MR item that builds out of Bami's Cinder?

BrightWîngs·Oct 7, 2018·10 votes·9,854 views

There's very few HP MR items for tanks only really and and in my opinion these are pretty situational items ( keep reading this leads somewhere ) is really good on tanks that can heal like or but not tanks or because of the 30% increased healing is good against champions like or but not or because of the subsequent magic damage reduction

So what if there was a MR item that build out of the build path could go like very similar to

I always feel if im playing a tank like or and cant utilize the passive from or if im only going up against bursty mages i cant utilize the passive from I mean i still get the stats and the MR but it feels so bad to be wasting passives like that

you still kind of utilize the passive since it also increases you're base health regen but there's a reason the item is so good on a champion like or because something part of their kit lets them heal but not someone like

let me know what you guys think this idea came up around like 10AM with no sleep but i honestly dont think it would be a bad addition give tanks a little more variety when dealing with AP champions

32 Comments

WeaselRuneOct 7, 20183 votes

Dont forget item 3065 synergy with Bard Janna Nami Sona Soraka Taric as well as item 3174 item 3107

Just because you dont heal, doesnt mean that 30% extra healing cant be very useful with the right support, or maybe even an occasional off meta item choice... item 3812

Some items passives can help team mates more than the person who built them often... item 3001 or item 3091 . Anyway, just wanted to put in that extra bit of consideration for item 3065

BrightWîngsOct 7, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Dont forget synergy with as well as

Just because you dont heal, doesnt mean that 30% extra healing cant be very useful with the right support, or maybe even an occasional off meta item choice...

Some items passives can help team mates more than the person who built them often... or . Anyway, just wanted to put in that extra bit of consideration for

Very true but my point mainly is that unless you have good synergy with the item it feels like a wasted passive like say you're Poppy and you have like a Blitzcrank support at this point you're only really getting the base stats of the item 30% healing isn't doing much for you but you are not wrong what so ever

YumaS2AstralOct 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Very true but my point mainly is that unless you have good synergy with the item it feels like a wasted passive like say you're and you have like a support at this point you're only really getting the base stats of the item 30% healing isn't doing much for you but you are not wrong what so ever

Even if you really don't have synergy with the passive, Spirit Visage is still the go-to buy MR item in general (when your champ can't make use of the other MR items) because SV has better stats than the other MR items. It also helps that this item works with passive health regeneration.

BrightWîngsOct 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Even if you really don't have synergy with the passive, Spirit Visage is still the go-to buy MR item in general (when your champ can't make use of the other MR items) because SV has better stats than the other MR items. It also helps that this item works with passive health regeneration.

Oh yeah for sure 100% still get the item because you really have no other option is kinda the point in getting at

YumaS2AstralOct 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Oh yeah for sure 100% still get the item because you really have no other option is kinda the point in getting at

Yeah, but think that way:

Abyssal Mask's passive is completely useless if you don't deal significant amounts of magic damage with your kit.

Adaptive Helm's passive is completely useless if the enemy doesn't have continuous magic damage (DoTs, spammable spells, or other forms of magic damage over time)

On other hand, Spirit Visage's passive is never completely useless. Even if you have absolutely no sustain in your kit or your items, you still have health regeneration, which works with Spirit Visage's passive. It also works with outside sustain (e.g. Soraka's W). Aditionally, Spirit Visage also works with the Ocean Dragon, which is a plus if your team manages to get that dragon.

HayaishiOct 8, 20183 votes

MOONFIRE CAPE!

BrightWîngsOct 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

MOONFIRE CAPE!

Love it!

VoraciousXOct 7, 20182 votes

I disagree with this because honestly tanks have enough MR as it is. They need more armor if anything. They can completely counter a mid laner with one item item 3065 / item 3194 . Even if you waste passive, you still negate a shit ton of damage from an AP caster. You could also get item 3001 instead. There's also the option of requesting item 3102 reversion. It's terrible as an AP item anyways and I miss building defensively.

BrightWîngsOct 7, 20181 votes

{quoted}

I disagree with this because honestly tanks have enough MR as it is. They need more armor if anything. They can completely counter a mid laner with one item/

I don't think that's true at all do you know how many armor items that are in the game? Compared to MR? And there's like only 3 MR items that give you HP item 3194 item 3001 item 3065

For armor item 3742 item 3800 item 3118 item 3143 item 3068

And for a mage you're most likely going to buy a item 3135 doing 40% of their entire MR. Say I have 200 MR you have a that takes away 80 MR so you make my item 3065 or item 3194 useless and then some so when it's all said and done I have 120 MR and don't forget you most likely have item 3020 so take that down to 102 and if I'm a champion like Maokai you probably don't want me healing so much so you might buy a item 3165 so take that down 87 MR at this point I'm basically an adc with a item 3156 or a item 3139 If you can't see what's bad about this then I don't know.

