bad positioning and being alone, while Katarina is about going into a teamfight and killing everything at the right moment, which is EXTREMELY easy against a team of 5 Adc's.

Katarina has her E as a gap closer, and yi has his not able to be slowed and just a slippery kit in general with his Q giving untargitibility.

Your arrogant and immature to attack the person rather than the argument at hand. Going for how I've recently played a champion shows you have a far way to go in life, and have much to learn to debate in general. The only thing insulting people gets you is ruining someone's day, and if that makes you happy then you've got some serious issues.

The fact that you think an Adc could take on any assassin shows you have little game knowledge though. The only adc I know of that can kind of do this is Vayne, and that reqiures exact mechanics and, usually, for the opponent to misplay as well.

ar·ro·gant ˈerəɡənt/ adjective having or revealing an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or abilities.

As far as either of our responses are concerned, you are the only one speaking about how amazing your Rengar/Udyr is. I have yet to talk about myself, either as a person, or my ability to do anything amazing. I only brought up the fact that I haven't died to an assassin as Graves, beyond that I haven't spoken anything about myself.

I also don't think you know what an "attack" is. I stated your Udyr's win loss ratio and the fact it didn't have an astounding kda because you're bragging about doing well as Udyr. Bringing up your stats to prove your claims are false is far from an attack or being arrogant. The one being arrogant is you, and your response just further shows how arrogant you are. You are upset I took 30 seconds to check how well you do as Udyr and are upset the stats are showing you're lying.

Then you want to talk about being immature? I'm not the one using forums to compliment myself and lie about my ability to play the game. I do not exaggerate my performance or lie about my experiences regarding the game. I also do not retaliate by responding with negative labels when I am exposed for lying.

As for your last comment, judging all adcs as if they have the same damage pattern shows you are the one lacking game knowledge. Some of them are in fact more burst than dps oriented. It is not my fault you are refusing to acknowledge each of them have different damage patterns, different build paths, different safety levels, and different durability levels.

Seeing as the discussion ended up personal, here's some advice; don't pretend to be something you're not. Not everyone is going go along with your hyperbole and you'll just end up unhappy when you're exposed.

ApocylipticFeb 22, 20162 votes

Normally I get to sit back and laugh at the boards. Compred to Reddit, the gameplay discussions that get discussed are full of ignorance and low elo comments getting upvoted while the higher elo players get downvoted into Obliviion.

I haven't lied about anything; you tried to talk about my Udyr stats and I gave you a more representable sample size, which go figure, you chose not to point out in your novel of a response.

I can play Udyr and Rengar at an exceptional level, better than 90% of the league community atm, and I'm still climbing, albeit not really with these champions because the boards and other elo players made Rengar feel like shit to play and Udyr is permabanned, but at least I can say he's ACTUALLY Op at the moment.

And I stated that a 4 ADC team, regardless of your opinion of "omg Adc meta suck", CANNOT beat a competent Katarina or Assassin player. You claim it can happen, which is only ever going to be true if the 4 ADC team just plays better than the opposing team.

I didn't lie about anything. You tried pulling up my Udyr stats and I told you why you were wrong, and in that long drawn out response, you pretended what I said didn't exist, which is usually the case when a counterpoint is brought up against an opponent who is weak at logical debates.

AhhShucksFeb 22, 20168 votes

Here is the issue right now though.

The assassin should be the logical answer to this, and if one gets going they can totally stomp the 3-4 ADC teams.

All of them get stomped in lane by Corki though. So they are guaranteed to be behind.

NephilimiconFeb 22, 201616 votes

Stop complaining about it and let me have my fun Malphite

YfrappefortFeb 23, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Stop complaining about it and let me have my fun

"Sorry Malphite, you are getting nerfed next patch because you counter our precious ADC meta."

Rito 2016

Ralik098Feb 22, 201615 votes

Because ADCs are obscenely overpowered.

alfavhunterFeb 22, 201614 votes

And then Ramus comes to play

MerxamersFeb 22, 201618 votes

Time for a TRUE hero to rise-

Rammus "Ok."

Bodkins OddsFeb 22, 201618 votes

Taric "Outrageous. Truly, truly, truly, outrageous."

ZenithEinFeb 22, 20167 votes

Him, Amumu, and Malphite just chilling and killing these ADC plebs.

KnoyleFeb 23, 20166 votes

When Rammus and Malphite corner someone, Malphite can finally make his joke.

Only Play DariusFeb 22, 201614 votes

Because if they win early, they destroy your towers so quickly that you can't catch up and get strong enough to exploit the weaknesses of their comp

A Miss FortuneFeb 22, 201613 votes

One of my most recent games I had a Quinn top, Graves jungle, Jhin mid, Lucian ADC, and Ashe support. We won the game going 34-11.

