Ok, Can we stop with the "balance team is doing nothing"?

Ahristocats··23 votes·1,705 views

its starting to get out of control due to how obnoxious those people are jesus

Darius -Crippling Strike (W) cooldown lowered from 9/8/7/6/5 to 7/6.5/6/5.5/5 AD ratio increased from 140% at all ranks to 140/145/150/155/160% -Apprehend (E) armor pen increased from 5/10/15/20/25% to 10/15/20/25/30%

Evelynn -Whiplash (E) Empowered damage increased from 70/90/110/130/150 to 95/115/135/155/175

Fiddlesticks -Dark Wind (E) cooldown lowered from 12/11.5/11/10.5/10 to 10 at all ranks Additional damage to monsters increased from 50% to 100% [No longer mentions minions] -Crowstorm (R) cooldown lowered from 150/140/130 to 140/110/80

Gangplank -Parrrley (Q) cost increased from 40 at all ranks to 60/55/50/45/40 -Powder Keg (E) keg duration lowered from 60 seconds to 25 seconds

Gnar -Hop (E) damage increased from 20/60/100/140/180 to 50/85/120/155/190 -GNAR! (R) [Removed] [Mini/Passive] No longer increases Boomerang Throw's CDR

Kalista Base AD lowered from 71 to 66 Base attack speed increased from 0.644 to 0.694 Attack speed per level increased from 2.5 to 3.5 Attack Range lowered from 550 to 525 -Sentinel (W) [Changed Effect] No longer gains attack speed near Oathsworn ally, now gains 5/10/15/20/25 Attack Damage. -Rend (E) mana refund changed from 30 mana to 10/15/20/25/30 mana.

Kog'Maw -Bio-Arcane Barrage (W) bonus magic damage increased from 3/3.5/4/4.5/5% to 3/3.75/4.5/5.25/6%

Ornn -Bellows Breath (W) damage increased from 10/12/14/16/18% to 12/13/14/15/16% cooldown increased from 13/12/11/10/9 to 17/15/13/11/9 shield duration increased from 2.5 seconds to 3.5 seconds Brittle duration lowered from 6 seconds to 3 seconds -Searing Charge (E) Damage increased from 30/50/70/90/110 to 80/125/170/215/260 bonus armor ratio increased from 30% to 40% bonus MR ratio increased from 30% to 40% [effect changed] "If Ornn rams into terrain, he creates a shockwave that knocks up enemies for 1 second and applies Searing Charge's damage to those not hit by the charge." The shockwave effect now only damages units NOT hit by the initial charge. Shockwave damage increased from 50-210 to 80-260. -Call of the Forge God (R) Brittle duration lowered from 6 seconds to 3 seconds.

Poppy -Heroic Charge (E) Initial damage increased from 55/75/95/115/135 to 60/80/100/120/140 Terrain collide damage increased from 55/75/95/115/130 to 60/80/100/120/140

Renekton -Cull the Meek (Q) Damage increased from 65/95/125/155/185 to 65/100/135/170/205 Enhanced damage increased from 95/140/185/230/275 to 100/150/200/250/300

Rengar Base HP lowered from 586.2 to 585 Base AD lowered from 68 to 65 AD growth increased from 1.5 to 3 Base attack speed changed from .625 + 3.5%/lvl to .666 + 3%/lvl Unseen Predator (Passive) Bonetooth buff changed from [1/3/7/13/20 flat AD and % bonus AD] to [1/4/9/16/25% bonus AD] Leap distance from target on landing lowered from 100 to 50 -Savagery (Q) [New] Active - Rengar’s next attack deals 20/50/80/110/140 (+110% TAD) [New] Empowered - Rengar’s next attack deals 30-240 (+130% TAD) damage and grants + 40% AS for next two attacks Q grants ferocity and Attack Speed vs. towers, but does not deal bonus damage. Buff duration for on-next hit lowered from 5 to 3 No longer partial resets after the Q attack (Pressing Q is still a full reset) Particles and sounds have been added/re-added to support the old Q animation and buffs. This includes stuff for skins. Q animation speed has been adjusted to better match when the damage comes out Old icon is back. Empowered Q now consumes ferocity on cast (should fix a number of bugs and feel issues) -Battle Roar (W) cooldown lowered from 20/18/16/14/12 to 16/14.5/13/11.5/10 -Thrill of the Hunt (R) Range at which enemies can sense Rengar lowered from 2000/3000/4000 to 1600 Range at which Rengar can track the nearest enemy changed from 2000/3000/4000 to 2500/3000/3500 Enemy champions revealed by Thrill of the Hunt (by being closest to Rengar) stay revealed for the spell's duration (even if another enemy moves closer) and are alerted of Rengar's presence. Movement Speed increased from 40% to 40/50/60% Closest enemy leap bonus changed from providing a critical strike to [30% TAD +12/18/24 Armor shred for 4 seconds.]

