Could someone explain to me how the interaction between Sivir's spellshield, and Zed's ult works?

Electro522·May 21, 2017·2 votes·951 views

So, I just recently played a game as Sivir against a Zed. Obviously, him being an assassin, and me being an ADC, it was obvious for him to try and kill me.

However, I happened to notice that sometimes his ult was blocked by my spell shield, and other times, it wasn't, despite me putting on the shield at relatively the same time.

So, does anyone know exactly how this works? And if so, when is the best time for me (the Sivir player) to put on the shield? Does it need to be cast before the ult is cast onto me, does it need to be cast before Zed comes out of the ult, or, do I need to block the "pop" portion of it (assuming I survive the rest of his abilities)?

26 Comments

ChaddyFantomeMay 21, 20171 votes

You have to spellshield the explosion itself, not the animation of him marking you. This is because the exact time when the mark is placed on you is hard to tell, so you are better off blocking the explosion instead.

Electro522May 21, 20171 votes

But, I can block the mark being placed, that did happen. How do I do that, since it is overall better for me?

SasogwaMay 21, 20172 votes

{quoted}

You have to spellshield the explosion itself, not the animation of him marking you. This is because the exact time when the mark is placed on you is hard to tell, so you are better off blocking the explosion instead.

it's the opposite actually, if you're marked by Zed, spellshield or not the mark will proc, you have to spellshield at the time where Zed tries to put the mark on you.

VoraciousXMay 21, 20172 votes

{quoted}

it's the opposite actually, if you're marked by Zed, spellshield or not the mark will proc, you have to spellshield at the time where Zed tries to put the mark on you.

TBH that's kinda janky. You'd think you'd need to spellshield the pop because when he ults you the spell is already cast regardless of if you spellshield it or not, since he travels to you. Riot should probably fix this, especially if it's like the other guy said where his ult goes on a 5 second cooldown, meaning he can do it again right after.

ReZisT LustMay 21, 20171 votes

The shadow is inside you just like the Recent video depicts the ball is just your heart popping 🌸🌼

Pierce The VealMay 21, 20171 votes

{quoted}

TBH that's kinda janky. You'd think you'd need to spellshield the pop because when he ults you the spell is already cast regardless of if you spellshield it or not, since he travels to you. Riot should probably fix this, especially if it's like the other guy said where his ult goes on a 5 second cooldown, meaning he can do it again right after.

I mean, them again, you'd then have a standard ability preventing an ult from ever being used, which seems like a little too much counterplay.

VoraciousXMay 22, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I mean, them again, you'd then have a standard ability preventing an ult from ever being used, which seems like a little too much counterplay.

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Not to mention if Sivir spellshields his ult and it's then placed on a 5 second cooldown it's not working as intended PLUS he'd be right on top of her, able to destroy her health bar, and then ult someone else. I know Zed isn't in an amazing place right now but this shouldn't be working like that since other ways to disable it, disable the pop.

Pierce The VealMay 24, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Not to mention if Sivir spellshields his ult and it's then placed on a 5 second cooldown it's not working as intended PLUS he'd be right on top of her, able to destroy her health bar, and then ult someone else. I know Zed isn't in an amazing place right now but this shouldn't be working like that since other ways to disable it, disable the pop.

But the pop is a status condition.

What you're asking for is like being able to use the spell shield to remove cc after the fact. That's simply not fair.

This is coming from someone whose first champion was Nocturne, and who also exclusively played nocturne for all of season 2 and much of season 3 (I still try to play him but he's so lackluster). Do remember he too has a spellshield.

VoraciousXMay 24, 20171 votes

{quoted}

But the pop is a status condition.

What you're asking for is like being able to use the spell shield to remove cc after the fact. That's simply not fair.

This is coming from someone whose first champion was Nocturne, and who also exclusively played nocturne for all of season 2 and much of season 3 (I still try to play him but he's so lackluster). Do remember he too has a spellshield.

Okay, if the spell shield SHOULDN'T block the pop, then when she CORRECTLY blocks the ultimate, it should cancel Zed's ENTIRE ability, including the teleportation, and put it on full cooldown. Is that what you prefer? Otherwise Sivir's spellshield isn't working correctly in either situation since he's STILL getting part of his ability, and as was said, it goes on a 5 second cooldown(he gets to use it again) if she spellshields it "correctly" now while also placing him in an advantageous position(so he still gets to use half of his ability) to deplete her healthbar despite her acting correctly.

Pierce The VealMay 31, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Okay, if the spell shield SHOULDN'T block the pop, then when she CORRECTLY blocks the ultimate, it should cancel Zed's ENTIRE ability, including the teleportation, and put it on full cooldown. Is that what you prefer? Otherwise Sivir's spellshield isn't working correctly in either situation since he's STILL getting part of his ability, and as was said, it goes on a 5 second cooldown(he gets to use it again) if she spellshields it "correctly" now while also placing him in an advantageous position(so he still gets to use half of his ability) to deplete her healthbar despite her acting correctly.

Yeah actually I do prefer that, minus the blocking the gap close. It doesn't block any gapclosers.

VoraciousXJun 1, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Yeah actually I do prefer that, minus the blocking the gap close. It doesn't block any gapclosers.

I think it should just put the ability on cooldown without doing anything because otherwise the spellshield was still pointless. Zed doesn't usually even need ult to kill a squishy, it's just something to ensure he does while placing him in the perfect position to get a lot of damage off.

Pierce The VealJun 2, 20171 votes

{quoted}

I think it should just put the ability on cooldown without doing anything because otherwise the spellshield was still pointless. Zed doesn't usually even need ult to kill a squishy, it's just something to ensure he does while placing him in the perfect position to get a lot of damage off.

