urgot shows up as a dark horse candidate and does well because he was a good pick into the comps and you parrots immediately start crowing about how you knew he was OP for ages lol
its hilarious how you guys ask for diversity until that diversity might threaten the champs you play. not even a week for people to develop a response to urgots new dominance
D357R0Y3R36 votesi'm all for urgot to be played in pro just don't want him to hit 100% pick/ban
same way i'm all for gnar nerfs because of the same reason
saltran8 votesGnar is already far from 100% pick ban, if that's the reason you shouldn't want more nerfs for him.
D357R0Y3R4 votesexcept that the only champions who are played that aren't gnar are aatrox tanks and gp and minus aatrox they all do fine against gnar
gnar is a champion in pro that gives players a condition when they pick toplaners: "can your champion do fine against gnar" and this is fucking annoying for diversity the option to ban him is there but you don't want to waste a ban on gnar when so much overpowered shit exists
Urgot right now has 100% presence in patch 8.17 with 80% win rate
Tormentula2 votesGnar is far from pick-ban in solo queue
in pro play he's a menace that can't seem to be stopped while hurting solo queue.
saltran1 votesDude I watch pro play and even there he is not pick/ban champ, there are just better toplane picks right now.
My Waifu Vanilla7 votesYou dont seem to understand the problem with Gnar. It's not that he IS picked it is that he CAN be picked. You cannot blind pick over half the tank roster in pro without banning Gnar. If you pick Cho without seeing your enemy lane opponent and Gnar isnt banned then congrats you get one of the worst lane match ups in the game. He warps first picking top lane because he hard counters over half the top laners.
saltran1 votesNo he is not like that right now, if that was the case he would had a really higher pickrate due to how many tank toplaners are first picked like it happened in previous metas.
My Waifu Vanilla1 votesRight NOW. Gnar has received basically only nerfs since his release. His design is incredibly limiting and if he is REMOTELY a good pick he warps too lane around himself harder than every other champion in the game. It's why champions like Draven, Lucian, and Caitlyn are also problematic because they invalidate over half the roster that goes bot lane. If Draven is a tier 1 ADC you physically cannot pick something like Twitch, Trist, or Kogmaw without going 50 CS down or 0/3. When Gnar is good you cant pick the likes of current Sion (so no E max anymore) or Cho since you WILL get zoned off almost every creep since he is going to pelt you to the end of the earth where you can do NOTHING about it.
saltran1 votesYeah, but I do think we are talking about balance right now, and I'm not saying that he should be buffed so he is back to the unbalanced state he was for a long time as you described.
I'm just saying that right now I dont think he needs more nerfs, just that.
BigBellBrute19 votesDiversity around here means buff my champ and nerf everything else.
RiotRiot MapleNectar17 votesFwiw - we have no plans of touching Urgot for World's at the moment. We're acknowledging that he could be a risk of pick/ban, but we'd also have to act on a lot of assumptions at the moment. We might yet, but we talked about him at length yesterday and we're going to leave him as is.
Wacky93 votesIs there a particular reason that Riot doesn't just share all of the balancing data they use to make decisions when they make decisions? I understand that it could get complicated, but you guys have to have it aggregated to be able to analyze it. I just am annoyed that all the patches say things like "X champion is looking too strong in low-elo right now" without sharing exactly what that means. Much of the toxicity on these Boards is related to the difference between how people perceive balance vs. how balance actually works and official Riot-gathered data on gameplay in general would be really interesting to look through and helpful for people that don't understand the rationale behind changes that are being made.
Jeddy0176 votesIn before Urgot help a team win Worlds & is selected for one of the World's skins.
Xilixer2 votesgood. Urgod may show mercy upon you.