VoraciousXOct 7, 20181 votes

{quoted}

I don't think that's true at all do you know how many armor items that are in the game? Compared to MR? And there's like only 3 MR items that give you HP

For armor

And for a mage you're most likely going to buy a doing 40% of their entire MR. Say I have 200 MR you have a that takes away 80 MR so you make my or useless and then some so when it's all said and done I have 120 MR and don't forget you most likely have so take that down to 102 and if I'm a champion like you probably don't want me healing so much so you might buy a so take that down 87 MR at this point I'm basically an adc with a or a If you can't see what's bad about this then I don't know.

You're not gonna get a void staff until 4th usually. A tank will usually have spirit visage for quite some time before a mage has void staff. Also an ADC with a maw basically negates a mage's combo(there's a reason people complain about maw specifically) if they don't have void staff. Tanks completely own mages in comparison to AD champions, and this is why I'd say if anything they need more(or better) Armor than MR. Also if you have a spirit visage and they have a Morellonomicon they kinda cancel each other out for the most part. ALSO Spirit Visage can also be used for ally heals. It increases any healing received. So a Soraka's W, Wish, Nami Ebb and Flow, anyone with item 3174 and a shield, etc will all increase healing used on you. So it's not really required to have synergy in your kit as long as there are heals on your team. How often are mages actually destroying tanks? Not often. It's generally AD champions.

They also have many more tank busting options than mages do. There's... item 3153 item 1416 item 3036 item 3033 and if you want to add actual armor pen(even though that barely makes a difference on a tank) there's item 3147 item 3142 item 3814 . Also adding more MR/Health options would completely break Mundo again. We don't need that.

BrightWîngsOct 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

You're not gonna get a void staff until 4th usually. A tank will usually have spirit visage for quite some time before a mage has void staff. Also an ADC with a maw basically negates a mage's combo(there's a reason people complain about maw specifically) if they don't have void staff. Tanks completely own mages in comparison to AD champions, and this is why I'd say if anything they need more(or better) Armor than MR. Also if you have a spirit visage and they have a Morellonomicon they kinda cancel each other out for the most part. ALSO Spirit Visage can also be used for ally heals. It increases any healing received. So a Soraka's W, Wish, Nami Ebb and Flow, anyone with and a shield, etc will all increase healing used on you. So it's not really required to have synergy in your kit as long as there are heals on your team. How often are mages actually destroying tanks? Not often. It's generally AD champions.

They also have many more tank busting options than mages do. There's... and if you want to add actual armor pen(even though that barely makes a difference on a tank) there's . Also adding more MR/Health options would completely break Mundo again. We don't need that.

Items like item 3147 And item 3142 are actually really bad at dealing with tanks because it's easier to stack armor I mean there just 1 item item 3110 that gives a whole woppin 100 armor and don't forget item 3151 is the AP equivalent to item 3153 then there's item 1416 which is only good on certain jungle champions like MasterYi And to be honest even if Yi built a item 1400 he'd probably still delete my booty since he is master yi. Then there is the percent pen item 3036 is the best out of the 2 since it does 35% pen item 3033 kinda sucks since it only does 25% but does apply grievous wounds however if you're an AP champ you can have 40% pen with am additional flat 15 pen with grievous wounds. At the end of the day magic damage dealers are going to do the most late game and that 100% TOTTALY fine what's not fine is you turning my MR into Swiss cheese as bad as you do 87 from 200 is disgusting. As far as champions as long as you have AD champions on your team Mundo won t be broken off adding an addition MR item the champion is good at dealing with magic damage you suggested adding more armor items instead wouldn't this just break rammus and malphite then? The thing is you're still limited to 6 items so if unless you're team is full AP and mundo stacked only MR you're probably going to not kill him but that goes both ways a full AD team into a malphite probably ain't gonna kill him either that's just how those things work if a certain tank is good at tanking 1 specific thing and your whole team is that one thing he's going to be very strong

