TSM had the easiest group they have ever been placed in in their International Career.

Electro522·Oct 14, 2017·116 votes·7,673 views

...and they still...

...did not...

...make it...

...out...

...of groups.

Granted, WE and Misfits played very well. All credit to them. But..

3rd seed from the LPL, 2nd seed from EU, 2nd seed from LMS, and no Korean teams.....yet TSM are NA's number 1 seed.

See, I don't blame Immortals for not making it out. Not only did they get slapped with Long Zhu, but no one could have expected Fnatic to go Super Saiyan. This is also their very first worlds performance. Despite being our 2nd seed, them getting knocked out with what they were given is not really surprising.

But this is the SEVENTH time that TSM has been to Worlds. This is...what...the 5th time that they've gone as the number 1 seed? This is simply unacceptable.

Are they simply content with only having NA figured out? Surely, not even they can find this acceptable! At this point, if I owned TSM, I'd be tearing the entire League portion of the organization apart, and rebuilding it from scratch. But, I'm not Regi.

Well done, TSM. You have disappointed everyone in NA AGAIN.

165 Comments

Virgin RayOct 14, 201729 votes

tsm dont deserve their large fan base at all

RainbowIceeOct 14, 20172 votes

they only have such a large fan base because the NA teams suck when it comes to international competition, so call it a desperate fan base. If another good team stepped up their game and took the lead for NA then a lot of those fans would quickly shift. Basically NA doesn't have much to cheer for. I wish they did so for once we'd see something besides the same people in finals but we don't. Anyways I hope anyone else competes vs korea, anyone else i'm cheering for you! i won't see worlds because i'm sure the matches aren't that fun to watch but go get em.

Joek9100Oct 14, 20172 votes

The biggest reason I still root for TSM is because they were my favorite team back when Reginald left (thank the roman gods) when it was Oddone, dyrus, wildturtle, bjergsen, Xpecial and I don't follow esports as much so I just hope TSM wins since that's who I used to like. I liked Immortals for a season when they were destroying everyone even though they were just people who were kicked from teams, but that didn't last.

LongSh4dowsOct 14, 201725 votes

Just some thoughts:

Doublelift gets caught out a lot. I don't like DL on Kog.

Bjerg never seems to actually win lane and roam. For the "nest NA mid", that isn't really impressive.

Bio has some good engages.

Hauntzer seemed to play pretty smart.

0/7 in first bloods is a telling statistic.

You can't always come back late game.

TSM picked the same kind of "standard meta pick" team every time, and really didn't show any flexibility or innovation.

Once again disappointed.

Walmart PornOct 14, 201712 votes

Imo jensen is quickly replacing bjerg. Yes he makes mistakes now and again but the diffrence is even in their losses he makes proactive plays. The roams with contracts he plays the map more,and dosnt just play defensively for 45 mins untill you lose. Bjerg used to do that on syndra, zed and the like. Now they just sort of stagnated. If youre not actively looking for oppertunity you get nowhere

MysterQOct 14, 20173 votes

1year ago, the talk was Faker and Bjerg(lol) were great mids because they mastered the roam art. Crown had great lane skills but couldn't match Bjerg in his roaming, so he still needed to grow into midlane. And you know Bjerg did have good roams then. Good map plays. But this year he just forgot how to play and chose to turtle.

Walmart PornOct 14, 20173 votes

Yeah i wouldnt say ryze is bad just how they played him. Like in NA bjerg used realm warp to threaten top inhib then bumrush baron before the enemy team could respond. I remember that being on highlight. Thats the kind of proactive play they need where theyre making map movements. Playing ryze just to stall out the game would never have worked as well

GForce9xOct 14, 201712 votes

The tiebreaker game feels so much like deja vu. I recall a win-or-go-home game against SSG at last worlds where they went with a Jayce top and Ryze mid and made a team that didn't really have any kind of cohesion. And Bio on Karma on top of that? Once again the deciding game was lost in champ select.

Bio performs best on a play making champ and you give him a pure support in Karma. Trist has been DL's bread and butter this year and they go with Kog.

I think the thing that disappoints me the most isn't so much that they lost and didn't qualify, but the fact that the TSM that shows up at worlds is never the team that got them there. They are slaves to the meta and tend to only try and do what seems to be working for everyone else. Their one-dimensional 'survive until 6 items' mindset didn't work.

