Juggernauts and tanks get buffed the same way despite having opposite problems

Moody P··2 votes·857 views

A tank is generally much more desirable in high elo or competitive because their kits strongly support coordinated play, sometimes unreasonably.

A juggernaut is usually disproportionately strong in lower brackets because their kits naturally punish in coordinated play but often fall off the higher up the ladder you seek because of their difficulty applying their damage or their lack of utility.

If Riot wants to buff a tank to be more playable across the ladder, we get damage buffs. Their recent philosophy of oodles of CC and pathetic damage leads to this and Riot has rightfully started changing back.

If Riot wants the same for a juggernaut, to attempt to improve them in the ranks they suffer they most, we get... Damage buffs.

Despite how much boards complains about tanks having better damage (a valid complaint for Ornn, to be fair), this method has consistently succeeded.

However, we've seen Riot do this approach for juggernauts several times, and it generally hasn't worked favorably; Darius and Nasus being the 2 most recent examples I can pull, who see noticeable improvements in low end games but continue to job it up in higher brackets. Most juggernauts are not wanting for damage; the buffs that prove most effective are things that improve usability. Urgot last year having his delays reduced, lockouts removed turned him from irrelevant to extremely pro dominant; Yorick's changes to his summon accessibility just this patch has skyrocketed his performance. Things that make them more reliable or raise their skill ceiling have had the best effect. Things like adding tenacity to Garen's W, incentivizing and rewarding good timing. Volibear gaining a knockback on E reinvigorated a long dead champion and had him seeing pro play.

On the flip side, Nasus has struggled to maintain a consistent high elo performance for years, both because he is very meta dependent and because his utility's a shell of its former self. Trundle having his pillar neutered has absolutely destroyed the champion across ALL ranks.

The only juggernaut I can think of who benefited from a damage bonus was Dr. Mundo gaining the attack reset on his E. But Dr. Mundo has naturally lended himself to being strongest in higher ELO anyway, so I consider him an exception.

Damage buffs to juggernauts are rarely necessary and don't fix what makes them bad in high elo. Utility and accessibility buffs have the best effects. Tank stats being good also helps in making them good champions.

Lastly, I would like to assert that buffs and changes unrelated to damage would do a much better job stabilizing the champion to not NEED these changes. Nasus gets his damage buffed in disgusting ways once a year for the past 2(3?) years and he still flops in high elo.

4 Comments

Alzon1 votes

> Mentons Volibear > Immediately uses the phrase “on the flip side”

Oof

Moody P1 votes

What are you implying?

Lovelle1 votes

It honestly seems like no one on the balance team actually plays juggernauts. Not only is their itemization awful, but they always get hard nerfs without reasonable compensation. For example, they gutted Trundle's E and nerfed his base damage, which hurts many aspects of his playstyle. However, they didn't compensate him at all for players that aren't in the top/competitive brackets. If he's not allowed to have decent pillar ganks for half the game, they could at least buff the slow on his Q, or reduce the mana cost of his W).

Moody P1 votes

Try to catch Meddler on his posts and ask about Trundle. He deserves better.

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