Feel like ADC have too much to say to determine a victory or a loss.
Riot spoke about their will of bringing diversity to ADC role, (bringing melee carry or mage for instance) Well, I would love to see something be done. (Crit Itemization ? Ranged/melee items ? Crit systemic changes ?)
oSEXYPLATYPUSo7 votesoh no a role that is primary focused on damage and objective taking has impact in the game
ALL ROLES HAVE IMPACT IN THE GAME
Saianna2 votesYou are trying to nitpick it from wrong direction.
Sure ADCs should have impact on the game, but since season 2 they were always "the real meta". And seeing this Riot were constantly buffing them untill ADCs could have 1v1 an assassin or fighter or just anyone.
In other words, right amount of impact = good Overbearing and huge impact ADC has right now = no good
oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votesyes its has always been an ADC META and always will until the game is a different game
as long as it is the same game it will always be an ADC META
Saianna2 votesI could translate your argument to "Hey you have a cancer, but we won't remove that cause you'd change to different person then"
Cool.
HonestJohnTheCon1 votesNot exactly. That's kind of a smaller scale and isn't accurate at all.
Personally I feel that ADCs shouldn't be nerfed but rather that juggernauts, divers, certain carry junglers, etc. get buffed. Midlaners don't need it, they get busted in the late game. Supports also don't need it, as their impact is on the ADC.
Saianna1 votesBuff this, nerf that...
As long as adc would be trimmed to actually be healthy class, sure. anything works with me ;)
oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votesso you associate adcs in game as cancer?
LOL ok
Kyunsei6 votesEvery position except Bot has multiple viable classes that normally fill it.
Support has Enchanters/Catchers, Tanks, and Mages.
Mid has Assassins and Mages.
Top has Divers, Skirmishers, Tanks, and Battle Mages.
Jungle has Divers, Assassins, Tanks, etc.
Bot has Marksmen.
Not only that, but Marksmen go to literally every other position. Why is it a problem when Ziggs Bot has under a 5% pick rate? Marksmen should not have a monopoly on the Bot position. Just because other champions can viable be played there does not mean Marksmen are weak. It means that they aren't oppressively strong.
Terozu1 votesI actually play Katarina and Annie bot, especially if the other damaging roles in the game all decided to go AD, so we need AP.
Lauchmelder1 votesYou probably haven't seen double Nashor's Azir bot. That's some next level oppressive shit.
Terozu1 votesSeen it, played it, but don't own Azir so I can't main it. :((((
HonestJohnTheCon1 votesI once saw someone play Taliyah bot. My friend was playing Cho'Gath support.
The Taliyah fed but my friend got 11/1 S+.
Anyway, I feel that ADCs are about as powerful as midlane mages right now in the meta. I would, however, like to see more diversity.
Terozu1 votesI have been on the inverse of that situation, I was Taliyah support, with a Chogath bot, he fed I carried(got my first Taliyah S :D)
Vectros2 votesPosting here the post of Glory ln Death (NA) (give a medal to this man, he sums it up greatly)
Every position except Bot has multiple viable classes that normally fill it.
Support has Enchanters/Catchers, Tanks, and Mages.
Mid has Assassins and Mages.
Top has Divers, Skirmishers, Tanks, and Battle Mages.
Jungle has Divers, Assassins, Tanks, etc.
Bot has Marksmen.
Not only that, but Marksmen go to literally every other position. Why is it a problem when Ziggs Bot has under a 5% pick rate? Marksmen should not have a monopoly on the Bot position. Just because other champions can viable be played there does not mean Marksmen are weak. It means that they aren't oppressively strong.
This is a point I've tried to make for ages.
AirKingNeo2 votesEvery position except Bot has multiple viable classes that normally fill it.
Support has Enchanters/Catchers, Tanks, and Mages.
Mid has Assassins and Mages.
Top has Divers, Skirmishers, Tanks, and Battle Mages.
Jungle has Divers, Assassins, Tanks, etc.
Bot has Marksmen.
I'm the person who stated this, not him. I also listed what each role did.
The reason only marksmen go bot lane isn't because of marksmen, it's because the role's job is high DPS. The only way you can build full damage attacking build work in a teamfight is to be ranged. Marksmen is the only class of champions that can do that. I have no idea about Cassiopeia so don't ask.
PrinceOfStorms1 votesCassiopeia and Azir are both high DPS mages, so they could theoretically be substituted for an ADC. The reason why they aren't is because Riot has a hate boner for mages and won't nerf Marksmen properly (and the moment they're weak they get huge buffs).
The reason why only marksmen are played as the carry in a duo lane is because they're the least level dependent out of all the champion classes. Mages rely on levels for additional ranks in their abilities for the base damage, lower CDs, and longer CC attached to them, while melee bruisers rely on levels for the innate tankiness they give. Marksmen, on the other hand, are more or less wholly item dependent, so they are taken bot lane where the support can feed them all the gold.
If you want to move other champions into the duo lane, you have to either nerf marksmen so that the class of champions is altogether bad, or you have to make ADCs level dependent by reducing the amount of AD on items (leaving the cost the same) and increasing their AD per level. You'd also have to delete crit and lifesteal from the game entirely, which is fair because neither stat should exist.
Tobias Brackner1 votesBot only has Marksmen because that is what the players have mandated.
Also Marksmen can be played in a lot of lanes aside from bot as well.
PrinceOfStorms1 votesADC only has marksmen because they're the least dependent on levels. Mages and ability focused champions want to have more levels for additional ranks in their abilities, giving more base damage, lower cooldowns, and longer CC. Melee champions and tanks want more levels for the innate tankiness that you get from levels.