VoraciousXOct 9, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Items like And are actually really bad at dealing with tanks because it's easier to stack armor I mean there just 1 item that gives a whole woppin 100 armor and don't forget is the AP equivalent to then there's which is only good on certain jungle champions like And to be honest even if Yi built a he'd probably still delete my booty since he is master yi. Then there is the percent pen is the best out of the 2 since it does 35% pen kinda sucks since it only does 25% but does apply grievous wounds however if you're an AP champ you can have 40% pen with am additional flat 15 pen with grievous wounds. At the end of the day magic damage dealers are going to do the most late game and that 100% TOTTALY fine what's not fine is you turning my MR into Swiss cheese as bad as you do 87 from 200 is disgusting. As far as champions as long as you have AD champions on your team Mundo won t be broken off adding an addition MR item the champion is good at dealing with magic damage you suggested adding more armor items instead wouldn't this just break rammus and malphite then? The thing is you're still limited to 6 items so if unless you're team is full AP and mundo stacked only MR you're probably going to not kill him but that goes both ways a full AD team into a malphite probably ain't gonna kill him either that's just how those things work if a certain tank is good at tanking 1 specific thing and your whole team is that one thing he's going to be very strong

Liandry's is really situational now, and you have to build it with that in mind. It's no longer got pen so it's not as good against squishies and isn't really that great against tanks either because it's 2.5% of their max health as magic damage. A spirit Visage further lowers that damage.

As for Void Staff being more pen than LDR, it's because a mage only has 3-4 instances of magic damage, whereas an AD champion can have many many more because of their auto attacks. The pen isn't really equal at all because of that(it's really not even close, if 1 AD = 2 AP, then 1% pen would = 2% magic pen I would think, but it only has 5% more pen. I mean 70% pen would be too much I know, but only having 5% more pen for that many less uses makes it severely weaker). You're not understanding that one single item is enough to negate a mage's damage vs a tank for most of the game, until they get void staff, which will generally be much later into the game. Even in late game an AD champion will melt a tank like butter faster than an AP champion, All you need is a Spirit Visage and a bunch of health and a mage is useless. The only late game mages who are good against tanks are champions like Cassiopeia and Brand because they provide consistent damage, always build rylai's/liandry's in their normal build, and have plenty of DOT to keep refreshing Liandry's. Brand also does %max HP damage in his own kit.

As for Liandry's vs BORK, 2.5% of 6k health is 150 damage(this assumes you have both liandry's and rylai's). So a Liandry's will do 150 damage to a 6k health tank with NO MR. Now let's look at BORK. BORK does 8% of target's current health per auto. That's 480 for the first hit, 441 for the second, 406 for the third, and 373 for the 4th. This is 4 auto attacks vs 4 spells. 4 spells would do 600 damage if you spaced the abilities out evenly(I assume Liandry's doesn't stack it's time, and instead just refreshes it) A BORK with 4 auto attacks would do 1700 damage to a champion with no armor. A Liandry's would only be good for a tank who was already lowish in health vs a BORK. They're not really the same at all and now Liandry's is kind of a bad item for anyone who doesn't have it naturally in their build.

BrightWîngsOct 9, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Liandry's is really situational now, and you have to build it with that in mind. It's no longer got pen so it's not as good against squishies and isn't really that great against tanks either because it's 2.5% of their max health as magic damage. A spirit Visage further lowers that damage.

As for Void Staff being more pen than LDR, it's because a mage only has 3-4 instances of magic damage, whereas an AD champion can have many many more because of their auto attacks. The pen isn't really equal at all because of that(it's really not even close, if 1 AD = 2 AP, then 1% pen would = 2% magic pen I would think, but it only has 5% more pen. I mean 70% pen would be too much I know, but only having 5% more pen for that many less uses makes it severely weaker). You're not understanding that one single item is enough to negate a mage's damage vs a tank for most of the game, until they get void staff, which will generally be much later into the game. Even in late game an AD champion will melt a tank like butter faster than an AP champion, All you need is a Spirit Visage and a bunch of health and a mage is useless. The only late game mages who are good against tanks are champions like Cassiopeia and Brand because they provide consistent damage, always build rylai's/liandry's in their normal build, and have plenty of DOT to keep refreshing Liandry's. Brand also does %max HP damage in his own kit.

