Yeah because good players never land skill shots, not to mention any skill shot that's ever frustrating to play against is typically spammable and low risk in its usage.
MohawkBird15 votes
Just dodge the spear that is on the smallest cooldown that still chunks 75% of your health
DJ Di032 votes
Um, excuse you; Nidalee got reworked and her Javelin damage was lowered.
Now she takes 74% of your health.
MohawkBird4 votesSaid every Nidalee main.
His Goatliness2 votes[{quoted}](name=DJ Di0,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=mb6HjyoF,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2015-07-24T01:41:47.327+0000)
Um, excuse you; Nidalee got reworked and her Javelin damage was lowered.
Now she takes 74% of your health.
Doesn't mean she's not fair. Her late game falls off pretty hard when it comes to 1v1's. Her Q is a way of evening the odds against the tankier champions.
Verxint7 votesI could agree with this if dodging one mattered.
You dodge the spear at max range? She pounces after you, waits 5 seconds, then throws another one. You dodge the spear at close range? She jumps on you anyway and does a shitload of damage, then throws another spear You got hit one time even though you just dodged 7 consecutive spears? GG outplayed you deserve to die You dodge the spear and all-in her? She does a shitload of damage and runs away and heals and then throws another spear.
Abyssphere1 votes[{quoted}](name=Little Mac is OP,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=mb6HjyoF,comment-id=0005000000010002,timestamp=2015-07-24T06:20:53.322+0000)
I could agree with this if dodging one mattered.
You dodge the spear at max range? She pounces after you, waits 5 seconds, then throws another one. You dodge the spear at close range? She jumps on you anyway and does a shitload of damage, then throws another spear You got hit one time even though you just dodged 7 consecutive spears? GG outplayed you deserve to die You dodge the spear and all-in her? She does a shitload of damage and runs away and heals and then throws another spear.
Um. Scenario 1 sure (don't agree with 3 - not her fault you decided to just hang around playing "dodge the spear") but I assure you that Cougar Form Nidalee is one of the worst duelists in the game if she hasn't landed a spear. Her damage scales in three different ways with Javelin Toss, her gapcloser has 375 range (plenty of time to wreck her before she even gets to you) and she doesn't get a reset on said gapcloser to get away, meaning she's in your range for several seconds after she's unleashed her mediocre burst. Even with her heal there's very little excuse for anyone except the support/tank not killing her in that scenario. Like, I can't think of many people who wouldn't kill her.
If Nidalee is legitimately jumping on you in cougar form and not dying then there were some big mistakes made in getting her to that point. Her damage is legitimately terrible without a landed spear unless she is horrifyingly far ahead.
foinhas5 votes" not her fault you decided to just hang around playing 'dodge the spear' "
So it's legit that a champion has a 1k radius zoning potencial?
Emperor Time1 votesIn higher elo's where people can play nidalee almost perfectly there will be no late game, she will dive you under turret time after time and win through extreme money bagging and dragon/baron control. Nidalee's early game is a tad overbearing since she can do dives earlier than anyone and is the safest to do so with.
MohawkBird1 votesThe joke is rising a steady pace of 10 meters per second above your head.
JimmyNtheKudos3 votesThe Blitz effect. Dodge 90% of skillshots, get hit with one youre dead.
Wheatloaf4 votesIt's better than "Just stay out of range of 'x' champion, they're useless if you're not in range of their skills."
Diananmen Square3 votes
Just dodge his rupture even though you're silenced.
LegitBacon663 votesYeah when your in a 5v5 cluster fuck of a team fight "just dodge skillshots"
HateDaddy3 votesHaha
They are releasing episode 49 soon, are you ready
LaowPing1 votesMy body is ready.
OperationDEEZ15 votesI guess you could say you beat me to the... PUNCH! HAHAHA
Adrian Umbra2 votesSo... by that logic, Veigar's W isn't weak?
HateDaddy8 votes[{quoted}](name=Adrian Umbra,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=mb6HjyoF,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-07-23T21:57:28.633+0000)
So... by that logic, Veigar's W isn't weak?
Yeah, Veigars W really isn't a skill shot. Technically it is, in reality it isn't
You only use it on stunned targets, to clear minion waves, or drop it on a bunched up group of champions in teamfights. It's a matter of when you use, not really aiming it.
Adrian Umbra1 votesThen what defines a skillshot? You can miss with Veigar's W, so there's obviously some skill involved in aiming it, plus what you just said can apply to several other champion abilities, from Ekko's W to Xerath's Ult to Zyra's Q to Bard's Ult. What are these abilities if they're not skillshots and not targeted abilities?
Be careful when you redefine something like that, it's difficult to say where your definition stops. I personally define anything that's not targeted, a self-buff, or a placed unit (see Teemo's shrooms or Zyra's W) to be a skillshot. In other words, anything that is aimed. What's your definition?