Maybe there was a mixup at the airport or something because the team I've enjoyed watching during the LCS didn't even show up at world's this year.

Darius StradaOct 14, 20179 votes

NA are way too cocky! Until they learn how to be humble, they will never go much further in Worlds.

MysterQOct 14, 201720 votes

I wouldn't say NA, but TSM yes. They even started off week1 saying "Oh we aint cocky this year. We respecting everyone, so we playing turtle defense." But then they disrespect FW and lose to them TWICE.

LankPantsOct 14, 201718 votes

But then they disrespect FW and lose to them TWICE.

Once. Flashwolves finished 1/5.

StoryDuckOct 14, 20179 votes

TSM is not only bad, they are boring too. They almost never innovate and always just play meta slave. They rarely go for early game and always want the late game scaling crap making for boring games to watch too.

Walmart PornOct 14, 20172 votes

The only time they do is when they play aginst bottom tier na or wildcards lul

YfrappefortOct 14, 20173 votes

{quoted}

TSM is not only bad, they are boring too. They almost never innovate and always just play meta slave. They rarely go for early game and always want the late game scaling crap making for boring games to watch too.

Yeah, compare this to GBM. Sure, sometimes they get crushed, but at least they have the balls to try new stuff (like that Nocturne pick) and are actually VERY enjoyable to watch. They play aggressive and try to push early advantages. TSM are meta slaves and play like crap. They also turtle every game and don't even try to win early. Very boring to watch.

StoryDuckOct 14, 20171 votes

I normally skip to 15 or 20 minutes into their games just because of that awful turtle and scale crap they have been doing. It's so boring! Even when they win I'm bored. Worlds also proves that this style is not the best. You need to bring something to the early game and not just focus on the late.

Walmart PornOct 14, 20176 votes

They went from being wild turtle to just turtle lol

MysterQOct 14, 20172 votes

They need the WILD to actually make proactive plays lol.

CrimsonLotus3Oct 14, 20177 votes

y'all hype TSM way too much and hate on people who dont support them. Shit drafts, AFK mid, weak adc, weak jng and decent top just decent...

aransOct 14, 20175 votes

They're not even a good team to begin with. Also EU people shouldn't talk because you're going to get trashed by KR anyway.

Gaxx DOct 14, 201753 votes

Year in, year out, brats like you keep saying the very same thing. Yeah, neither Fnatic nor Misfits have much of a chance against korean teams, but that doesn't take away from the fact, that NA teams can't perform when it matters. People like you are the last ones who should be telling others not to talk.

UzuryuujinOct 14, 201717 votes

I honestly thought it was pretty awesome that Fnatic managed to make it out of groups with everything that was happening with the team. And although i'm disappointed with NA's performance so far, it's not like it's undeserved. Both TSM and IMT had their fates in their own hands and couldn't win when it mattered most. I still have some hope for Cloud 9 though. They actually looked somewhat dominant in their wins unlike the other NA teams, but I guess tomorrow will show whether or not that's just wishful thinking.

xx12xx2019Oct 14, 20174 votes

{quoted}

They're not even a good team to begin with. Also EU people shouldn't talk because you're going to get trashed by KR anyway.

At least we manage to take games off KR teams unlike NA who can't even qualify out of groups. LUL

HonestJohnTheConOct 14, 20176 votes

We have a good chance in Group A, don't speak too soon...

...and yes, I know that's what we said about Group D, too...

...

[sg-janna]

Serika ZeroOct 14, 20172 votes

imt was 2-1 and fanatic was 0/3 at the start of the week. With a korean team in the group that seemed to win everything

c9 still has to work for it to get out.

Walmart PornOct 14, 20176 votes

We DID have a chance. Just no one expected tsm to leave their balls back in NA and just roll over and die

Emelie CauchemarOct 14, 20178 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lewd Ahri,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=EzEWrMMW,comment-id=0002000200000001,timestamp=2017-10-14T21:26:28.687+0000)

We DID have a chance. Just no one expected tsm to leave their balls back in NA and just roll over and die

That's what they always do though.

Walmart PornOct 14, 20174 votes

Yeah kinda. But you can at least hope they do something differently. Thats why i go for C9 over tsm myself. Their coach is actually good and if one thing isnt working he changes it. Not like tsm showing up with the same strat every year

SerophousOct 15, 20175 votes

I agree. I saw this group and thought "yep, TSM should hit first place, so I'll place them in my picks as first at least"

Nope

Thanks TSM, I usually dont expect much from you, but i thought with the bar set so low you would pass. Instead, you trip over it.