As for Liandry's vs BORK, 2.5% of 6k health is 150 damage(this assumes you have both liandry's and rylai's). So a Liandry's will do 150 damage to a 6k health tank with NO MR. Now let's look at BORK. BORK does 8% of target's current health per auto. That's 480 for the first hit, 441 for the second, 406 for the third, and 373 for the 4th. This is 4 auto attacks vs 4 spells. 4 spells would do 600 damage if you spaced the abilities out evenly(I assume Liandry's doesn't stack it's time, and instead just refreshes it) A BORK with 4 auto attacks would do 1700 damage to a champion with no armor. A Liandry's would only be good for a tank who was already lowish in health vs a BORK. They're not really the same at all and now Liandry's is kind of a bad item for anyone who doesn't have it naturally in their build.

Bork does the same thing it does 8% of targets current health as physical damage and since armor is easier to stack than MR it's not as good as you may think nor is a tank unless you're Sion going to have 6K HP is Bork bad? Of course not but neither is item 3151 and it does A LOT MORE than just a measly 2.5% I'm gonna just copy and paste what the client says it's actually pretty damn good against tanks

Liandry's Torment

3100G +75 Ability Power +300 Health

UNIQUE Passive - Madness: Deal 2% more damage for each second in combat with champions ( 10% maximum ). UNIQUE Passive - Torment: Spells Burn enemies for 3 seconds, dealing bonus magic damage equal to 1.5% of their maximum Health per second. Burn damage is increased to 2.5% against movement-impaired units

(This isn't because I think you lack knowledge on the item it's mainly to make sure I'm clear in what I say)

But the 10% increased damage is actually pretty damn good and the burn not only can be consistently reapplied but it's MAX health not current so it not doing as much as Bork makes sense since with Bork the more health they have the more damage you'll do but trade off is the less health they have the less damage you'll do but with item 3151 you will ALWAYS do that damage no matter how low they are I think that's pretty even and item 3153 is built primarily on AD carries so they can pump out good consistent damage but their auto attacks don't do a whole lot unless you're Draven . Late game an ADC is going to destroy a tank and that's fine because I have a lot more options to mitigate it that damage with things like item 3110 item 3047 item 3143 And I'm the same way with mages they should be able to kill a tank late game but my issue is I have few options to deal with it I can't count how many times I play a tank like Shen into a full AP team and would just STACK the fuck out of MR but would still die very fast but in the same situation but enemy team being FULL AD it takes the whole team and what feels like years to kill me

And I'm not going to ignore the couple of mages that just blow at killing tanks like Lux Syndra

But I kinda wanna get back on track here these are all the tank Armor items that give HP

item 3742 item 3068 item 3143 item 3075 item 3109 item 3800

This is all the tank MR items that give HP item 3194 item 3001 item 3065

And if I get both item 3194 And item 3065 I'm stacking unique passive from item 3211 which isn't a BIG deal but it's still wasted stats every other MR item just gives Armor and MR no HP in this current meta especially with all the true damage HP is a very important thing to a tank even if I had 300MR and had 3K HP I'll still die rather quick because you have that pen that destroys my MR and I'm not being bias if I had 300 armor and 3K HP I will still die quick with their pen too I don't have this issue because there's plenty of armor items that give HP.

You could make the argument that well if youre low on HP you can get those MR items and a item 3083 which is not a terrible idea but doesn't give MR ( and it shouldn't ) but like I just said you're destroying my MR I'm still gonna blow up because I'm taking so much magic damage do to the pen that my HP doesn't even matter this is why 99% of the time is your last item

My issue isn't really that mages are doing too much damage my issue is that I have very little options to deal with the damage.

VoraciousXOct 10, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Bork does the same thing it does 8% of targets current health as physical damage and since armor is easier to stack than MR it's not as good as you may think nor is a tank unless you're going to have 6K HP is Bork bad? Of course not but neither is and it does A LOT MORE than just a measly 2.5% I'm gonna just copy and paste what the client says it's actually pretty damn good against tanks

Liandry's Torment

3100G +75 Ability Power +300 Health

UNIQUE Passive - Madness: Deal 2% more damage for each second in combat with champions ( 10% maximum ). UNIQUE Passive - Torment: Spells Burn enemies for 3 seconds, dealing bonus magic damage equal to 1.5% of their maximum Health per second. Burn damage is increased to 2.5% against movement-impaired units

(This isn't because I think you lack knowledge on the item it's mainly to make sure I'm clear in what I say)

