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Some time ago, I said the recent W change to Diana wasn't good enough. I was wrong.

Beats29··16 votes·2,482 views

http://matchhistory.euw.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-history/EUW1/35546018

I was wrong. Seriously, I must admit, I failed on my judgement when I said it didn't helped her enough. I didn't QQ as some people did, I just sincerly said my opinion and my thoughts of what could possibly happen. Here's where I said my opinion.

Again, I didn't QQ to Riot, just expressed my concern. Even though, since Riot is struggling so much against comunity feedback due to recent patches (cough Veigar and Kassading cough cough), I feel we also must admit that Riot was right on some of the changes they did.

Diana is great at the moment. Her pre 6 isn't the best, she's very item dependent, has little escapes, but hey, anyone needs it's cons. She's a great assassin late game, great to shut down a carry and snowballs pretty hard. While extremely fun to play and strong vs squishy targets, she isn't obnoxious against the right comp, as well lane phase. And this is what I call a good assassin theme.

Riot did great on Diana, with such a little change and therefore, I was wrong. Good Job Riot.

41 Comments

Whitakker4 votes

Dammit, here I was enjoying my sleeper freelo. Now that Diana just saw some LCS love, the nerf bats are coming her way...again. She's been getting quietly buffed ever since last season's changes to Lich Bane.

Plz Rito, don't touch my Moon Lady. She's fine as she is.

D1rtFarmer1 votes

yea... wasnt trying to bring anymore attention to her... are probably about to take her out again

Beats291 votes

The changes were slight, I don't think Riot will change her unless her counters get more guted.

pleep2 votes

The second something appears in the LCS.......... these brainless idiots

Beats292 votes

I don't care about LCS, I care about what I play. I did this due to my results after the W changes, not because she was at LCS. I already played her a lot on jungle before the W change.

Actually, she was a bit on hold till I tried her a bit better with the new item on a custom. I actually like the change and that's why I'm playing her, if you see the date is before Katowice.

Baron of Bread1 votes

Diana was in the LCS? I might actually want to see that game. Which one was it?

SaltyKracka1 votes

presumably IEM Katowice, where SK used her to some success and WE to...less success.

goldensilver091 votes

I knew diana was strong, but she showed up at LCS?! Mid lane? Jungle? Oh gawd... Nerf incoming D:

PerishSoftly1 votes

I actually view Diana as a very effective maxCDR fighter more than an assassin. That however might be my dislike of playing full assassins who blow up if you make the slightest mistake or get predicted.

My usual build path for... Jungle: item 3706 into item 3047, item 3708, item 3110 core. Then 3 situational items from: item 3001 item 3091 item 3157 item 3068 item 3116 item 3060 item 3075

Lane: item 1056 into item 3001 / item 3110 depending on my lane opponent, then item 3027 /item 3068 to further shut them down and become bulky.

In all cases, I max W over Q if I know there will be melee range trading (so always in the jungle) in order to maximize effective HP.

Beats291 votes

I cover the fighter part building Nashor's Tooth along with Lich Bane, it gives a good DPS as well CDR. I don't think you need that heavy itemization (besides some exceptions ofc), Zhyona with Abyssal is more than enough. I strongly recomend you using Nashor's instead Wit's end, it really synergizes well with Lich Bane, her passive and the cdr part. It's a core item to me.

aaronconlin1 votes

I always build Nashor's and Lich Bane on Diana, they synergize with her passive and Attack speed bonus so well

Hyrum Graff1 votes

I strongly recomend you using Nashor's instead Wit's end

I'd say it depends on how much CDR you have elsewhere in her build.

Bard in a Diaper1 votes

why are you showing us your bronze match history as if that makes a champion good or something

i could literally go 30-0 with any champion at that elo

Crett10 votes

[{quoted}](name=Quinn Caused 911,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=p80aJgbG,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-03-16T03:53:24.077+0000) i could literally go 30-0 with any champion at that elo

Janna

UPfreely5 votes

Veigar

ForgiveColour1 votes

this is why typing out an essay about champion balance doesnt make you know anything about champion balance

Opistach1 votes

I made a thread stating that Diana should be the balance economy for Assassins awhile ago. Got downvoted alot :>

Takeuchi 171 votes

I never played diana until the nemesis draft where i got pitted againts a yorick. absolutely wrecked him and immediately bought her after that. shes such a fun champion and i enjoy jungling with her. she does have a very slow start up but once she gets rolling its just ridiculous. I love where shes at right now and I hope to god rito doesnt change her. I'm not that great with her admittedly but from the games I have played I feel shes pretty balanced and in a very good spot.

