without his instant stun, he is farming mage #112313534
even if he ever becomes good again (which won't happen) no one will play him, he's now a boring champion and I honestly don't feel like farming all game just to be relevant with only 2 spells at my disposal
Very Hard Engage6 votesi want to refund my veigar skins. hes been put into the dumpster.
so now ive been practicing galio/diana mid to fill the void.
SwapShadows10 votesI regret buying his legendary skin so much.
Old veigar was so damn fun and now im left with a broken heart
ActuallyArrow5 votesThey could have at least made it so it slows enemies in the circle.. But nah, it just traps them which isn't much at all..
MrButtermancer5 votesHe's virtually out of the game. He's been my main for years and I can't justify playing him anymore. There's no way he crawls into any kind of competitive play with his current kit. It's entirely dependent on your opponent being stupid. Q doesn't hit if they have mobility or stand behind the minons, so immediately he can't trade in lane. E doesn't actually stun unless your opponent is Bronze. Trapping them isn't enough to even land a meteor, much less win a trade. It's also not going to save you fast enough if somebody's flashed on you or you get closed on.
Saying it's better now because he can farm more in lane is stupid. He HAS to farm more in lane to compensate for the nerfed ulti AP ratio. Also, it doesn't matter if you have 1200 AP if you can't land anything. I don't freakin' care. Make his stun more skillful but not like this. Q MUST be a targeted ability for Veigar to be Veigar at all.
As things lie, he's dead. That patch was absolutely lethal. What you do doesn't matter even close to as much as what your opponent does. He went straight from hard countering Yasuo to being hard countered BY Yasuo. It's pathetic.
Curling Veigar4 votesi dont think hes as bad as you make him out to be
Very Hard Engage3 votes[{quoted}](name=Curling Veigar,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qiJUNAml,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-03-25T22:43:58.553+0000)
i dont think hes as bad as you make him out to be
i dont think you realize how long you've been in the same game before you make that comment....
stuartk113 votes[{quoted}](name=Curling Veigar,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qiJUNAml,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-03-25T22:43:58.553+0000)
i dont think hes as bad as you make him out to be
He's not really that bad, balance wise. He's still a little weak, but the way that they're treating balance changes, that is to be expected.
The problem is that Veigar has become quite boring to play after only a few games, and doesn't really feel unique like he used to. I remember something similar happening to Ahri, and while her change did actually make her stronger, her playstyle was changed to one that seemed healthier. I just feel that Veigar could still have his unique identity kept whilst still staying actually balanced, and that the balance team really missed the mark in keeping him more unique.
The5lacker4 votesIf the only thing keeping Veigar interesting was his ability to instantly stun and kill someone without any hope of them reacting or dodging in any capacity, I don't think he was a particularly healthy champion.
DrCyanide2 votesI don't think his current iteration is particularly healthy for Veigar.
SwapShadows2 votesbump
LoRdJeSuS69694202 votesI agree. He needs to be rewarded in some way for trapping a target inside his stun. Before the changes, the play you needed to make was hitting the edge of the stun immediately. If you missed, the fact that they were trapped inside the circle was just a nice way to buy time for you to run away. Now that they removed the ability to directly stun the target, there has to be some benefit to actually trapping them. ** As is, they can still 1) dodge the w, and 2) retaliate against veigar, which for most champions means they win the trade heavily.**
Maybe if they keep buffing his q his winrate will stabilize, but he still won't be satisfying to play or really make sense as a champion.
air tiger1 votesYea, hopefully Riot will continue to buff/rework him until they find a sweet spot. Right now, he is dull and just feels like a poor pick.
Bergk1 votesHe's OP right now. I just played him. Had 1k AP by 24 minutes. Over 1600 by the end of the game. My ult alone would 1 shot anyone but their tank. I farmed 2 minions per Q all game and between waves used Q two pick up 2 baby raptors from both camps since they're right there lol. Anyway I didn't build mana regen items and never went oom. That mana regen buff in 5.6 was huge! And with 1600 AP I had to buy lichbane. Extra 900 damage auto after every Q. He's the definition of the best defense is a good offense. Who needs escapes when you can 1 shot anyone.
PapaShongo533 votesHe's OP right now. I just played him. Had 1k AP by 24 minutes. Over 1600 by the end of the game. My ult alone would 1 shot anyone but their tank. I farmed 2 minions per Q all game and between waves used Q two pick up 2 baby raptors from both camps since they're right there lol. Anyway I didn't build mana regen items and never went oom. That mana regen buff in 5.6 was huge! And with 1600 AP I had to buy lichbane. Extra 900 damage auto after every Q. He's the definition of the best defense is a good offense. Who needs escapes when you can 1 shot anyone.