Shyvana AD per level lowered from 3.4 to 2.8 -Twin Bite (Q) second hit bonus damage lowered from 40/55/70/85/100% to 20/35/50/65/80%

Swain -Vision of Empire (W) cost changed from 90/100/110/120/130 to 70/85/100/115/130 -Demonic Ascension (R) heal increased from 15/30/45 to 20/35/50 Demonflare health drain value changed from 150/300/450 to 125/300/450 (at 1/12/16)

Talon Base magic resist increased from 32.1 to 39 Base armor lowered from 32 to 30

Tristana -Buster Shot (R) cooldown increased from 100/85/70 to 120/110/100

Twitch -Contaminate (E) base damage lowered from 20/35/50/65/80 to 20/25/30/35/40

Volibear -Rolling Thunder (Q) enhanced Movement speed bonus toward champions increased from 30/35/40/45/50% to 30/37.5/45/52.5/60% "Transitioning from the Movement Speed Maximum to the Movement Speed Minimum now decays over 1 second rather than falling off immediately." -Frenzy (W) In addition to monsters, active's cooldown is now reduced by 50% when he bites a minion. -Majestic Roar (E) [New Effect] Now knocks back enemies slightly. [New Effect] Airborne or dashing enemies now take an additional 40/60/80/100/120 (+30% AP) damage

Xin Zhao -Determination (Passive) bonus damage lowered from 20/40/60/80% at 1/6/11/16 to 15/25/35/45% at 1/6/11/16. -Wind Becomes Lightning (W) duration extend of other abilities lowered from 0.60 to 0.50

Zed -Death Mark (R) cooldown lowered from 120/100/80 to 120/90/60

Zoe Base hp increased by 34 Base AD increased by 2 -More Sparkles(P) AP ratio increased from 20% to 32.5% -Paddle Star (Q) Paddle Star no longer applies More Sparkles' damage to enemies past the first hit. Damage reduced to 45-105+20% from 45-165+40% -Spell Thief (W) Minions can no longer drop Teleport. AP ratio increased from 40% to 60% Movement speed increased from 10-70% to 30-70% -Sleepy Trouble Bubble (E) [Removed Effect] No longer notes "When an enemy champion falls asleep, Sleepy Trouble Bubble's cooldown is reduced by 10/15/20/25/30%." "Removing Drowsy now prevents the affected target from asleep." "This includes effects such as Cleanse, Mikeal's Crucible, or Quicksilver Sash, as well as champion CC removals such as Alistar ult.

Perfect Timing (I2) Stopwatch transform time increased from 6 mins to 10 mins

Inspiration: no longer increases potions duration

Press The Attack (P1) Damage increased from [30 - 120] to [40 - 180] Vulnerable champion damage taken changed from[12% to [4% - 12%]

Precision bonus attack speed changed to AD/AP+attack speed if combined with domination/sorcery

Frozen Mallet Ranged attack slow lowered from 30% to 20%

Targon's Brace Health lowered from 175 to 120

Wit's End Cost lowered from 2500 to 2400 Combine cost lowered from 480 to 380 Unique Passive bonus magic damage increased from 40 to 42 Unique Passive changed from[basic attacks steal 5 MR on hit (stacks up to 5 times)] to [basic attacks steal 3 MR on hit (6 if attacker is melee), up to a max of 30 MR.]

