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I don't get it, Why late game champions can win lane and stomp their laner

ValiantKiller··11 votes·9,000 views

Legit right now due to the dumb Conquer , Nasus buff and such unneeded and blind balance change.

Jax Yasuo Nasus Lucian etc can just stomp you in lane and ruin your life for real while if they snowball game is mostly over.

Right now Yasuo is top tier both Mid and Top, got a high banned rate and it impossible to lane against him while he can scale like monster and take over game. Sames goes for Nasus who legit one of this few laner counter such as Darius if he fail to kill him before 6, he going to roll over him and the lane then snowball out of control.

and almost everything apply to every damn supposed " Late scaling champion " Right now they can just stomp you in lane and win the game easily cause he still scale hard.

I don't get it, if you want to make them viable stop buffing their early game and fix the game play core it self so it doesn't end.

I'm really legit sick of not able to banned Nasus Yasuo Jax Lucian just together in one game cause it pure hell and cancer for me to lane against them knowing if i made one mistake they will just take over the lane and destroy me.

65 Comments

Seenan6 votes

Remove Conqueror imo. Too strong on many champions.

ValiantKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Remove Conqueror imo. Too strong on many champions.

Agree

Kheshig1 votes

Hell no. That’s a bad idea.

kingDeDeDarius1 votes

Agree, it through true damage into kits that already scaled well as do, and made them lose many of their weaknesses, aka, you can't really Counterbuild Jax anymore, but he can Counterbuild you

Moody P4 votes

Nasus doesn't scale though

ValiantKiller2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lvXWwOAZ,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-02-01T21:40:49.450+0000)

Nasus doesn't scale though

Then what he do ?

Moody P4 votes

mid game power spike before people group 5v5 and kite him as a team and before the real hyper carries come online

strongest between about 15-25 minutes

ValiantKiller2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lvXWwOAZ,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2019-02-01T21:52:31.296+0000)

mid game power spike before people group 5v5 and kite him as a team and before the real hyper carries come online

strongest between about 15-25 minutes

Still he is scaling monster and you know that

Moody P4 votes

only theoretically, not really in practice

ValiantKiller2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lvXWwOAZ,comment-id=00000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-02-01T21:58:51.692+0000)

only theoretically, not really in practice

True

Dieenepappie1 votes

Oh in my elo teams often surrender when they see me kill half their team with 2 Q's.

Saezio5 votes

Well in 2019 League nasus can't reach anyone to Q in late game so. :/ He is only strong in midgame skirmishes and splitting and only if he is allowed a good Lane phase which is not very hard to do for a lot of champs in the top lane.

wildfox9T1 votes

wait for the summoner 4 + Q that will get 4/5 of your HP

also he will destroy the enemy frontline,so it's not true at all,he just can't reach the backlines easily because he's not supposed to,he's NOT an assassin

Saezio1 votes

Even if nasus has flash. 1 simple CC just makes him useless late game. (we are talking 5-6 items on all carries) You flash in as nasus, vayne E's you back and basically you need to abandon the fight. Same with any CC late game. If nasus is not duelling his Q stacks are worth nothing. The fact that every new age adc has mobility doesn't help either.

Dieenepappie1 votes

thats only gonna happen when hes been allowed to farm/ you aren't farmed enough. And if you know that its coming you should be able to play (FLASH) around it. Thats great. He flashes you flash or whatever and there he is. He used his flash pressed his Q and you are out of reach. play ashe (weak and basic champion). make him waste his slow. Then kite him and see him walk to you and back and back to you again and then drop without being able to do anything. Super satisfying.

GoldStorm71091 votes

{quoted}

Then what he do ?

Believe it or not, nasus is a midgame champ, 25 min + he falls off, yea maybe if you have an hour game he will start to get incredibly strong but that doesn't happen. Late game cc and the pure damage that ADC's can put out makes him pretty useless late.

Ch1efBeefQueef3 votes

Hold up, darius is not Nasus's only counter, in fact he is countered by a plethora of champions.

ValiantKiller1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Mike Hunt,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lvXWwOAZ,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-02-01T22:37:39.269+0000)

Hold up, darius is not Nasus's only counter, in fact he is countered by a plethora of champions.

I mean as example as he is go to counter.

Frog goes moo3 votes

lucian isn't a late game champ lmao. He's an early game bully that falls off if he doesn't get fed because he's not built with crit.

Nasus should be punishable early but I admit the buffs were unnecessary.

Yasuo and jax are the only ones I have a problem with. Yasuo is incredibly strong early for someone that scales so hard and has much more sustain than the people he lanes against due to his resourceless abilities and jax can turn into a tank with the press of a button. Also conqueror makes them even more unfun to play against since you can't really do much against them as a tank.

ValiantKiller1 votes

{quoted}

lucian isn't a late game champ lmao. He's an early game bully that falls off if he doesn't get fed because he's not built with crit.

Nasus should be punishable early but I admit the buffs were unnecessary.

