Boards›Gameplay

Can we talk about this?

Zerenza··1 votes·1,024 views

Khazix

This guy's been really strong for a really long time, most of season 7, all of season 8 and nothing has been done to him yet for season 9.

https://www.leagueofgraphs.com/champions/overview/khazix http://na.op.gg/champion/khazix/statistics/jungle https://champion.gg/champion/Khazix/Jungle?

He boasts a winrate of 49.9%-51% on 3 separate websites, on 2 of them he has a pickrate of 17 or 18%. The champion is a monster in the jungle, he's great at Counter Jungling, Great at ganking from levels 3+ and a phenomenal duelist. The champion is incredible at getting ahead and incredibly hard to stop when he does get ahead, he's a common pick for ELO Booster's and to top it all off even in a Jungle Meta where EXP was lowered he still manages to rack up kills faster than almost any other jungler. The worst part is that he's been this way for nearly 2 year's, the jungle changes have benefit him more than almost any other champion(because your forced to fight him for your scuttle crab now and you'll most likely lose) and i'm surprised i haven't seen any threads talking about him.

9 Comments

FOR JUSTICE2 votes

uhh...

48-52% is just about the midpoint of balance actually.

Zerenza1 votes

His play rate is insane, the higher the play rate the lower the winrate right. A champion with the skillcap of Kha'zix should not have a 49-51% winrate with an 18% playrate, that's way to far. Champions with playrates above 10% and winrate's above 49% are really strong, especially in the main area where all these stats come from, Platinum+

Butterwood1 votes

Once they get around to nerfing damage and lethality he's going to need a health/base defense buff.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

As For Justice pointed out, your own evidence suggests he isn't actually a problem. And with a massive play rate like that, we have even more reason to trust the evidence that he's actually quite balanced.

Zerenza1 votes

Okay, so last time i checked the higher the playrate the lower the winrate needs to be, why does that not apply to kha'zix?

The Ecdysiast1 votes

{quoted}

Okay, so last time i checked the higher the playrate the lower the winrate needs to be, why does that not apply to kha'zix?

You're twisting the opposite case. It's that the lower the playrate, the higher the win rate should be because extremely low means it's only mains.

That doesn't work the other way, though. A higher play rate shouldn't make a champion under-perform. It simply means we have a larger sample size from which to determine they're balanced.

Zerenza1 votes

I think it works both ways, basically a champion shouldn't be guaranteed good for everybody. Xin Zhao has an 18% playrate with a winrate over 50% on OP.gg(at time of writing.) Lee Sin has a 35% winrate and, again, an over 50% winrate on OP.gg(at time of writing.). Their winrates are too high to validate nearly 50% of all jungler's using them with almost all of them having some form of Success, especially with Lee Sin who's skillcap is said to be one of the highest in the game.

The Ecdysiast1 votes

{quoted}

I think it works both ways, basically a champion shouldn't be guaranteed good for everybody. Xin Zhao has an 18% playrate with a winrate over 50% on OP.gg(at time of writing.) Lee Sin has a 35% winrate and, again, an over 50% winrate on OP.gg(at time of writing.). Their winrates are too high to validate nearly 50% of all jungler's using them with almost all of them having some form of Success, especially with Lee Sin who's skillcap is said to be one of the highest in the game.

What I just explained to you was why it doesn't work both ways.

This game is not a mechanically difficult one. The difficulty lies in your awareness, knowledge, and strategy. Even the most "difficult" characters in the game don't require half the mechanical skill of the easiest character in something like Soul Calibur.

As such, a character who's doing extremely balanced as far as performance but is picked a lot is a result of the popularity of their kit, not their strength. And you could even go a step further and say it's because the impact you have as that champion is balanced that they're more popular. Because when it's due to simple strength, then that champion becomes a top ban instead.

Being a top pick but not a top ban while maintaining a 50% win rate is incredibly good for a champion.

And I don't appreciate you misrepresenting the information you provided about Lee and Xin. You're trying to use the con-man tactic of saying "over 50%" when the actual numbers are LOWER THAN 51%.

So no, their win rates are not too high. They, too, are examples of good balance. Similarly, claiming, "nearly 50% of all junglers use them," is a flat out lie because their numbers cannot overlap. A person playing Lee is not playing Xin.

Xin Zhao is an extremely mechanically simple champion, so it stands to reason his performance would be even throughout if his stats are in a balanced state. On the other hand, Lee Sin is not as difficult as people who play him want to pretend he is.

Evidently, the information you can use to determine skill cap is a champion's performance relative to games played, not the other way around. You don't act like a champion is hard and then set their stats low so that only mains can get a 50% win rate on them.

Saezio1 votes

He wasn't like this in season 7. Damage across the board was normal. Many people used to even build him tank in competitive

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Zerenza

I'm so sick and tired of Nasus existing.
Gameplay127 comments
82
votes
Why aren't more items Melee only.
Gameplay107 comments
78
votes
What if Tiamat built into an AP item?
Gameplay152 comments
78
votes
Soooooo when we getting Twitch Nerfs?
Gameplay49 comments
61
votes
The ADC role is the only role where 95% of games have one class in said role.
Gameplay104 comments
59
votes
Making Kayn's Q a Double Cast Ability.
Gameplay45 comments
56
votes