FREAKING AP ITEMIZATION REWORK

and i didn't even list all the changes because i need to save my bloody time they're changing resolve

this is the longest patch we ever had since i don't know how many years press the attack buff combined with ad from precision, Renekton and **ing Darius buff , item 3091 becoming broken with Gangplank Gnar nerfs, you can be 100% sure that toplane meta will shift Ornn HEAVY NERF Kalista HEAVY NERF Zoe HEAVY NERF AP itemization having more diversity, buffing mages who couldn't build morello

Twitch nerf, kog has been buffed in a cancerous way which is the only negative point of the patch

Lot of broken champions like Shyvana, xin zhao being nerfed

Inspiration tree becoming less stupid(which is a gp nerf) heavily

Fiddlesticks insane buff (you can argue it's powercreep but idc) Volibear insane buff (you can argue it's powercreep) Rengar Rengar Rengar Rengar Rengar Rengar Rengar Rengar IS BEING REVERTED WHICH IS WHAT YOU WANTED

complain about balance as much as you want but you make me so sick inside if you complain about the balance team not working, this is just flat out untrue

consider yourself lucky, **** never did we have so much changes in one patch, and low elo is being looked at (twitch nerf) just like high elo (kalista nerf)

if you pretend that the balance team is not working, you either have amnesia or you don't read PBE

58 Comments

BlackEyesBlue12 votes

They're doing stuff, but its the WRONG stuff from my players perspective. Is that better?

Ahristocats2 votes

Hm not it isn't Rengar revert is good Zoe nerf is good Fiddle buff is good, i agree it's powercreep but you would need to nerf THE ENTIRE game to buff him, which one do you think is easier to do? Ornn nerf is good Kalista nerf is good

Overall, the entire patch is good except Kog who needs power shifting rather than nerfing/buffing his W constantly

BlackEyesBlue8 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lsWZz9tv,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2018-02-20T14:36:28.270+0000)

Hm not it isn't Rengar revert is good Zoe nerf is good Fiddle buff is good, i agree it's powercreep but you would need to nerf THE ENTIRE game to buff him, which one do you think is easier to do? Ornn nerf is good Kalista nerf is good

Overall, the entire patch is good except Kog who needs power shifting rather than nerfing/buffing his W constantly

They are putting a poster over hole in the wall when they should be fixing it. Just the way They've handled Zoe this patch alone shows that they are basically Throwing stuff at the wall and seeing if it sticks! "She will likely be very weak after this" I believe was the quote.

Remember that old Simpsons clip where Jasper gets his beard stuck in the pencil sharpener? ... Feels like they're taking the grandpa Simpson approach to the situation...

LankPants4 votes

And none of that matters as the game at large is still in a critical state. Until Riot actually address the large issues with the game it doesn't matter what they do with individual champions.

Ahristocats1 votes

and you think that inspiration tree safety being removed, press the attack/precision buff buffing bruisers, wit's end buffing bruisers vs tanks, AP itemization COMPLETE rebalance, and cancerous stopwatch being nerfed

won't affect the issues of the games?

especially when some unhealthy champions like ornn/zoe/kalista are being rebalanced?

you expect the game to be fixed within one patch, or the healthiness of the game being at least improved by a step? jesus, you guys are worse than me when it comes to ego

LankPants1 votes

and you think that inspiration tree safety being removed, press the attack/precision buff buffing bruisers, wit's end buffing bruisers vs tanks, AP itemization COMPLETE rebalance, and cancerous stopwatch being nerfed

won't affect the issues of the games?

Yes, I completely believe that.

The issue with the game at current isn't on the rune/item level, the issue is with the fundamentals of the map. You can change runes all you want, that won't fix how pathetic towers are, how generally fucked game pacing is and how absurd objectives are (and Riot's thinking about buffing Baron). These issues are the first that need to be dealt with. Part of dealing with this issue would be itemisation changes, but not changes to mage item or bruiser items, the items that are problematic are ADC items and they are the ones that are harming the game at large.