Draconic PoweR1 votes[{quoted}](name=Riot MapleNectar,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ms3JMf9I,comment-id=0015,timestamp=2018-09-11T20:41:24.037+0000)
Fwiw - we have no plans of touching Urgot for World's at the moment. We're acknowledging that he could be a risk of pick/ban, but we'd also have to act on a lot of assumptions at the moment. We might yet, but we talked about him at length yesterday and we're going to leave him as is.
Did you guys happen to talk about RekSai...or is the Queen going to continue to be ignored by the balance team? Buff her already...
EROTIC RAID BOSS1 votesProbably a mistake. I meanright this second I hear pros like goldenglue on twitch saying yeah this champ is not balanced. mid especially seems kinda dumb
that said, adding aatrox renekton and urgot top sounds like way more fun than watching cho and ornn only
Sire Hippington15 votesIt's like with everyone complaineing about 'balanceing for proplay' since they aren't proplayers, and yet they all blindly follow the pro meta and picks. Urgots soloQ pickrate trippled since he was used in pro...
Yordle Xayah10 votesI'll take stability >>> diverse meta any day. But that's just me.
Saianna4 votesWho said diverse meta cannot be stable?
As long as all champions are treated equal and meta has time to calm down and you balance champions properly, rather than "WHAT DOES THAT +10000 TRUE DAMAGE SWITCH DO xDdddd", then you'd have stable, diverse meta. it really can be done. All it takes is willpower, time and good balance team... Oh...
ankoanko192 votesSo in other words, Tristana should never be meta?
Yordle Xayah1 votesSo in other words, Tristana should never be meta?
Sure, I wouldn't mind if she wasn't ever meta at all. That's how she was for a long time before THE crit buffs, remember? Nobody remembers for how long she was not relevant, and I never had a problem with that actually. I wouldn't even mind a rework that let them buff her without busting the game open. So yeah, I really don't mind Trist not being meta. I didn't get my million+ points during the Trist Flavor of the Month age.
Daddy Ants2 votesSure, I wouldn't mind if she wasn't ever meta at all. That's how she was for a long time before THE crit buffs, remember? Nobody remembers for how long she was not relevant, and I never had a problem with that actually. I wouldn't even mind a rework that let them buff her without busting the game open. So yeah, I really don't mind Trist not being meta. I didn't get my million+ points during the Trist Flavor of the Month age.
You mean Tristana Flavor of the Season
She was S+ tier for the entire of Season 7 along side Twitch.
Yordle Xayah2 votesYou mean Tristana Flavor of the Season
She was S+ tier for the entire of Season 7 along side Twitch.
Sorry, but you're mistaken about Tristana. I don't know anything about Twitch, but about Trist I'm not sure if you're just uninformed or just ignore the facts and pretend she was that good "the entire of Season 7" which is just a lie.
The fact is that Tristana was so bad at one point, that not only did she have a miserable play rate, but she spent several months in the bottom 3 worst ADC in the game. Patches like 7.13 for instance where she was the 14th worst ADC if we go by win rates, which aren't everything, but do paint a general picture of where a character is at the time.
Her only buff happened in 7.3 and she continued to perform very poorly until the horrendous Ardent Censer meta came about, which was an external factor to the character.
Here's a fun one for you. Let's see how S+ Tier Trist really was in 2017...
That's all games she had in Spring in any major region World Wide. She wasn't played a single time in NA, LPL or Korea. Those games you see were one on Hjarnan in the regular season, and then two from Rekkles in Spring playoffs. She lost all three games she was in. This was in April after the 7.3 buff.
She didn't see any play again till June, where Rekkles played her for the first time again in FNATIC's match against Misfits. Turns out even then she still wasn't considered meta, as she wasn't played till the 24th, again by Rekkles, and then the 29th. People then tried to pick her up. She lost her 4 next matches in a row.
She then actually becomes meta around July, Only three months prior to Worlds (This crap btw 
) which was followed by Pre Season and the IE+Shiv nonsense meta I've attacked a lot in older posts.