Yasuo and jax are the only ones I have a problem with. Yasuo is incredibly strong early for someone that scales so hard and has much more sustain than the people he lanes against due to his resourceless abilities and jax can turn into a tank with the press of a button. Also conqueror makes them even more unfun to play against since you can't really do much against them as a tank.

Yasuo with bloodline and secondary ravones hunter = just much healing in lane for no reason from dashing and making damage with his Q + AA. Yah it dumb how he can heal in lane that much.

Saezio2 votes

Jax is trash early. Also, all the 3 top laners you mention are countered by the same champs. Just pick up one of these Darius Renekton Jayce Pick the one that matches your playstyle and never worry about those meanies again. There are other more niche choices but these are kinda your bread and butter to win an early game and snowball to a quick W

ValiantKiller4 votes

{quoted}

Jax is trash early. Also, all the 3 top laners you mention are countered by the same champs. Just pick up one of these Darius Renekton Jayce Pick the one that matches your playstyle and never worry about those meanies again. There are other more niche choices but these are kinda your bread and butter to win an early game and snowball to a quick W

Jax isn't that trash and yah i can agree with this picks but you get my point of this post.

Saezio2 votes

Well, I do get your point because I have been playing this game since season 1 so even if you just said 3 words I could understand the rest of the context. (too much time wasted around this game I know it's sad) I get your point, but you use the wrong champions as an example. Jax Nasus and Yasuo all 3 have distinct bad early games (except for some very small windows for jax and yas and 0 windows for nasus except maybe lvl 6 turning around a towerdive) Lucian has a strong early but that is his thing, he is a strong early very strong mid kinda lame late (or that's how he is supposed to be)

If you want to look at straight up unreasonably strong in all phases of the game champions you should check Irelia season 8 post rework Camile season 8 Jax season 8 (he has been nerfed since)

P.S. Don't get me wrong, jax is indeed strong and maybe deserves a couple more nerfs but not by any stretch of the imagination because his early is too strong + riot are bad and decided to nerf his late instead of early, when late should be all that jax wants.

ValiantKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Well, I do get your point because I have been playing this game since season 1 so even if you just said 3 words I could understand the rest of the context. (too much time wasted around this game I know it's sad) I get your point, but you use the wrong champions as an example. Jax Nasus and Yasuo all 3 have distinct bad early games (except for some very small windows for jax and yas and 0 windows for nasus except maybe lvl 6 turning around a towerdive) Lucian has a strong early but that is his thing, he is a strong early very strong mid kinda lame late (or that's how he is supposed to be)

If you want to look at straight up unreasonably strong in all phases of the game champions you should check Irelia season 8 post rework Camile season 8 Jax season 8 (he has been nerfed since)

P.S. Don't get me wrong, jax is indeed strong and maybe deserves a couple more nerfs but not by any stretch of the imagination because his early is too strong + riot are bad and decided to nerf his late instead of early, when late should be all that jax wants.

And they shouldn't have any form of power spikes in lane by all means, Look at good healthy example of late scaling champion Veigar legit that dude is complete trash till level 11 and 3 items while looking at the 3 i mention it impossible to keep them under control by all means.

Saezio4 votes

The windows I mention are like really small windows. here is a small example If someone tries to all in a jax at level 1 and jax has E and conq/pta. that's not really a powerspike but very very VERY VERY bad decision making by the enemy

Doge20201 votes

Nasus only has a powerspike early if the enemy wasn’t aggressive early to deny nasus enough gold to get a sheen at lvl 6 and didn’t deny enough stacks to make the sheen+lvl 6 combo worth anything (usually around 200 stacks at 15 min). If the nasus has more than 200 stacks at 15 min then you weren’t aggressive enough and didn’t deny a lot or any cannon minion stacks. If nasus can get a good amount of stacks during the early game (where he gets the smallest amount of stacks compared to the other phases of the game), got enough gold to get atleast a sheen and is lvl 6, then his window of creating a snowball is very very large and usually this can result in a lost game.

The “windows” that Saezio described are like niche powerspikes. They can become powerspikes if the champ plays correctly and gets a lead during these windows, but the window can be useless if the enemy plays correctly and stops the late game champ from snowballing.

kingDeDeDarius1 votes

The problem. With being aggressive against nad is it makes you incredibly, stupidly vulnerable to ganks. I know this as a Darius main lol. If the enemy jg has half a brain, you will lose.lane to nas

Doge20201 votes

Yeah that is why you want to play aggressive at certain times, like before lvl 6 when he is at your tower, or if he wasted flash and the enemy jungler left after a failed gank.

3TWarrior1 votes

considering level 11 used to be barely midgame...

ValiantKiller1 votes

{quoted}

considering level 11 used to be barely midgame...