Chessburger1 votes

How do you manage your mana? Do you take the first 3 blue buffs? That's the main issue I had with diana jungle.

Hyrum Graff1 votes

Runes. Run something like:

  • Armor Yellows
  • Your choice of blues (I'd go scaling MR)
  • AP Quints
  • 5 hybrid pen reds and 4 AS reds

You can do a couple more AS reds if your clear is hurting.

Level W-Q-W-Q-E, then max R>Q>W>E.

Save your smite for Gromp/Blue/Red, and maybe Krugs -- your AOE will kill wolves and razorbacks fast enough. By the same token, try to save your shield for wolves/razorbacks as much as you can, because it'll do more against those camps.

You can make it if you only take the first blue, although your clear will be slightly slower. If you don't take the 2nd blue or onward, your clear is slightly slower, but not that bad.

You can also start krugs. The AS reds will let you stun more, so you'll take less damage, especially from camps with 1 strong monster (ones to use smite against).

RogueWill1 votes

I go

*Armor yellows *scaling mr blues *ad quint *magic pen red

basically die to the extra AD I can kill the camps with just a shield.

Beats292 votes

You don't need the extra AD if you go with hybrid pen. Also, you'll lose power when procing the passive.

RogueWill1 votes

You do if you want to give the second blue so you don't have to go so deep in your mana pool.

as for losing power on your passive, you gain the extra 8adx3 attacks so you still have 24AD extra damage which is larger than the 15*0.8 extra magic damage you get from your passive.

Beats291 votes

Like I said, I dont get without mana because I dont overuse abilities. If you need some smiting blue before mid takes gives already a decent chunk of mana. If you keep getting without mana then you're the one who needs to control better.

Beats291 votes

Hi there,

Personally I don't think she has mana issues, unless you overuse the abilities. I believe many people underestimate her passive, specially with Nashor's Tooth. Just rush AS on 1st levels. When laning I even sometimes kill the enemy by just flashing to proc the passive on the target along with ignite. It's very underestimated.

Also, unlike some said below, I personally just use hybrid pen without AS on runes. If the enemy doesn't have high magic damage, then go with AP/AP per level blues to give more power to the passive.

Basicly, if you're jungling rush Nashor's Tooth. If you're laning rush Abyssal or Zhyona, depending on the lane.

Chessburger1 votes

But there's an issue with it for me. If you're top lane nashor rush makes a lot of sense in some matchups because the damage is what you said and you can wail on them for longer periods of time. Rushing it on jungle seems iffy to me. You usually can't stick to them for more than 2s during a gank in which case an item that helps your burst would work a lot better.

I'd mostly rush Zhonya after magus and only then maybe go nashor's but still it seems like a lot of money for not much of a bang. It depends on your and enemy comp and how long you can stick to your target before they escape/you die. Zhonya's is a really important item to get as fast as possible on all in melee mages like diana and gragas. I would never delay it for some measly attack speed and cdr (you get 20% from magus anyway).

Beats291 votes

It isn't iffy at all. Some players even use AS reds on Amumu and Cho'gath for example to help their clears. While you can also use AS on Diana, it's more benefical using hybrid because it also helps on her scaling, as well helps procing the passive. Don't forget the passive is also AoE. And the more AS you have, the faster you clear the jungle and the faster you gain xp and gold for the rest of the itemization.

Also, don't forget that her pre 6 doesn't have a gap closer, and you're forced to go melee range anyway. Yes Zhyona is a core item on her, but the build path is too expensive to rush on jungle. It's very hard to get 1600g on jungle unless you farm fast. And that's where the Nashor helps. While Nashor is also an expensive item, the buildpath is more useful and easy to do on jungle than the Zhyona.

Her role on jungle is a bit diferent. When laning you're role is to try 1v1 and to delete a target, on jungle her role late game is more to initiate fights to soak damage. But those 5v5 usually don't happen that early.