But the 10% increased damage is actually pretty damn good and the burn not only can be consistently reapplied but it's MAX health not current so it not doing as much as Bork makes sense since with Bork the more health they have the more damage you'll do but trade off is the less health they have the less damage you'll do but with you will ALWAYS do that damage no matter how low they are I think that's pretty even and is built primarily on AD carries so they can pump out good consistent damage but their auto attacks don't do a whole lot unless you're . Late game an ADC is going to destroy a tank and that's fine because I have a lot more options to mitigate it that damage with things like And I'm the same way with mages they should be able to kill a tank late game but my issue is I have few options to deal with it I can't count how many times I play a tank like into a full AP team and would just STACK the fuck out of MR but would still die very fast but in the same situation but enemy team being FULL AD it takes the whole team and what feels like years to kill me

And I'm not going to ignore the couple of mages that just blow at killing tanks like

But I kinda wanna get back on track here these are all the tank Armor items that give HP

This is all the tank MR items that give HP

And if I get both And I'm stacking unique passive from which isn't a BIG deal but it's still wasted stats every other MR item just gives Armor and MR no HP in this current meta especially with all the true damage HP is a very important thing to a tank even if I had 300MR and had 3K HP I'll still die rather quick because you have that pen that destroys my MR and I'm not being bias if I had 300 armor and 3K HP I will still die quick with their pen too I don't have this issue because there's plenty of armor items that give HP.

You could make the argument that well if youre low on HP you can get those MR items and a which is not a terrible idea but doesn't give MR ( and it shouldn't ) but like I just said you're destroying my MR I'm still gonna blow up because I'm taking so much magic damage do to the pen that my HP doesn't even matter this is why 99% of the time is your last item

My issue isn't really that mages are doing too much damage my issue is that I have very little options to deal with the damage.

A BORK won't do low damage until the tank is low, and at that point an AD champion can kill the tank rather easily with their autos. Also AD champions can take things like Conqueror, and have Infinity Edge which deal true damage. A Mage doesn't have those options, and again, auto attacks + abilities penetrate a tank for AD champions, while for mage champions they only have generally 4 instances of damage. The only AP champions who are going to melt a tank are champions that are designed to melt tanks, like Brand or Cassiopeia. Yes, Liandry's decent consistent DPS, but when you have 6k 150 consistent damage is not going to be good enough, and again, that's mitigated by MR so it's even less. A BORK which can be mitigated, won't be mitigated as much because of all the other things like lord Dominik's, infinity edge, conqueror. You also may have more armor options, but unless you have a full AD enemy team you're going to build some MR and straight health too, and some tanks take damage items like Titanic Hydra which further lowers their actual armor options. Yes, a tank will have more armor than MR, but AGAIN, that's because 1 AD is equal to 2 AP because of auto attacks being counted in. You need more armor to deal with the auto attacks from AD champions. The auto from a mage isn't gonna do any good and they're not gonna kill you in one rotation even with an RoA. I know how tanks work, I play enough AP champions. If I'm going up against a Galio for example, a champion like Brand or Cassiopeia designed to deal with tanks specifically would be the only way I'm gonna be able to lay the smackdown on them, because they're gonna build that one MR item, a bunch of health, and I won't be able to hurt them otherwise. I experience it quite often. However as an AD champion it doesn't matter how much armor they build, because most AD champions have a BORK, LDR, sometimes an Infinity Edge with crit to deal with all the excess armor + they need to stack more to deal with them. Also again, another MR health item would just make Mundo impossible to deal with as an AP champion. This is also the reason why champions like MF SUCK vs tanks. They don't auto attack consistently, so they don't do as much damage due to the amount of armor a tank builds to deal with normal constant auto attackers.

Late game it doesn't matter how much armor you have, an AD marksman is going to destroy you unless they don't auto a lot, because of their consistent DPS. A Mage will throw out one combo and you MAY be at 75% health, and they'll have to do it again, and again, and again until they kill you. It's a MUCH MORE drawn out fight between a mage and a tank than an ADC and a tank. EVENTUALLY a mage will kill you, but that one(maybe 2) MR item(s) did enough to keep you alive for a long while before they finally do.

As for the item 3211 passive being wasted. This is entirely fine, as there are plenty of things that you can build together that waste stats. Some champions don't have mana, but that doesn't make Trinity Force or Lich Bane any worse on them for example. Plus no one builds for it's passive really. It's useful but the decent MR and HP early is much more useful than the passive.