It's really not fair to do that considering with every other gapclose ability it still procs everything that doesn't hit the champion.

VoraciousXJun 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

It's really not fair to do that considering with every other gapclose ability it still procs everything that doesn't hit the champion.

Well we can agree to disagree. It gives Zed a lot more than most people with target dashes and his ability acts a bit different than the others, but I can see why it would keep that aspect. It still would be really hard for a Sivir to survive whether she spellshielded his ulti or not though since he could probably just kill her with a W>E>Q after that. Either way it apparently isn't working as intended either way and needs to be fixed somehow.

Pierce The VealJun 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Well we can agree to disagree. It gives Zed a lot more than most people with target dashes and his ability acts a bit different than the others, but I can see why it would keep that aspect. It still would be really hard for a Sivir to survive whether she spellshielded his ulti or not though since he could probably just kill her with a W>E>Q after that. Either way it apparently isn't working as intended either way and needs to be fixed somehow.

It is working as intended. The spellshield blocks his ultimate, which goes on a 5 second cooldown.

VoraciousXJun 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

It is working as intended. The spellshield blocks his ultimate, which goes on a 5 second cooldown.

Zed's ultimate ISN'T a 5 second cooldown, so it's not working as intended. Sivir's spellshield doesn't put every spell she blocks on a 5 second cooldown. The ability, if used, is supposed to go on it's normal cooldown. It's literally pointless to even use the spellshield on Zed if he just gets it back again in 5 seconds, not to mention gives him another skillshot dodge. You'd be literally HELPING Zed by spell shielding his ultimate.

Pierce The VealJun 3, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Zed's ultimate ISN'T a 5 second cooldown, so it's not working as intended. Sivir's spellshield doesn't put every spell she blocks on a 5 second cooldown. The ability, if used, is supposed to go on it's normal cooldown. It's literally pointless to even use the spellshield on Zed if he just gets it back again in 5 seconds, not to mention gives him another skillshot dodge. You'd be literally HELPING Zed by spell shielding his ultimate.

But Zed's ultimate, if it fails, is made to go on a 5 second cooldown, thus, spell shielding it causing it to go on a 5 second cooldown is an intended result. This also occurs if you zhonya's right when he's about to hit you with his ultimate, or if fizz trollpolls, and etc..

VoraciousXJun 4, 20171 votes

{quoted}

But Zed's ultimate, if it fails, is made to go on a 5 second cooldown, thus, spell shielding it causing it to go on a 5 second cooldown is an intended result. This also occurs if you zhonya's right when he's about to hit you with his ultimate, or if fizz trollpolls, and etc..

Still Sivir's spellshield should be different, or the interaction is TOTALLY in Zed's favor whether she fails it or not. I wouldn't call that a good decision.

ChaddyFantomeMay 22, 20171 votes

A similar change was made to Zilean bombs back when they were a point and click spell to make it that you could spellshield the explosion as opposed to the bomb being put on you, so i agree.

Emerald FangMay 22, 20171 votes

You can't block the final damage. The spellshield isn't a cleanse; if you are hit with any debuff before casting the shield, the debuff will still be there. Death Mark counts as a debuff, so after he lands on you, the debuff is applied and cannot be shielded.

Dorans ShurikenMay 21, 20171 votes

haven't played against a sivir in a while, so you might want to double-check, but i believe it goes like this.

Spell shield before zed marks you (he disappears then dashes towards you and places the mark, so anytime before he actually reaches you), and you don't get the explosion damage, but he still gets the gap closer. His ult goes on a 5 second cool down i think, because the mark was never applied.

Spell shield right as he marks you/slightly afterwards, and chances are you'll block his shadowslash.

Save the spell shield for the pop : last i checked this didn't work. Of course theres a chance I'm wrong, but I'm fairly certain you can't spell shield the pop.

Edit: check out this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJiiZfx2dVQ

hope it helps

Electro522May 21, 20171 votes

See, this is what I was thinking: put up the spell shield while Zed is untargettable.

And yet....there was a couple times where the Death Mark still set in......and a couple times where it didn't.

So....I'm confused.

Dorans ShurikenMay 21, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Paleo Electro,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=m7EOl07F,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2017-05-21T08:26:03.839+0000)

See, this is what I was thinking: put up the spell shield while Zed is untargettable.

And yet....there was a couple times where the Death Mark still set in......and a couple times where it didn't.

So....I'm confused.

Check the replays and slow it down. Chances are you mistimed it. But if not, then its a bug.

Electro522May 21, 20171 votes

Thats actually exactly what I just did.

Turns out, I actually put on the shield right when he lands several times. The times I did put it on before he even gets to me were blocked. This guy seemed to queue up his E for right when he lands (or spam it...I don't know), that way it goes off the moment he lands. The times I didn't block his ult were times that I actually blocked his E instead of the mark.....which is odd.

Either way, I now know when to hit it. Thanks for the help!

Emerald FangMay 22, 20171 votes

Yeah, you can't block the actual mark "pop" because it's a debuff that's already applied to you, not one about to be applied.

Akali is SO HOTJun 4, 20171 votes

You have to spellshield it before he marks you. If he already has you marked, then there is nothing you can do to stop it. You have until a little before he lands from his ult animation to spellshield it.

VoraciousXJun 4, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Akali is SO HOT,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=m7EOl07F,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2017-06-04T02:10:15.678+0000)

You have to spellshield it before he marks you. If he already has you marked, then there is nothing you can do to stop it. You have until a little before he lands from his ult animation to spellshield it.

Yeah, but the issue is even if you do spellshield it, it's in Zed's favor because it repositions him still while ALSO going on a 5 second cooldown to allow him to do it again.