Ayanami3rd9 votes

Gnar Hop (E) damage increased from 20/60/100/140/180 to 50/85/120/155/190 GNAR! (R)

Super Gnario stomping you!

Concerning the rest:

The buffs sound quite scary to me. Zed ult CDR peak at 60? For the love of God, wtf.

Good news is, that cleansing drowsy now actually saves you.

Ahristocats5 votes

yea i agree, a lot of champions (fiddle zed viktor in last patch) are getting cd buff on ult which is something i don't like because it allows someone to be "oh i used ult and did nothing, let's just wait 30 sec)

ie: ori since her ult cd buff

Eedat3 votes

But they said they're nerging Duskblade so it's a trade off. They're hitting Zed early then giving him back something late. Late game Zed isnt very good so it's overall a nerf imo

Eedat1 votes

Don't forget they said they are nerfing Duskblade so I guess it's kind of a trade off. They're hitting his early game then giving him some late game back. Considering how Zed is pretty feast or famine I'd say it's an overall nerf.

Chromatic Eagle1 votes
Illâoi Evê Siôn8 votes

But what about power creep? :( I wanna complain about power creep.

I actually do, but I'll admit that they're trying.

Blåbæret8 votes

They're fixing none of the major issues. To me, that's doing nothing.

Salson7 votes

Ye, most of them are actually good at their job.

The team leader just has a messed up vision of League, judging by the current Jungle oppression and Marksman assassinating people.

GayFluffyUnicorn3 votes

Say ty to fearless for the jungle. Not meddler. You can scrap and fire the entire team. Ricklessabandon, fearless, meddler they are ALL awful. Throw certainly in too.

Salson2 votes

Someone still allowed for those changes to go through. In situations like that, the team leader and the worker share the fault.

You can scrap and fire the entire team.

Meh, I've worked with some really underachieving people. A good leader can work wonders.

ComeGankMeBro7 votes

Wow, powercreep!

They're doing such a wonderful job buffing so many things up instead taking the dominant Characters down a peg.

Ahristocats8 votes

Ornn Gangplank XinZhao Zoe Twitch Kalista Shyvana Gnar Tristana (more nerfs in 8.5) but sure, no dominant characters taken down

k

ComeGankMeBro4 votes

PBE being the prime word.

How many times has stuff been reverted? And hey didn't Kog just get insta-buffs after his nerf?

I'm not holding my breath due to these things.

Ahristocats3 votes

it's locked, it's being shipped tomorow it ain't pbe anymore at this point

ComeGankMeBro1 votes

8.4 or 8.5? Which is it?

Ahristocats2 votes

8.4

Tristanl0l7 votes

balance team took 3 months to do something lelelelelele

Sun Wu Ryuumoku6 votes

i don't see my MonkeyKing

Eedat4 votes

Duskblade getting nerfed and no Wu buffs. RIP

BoostedMessiah5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lsWZz9tv,comment-id=,timestamp=2018-02-20T13:40:37.567+0000)

Renekton *Cull the Meek (Q) Damage increased from 65/95/125/155/185 to 65/100/135/170/205 Enhanced damage increased from 95/140/185/230/275 to 100/150/200/250/300

This is literally doing nothing. Let me know when they wake up and replace Press the Attack with a reworked Fervor of Battle that also appropriately delineates a distinction between melee and ranged champions because, in case you weren't aware, there is one.