Bot only has marksmen because marksmen are busted. People tried playing stuff like Ziggs bot and it only worked back when the entire class was garbage except for Jhin and Varus.
Also Marksmen can be played in a lot of lanes aside from bot as well.
And that's the problem. Marksmen should be nerfed so that they autolose to every other class of champion in a solo lane.
Tobias Brackner2 votesYour definition for "ADC is only Marksmen" is completely arbitrary and has no relevance on the actual game since Support and Jungle are the two that are well-known for finding themselves behind in levels.
Marksmen are not busted and plenty of others can work botlane. No one wants to experiment cuz MUH META.
And no they shouldn't be nerfed, people need to realize this game has way more flexibility than what pros do.
ProfDrDeath1 votesThe reason the gold-getting partner of the duo lane has virtually always been marksman is because that champion class - ranged, auto-attack-focused champs - suffers the least from sharing experience.
You don't see melees in a duo lane, as they absolutely NEED the tankiness that comes with additional levels (between levels 1 and 18, base stat tankiness triples to quadruples. Offensive stats, meanwhile, barely double for most marksmen). And purely ability-focused champions suffer as well, since they want the extra levels for the benefits of more ranks on their abilities (lower CD, higher base damage, better utility) - and unlike champions with a mixed ability/auto-attack-focus (like 
), purely ability-focused champs don't have their autos to fall back on.
That is also the reason why something is utterly screwed up if you see a Juggernaut in a duo lane - they are the single most XP-dependent champion type in the game, between being melee, rather ability-focused (low AS in general) and having the highest base stat increases with additional levels. Morde was the one Juggernaut who played bot, and he only could because he got to ignore the XP penalty of the duo lane.
Tobias Brackner2 votesThis is a problem with the community not the game.
Other champions can be played bot, the community just refuses to acknowledge that for no reason.
rtbf2216514121 votes[{quoted}](name=Tobias Brackner,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jK2vhAOl,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2017-06-23T05:57:36.667+0000)
This is a problem with the community not the game.
Other champions can be played bot, the community just refuses to acknowledge that for no reason.
Tobias Brackner2 votes[zombie-nunu-hearts]
Pinkaj1 votesThe impact of an ADC at bot lane is determined by
Stephen The G2 votesLet me order those from most to least important, for you.
PrinceOfStorms1 votesExcept the ADC automatically gets a lot more impact than the jungler, mid, and toplaner because they do absurd and quite frankly moronic levels of damage once they finish 2 items.
HonestJohnTheCon1 votesJungle impacts the early game (camping and buffs). ADC impacts the midgame (tons of damage with powerspike). Mages impact the late game (you can straight up deleted by a fully built one).
PrinceOfStorms1 votesMages impact the late game (you can straight up deleted by a fully built one).
ADCs don't fall off in the lategame though, and thanks to GA being an item that ADCs build now that it has damage on it (delete GA please riot), ADCs can survive a mage's full rotation.
HonestJohnTheCon1 votesEh, I never really build GA as an ADC. It has a largish cooldown, puts the ADC out of the fight for crucial seconds, and you're still dead either way as the ADC unless you have QSS. If the enemy has any cc, which they should, they'll use it on you as soon as you respawn effectively removing you from the fight again. Just like assassins, ADCs can't get out their burst if they're cc'd.
They probably should revert the 50% health regenerated change to 30% again though, because that just seems a bit overtuned.
Yasuo VS Riven1 votesits called assassins xd
LemonsIsGood7 votes[deleted]
VoraciousX1 votesExcept assassins can't really assassinate now that they have delayed burst and the ADC has so much heals, shields, and life steal to keep them alive.
You forgot to add that they can usually kill assassins before they actually are able to use a full rotation of spells usually as well. Unless they're one of the assassins that was heavily favored during the assassin update(Talon/Kha for example)
Bronze Demon1 votesyes and when talon and khazix finally gets to them at around 40% hp, the ADC instantly gains about 500 shield while chunking you to death. AT THE SAME TIME, EVERY CHUNK HEALS THEM 180HP UNTIL THEY BECOME FULL HP AGAIN.
Telosen1 votesThis right here.
Solari, KNight's Vow, Heal, Exhaust, Phantom dancer, Death's Dance, Bork, Warlord's Bloodlust. It's all just fucking ridiculous. You literally need two or three divers to ensure a kill on a competent adc with peel these days.
DunkinNoobs1 votesThe "adcs in 2k17 LUL" meme wasn't that long ago.
PrinceOfStorms1 votesAnd it should be a thing again.
Lauchmelder2 votesAnd how long was it actually a viable excuse?
People used it way too long.
IcyPepper1 votesRiot spoke about their will of bringing diversity to ADC role, (bringing melee carry or mage for instance)
Er, that's bot lane. The first step to diversifying bot lane is differentiating bot lane and the ADC role.
crzymdscntst1 votesI think toning down ADCs just a hair would only be one step in the right direction. (Particularly in the less durable direction if I had a say, since dps reduction shouldn't be a itemized focus on a dps.)
Here's another thought: Objectives. Who takes which objectives?
Honestly, I think there's disparity with who can take which objectives. There's only really 2 core roles in this, Jungler and ADC. Jungler has a lot of weight placed on Dragon, Herald and Scuttle control. They need to pressure/roam all lanes to keep their team ahead. ADC needs to farm, get their gold and then late-game get kills and have the multi-kill potential dps. Their scaling with auto-attacks makes them the core of pushing, since they're building around those auto-attacks you need to take down turrets, inhibitors and eventually the nexus.
This isn't to say that other roles cannot complete these objectives, only that they do not have the tools to do it with the same ease. I think that there's a slight balance issue in other roles being able to take these objectives in some cases.