Painted CeltOct 13, 20181 votes

I think that the actual amount of armor on armor items could be buffed, but more MR tanks items could be added to provide variety without buffing the amount of MR each item slot can provide. In almost every case, this new item would be built as a slot replacement for an existing MR item rather than as an addition.

VoraciousXOct 16, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Painted Celt,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nXMrwaEv,comment-id=00020001,timestamp=2018-10-13T20:08:07.932+0000)

I think that the actual amount of armor on armor items could be buffed, but more MR tanks items could be added to provide variety without buffing the amount of MR each item slot can provide. In almost every case, this new item would be built as a slot replacement for an existing MR item rather than as an addition.

The only way they could do that is to have a unique passive that is shared between items that I can think of.

Painted CeltOct 7, 20182 votes

How about this?

item 3084 Dullahan's Vest 2,900g (650g) item 3751 item 3211 item 1006 +500 Health +50 Magic Resistance +200% Base Health Regen Unique Passive: Steal health from nearby enemies equal to 10 + [1 * Total Health Regen] per second. Damage dealt to minions and monsters is increased by 50% but only heals for 15% of the total damage dealt.

Also a version of item 4401 for Summoner's Rift could be good.

If Riot adds new magic resistance items, they'll need to add new mage DPS and/or MR shred items to keep things even. I think that is needed in any case though, because current AP itemization is lacking in meaningful options and is too often narrowly burst + flat-pen focused. So I say Riot should release a variety of both new MR items and new non-burst AP itemization simultaneously in a future patch.

DearPearOct 7, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Painted Celt,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nXMrwaEv,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-10-07T21:53:51.368+0000)

How about this?

Dullahan's Vest 2,900g (650g) +500 Health +50 Magic Resistance +200% Base Health Regen Unique Passive: Steal health from nearby enemies equal to 10 + [1 * Total Health Regen] per second. Damage dealt to minions and monsters is increased by 50% but only heals for 15% of the total damage dealt.

Ah yes, the 1000 damage per second with mundo and his ult. That would be amazing...

Painted CeltOct 7, 20181 votes

It would be amazing, but it probably wouldn't be coded to consider Mundo's ult regeneration for the item passive. = P Correct me if I am wrong, but I don't think item 3174 gives Mundo massive amounts of AP during his ult.

Edit: Nevermind. I forgot that Athene's is based on mana regen, not health regen. Hm.... Well, it would depend on how it is coded, whether or not Mundo's ult would be included in the lifesteal. I think Mundo's ult would probably need to be coded as an exception or the item passive would need to have a cap. But on the other hand, the interaction might just be strong but not even be all that overpowered, considering that it requires Mundo to have his ult available, and a lategame health regen focused full build, and he is kiteable, and item 3033 item 3153 item 1419 and health shred in champion kits exist. According to my test on the practice tool, Mundo can only get to almost 650 health regen during his ult (unless he sells boots, which would probably be a bad idea), which would be really strong if it applied to the item passive but it's hard to say what is "overpowered" lategame when full-built marksmen invalidate lategame kiteable health stackers anyways. It would probably be too strong for pub-stomping though, so the interaction would probably need to be disabled or capped.

BrightWîngsOct 8, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Painted Celt,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nXMrwaEv,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-10-07T21:53:51.368+0000)

How about this?

Dullahan's Vest 2,900g (650g) +500 Health +50 Magic Resistance +200% Base Health Regen Unique Passive: Steal health from nearby enemies equal to 10 + [1 * Total Health Regen] per second. Damage dealt to minions and monsters is increased by 50% but only heals for 15% of the total damage dealt.

Also a version of for Summoner's Rift could be good.

If Riot adds new magic resistance items, they'll need to add new mage DPS and/or MR shred items to keep things even. I think that is needed in any case though, because current AP itemization is lacking in meaningful options and is too often narrowly burst + flat-pen focused. So I say Riot should release a variety of both new MR items and new non-burst AP itemization simultaneously in a future patch.

Not a bad idea i was hoping to for it to not use item 3211 simply because I don't want to be stacking passives if I were also to get like a item 3194 still a great idea though

Painted CeltOct 13, 20181 votes

The upgraded item doesn't item 3211 's passive but has non-unique +Base Health Regen, so you wouldn't need to worry about stacking passives after completing the item.

