Why are there so many champions with similar abilities that basically just look different?

JavelinJoe·Oct 15, 2015·1 votes·393 views

sejuani, vi, nautilus, leona, cassiopeia, nunu, sion, morgan, rumble, janna, kalista, bard, azir, ekko, gangplank, pantheon, anivia, hecarim, xin zhao, fizz, galio, zyra, braum, lee sin, zac, amumu, thresh, blitz, lissandra, nami, malphite, gragas, and gnar all seem based around similar principles.

AOE cc for an ult.
Additional forms of cc from somewhere other than the ult.
Some kind of survivability (escape/ movement speed buff/ shield/ heal). // zyra's e adds a slow to rampant growth
usually annoying to play either with or against (not really a statistic of their design, but it is a common trait shared among them )

Just something I noticed. Maybe this is the default template for champions?

9 Comments

IcyPepperOct 15, 20152 votes

If you strip enough specifics, you'll eventually have the base template for every champion.

But the specifics is what makes them unique. You don't need fancy new mechanics to make a champion unique, sometimes it's the little things that add up that make up their identity.

Take Vi for example. Unlike, let's go with Vayne, she doesn't proc her W passive every three autoattacks. She procs it every time she lands a spell or an autoattack, and instead of just damage it 1.) deals %hp damage based on her AD and 2.) shreds the enemy's armor while boosting her attack speed. In this case, it encourages her to build bruiser to have sticking power for her W, win trades by being a bit tankier, aids in her jungle clears, and have enough damage to make her W really hurt. The way her W works makes her the perfect jungler: if she succeeds in initiating a gank by landing her Q, her W passive is nearly guaranteed to proc. If she fails and misses, it's unlikely she'll land all three hits outside her ult due to her E only having two charges if she can't get in melee range. Sure, you can farm until six if you have this problem, but you play Vi for her early game not her farming game.

It's not like Vayne, who basically only autos with the occasional condemn. Vayne's W is an ADC's wet dream, dealing assloads of damage by autoattacking. However, the true damage is fixed, it doesn't scale off any stat besides attack speed. Because of this, Vayne has a slightly different ADC build path since her first three items deal in attack speed, then the rest of her items compliment her physical damage. Vayne can build tanky if she wanted to, but because she's ranged and have mobility/condemn she has no need to if she plays her cards right. Unlike Vi, Vayne's W makes her a late-game carry, not an early game ganking jungler. It doesn't do much at early ranks, it doesn't scale off her own stats, it doesn't boost her stats or lower her opponent's stats.

I know this wasn't part of your list, but three-hit abilities are a common complaint and I just wanted to point out how similar they are, yet wildly different they can be. They also have their place, since if Vi and Vayne's Ws were cut in thirds and proc'd every autoattack, it would be ridiculously overpowered. These types of abilities gate power, and reward champions if they fulfill the conditions.

JavelinJoeOct 15, 20151 votes

Lol i just realized how right you are about how many abilities work around a specific number of _____ hit on the same champion. But vayne is unique with the true damage since it scales with the % max health

KougaOct 15, 20151 votes

She isn't unique anymore - there is a lot more True Damage in the game, a lot of % Max HP damage, and even some (like Fiora) that have % Max HP True Damage.

But like Tomb said, if you look at broad strokes, yes many Champions have overlap. They aren't special because of the generalities, they're special because of the specifics.

KougaOct 15, 20152 votes

Because I like making a point:

•AOE cc for an ult.

[Sejuani] Range: 1175 Max Dmg: 350 + .80AP magic Max CC Duration: 1.75 seconds Target type: AoE Colliding Skillshot Notes: Can initiate at range, can stun multiple targets, Sejuani can remain at safe distance (can be a disengage), but has to hit target to stun, can miss (slows only it targets are in range of AoE)

[Vi] Range: 800 Max Dmg: 450 + 1.4 Bonus AD physical Max CC Duration: 1.25 seconds Target: targeted (point & click) dash Notes: Can initiate at range, can knock aside multiple targets but generally only used for 1 target, Vi moves herself into range (generally not a disengage), cannot "miss" (unless shielded)

[Nautilus] Range: 825 Max dmg: 450 + .80AP magic Max CC Duration: 2 seconds (0.5 for secondary targets) Target type: Targeted AoE Notes: Can initiate at range, can knock up multiple targets, can give large zone control (drop Ult on back line, watch everyone scatter), can be a disengage, cannot miss (unless shielded)

[Nunu] Range: 650 (radius) Max Dmg: 1,125 + 2.25 AP Magic Max CC Duration: Channel time of 3 seconds Target type: point-blank AoE channel Notes: can be interrupted for less damage, can be avoided by moving out of range, Nunu has to already be within range/danger zone (not a disengage), Channel prevents Nunu from doing anything for 3 seconds.

