BF Sword, Large Rod Need Build Paths

IziMytTJd7·Apr 3, 2015·2 votes·696 views

15 Comments

LXIIApr 3, 20158 votes

I think the point of them is that you don't get a power spike of any kind until you save enough to buy them..

IziMytTJd7Apr 3, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=RYN Flux,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-04-03T18:53:00.225+0000)

I think the point of them is that you don't get a power spike of any kind until you save enough to buy them..

They are as cost-effective as all other items near their cost. Yet all the other items have build paths. So no, that's not it.

LXIIApr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Harry Balzack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-04-03T22:20:16.057+0000)

They are as cost-effective as all other items near their cost. Yet all the other items have build paths. So no, that's not it.

And that my friend, is where you're wrong. We'll just use the rod as an example here. Dig deep and think of another item that gives a flat 80 ap. If you buy two blasting wands instead you're spending 1720.. so that's out. Maybe 4 amp tomes? Nope, that just cost you 1740. I guess you could Aether Wisp? but that's only 30 ap at the price of 850. Also not worth. Codex is 30 at 820. You see where this is going.

Do the same for bf sword, I don't feel like typing it all out.

IziMytTJd7Apr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=RYN Flux,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-04T01:40:48.507+0000)

And that my friend, is where you're wrong. We'll just use the rod as an example here. Dig deep and think of another item that gives a flat 80 ap. If you buy two blasting wands instead you're spending 1720.. so that's out. Maybe 4 amp tomes? Nope, that just cost you 1740. I guess you could Aether Wisp? but that's only 30 ap at the price of 850. Also not worth. Codex is 30 at 820. You see where this is going.

Do the same for bf sword, I don't feel like typing it all out.

You gave all examples of items under 900g. Every item with a build path gets more cost-efficient the deeper you go into its build. So of course BF and large rod are more cost efficient than the items you listed- they cost twice as much. There's just no logical reason keep these items without a build path besides player inconvenience. Admittedly it's fair since it's inconvenient for everyone. But it's just like creep block, nothing positive comes out of it.

LXIIApr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Harry Balzack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-04T01:54:02.433+0000)

You gave all examples of items under 900g. Every item with a build path gets more cost-efficient the deeper you go into its build. So of course BF and large rod are more cost efficient than the items you listed- they cost twice as much. There's just no logical reason keep these items without a build path besides player inconvenience. Admittedly it's fair since it's inconvenient for everyone. But it's just like creep block, nothing positive comes out of it.

So what you're saying is if I complete another item entirely then it's worth more than the 1550 or 1600 I spend on those? What a breakthrough! But again your point is completely vaporized by the fact that these items also build into the strongest items for their stat.

My real question here is, why? How is it even an issue to acquire that much gold before first back?

TheSlogsApr 4, 20152 votes

Or you can get good and have enough gold to buy them :O

IziMytTJd7Apr 4, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Or you can get good and have enough gold to buy them :O

That is stupid enough to be said by a silver.

IziMytTJd7Apr 4, 20151 votes

For your 1st part, I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

And for the question: if you are losing lane and can't sustain, you will have big problems when trying to get those items. You will have to go back and either abandon pursuing those items, or just not buying anything in an attempt to save up. For the second case, then you fall even further behind having to go back to lane with no items.

LXIIApr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Harry Balzack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-04-04T02:04:24.243+0000)

For your 1st part, I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

And for the question: if you are losing lane and can't sustain, you will have big problems when trying to get those items. You will have to go back and either abandon pursuing those items, or just not buying anything in an attempt to save up. For the second case, then you fall even further behind having to go back to lane with no items.

Nooo, I think it's the world that doesn't understand what you're trying to say. It's a statistical fact that the large rod is one of the most gold efficient items (barring Magus), and you just can't accept that for some reason. And if you fall behind in lane you have to buy other stuff.. that's the whole point of winning lane. It wouldn't make sense if winning your lane didn't put the other guy at a disadvantage.

IziMytTJd7Apr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=RYN Flux,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2015-04-04T02:06:54.040+0000)

Nooo, I think it's the world that doesn't understand what you're trying to say. It's a statistical fact that the large rod is one of the most gold efficient items (barring Magus), and you just can't accept that for some reason. And if you fall behind in lane you have to buy other stuff.. that's the whole point of winning lane. It wouldn't make sense if winning your lane didn't put the other guy at a disadvantage.

Losing lane already puts you at a disadvantage in many ways. Poor build paths shouldn't be one of them.

LXIIApr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Harry Balzack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-04-04T02:11:59.033+0000)

Losing lane already puts you at a disadvantage in many ways. Poor build paths shouldn't be one of them.

I'm convinced you don't understand your own argument now.. The disadvantage should most definitely be that you don't get the really good items as fast as the other guy. You have to back at 4 minutes with 15 cs? Kiss that bf sword goodbye, you didn't earn it.

IziMytTJd7Apr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=RYN Flux,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-04T02:14:34.492+0000)

I'm convinced you don't understand your own argument now.. The disadvantage should most definitely be that you don't get the really good items as fast as the other guy. You have to back at 4 minutes with 15 cs? Kiss that bf sword goodbye, you didn't earn it.

It's funny because you are the one who actually doesn't understand. I am NOT saying "if you get beat up in lane and have bad cs you should still get the item you want".

What I AM saying is "If you get beat up in lane you should still be able to spend the gold you DO have (as long as its a fair amount) towards building the item you want".

Think of it this way: Say I really want to buy a Mejai's soulstealer after my 1st back. But I get ganked/ beaten up and have to go back before I get the required 1400 gold. Of course I am not saying "I should still be able to get Soulstealer even though I don't have the money for it" like you seem to think I am saying. However, I can still get the Amp Tome!! See how that works?? I don't get any sort of "unfair advantage". I spend the money I have towards building the item I want. Is it clear now what I am saying? I honestly don't know how you are getting so confused.

LXIIApr 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Harry Balzack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=piKT2Ajt,comment-id=00020000000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-04T02:26:20.900+0000)

It's funny because you are the one who actually doesn't understand. I am NOT saying "if you get beat up in lane and have bad cs you should still get the item you want".

What I AM saying is "If you get beat up in lane you should still be able to spend the gold you DO have (as long as its a fair amount) towards building the item you want".

Think of it this way: Say I really want to buy a Mejai's soulstealer after my 1st back. But I get ganked/ beaten up and have to go back before I get the required 1400 gold. Of course I am not saying "I should still be able to get Soulstealer even though I don't have the money for it" like you seem to think I am saying. However, I can still get the Amp Tome!! See how that works?? I don't get any sort of "unfair advantage". I spend the money I have towards building the item I want. Is it clear now what I am saying? I honestly don't know how you are getting so confused.

But what you're saying there is that you can buy ONE item of the recipe. Well surprise, everything that builds out of bf and rod also have.. wait for it.. OTHER COMPONENTS! Shocker! So you want the Zhonya's but you got smacked? Amp tome. Want a Luden's, but you got poked right out of lane? Amp tome. Trying to get that Deathcap and you did alright in lane? Blasting wand. You're never forced to buy the bigger ingredient. It's just what people do since it's more gold efficient. But if you don't have the gold you just get the other pieces and try to do better.

ZACKandATTACKApr 4, 20151 votes

They give a huge power spike, so you have to choose between buying smaller items and getting a quicker power spike or saving up gold to get a huge power spike.

IziMytTJd7Apr 4, 20151 votes

You are right, and that does help the situation. But ultimately you will still have to save up that lump sum. And in most games it's not a problem and just happens naturally. But in some cases it becomes a problem, especially when you are already behind.