HateDaddy3 votes[{quoted}](name=Adrian Umbra,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=mb6HjyoF,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-07-23T22:34:54.018+0000)
Then what defines a skillshot? You can miss with Veigar's W, so there's obviously some skill involved in aiming it, plus what you just said can apply to several other champion abilities, from Ekko's W to Xerath's Ult to Zyra's Q to Bard's Ult. What are these abilities if they're not skillshots and not targeted abilities?
Be careful when you redefine something like that, it's difficult to say where your definition stops. I personally define anything that's not targeted, a self-buff, or a placed unit (see Teemo's shrooms or Zyra's W) to be a skillshot. In other words, anything that is aimed. What's your definition?
It's still a skill shot but the way it should be used takes most of the skill out of the ability, that's not a good or bad thing. It means Veigar has to land his E or follow it up with another cc spell or just drop it on a clump of champions. Timing has to be there still but in reality, it's a pretty hard spell to screw up. It's also a low risk spell. again, this doesn't make it good/bad or broken/weak, truthfully dark matter is fucking absurd in damage but it's allowed to be because it's only reliable when followed up with CC.
theres a lot of spells like this. Lux's E is technically a skill shot, it's relatively spammable and its pretty low risk to use. But it's really not a skill shot, it's just drop here and pop. The flip side of that is lux's Q, which is a skill shot that is harder to land, is not low risk at all because if she misses it, she can be engaged on and while it is somewhat spammable, it's still moderately risky to use.
By technicality, a skill shot is a spell that can be freely targeted anywhere. But just because it's a "skill shot" doesn't mean it's a spell that has a great degree of difficulty to use or land. An example of a frustrating skill shot to play against is Ziggs Q or Nid Q. Spammable, high damage, low risk in usage. Now when comparing their kits, Ziggs is significantly less frustrating to play against because he's divable, Nid really isn't.
My point of this thread is just that stop saying "dodge skill shot = champion countered." Not only is that complety untrue because there's far more to that than just dodge a skill shot but good players are also good at landing skill shots so it's not even a rational defense.
His Goatliness1 votes[{quoted}](name=Adrian Umbra,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=mb6HjyoF,comment-id=000200000000,timestamp=2015-07-23T22:34:54.018+0000)
Then what defines a skillshot? You can miss with Veigar's W, so there's obviously some skill involved in aiming it, plus what you just said can apply to several other champion abilities, from Ekko's W to Xerath's Ult to Zyra's Q to Bard's Ult. What are these abilities if they're not skillshots and not targeted abilities?
Be careful when you redefine something like that, it's difficult to say where your definition stops. I personally define anything that's not targeted, a self-buff, or a placed unit (see Teemo's shrooms or Zyra's W) to be a skillshot. In other words, anything that is aimed. What's your definition?
The world isn't black and white. You can't put everything in 2 categories. Veigar W is a skill. It's a skill you have to position ahead of time and most of the time it's necessary to aid it with CC to get it to land on champions. Teemo's shrooms and skills of the like are traps, not skillshots. It could even be argued that Vieg W is a trap because you basically have to walk into it, but that's a stretch and I'm not going to try and call it that. There's skill involved in Veigars W but it's not the same concept as hitting an ezreal Q.
And as for HateDaddy's post, I agree and disagree. With a lot of champions it's not a matter of dodging, but more of avoiding. That's what made viegar's old E fair. You had to play around it, not just try to react to it. champions like Lux are very easily dominated if you play smart, and avoid her skillshots. Again, the game isn't black and white. People that say "just dodge the skillshots and you're fine" aren't always wrong.
lB2kGRlc8y2 votesI kind of agree, since you basically mentioned how it's absolutely useless unless you are in a teamfight, and that's what riot took from Veigar, the ability to duel, and as an extension of that lane safety. It can be aimed though, basically, skunk Veigar reaction is to drop it on himself, or on the path between him and his pursuer (cause there's always at least one) but this depends on his enemy's inability to see glowy particles in order to succeed.
Meeks0111 votesThough you have 1.2 seconds to dodge it. With a reaction time of 0.3 seconds and a ping of 100 you have a 0.8 seconds period to dodge it which is ridiculously easy.
Also, we're talking LINEAR skillshots here like spears.
TheRakkun2 votesDepends on the skillshot, some of them you can honestly say "Just dodge it" and be correct in the statement since they're slow and heavily choreographed such as 
's E 
's Q and 
's Q.
On the other hand there are others that, despite being skillshots are not nearly as avoidable such as 
's Q 's Q or 
's Q
Tea Mochi2 votesI just played a 
game vs blitz bot lane sup and even when i tumbled to try to b8 his Q i still get hit ;-;
lB2kGRlc8y2 votesTumble seems to consider you in the cast position until you arive at the target position, tumbles so goddamn quick it doesn't usually matter, but blitz hook is really quick as well. Its a common issue in games i've seen, happens a lot in RTSs, MOBAs and MMOs.