I picked the first couple names in your list. Even though each one has a "CC Ult" they are each radically different. Sejuani's Ultimate has the most range and is an AoE Stun. Why? Sejuani's other abilities are very short or melee range, so this is her only range engage. It also lets her use it and stay out of the fight if she needs to, or if she's out of position. Compare that with Vi - Vi's ult puts her directly next to an enemy. Now usually this is exactly where Vi wants to be - but it means that if Vi is low and trying to get away, she can't use her ult in the same way that Sejuani can to protect herself or allies. Now Naut, on the other hand, can still use his to engage or disengage, but it also has a lower range than Sejuani, and usually gives the opponent plenty of time to react at range (long wind up animation, his ult has a lot of travel time if the enemy is running away). Why? Well, Nautilus (unlike Sejuani) has another ranged engage (via his hook) so its okay to give him an ult that isn't quite as quick or powerful as Sejuani, because Naut already has so much lock down potential. Then you have Nunu - Nunu's is the least reliable of all them - it takes a full 3 seconds to reach max damage, it can be interrupted very easily or they can just walk/blink/dash/Zed right out. Why? Because look at that damage. 1,125 base damage. Ouch. Nunu's ultimate is all about "Focus Me Or Die", forcing the opponents to either flee in terror or focus their attention on stopping/killing him, which is exactly what a Tank is meant to do. Notice that with Vi/Naut, the focus is more about locking down a single enemy target so that your team can kill them, while Nunu is about forcing the enemy team to move their focus off his allies.

I could go on for your entire list, but this should make my point clear enough. Each one has its own niche, its own role to play. And you'll start to see after a while why you'd pick one Champion over another. Got a lot of AoE lockdown ults like Amumu, Orianna or Kennen? Grab Sejuani. Enemy have a strong hypercarry like Vayne that you need to be able to lock down? Grab Naut or Vi. Enemy lack hard CC? Grab Nunu and make them pay.

This same thing goes for other roles. Look at ADCs - a lot of them have some form of 1) damage amplification, usually in the form of AS boosts (Graves, Jinx, Varus) or 2) critical-strike synergy (i.e., they auto attack), or 3) if they don't crit, they have some form of "Alternate Damage" such as Vayne's Silver Bolts or Kallista's Rend, and 4) some form of mobility/utility to reposition or keep themselves alive (Tumbles, dashes, blinks, spell shields, etc) - but each of them are vastly unique.

Melee ADCs are even more "color by numbers" than probably any other class. Riven, Tryndamere, Yi, Yasuo. They all have:

gap closers (Riven's multiple Qs, Yasuo's Dash, Tryn's Spin, Yi's Alpha Strike)
self-defense or damage mitigation (Riven's shields, Yasuo's shield/wall, Tryn's "I Can't Die" Ult, Yi's Meditate)
Damage amp (Riven's passive and mad AD scaling, Yasuo/Tryn crit passives, Yi's double-strike passive & Bonus AD boost & true damage)
way of sticking to the enemy to stay in melee range (Riven's stun, general mobility, tryn's AoE slow, Yasuo's repeated dashes/wall to block CC, Yi's "Cannot Be Slowed" Ultimate)

But each of them brings something different.

WookieJesuzOct 15, 20151 votes

Those are very vague classifications.

JavelinJoeOct 15, 20151 votes

True that they are not very very specific like, for example, all basic attacks deal true damage, but each of these champions have the same basic kits to the point that they are basically interchangeable, while still providing the desired level of cc and team fight potential.

TilomentryOct 15, 20151 votes

You might as well add "All champions do damage" to that list. You're just broadly listing mechanics that exist in the game and claiming that all champions are similar because all champions use some or most of them.

JavelinJoeOct 15, 20151 votes

never said all