The problem that people who played Veigar before have is that what you describe is the complete opposite of how he was played before. Before you could start harassing at level 1 and set the tone as a 100-0 Mage from level 6+. Now you have to farm your Q like Nasus to start destroying people, but unlike him you die immediately when ganked and your stun can no longer reliably save you.
If you're against someone that is just going to push you into your turret all lane you should be fine farming, or if they are playing passive and want to farm as well you're good to go. If you are up against a Zed/LeBlanc/Yasuo who harrass you down and freeze the lane, you're screwed. Old Veigar could trade poke with his Q and land a stun and win, now he gets shit on by them just like everyone else.
That is the problem people are having, not necessarily that he his weak, but his play style changed from 100-0 burst mage to poke down DPS mage Nasus.
Bergk1 votesOMG he has so much poke, it just takes more skill. His Q has a huge range of 950 units. While you're farming you line it up so you get a minion and hit the opposing mid laner. End game you just throw a Q into the enemy team to poke (with Luden's Echo). I had 1600 AP in my last game. So my Q would poke up to 2 targets for over 1,220 magic damage [260 + (1600*.6)] Luden's Echo procs 100+15% AP to FOUR TARGETS (340 magic dmg in my case). Now have Lich Bane (After using an ability, your next basic attack deals 75% base AD (+ 50% AP) bonus magic damage. 1.5 second cooldown.) (95*.75 + 1600*.5) = 871 (of course your using mastery "Arcane Blade" so every auto has +80 magic damage at this point)
So end game, you can SINGLE target poke with just ONE Q followed by an auto attack for 2511 magic damage (1220+340+871+80) - this doesn't even factor in splash damage potential, or his W (because that is rather unreliable). [All of this is modified by magic resistance, but I ran +20 Magic Pen runes]
He's more of an endgame beast than nasus
Hard Penetrator1 votesI think they improve Veigar a bit every patch. In 1-2 months he should be fine. Yes it is kinda long but hey, if they actually make him fun and strong again I can wait.
Ace Access 1 votesthats 1350 IP wasted for me, his old Q made it worthwhile but right now his kit doesn't feel all that useful
"my beloved Q and DFG are gone"
Cilvia1 votesAs a Veigar main, I think this is a slight buff for him. It may not feel like it, but it is. Well at least in my opinion. He has more range now so he can farm safely or snipe someone from afar. Even though they gave a huge change to him stun, it is still useful. It's just hard to land. I never use my stun during laning phase, unless my jungler is delivering a gank or roaming to another lane. It also stopped dashes when the opponent touched the sides of the event horizon when it fully popped up. I never use my stun in lane because I know i'm never going to land it and it cost so much mana. Speaking of mana, his passive got buffed. His passive is way more useful now. 1.5% may sound small, but it's more than 1%. It really helps a lot in lane because you can stack with your Q more often now! What I do is just farm in lane, and poke down your opponent mid laner with your Q. :)
He's a straight up counter to LeBlanc, one of the most used mid laner and a champ that fits in the meta right now! His stun can stop her dash mid-way, better late game (Instant Primordal Burst one-shot!) , and has the Q range to farm to stay out of her W range!
He's still good! Just really difficult to play now! He takes ton of practice now! c:
Solidair31 votesI've been enjoying the changes, especially in this patch. The range increase on Q has really upped my ability to harass and farm at the same time.
And his E isn't TOO hard to land once you're used to it. That being said, his W is pretty much relegated to waveclear, and very difficult to use during the laning phase, but I guess since my goal during lane when I play veigar is to just power up for later, it hasn't affected me too much.
Lord Malice1 votescan we increase the range on his W to match the maximum range on his E so that if by some freak chance you do land it you don't have to kill yourself the cast W by walking up to get in range?
Lord Malice1 voteswithout his instant stun, he is farming mage #112313534
even if he ever becomes good again (which won't happen) no one will play him, he's now a boring champion and I honestly don't feel like farming all game just to be relevant with only 2 spells at my disposal
Totally agree, many other mages do his job but better now, whereas before he and Leblanc were the only two of their class, but they were vastly different in playstyle.
Mohrb1 votesAye, veigar's burst was good, but the main thing he brought to the team was Dat stun. Without a reliable stun, he's basically ahri minus the mobility and charm... or lablanc minus the mobility and clone and silence. Or Annie minus the reliable stun, tower pushing ability, and shield. Yes, veigar still bursts as well as most of them... but the rest bring something to the table to support the team.
Possible fixes: 1-just get rid of the delay. 2- keep the delay but significantly increase the duration to make up for it. 3- keep the delay and duration, but increase the hit area so it's actually difficult to dodge.