Only Play DariusFeb 22, 20166 votes

I hate when I'm last pick ADC and we have Quinn top, Graves jg, and Jhin/Corki mid. Then I get reported for picking Darius or Yasuo botlane.

ZelnorackFeb 22, 20164 votes

Honestly. The fuck are you gonna do? Your team had no front line, so you wanted to fix that, and for trying to do good, everyone gets pissy and reports you straight to oblivion.

Unstoppable MonkFeb 23, 20164 votes

Which is why people who rage at off-meta bot lane in low elo pretty much make everything unpleasant.

Riot makes all these cool changes so you don't have to have marksman in just bot lane, but people lose their minds anyway.

A Miss FortuneFeb 23, 20165 votes

They yell at you until you're the one carrying as Pantheon ADC.

KarfussFeb 22, 201612 votes

Because AD itemization outclasses everything else. It's an Assassins (or ridiculously strong bruisers) vs ADC meta.

SpoofghoulFeb 23, 20164 votes

i think you mean overtuned ball of stats lighfighters like fiora or yi who have an obscene amount of true damage and steroids along with tons of mobility and really powerfull defensive abilities like parry meditate alphastrike

NazZomLordFeb 22, 201612 votes

Draven "DRAVEN DOES IT ALL!"

Phoenix Kotori Feb 22, 20167 votes

Where do people see this shit, I main Quinn mid and top and literally never gotten 4 adc comps and 3 is rare.

Hello I am BirdFeb 23, 20162 votes

Same doe.

I see 3 every now and then when we get a Graves jungle.

Kindred doesn't really count because they were built for the jungle.

HigeRFeb 22, 20163 votes

because people don't understand this game, given this, a well rounder team will steamroll these 4 adcs.

adcs have good damage, but they're squishy and must know how to position, how will they actually set up a teamfight where 4 of them are safe? pick a malphite and kill them all if they dare to group together, an assasin to burst them one by one, a competent long range adc on the back and a support with good CC.

XonraFeb 22, 201612 votes

{quoted}

because people don't understand this game, given this, a well rounder team will steamroll these 4 adcs.

adcs have good damage, but they're squishy and must know how to position, how will they actually set up a teamfight where 4 of them are safe? pick a malphite and kill them all if they dare to group together, an assasin to burst them one by one, a competent long range adc on the back and a support with good CC.

That would be sound logic if it wasn't for the fact that right now, given the balance and itemization of "adcs", they ARE a well rounded team.

Graves can easily clear, gank, and be at the worst a light bruiser as an adc out of the jungle
Quinn is ridiculously mobile, can easily split push, and no melee champ outside of Malphite or Rammus are going to have a good laning phase against her
Corki has the burst of a mage, the dps of an adc, and the engage and disengage of just about anyone, with high poke
Pike a marksman for the adc role and it won't matter too much past that give the other three

People understand the game just fine, hence why they are doing this, because it is the state of the meta. If it wasn't working, you wouldn't be seeing adc jungle, top, and mid in pro play as well as dynamic queue.

HigeRFeb 22, 20161 votes

you are gimping your team by picking this much adcs, understand that adcs alone can't do much since they barely compare in utility to any other class, no matter how much damage they can dish out, once they get suppressed a little their threat dies out. On a lane they might be able to hold themselves enough but once teamfights breakout they MUST use their positioning wisely, once one of them is caught, they'll fall like flies.

Also, pro play has NEVER had 4 adcs (2 at best, maybe) and will never have it because they understand that a buttload of damage without ways of applying it successfully is plainly a bad idea and will be heavily punished by coordinated enemy teams.

But of course solo queue will showcase low level strategies, I just laugh and proceed to melt faces as I'm an adc main and understand the weaknesses of these champions you think so high off.

XonraFeb 23, 20163 votes

{quoted}

you are gimping your team by picking this much adcs, understand that adcs alone can't do much since they barely compare in utility to any other class, no matter how much damage they can dish out, once they get suppressed a little their threat dies out. On a lane they might be able to hold themselves enough but once teamfights breakout they MUST use their positioning wisely, once one of them is caught, they'll fall like flies.

Also, pro play has NEVER had 4 adcs (2 at best, maybe) and will never have it because they understand that a buttload of damage without ways of applying it successfully is plainly a bad idea and will be heavily punished by coordinated enemy teams.

But of course solo queue will showcase low level strategies, I just laugh and proceed to melt faces as I'm an adc main and understand the weaknesses of these champions you think so high off.

You've clearly missed the meta train the past few months if you really believe all of this. I also never said pro play had 4 adcs, so you are just looking for stuff to throw at my response despite even saying it was dynamic queue (I've seen pro games with up to 3 just fyi, not just two, but still speaking directly about dynamic queue regardless. I've seen top/jungle/bot - top/mid/bot that I can remember, which doesn't speak to any of the LPL games I don't watch).