Yah it not that late anymore

kingDeDeDarius1 votes

I think the point is that a Jax can be unreasonably safe early game, and isn't really that weak at all. He's merely not dominant. And lucian's late game is actually solid because he still has high damage (not the highest dps among adcs), and fantast mobility which allows him to outplay many opponents who otherwise outscale him

boricCentaur12 votes

If you get stomped by nasus without any jungle help maybe you should rethink how you play top lane since his early game is one of if not the worst in the game. lucian does not scale that well compared to other adcs the only one he does out scale is draven and maybe ezreal.

Saezio3 votes

Well, lucian is not a traditional late game adc for sure... Why is that? Because he has trouble sustaining his dps vs tanks and he has low range... Well, item 3153 item 3071 +PtA and the fact tanks are useless atm and lucian never runs out of damage or needs to really siege or FTB fight

ValiantKiller2 votes

{quoted}

Well, lucian is not a traditional late game adc for sure... Why is that? Because he has trouble sustaining his dps vs tanks and he has low range... Well, item 3153 item 3071 +PtA and the fact tanks are useless atm and lucian never runs out of damage or needs to really siege or FTB fight

^

3TWarrior1 votes

nasus isn't the worst but he does have it bad against any champion that can be over-aggressive without much consequence such as: rengar, riven, jax, etc

the high lifesteal on his passive tends to keep him around easily after harass

heroikc2 votes

To be fair, if you had stomped a game and allowed it to stall, you deserve to be wrecked by late game champs.

ZephyrDrake2 votes

Lucian a late game champion? He has always been strong early and then above average late so no idea why you calling him a "late game champion"

Daddy Ants1 votes

{quoted}

Lucian a late game champion? He has always been strong early and then above average late so no idea why you calling him a "late game champion"

His late game isn't anything to disregard.

It's not on the level of a Vayne, Kai'Sa, Jinx etc but he still does respectable damage, can do damage to tanks due to his build.

ZephyrDrake1 votes

{quoted}

His late game isn't anything to disregard.

It's not on the level of a Vayne, Kai'Sa, Jinx etc but he still does respectable damage, can do damage to tanks due to his build.

never said he had a bad late game. I said he had an above average late game. His late game when compared to most ADCs isn't great. He is still short ranged at a time where he is more easily punished. He can do all the damage he wants to tanks, all it takes is tanks landing ONE CC on him and he is dead, unless the tanks team are just a bunch of monkeys that don't know how to follow up on their tank engaging

JackMcCarry2 votes

Lucian isnt late game, he's one of the main lane bullies, which is why he's top tier in this snowbally meta. Nasus got buffed and power creeped his way into the early game with damage buffs instead of utility.

Jax is cancer, conquerer amplifies it, same as yasuo.

Zed genius2 votes

Lucian is NOT a lategame champion...

xDogMeatx1 votes

actually on jax all he needs is sheen then he auto wins at that point.

ValiantKiller1 votes

{quoted}

actually on jax all he needs is sheen then he auto wins at that point.

Special when he got sheen he mostly got his passive from his R too.

xDogMeatx1 votes

your saying after sheen power up his passive ult (3rd hit) spikes him further if im reading that right?

ValiantKiller1 votes

{quoted}

your saying after sheen power up his passive ult (3rd hit) spikes him further if im reading that right?

Yah

GayFluffyUnicorn1 votes

Yeah right. If you rush sheen most matchups will oneshot you.

But whatever the jax circlejerk is too strong nowadays.

In fact whole boards is legit a trash can right now seeing all these lies about jax and also yasuo while lucian is completely fine lululul.

Also jungle the by far hardest role in the game :D

Holy shit this place.

NodirjonSattarov1 votes

For how late game oriented Yasuo is supposed to be, his one item Phantom Dancer power spike is so disgusting

ValiantKiller1 votes

{quoted}

For how late game oriented Yasuo is supposed to be, his one item Phantom Dancer power spike is so disgusting

Atleast hope that crit change make him unable to buy another lifeline item and in same time the shield should be less weaker than 12% damage reduction

Schenix1 votes

Lucian Late Game

Pick one

Dieenepappie1 votes

Im a bit of a nasus main right now. When hes farmed he is pretty broken. But only then. And there are so many ways to counter him. Almost anything with a strong early game. Or alot of early game outplay potential since nasus is pretty basic. Teemo pantheon jax himself are great counters. Also any champ good at kiting. Also his wither is only for one person so he is easily ganked since that is his only escape.

So he is actually really easy countered, most people at low elo just cant do it. I think thats your problem. Last game against a vi she starts complaining hes broken after 1 kill. She let me farm, also vi is a really bad matchup against nasus. Doesnt mean he is broken, just means you do the wrong thing with the wrong champ. any champion can beat you if you let them farm. Teemo is almost a perfect counter with his blind poison slow and speed. Last teemo i laned against fed me and let me farm then starts complaining about nasus... people in my elo look too much at the champions and 2 little at their own skill me thinks.

I win more games now that i know how to use nasus' ''brokeness''. But thats only because im starting to get good at it and people are letting me.

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