Tea Mochi1 votesI can usually b8 out 80% of skillshots but i can only dodge 40% of blitz grabs 
Abyssphere1 votesDepends on the skillshot, some of them you can honestly say "Just dodge it" and be correct in the statement since they're slow and heavily choreographed such as
On the other hand there are others that, despite being skillshots are not nearly as avoidable such as
How is Nidalee's spear easier to get hit with than Morgana's snare. Morgana's snare is much bigger and the two skillshots move at almost identical speeds. Nidalee's is more spammable, but Morg's is objectively easier to get hit with.
MohawkBird1 votesSure, some are heavily choreographed, like a Morgana snare, but all it takes for her to get a kill is one snare. Morgana can miss snares all day, but if she lands her and her laner are taking 90% of your health and forcing flash.
Harrys Nut Shack2 votes
I feel is the worst offender. Her E has an enormous radius and now with her predetonate is nearly impossible to dodge without 400+ MS and perfect ping. Xerath and Jayce come close.
Cloud Potato3 votesWhich is why I laugh when people suggest Lux buffs, especially on E. Its damage is low and its mana cost is high for a reason.
Harrys Nut Shack1 votesI'm honestly shocked at the pre-detonate buff. It has a high mana cost because it has near perfect accuracy in the right hands and can clear entire waves in 1 cast + a few AAs proccing her passive. The issue is that the skillshot is 100% based on the caster. There is little to no counterplay out of having huge MS, a dash, or moving as she casts it and hoping she didn't predict where you would go. If the enemy Lux is good, she's gonna get fed.
Cloud Potato2 votesSkillshots in general have pretty poor play patterns. They might have counterplay, but they don't singlehandedly make a champion healthy. Two egregious types of skillshot which are unhealthy:
1: The 'I must hit you to be able to do anything' 
(when he isn't blowing you up with the rest of his counterplayless kit)
These champions are completely dependent on landing a single skillshot. If they get you, they put you in an extremely tough position and you just have to bend over and take it, but they spend the rest of their time hanging back doing jack shit because they simply can't do much else.
2: The 'I can poke you forever and run if you come close' 
These champions can poke you to death with their low cost skillshots and can save their escapes without penalty (which is why Zed isn't here, he can't farm safely without entering melee or using his escape). You can't force these champs out of lane unless you are one of them or are playing a champ with low counterplay.
MohawkBird3 votesNumber one can also fall under the "I can miss 99% of my skillshots, but land one and still be just as effective".
Cloud Potato2 votesThere's a subtle difference. Champions that get incredible reward from skillshots but can still do other stuff (
) can have their skillshots nerfed and still function. Champions who are dependent on their skillshot to be useful need to have their skillshot intact for them to be usable at all.
Emperor Time2 votesJust play yasuo and press E all day bro.
Meeks0112 votesYeah, especially if you want to kill said champion. Like playing Ez, I land like 80% of my skillshots. It's not like everybody is 100% pro at focusing on minimap, dodging skillshots, getting CS, checking health, warding, etc. all at once.
Also there are champions like Blitzcrank that are no risk, high reward. "easy, stand behind minions" but then he just ults and all the minions are dead, the fuck you gonna do now? "easy, dodge his hook" Yeah, it's not like it has a speed of 1800 and a range of 915 which means that it takes 0.5 seconds to reach you. The average person has a reaction time of like 0.3 seconds + 100 ping so I have a 0.1 second window (makes sense to me) to dodge his hook. You shitting me?
I almost lost a bot game as a level 30 once, because the enemy team had a Blitz bot and he landed every hook. They made it to our inhibitor turret, for fucks sake.
TheUltimateSpear2 votesI like some of these champs, but I agree, playing against them can be so damn frustrating.
Oh, you didn't dodge charm? You're fucking dead kid and I'm just gonna dash on out after that kill.
Zone's you by existing. Oh, he can miss grabs all he wants but as long as he lands one there's your flash or a kill.
This champion's existence is a mathematical error. A mathematical error I'm about to correct.
IcyPepper1 votesthere's your flash or a kill.
*and
SociopathFriend2 votes
Spammable?
I doubt that
Perhaps they have a different meaning of "spam"?
Seems odd to call something that costs a lot of mana
and has a long cooldown
"Spammable"
Matezoide2 votesMaybe skillshots wouldnt be so annoying if the god damn hitbox was accurate.
The Ecdysiast1 votesDon't complain about skillshots, they'll only make Kallista's passive a thing on every new champion if you do that.
manbearswine1 votesDon't complain about skillshots, they'll only make Kallista's passive a thing on every new champion if you do that.
They are going to do that regardless.
Then they will nerf annie,cause no counterplay. Kappa
Jofeyy1 votesBy that logic one could argue "Just hit x skillshot, x champion is unstoppable if you land x skillshot".
In other words: you are right, its not a very accurate method of judging how good a champ is.
IAMS4T4N1 votes in a nutshell
Only Play Darius1 votes
"ez"
Biff Manly1 votesWhat if when missed his damn grab, the hand flew off and he had to go pick it up to use the skill again?
Mecha MaIphite1 votes"just dodge morgana q"
It has the hitbox of ten gragases.
WolfBV1 votesEnemy has a Brand support guys what should I do? "Just keep moving and he'll miss his skill shots every time." ._.