Ahristocats6 votes

Yes it does, renekton is already being buffed with precision and PTA, and now his Q also gained base damage buff which is a buff to his laning phase

i'm a renekton player since season 3, and i do know that this change is huge renekton Q is obnoxious as hell in lane, if you give it +20 base damage you're buffing renekton's damage in lane by like 2000 due to the amount of time he uses Q against you

BoostedMessiah5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lsWZz9tv,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-02-20T13:55:08.325+0000)

Yes it does, renekton is already being buffed with precision and PTA, and now his Q also gained base damage buff which is a buff to his laning phase

i'm a renekton player since season 3, and i do know that this change is huge renekton Q is obnoxious as hell in lane, if you give it +20 base damage you're buffing renekton's damage in lane by like 2000 due to the amount of time he uses Q against you

It gets +20 base damage at Rank 5. Renekton's current problems are that his early game has been nerfed to the floor, he has no truly useful keystone, and the extant tank meta makes him largely irrelevant. Stop trying to sell this nothingburger as being more than it is for no other reason than your need to be a cheerleader.

Ahristocats5 votes

i told you THAT HIS EARLY GAME is being buffed with PTA and precision giving AD

renekton is able to apply PTA with AA+W, and the triggering damage is being heavily buffed in early game additionally, his lvl 3-4 is not the problem, currently it is because he gets attack speed from precision, he will get AD, it's rather his lvl 5-8 where he sucks, and it got buffed

BoostedMessiah6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lsWZz9tv,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-20T14:06:08.843+0000)

renekton is able to apply PTA with AA+W, and the triggering damage is being heavily buffed in early game

It's actually getting nerfed, though. Renekton is an AD caster, and the damage increase from other sources is changing from 12% to 4%. Or can't you read? Also, as I said before, the fact that there is no difference between melee champions and ranged champs who use this rune is a dead giveaway that something is wrong.

additionally, his lvl 3-4 is not the problem,

His early game is the problem. It's not where it used to be, and where it needs to be given the way he scales.

Ahristocats4 votes

it's getting nerfed if you deal 200 damage+ in trades AFTER the proc of PTA

which is impossible to do in early game unless you heavily comit, but with renekton once you use your spells you just disengage and wait to trade again with them

a rioter released a chart of PTA's old damage vs new damage, it's a buff dude

BoostedMessiah5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lsWZz9tv,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-20T14:16:57.952+0000)

it's getting nerfed if you deal 200 damage+ in trades AFTER the proc of PTA

LOL? How the hell else do you play the trade? Is this some sort of joke response?

It's pretty obvious you want to just keep screaming "it's a BUFF" rather than acknowledge the state of the game.

I couldn't care less what a Rioter's theorycraft chart says. In reality, if you're spamming Q in order to see some returns from the 5 or 10 damage buff it received, you just handed your opponent an easy freeze and/or invited their jungle to sit on you for habitually shoving.

I also can't help but notice you keep ignoring my point about PTA not having a melee variant. They literally just added that to Wit's End in this very patch, so I guess you can't reasonably pretend it's not needed, so just pretend I didn't even mention it.

Anyway, if the Renekton mains go back to playing Renekton because of these changes, I guess that will mean you were right. But if they don't, then just as surely, you were not.

Ahristocats4 votes

{quoted}

LOL? How the hell else do you play the trade? Is this some sort of joke response?

you're able to deal 200 damage at lvl 1 after PTA proc?

okay my bad then

BoostedMessiah4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Je suis Rubick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=lsWZz9tv,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-02-20T14:45:52.319+0000)

you're able to deal 200 damage at lvl 1 after PTA proc?

okay my bad then

You dump all your damage before you actually proc PTA? Okay, my bad then.

D357R0Y3R2 votes

there is no way that at level one you can deal 200 damage after a target is exposed

at least on renekton unless you went from a full lvl 1 agression which is a retarded move

BoostedMessiah2 votes

{quoted}

there is no way that at level one you can deal 200 damage after a target is exposed

at least on renekton unless you went from a full lvl 1 agression which is a retarded move

Why is that one specific case the entire crux of the argument? Because that just means in every instance below level 5, I am correct.

Dracocrash1 votes

You can easily deal 200 physical damage (reduced by armor) as renekton level 1. All it takes is one Q + 2 auto attacks with a long sword.

here is the math Q base damage + 80% bonus ad scaling + 2 x (base ad + bonus ad) 65 + (8) + 2 x (69+10)

=231.

