and 
practically have the same kind of stun except his does damage and hers does not (which im fine with.) but
Xerath's missile speed is** 2300** and the stun duration is .7 - 1.75 at the range it traveled.
Elise's missile speed is** 1600 **and the stun duration is 1/1.2/1.7/2 each level.
Tsugaga4 votesThey're 2 completely different champs, why should Elise do the same thing as Xerath?
CatSith1 votesThey're 2 completely different champs, why should Elise do the same thing as Xerath?
they are both mages check! both require their stuns to land check! both requires to be in melee range nope.
IcyPepper5 votesIt's part of their power budget.
Keep in mind that Elise has six spells, three of which cost mana. It would make sense that a dedicated mage who uses mana with only four spells would have slightly strong effects.
CatSith1 votesIt's part of their power budget.
Keep in mind that Elise has six spells, three of which cost mana. It would make sense that a dedicated mage who uses mana with only four spells would have slightly strong effects.
techinally xerath has 3 hits with his ult and 3 other spells = 6 spells
Lord Dusteon4 votestechinally xerath has 3 hits with his ult and 3 other spells = 6 spells
Technically Elise's ultimate summons up to 5 spiderlings so she has 11 spells.
No, that's stupid. So is your comparison. Just because something can hit multiple times does not mean it is an extra spell each time; that's like saying Vel'Koz has 5 spells or Heimerdinger has 6 (or 8 if you want to consider any different ult choice as a 'spell') just because they can multi cast.
CatSith1 votes[{quoted}](name=Lord Dusteon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nWNEKkHl,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-03T01:49:53.064+0000)
Technically Elise's ultimate summons up to 5 spiderlings so she has 11 spells.
No, that's stupid. So is your comparison. Just because something can hit multiple times does not mean it is an extra spell each time; that's like saying Vel'Koz has 5 spells or Heimerdinger has 6 (or 8 if you want to consider any different ult choice as a 'spell') just because they can multi cast.
lol technically you don't have logic because the spider lings aren't considered a spell.
Lord Dusteon3 voteslol technically you don't have logic because the spider lings aren't considered a spell.
Okay, since you are obviously a troll I'm going to say this once.
A spell is the unique ability in a QWER slot. Form change champions (Gnar, Jayce, Elise, Nidalee, Rek'Sai) have multiple unique abilities in one slot due to their alternate form getting new abilities. As such, they tend to have 6-7 spells (depending on if their form change itself is considered a spell). Because of this added power their spells tend to be a bit weaker since they have 2-3 extra ones on every other champion.
Otherwise, spells have multiple forms. Some (Renekton's QWE, Rumble's QWE, Heimerdinger's Ult, Karma's Ult) get empowered effects; these tend to be considered the same single spell as they do the same effect as the base spell but a bit better. Some (Xerath R, Azir W, Irelia R) have some form of ammo (whether a recharge system or a temporary ammo storage); these are all considered to be the same single spell and require all multiple hits to compare to other abilities.
So no, Xerath has 4 spells, Elise has 6-7, and you are a moron.
CatSith1 votes[{quoted}](name=Lord Dusteon,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nWNEKkHl,comment-id=0000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2015-04-03T02:00:33.051+0000)
Okay, since you are obviously a troll I'm going to say this once.
A spell is the unique ability in a QWER slot. Form change champions (Gnar, Jayce, Elise, Nidalee, Rek'Sai) have multiple unique abilities in one slot due to their alternate form getting new abilities. As such, they tend to have 6-7 spells (depending on if their form change itself is considered a spell). Because of this added power their spells tend to be a bit weaker since they have 2-3 extra ones on every other champion.
Otherwise, spells have multiple forms. Some (Renekton's QWE, Rumble's QWE, Heimerdinger's Ult, Karma's Ult) get empowered effects; these tend to be considered the same single spell as they do the same effect as the base spell but a bit better. Some (Xerath R, Azir W, Irelia R) have some form of ammo (whether a recharge system or a temporary ammo storage); these are all considered to be the same single spell and require all multiple hits to compare to other abilities.
So no, Xerath has 4 spells, Elise has 6-7, and you are a moron.
woah woah mister don't you get mad on me. so you re saying its okay for one mage to be able to land their combo and its not okay for another? hmmm
IcyPepper2 votesElise gets boosted movement speed in spider form, spiderlings for sustain, and a gap closer.
She's not just a mage, she's also a fighter. They're different.
CatSith1 votesElise gets boosted movement speed in spider form, spiderlings for sustain, and a gap closer.
She's not just a mage, she's also a fighter. They're different.
Yeah a mage fighter.
IcyPepper1 votesSo what's your point?
Xerath and Elise's stuns are FINE. They're not supposed to be the same anyway.
CatSith1 votesSo what's your point?
Xerath and Elise's stuns are FINE. They're not supposed to be the same anyway.
his stun is rewarded the further it travels. so why is the missile speed so fast compared to a stun that doesn't do damage.
IcyPepper2 votesOkay, let's play this game.