Don't get me wrong, I completly understand your point, but the Zhyona's buildpath is so hard to get on jungle that, if you fall early you'll have a bad time in recovering. Keep it safe, go for itemization that's easy to build. And Diana is lucky because Nashor helps not only at clearing jungle, but also provides vital stats to her scalling late game like cdr and more dmg on procing the passive.

Chessburger1 votes

ofc, I use AS reds on almost all tank/ap junglers. I almost always rush zhonya on gragas, the 1.6k g at once for a large rod is a bit expensive but I mostly don't have many problems with that. If all else fails I can meanwhile upgrade my shoes to sorcs and build a seeker's.

I don't have as much experience with diana so I can't say for certain. Would have to try both ways for some games to get a feel for it.

Saixos1 votes

Heya, Diana is pretty much the only jungler that I'm good at and can carry with.

I actually feel that it's situational between nashors and lich bane as a second item on Diana jungle. The thing with zhonyas is that it's partially to soak damage from AD enemies, but in the jungle with your shield and trailblazers it's really not needed. Since you're mainly spending time in the jungle, it's perfectly fine to delay it as most of the time you'll be the one initiating the fights/picking and choosing your fights, so you shouldn't need zhonyas in the early game.

The thing with nashors is that it's mainly for extended fights, better for late game when diana takes on a role similar to riven. Lich is what I choose if I'm not needed for extended fights, as it's better for bursting people down and you'll prolly proc it 1/2/3 times in a gank. And while nashors makes you use your passive more often for clearing, lich has a nice bit of bonus mana which helps you clear if you choose it (more mana is a good interaction with rangers as well).

Beats291 votes

I use AS reds on some as well but Diana isnt one of them. Like I sais, imo hybrid pen is more rewarding. But that depends on player preference of course

Chessburger1 votes

I tried nashors today. Had just enough for a fiendish codex on a buy after magus. It was so underwhelming... I'd get a lot more value from going cloth armor + tome. I ended up finishing zhonya first because it just wasn't working out. There was no way in hell rushing nashor's would do anything. Especially since they had a lot of AD damage. That zhonya saved my game and I did nashor finish as a 3rd item but it was still not good for the money I spent. It could work against certain comps as a 4th item I feel, or if I went for a more bruiser-ish build. It just does almost nothing when you rely on going in bursting and disrupting for a bit with E then try to bait important CC with a zhonya and then do whatever you can after the golden statue. Maybe nashor's would work against lower elo people with bad reaction times but as it stands I was barely getting 1 passive proc off before being peeled off.

To each his own I guess but I'll put a pause on the nashor's unless I'm going for the bruiser hard engage build that would thrive off of 40% cdr and multiple passive procs.

Beats291 votes

You're the one who knows what it feels better man, I've just expressed my opinion. To me and to most, Nashor's good on Diana.

Chessburger1 votes

Yeah, meant no offense I'm just trying to articulate my thoughts as to why I'd say something :)

Beats291 votes

It's fine mate, I'm also only trying to help. It's just how I feel better with her :)

Sentinel Hydra1 votes

Diana's on free week now, and by what you say about her, I'm gonna try her.

Beats291 votes

1 tip, don't fear to dive on late game with shield and procing passive. Imo those are the abilities that are more underated on her. Sometimes on lane I get kills by just stacking on minions to flash and proc the passive along with ignite to take a kill.

Hyrum Graff1 votes

I love trading with my opponent by stacking the auto, then R-W-AA-E, then hit them with my Q on the way out. It's over 200% AP in the blink of an eye, and then if you can dodge their retribution, you walk off pretty scot-free. Yeah, you're down your ult for 20 sec or so, but you can usually farm with Q for that long, until you can do it again.

Celeste Benal1 votes

Diana was the second champ I bought after Jinx. Always liked her. But couldn't really play her effectively. I've picked her up a gain a little bit just to see how she is doing. Its nice that she is getting a little love. The slight nerf to the jungle should make her more viable.

KaisadiIIa1 votes

I hope my Diana never gets popular again D:

TheLordPrism1 votes

My Diana is really free this week? :( man that sucks.... I hate when my main is free to play. I was going to play my provis this week too...... When champions are free can you still use them in ranked?

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