So as history and raw stats clearly show, she was in fact not "S+ Tier" for "the entire of Season 7" but rather the final months of the season. Stats are stats. It's not my opinion, it's the raw truth about the state of a character.
I get a bit of a hater vibe from you, and I'm starting to wonder where this conversation will go. I'm not sure I'll continue answering. I've lay down the stats and stated how I'll play her regardless of the meta. If you wanna try to go against stats, say I won't play her if she isn't strong or make stuff up like "she was s+ tier the entire season 7" you aren't gonna get anything else from me.
Bottom line: I don't care if she is or isn't meta. I don't mind if she's good or bad, I just play the character I enjoy regardless. I reached 1M points in April of 2017, with most of the grind happening in 2016.
Ryusaether3 votesLul like that's a problem. Probably one of the most annoying ADCs out there.
Crit scaling ADC with good escape that can be buffered to avoid CCs (therefore difficult to gank), that resets on takedowns or fully charged bomb, insane pushing power and fast at taking objectives, on demand steroids and a get-off-me point and click ultimate. All her kit is point and click (except rocket jump but who actually cares) and she gets access to insane range the more levels she has.
Yeah definitely a good time to be alive when she's meta.
Phoneixflare1 votesyeah, they really should remove the buffering element because it's a bit unfair.
Sewer Side9 votesI'll take stability >>> diverse meta any day. But that's just me.
Stability in league is picking between either 3 ADCs, 2 junglers, or 5 mid laners.
Arcane Blue Boi6 votes''Botlane is so boring! only marksmen can play in it Riot: we've got'ya ''Wtf riot why did you allow other champions to be played on the bottom lane im quitting bye''
what
Weiner the Pooh2 votesBecause the top comment is viewers of LCS/mid(read mage) players. And the bottom comment is adc players after they couldn’t play in their lane because the items their champs use were made absolute ass.
3TWarrior1 voteswell, that wasn't what the problem was about
at the time, everyone was complaining about damage(and still are) well, riot decided to experiment and only changed marksmen(the most volatile class as always)
instead of lowering all overall damage, they lowered one source of it many years too late and did it in a way that caused marksmen to suffer because they would never hit their powerspikes
I'm all for marksmen getting weaker and I love diversity, though it would have been appreciated if they had not done it in such a static manner that just made it where anything that can stat-check the crit-based marksmen became the new meta
JoeAnarchy4 votesok, but now i'm just imagining Urgot singing "Dark horse" by katy perry.. thanks alot for that [slayer-jinx-unamused]
3TWarrior1 votesnow imagine urgot singing "Trogdor" in a robot voice XD which makes me think of blitzcrank doing the same XD
option paralysis3 votesi like how you talk like all the people that said they want diversity are the same exact people that talk shit about urgot. that's a really sound logic,
SpecterVonBaren2 votesOh so the people that are complaining about Urgot now shouldn't have to answer for not complaining about him before and not disputing the people that were saying he was weak?
TheDangerousTaco3 votesthis needs to be upvoting a billion times. spread the word people
SugeMinPikk3 votesAs long as Irelia isn't meta when I want to play top and Eve isn't meta when I want to play mid, I'm fine with the game's state
######fuck those champs xd
saltran2 votesIrelia is meta right now, but on midlane.
Fury Reaver1 votesIrelia is meta everywhere
Reziztor3 votesPeople should just adapt to the meta, it will have ups and downs but it is still balanced in that sense. Except for Z O E, thats another subject
F Ù Ń1 votesPeople should just adapt to the meta, it will have ups and downs but it is still balanced in that sense. Except for Z O E, thats another subject Dude please grow up. It’s Zoe, she got nerfed hard, u happy? 43% winrate and now it’s going to plummet even lower b/c of you. A person that can’t dodge SKILLSHOTS. Zoe has her time in the Meta for 6 months, and got nerfed hard for it. Also I bet Zoe counters one of your characters
Phoneixflare2 votesZoe was oneshotting champions legitimately from 100% hp from a massive range away at no risk to herself and getting 3-4 free flashes typically and movespeed bonuses. and the aoe the bubble leaves was a zoning tool that really wasnt fair.