MrFawknSunshineOct 7, 20181 votes

i could see it but i really like stacking bami into mask as a maokai player so if this happens i would have to do something else

DabDogOct 7, 20183 votes

i dont think hes removing sunfire so if you want a armor version u still go sunfire but if u want mr u go the mr version.

MrFawknSunshineOct 7, 20181 votes

i get that.

but if i go bami into sunfire i get bami/hp/armor and if i go mask i get hp/mana/mr and the passives

i dont want bami +mr into mask where i already have the mr that was my point.

BrightWîngsOct 7, 20181 votes

{quoted}

i get that.

but if i go bami into sunfire i get bami/hp/armor and if i go mask i get hp/mana/mr and the passives

i dont want bami +mr into mask where i already have the mr that was my point.

Then get the item 3068 instead of the MR one and buy item 3001

Warlord RhinarkOct 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

i get that.

but if i go bami into sunfire i get bami/hp/armor and if i go mask i get hp/mana/mr and the passives

i dont want bami +mr into mask where i already have the mr that was my point.

The more MR the better?

JavelinJoeOct 7, 20181 votes

Armor and MR mechanics are not entirely equal. While similar, you have to factor in how a champion is damaged. MR is usually paired with countering damage non-burst mages or DoT abilities. But just stacking health with 1 MR item is enough to counter burst mages. Armor is a bit different because it is countering basic attacks as well as some abilities so it cant be taken situationally (just take it regardless, where with MR just having a lot of health and maybe a Spirit would be more than enough). Bami's cinder is more of an alternative form of wave clear for certain tanks to use. Also since it deals magic damage, having MR would counter itself. There are only a few items which have the same side of offense and defense (Armor and AD, or MR and AP) item 3026 item 3102 item 3174 and they are only like that because of who would use them.

NeameanOct 8, 20181 votes

Honestly I would want them to rework item 3091 to be more of an HP item rather than an atk speed. Like item 1057 + item 3052 or + item 3801 + item 1028 . I don't think we should have an MR equivalent to Sunfire but I do think we need a more offensive tank item with MR.

YumaS2AstralOct 8, 20182 votes

{quoted}

Honestly I would want them to rework to be more of an HP item rather than an atk speed. Like + or + +. I don't think we should have an MR equivalent to Sunfire but I do think we need a more offensive tank item with MR.

Then Riot will need to add more on-hit items in this game. On-hit itemization is surprisingly awful. People don't notice this because Guinsoo is OP (and is actually the only OP item between on-hit items, all of them are bad, extremely situtional, or are good but locked behind building restrictions)

NeameanOct 9, 20181 votes

Maybe bring back Ionic Spark with the same build path I mention before.

Incase anyone don't know Ionic spark was an HP/Atk Spd item

Unique: Every fourth autoattack unleashes a chain lightning, dealing 125 magic damage to up to 4 targets. Targets cannot be hit twice by the same lightning. (400 bounce range)

Keep the passive but change the stat because of a new build path.

Sire HippingtonOct 8, 20181 votes

item 3001 same stats as abyssal, but instead of decreasing magic damage taken it increases the magic damage nearby opponents take, which means not only you're own damage but also that of your allies gets amped, makeing it a strong offensive mr option on tanks(unless they have a full physical comp) Also adds some extra sustain that basically gives enough effective hp to be on pair with SV on non healing tanks while basically fixing all mana issues you have

It's just what you are looking for on the majority of tanks. Also, item 3190 has more mr than any of the hp+mr items and the if the shield active is used right, it offers more effective hp for much less gold(the shield easily reaches the 450hp of SV) and you can easily get HP from armor items and warmongs to back it up.

As far as shen and poppy go, both are more on a line between tank and fighter and like getting a bit damage rather than beeing plain fulltank, item 3091 is supprisingly good on shen, and poppy likes some item 3163 , which with the 350hp shield nearly gives the same defense as a item 3001 , possibly more depending on how much value you gain from the 10% hybrid-vamp

also, Leblanc actually does get countered by item 3194 , her Q and E hit twice so they get a good part reduced by adaptive, and for the ULT-versions, 2/3 of the total damage is backloaded to the second part which is affected by the damage-reduction from adaptive helmet

Noor SakataOct 8, 20181 votes

The same goes to mages tho when it comes to Magic Pen , they don't really have many options Always the same Boots item 3020 and not taking it is trolling and item 3135 that is always a must but keeps getting AP nerfs and item 3165 a new one after the ap items rework and has a useless passive in a lot of cases but we keep buying it just because it has magic pen