D357R0Y3R1 votes

but 200 damage after press the attack proced? i hardly imagine it, you must really do a long trade

Dracocrash1 votes

Renekton can pull this off at level 2

Auto W (w is an auto reset and applies onhit effects 2 times, which immediatly switches on press the attack)

then Q auto auto. It's doable, also I did math which showed new PTA at level 2 to do lower damage with a Q auto as well.

Wert the Wacky5 votes

Swain buffs? I already have a 67% winrate so why not.

Kai Guy1 votes

How I felt with Bard for ages lol.

JohnnyNeverSins3 votes

Just because they change some things it doesnt mean that they are doing something.although they did change some things after about eh 2 months but hey,at least they did something in the end.

JackMcSnipeyz5 votes

"Just because they are doing something doesnt mean they are doing something" kappa

xelaker3 votes

So if my job is to take out a trash can and I tip it over and roll it in the general direction of the curb, I'm good?

Slythion3 votes

I know Rengar needed major nerfs/adjustments based on my time on the PBE, but did they really halve his leap distance from bushes? That's gonna take some time getting used to

Other than a few things like Talon's 7mr lv.1 buff (even though idk much about Talon's current state) or some slight powercreep suspicions (even though there are definitely a lot of nerfs) I really do like this patch

Apocalypsic1 votes

{quoted}

I know Rengar needed major nerfs/adjustments based on my time on the PBE, but did they really halve his leap distance from bushes? That's gonna take some time getting used to

Other than a few things like Talon's 7mr lv.1 buff (even though idk much about Talon's current state) or some slight powercreep suspicions (even though there are definitely a lot of nerfs) I really do like this patch

Probably halfed his bushleap due to how oppressive Rengar is top, especially the single target Q version.

Slythion1 votes

I can understand that, but I wonder how thatll effect his jungle

Dracocrash2 votes

Press The Attack (P1) Damage increased from [30 - 120] to [40 - 180] Vulnerable champion damage taken changed from[12% to [4% - 12%]

and

press the attack buff combined with ad from precision

Gona go out on a limb and say that looks like a nerf (or a rebalance) to me. Definitely a late game buff, but most of its users use it for its early to mid game.

A renekton trading would do a auto W. (proc PTA) then Q auto and get out.

Renekton Q has 65 base damage + 80% bonus ad ratio = 73 damage at level 1 with long sword + 1 auto = 71 damage approx at level 2.

=144 damage boosted by press the attack (this can increase depending on how much more renekton decides to trade/ but for calculation purposes we will consider minimum)

Pre change damage at level 2- 35 + (12% of 144) = 52.8

Post change damage

37.8 + (4.4% of 144) = 44.136

This gap definitly bridges and surpasses pre change PTA as time goes on, but I would call it a rebalance, not a buff.

But I personally think this change is extremely genius.

The early game damage loss only effects champs like renekton/darius/lucian. But this is mended by the fact that precision can now be paired with other trees for ad. So the changes don't actually result in a NET nerf for early game champions that want to use it.

But it definitly hurts many OP outliers that I thought riot was ignoring, the most potent one being warwick. (yes, I think warwick is op right now, sue me)

Warwick really doesn't benefit much from the early ad as much as the other champs, and he has a ridiculously high winrate early game that falls of as the game goes on. This nerfs his early game (no more amplified damage on insane attack speed steroids with W max, and Q % hp damage)

and late game its not easy for him to proc the mastery, so the buff isn't really much of a buff on him. (supports body blocking ww ult in a 5v5, getting peeled of adc, etc, just generally falling off in damage)

AMYS GRAVE2 votes

So that's an entire TEAMS worth of work for a whole month (big patches like this every other patch, with smaller patches in between not addressing things), except rengar was handled by a VGU team not live balance, and the AP itemization pass was handled by the systems team not the live gameplay team. They touched ~1/7th of the champs and still haven't solved problems introduced literally years ago.

I have no problem criticizing that team.

Trollmanship2 votes

90% of the changes are damage buffs

lmao they have no clue wtf they're doing

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