Why can't Xerath transform into a manaless fighter? Why doesn't Elise get multiple shots with her Q? Why can't Xerath be played as a jungle bruiser? Why doesn't Elise get an ultimate with high burst, huge range that gives vision, and three charges? Why does Elise get sustain? Why does Xerath have better waveclear?
Because they're fucking different.
This conversation is over.
CatSith1 votesOkay, let's play this game.
Why can't Xerath transform into a manaless fighter? Why doesn't Elise get multiple shots with her Q? Why can't Xerath be played as a jungle bruiser? Why doesn't Elise get an ultimate with high burst, huge range that gives vision, and three charges? Why does Elise get sustain? Why does Xerath have better waveclear?
Because they're fucking different.
This conversation is over.
someone cant see the point. Poor you D:
IcyPepper2 votesSomeone can't read. Conversation over.
I eat dragons4 votes[deleted]
CatSith1 votes[{quoted}](name=Crazeh Fruit,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nWNEKkHl,comment-id=00000000000000000001,timestamp=2015-04-03T01:50:31.844+0000)
By that logic Riven has 7 spells and Fiora has 5...
you are correct
IcyPepper4 votesNo, that's still one spell. He has to aim his ult, and it has a slight delay and indicator where it will land. Also part of his ultimate's power budget.
I eat dragons4 votes[deleted]
CatSith1 votes[{quoted}](name=Crazeh Fruit,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nWNEKkHl,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2015-04-03T01:49:28.494+0000)
They both have six abilities che...
Oh wait.
No, no they don't.
technically xearth does have 6 abilities so ty Check!
Best Darius KR1 votesWhat have you been smoking?
BeatzBoyFTW1 votes
& 
are both Marksman.
.....wtf Teemo, why do you keep going top?
Abyssphere2 votesAs someone who loves Elise: it's because she has 6 spells.
Cocoon is perfectly fine without damage. She already has 3 damaging abilities, and empowered basic attacks, a 140% Attack Speed steroid and a passive that adds massive amounts of DPS.
CatSith1 votesAs someone who loves Elise: it's because she has 6 spells.
Cocoon is perfectly fine without damage. She already has 3 damaging abilities, and empowered basic attacks, a 140% Attack Speed steroid and a passive that adds massive amounts of DPS.
I dont see massive amounts of dps on elise. show me where it is.
Abyssphere2 votesI dont see massive amounts of dps on elise. show me where it is.
Have you even played her? I can't tell if you're playing dumb or not but here goes:
Elise has 0.625 base attack speed. At level 18 she has 29.8% bonus. She also has Skittering Frenzy to give her 140%. Let's say she builds Nashor's Tooth and gets 50% AS. After activating that, her attack speed becomes 2.00. Skittering Frenzy lasts 3 seconds, so she gets 6 auto-attacks in 3 seconds. Her Spiderlings have 0.665 base attack speed and gain 25% passively from Skittering Frenzy. They also get its active, putting them at 1.76. At level 16 she has five spiderlings, meaning she gets 8.8 spiderling attacks per second, or 26.4 (let's say 26) over 3 seconds, for the duration of Skittering Frenzy.
Elise's basic attacks will apply her base AD (at level 18, 102), 40 magic damage, plus 30% AP from her ult passive and 15% AP from Nashor's. Essentially, every basic attack will do 142 (+ 45% AP). Let's say her build is Deathcap, Nashor's, Zhonya's, Abyssal, Luden's, Sorc Shoes. She has 637 AP just from items, not taking into account masteries and so on. Her basic attacks do 287 from her AP, meaning every basic attack will do 429 damage. 6 attacks over 3 seconds is 2574 damage.
Now onto her Spiderlings. They do 40 (+ 10% AP), i.e 104 per basic attack. They will get 26 attacks in over 3 seconds, so 2704 damage.
Over 3 seconds this Elise has 5278 damage loaded into her basic attacks. Her Venomous Bite will also do 220 (+ 26% of target's missing health), Neurotoxin will do 220 (+26% of target's current health) and Volatile Spiderling will do 779 thanks to its insane AP scaling.
Tell me again how she doesn't have huge DPS. She has some of the best DPS in the game, she just can't deliver it because Skittering Frenzy's healing isn't enough to keep her alive for the time she needs, she's easily disrupted because she dies the second she's CCd and her Spiderlings fall over from stray spells being cast in their general direction. But when she's allowed to do her damage it's huge.
Zuske BloodLine1 votesElise deals Hp% damage wich allows her to build mostly 2 ap items then go fulltank and STILL hurt. Xerath has to blow everything.
CatSith1 votes[{quoted}](name=Zuske BloodLine,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=nWNEKkHl,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-04-03T01:44:15.169+0000)
Elise deals Hp% damage wich allows her to build mostly 2 ap items then go fulltank and STILL hurt. Xerath has to blow everything.
do you even play her? just building 2 ap items wont give her decent damage. and going full tank vs the tanks this meta will make her useless in team fights.
BeatzBoyFTW1 votes.
Sooko1 votesXerath lacks mobility and untargetability to get out of sticky situations?