LitAFOct 14, 20174 votes

They need a new jungler and coach IMO.

FableBlazeOct 14, 20174 votes

TSM seems to be the G2 of NA at at the moment

MooooooooreDakkaOct 14, 20173 votes

If we're going by history, I believe G2 would be the TSM of EU

xx12xx2019Oct 14, 20174 votes

{quoted}

TSM seems to be the G2 of NA at at the moment

Oh really? G2 got 2 KR teams in their group and finished 3-3 which is pretty darn good considering circumstances. Meanwhile... TSM couldn't get out of easiest group they've been given EVER in their careers or at least beat Taiwan that was 0-5.

Doesn't look to me that TSM is even close to the level of G2.

FableBlazeOct 14, 20174 votes

{quoted}

Oh really? G2 got 2 KR teams in their group and finished 3-3 which is pretty darn good considering circumstances.

Hmm... care to name these two(!) Korean teams?

xx12xx2019Oct 14, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Hmm... care to name these two(!) Korean teams?

Care to stick that thorn out of your ass so it doesn't hurt so much? Last time I checked on gamepedia RNG was Korean not Chinese. So there is that.

Deez CritsOct 14, 20174 votes

{quoted}

Care to stick that thorn out of your ass so it doesn't hurt so much?

Same, if you're gonna be rude at least know what you're talking about.

xx12xx2019Oct 14, 20171 votes

[{quoted}](name=Deez Crits,realm=NA,application-id=9hBQwnEU,discussion-id=EzEWrMMW,comment-id=00070002000000000001,timestamp=2017-10-14T14:38:14.143+0000)

Same, if you're gonna be rude at least know what you're talking about.

Lol RNG was marked as KR team in gamepedia last time I checked. It's not my problem if they made a mistake. MY FACTS ARE SOLID.

Deez CritsOct 14, 20175 votes

The fact that you were wrong is solid regardless of the reason. And yes, it is quite your problem because you're making incorrect claims as a consequence and that's kind of why we're in this situation.

All you need to say was

RNG was marked as KR team in gamepedia last time I checked

And reassess your previous statement but you've got an ego. I love Wikipedia myself but you'd spew out anything that's on there for an argument without thinking twice and shift the criticism from you to the source as though you've done nothing wrong. If you didn't have the right facts, own up to it instead of being so obnoxiously defensive. The excessive remarks like

Care to stick that thorn out of your ass so it doesn't hurt so much? It's not my problem if they made a mistake. MY FACTS ARE SOLID.

are severely detrimental to how serious people can take you; if you just stopped after saying why you were misinformed it probably would've been better.

DradenOct 14, 20174 votes

Tsm isn't proactive, that's ok in NA as they can't close, but best teams in the world don't have that problem. NA chokes week 2, every year, don't know why I thought would be different this year.

Walmart PornOct 14, 20172 votes

Theres still a slight hope because historically unlike imt and tsm c9 play proactively around jensen and contracts. They have the best coach in na that MIGHT be enough to get them 2 wins. That said they got the group with skt ans i doubt ajq and edg have been sitting idle this last week...

Head ConnoisseurOct 14, 20174 votes

Svenskeren was just objectively bad for the entire group stage when compared to the other junglers at worlds. Even after week 1, when TSM was 2-1, Svenskeren had looked inconsistent at best, and overwhelmed/out of his league at worst.

HemanthOct 14, 20173 votes

It was surprising watching Crumbzz who is generally talking dumb stuff actually turn out perfect

MasziiOct 14, 20175 votes

{quoted}

It was surprising watching Crumbzz who is generally talking dumb stuff actually turn out perfect

? Crumbz is actualiteit pretty legit. He isnt a LCK caster for talking bs. And his predictions are usually right (apart from the GAM)

JuliénOct 15, 20173 votes

Bjerg shall go back to Denmark and play for an EU team, because NA is keeping him down too much. [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

MasziiOct 14, 20171 votes

i didnt watch pick and ban, but why Ryze. You didnt do anything with it. Might aswell picked something with more early game power.

Also Maxlore really carried this game. Great pathing, great ackniwledgement of the lanes that had to be snowballed and great body block on the sej ults.

MysterQOct 14, 20177 votes

Bjerg should just stick to Syndra Press R.