Leetri3 votesMy main issue with champions like Urgot being dominant/great in pro play is that now people might start to ban him and if I do get to pick him they'll try to flame me with "Urgot is so OP, you only play him because he's broken" when I've loved and played Urgot since even before they reworked him. Same thing happened with Viktor, despite the fact that I've considered him my main ever since he was released in 2011. I'd rather Urgot was slightly weaker and less popular so I got to play a champion I enjoy.
Dingding1232 votesLike, at this point in Season 8 is anyone surprised that the champions that deal the most damage are the most popular to play?
ChallengerTier2 votesyea, im really sad we couldnt have maokais soloing adcs while taking 100 dmg per auto with 4k hp
Stephenizgod2 votesFirst off, Urgot has always been ridiculous. Just not many people knew about him until Pro's started to realize he can be insanely strong. Is he OP? No not really, at least not compared to the major offenders. Does he need nerfs? Perhaps buffing other champions would be better, but yea maybe he does need some.
Second off, if people are finding a lot of success on him now that he has been uncovered as a dominant pick, doesn't that mean he has always been dominant? Like just because he wasn't well known before doesn't mean he wasn't always imbalanced.
Urgot is strong and needs a bit of tweaking, it is really not fun facing him in lane. Nothing major though, just enough that it isn't a death sentence Top lane if you don't completely counter him. But I find it funny the hypocritical comments in this post, Urgot is consistently strong at all levels, that is indication of a possible imbalance. Just because he is your champions doesn't change anything, he deserves the same treatment as every champion who is too dominant.
My Waifu Vanilla3 votesExcept statistics completely contradict your statement. Urgot hasn't been touched in PATCHES and he has rarely been above a 50% WR and if he was it was MAYBE 51%. Almost everyone I watched that does patch rundowns said any Urgot changes were pointless since the champion isnt good. Which has statistically been the case for the past like 3 months which is when he got his R buff. You cant say something has "always been OP" when the champion has had a garbage pickrate and a mediocre winrate until recently.
BeatzBoyFTW2 votesStill pissed about the part where they suddenly nerfed Wukong out of the blue after he gets played twice.
TrainerRobo2 votesThis really pisses me off honestly. I've been an Urgot one trick since 2 weeks after his rework, and not even 2 months ago people were telling me I was troll picking when I picked Urgot. Now people are calling me a meta whore for playing my main, even though he hasn't gotten ANY buffs in the past few months (minus a quality of life change that lets him move after ulting).
Blue Moon Wolf1 votesWukong get's picked 2 times in pro play for once in years, instantly gets nerfed to the ground then put back into his old spot win rate wise. Not saying they weren't needed, but it still would have been cool to see Wukong make it to worlds before getting nerfed. Or even better, could just work a kit change.
3TWarrior1 votespower only sometimes has to do with how the playerbase reacts. Frustration caused by power is the main source. Urgot was probably strong but if he was not frustrating to play against, would the players mind?
mordekaiser before his rework used to have a 58% average winrate but only like 0.1% playrate. 1 in 1000 matches you would meet him because he had nothing to make flashy plays or he was used as a counterpick
he did his job and he was fun though. His job was literally to crush his lane opponent (which is one reason he needed a rework but they went too far with CT in charge of a concept that caused its own problems when the pros did exactly what they wanted the new mordekaiser to do)
chipndip11 votesThis is EXACTLY what happened with the bot lane changes. Before it, everyone was clamoring about bot lane being stale. When it hits? Everyone IMMEDIATELY shits bricks and forces Riot to do a 180, putting us in a slight variant of the exact same shit we were in before that patch, anyway.
Any complaining anyone does about this type of thing is just complaining so they can play their Ahri or marksman in "peace".
