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Riot, I Beg You, Minimum 5 Normal Games Played Before You Are Allowed To Use That Champ In Ranked

VvVVvV··261 votes·10,554 views

I dont think 5 is too much to ask for.

People should not be allowed to use a champ they ZERO experience with in a ranked game. And people should no be forced to have to coach someone who has no clue how their champ works, what items to buy and so on and so on.

I dont mind giving someone tips.....but i should not have sit there and look at someone sitting at the fountain for long periods of time having to read the descriptions of what their abilities do in a ranked game and i dont have time to spend the whole game telling you about your champ. The team should be focused on other things not having to take time to type to teach you about the champ you chose to play in a ranked game. Its just stupid to play a ranked game with a champ that you have never played 1 single game with. Not even a normal game, not even a bot game....absolutely no experience with.

What makes these people think this is a good idea and best for the team?

EDIT: To anyone taking the "normal games" as word for word what is really meant is any game that is not a ranked game........ARAM, any rotating game mode, bot games...just something........anything to stop people for playing a champ in a ranked game that they have never played before at all and costing someone their promo game. It just sucks.

EDIT#2: Some people are trying to use the fact that they do not have a lot of time to play and only play a few games a week as their way to argue that people should not have to have a minimum games played on a certain champ to be able to use that champ in ranked play. So put yourself in that situation. Lets say its a day you have time to play and you have time for 2 games.......in your 1st game you end up with someone using a champ they have never played before. it is single handily the reason your team lost. (Not saying it was a guaranteed win if the person was very experienced on the champ but your odds of winning was greatly reduced before the game even started because f the simple fact the person had no clue how to play or build their champ). So now you basically just wasted half of the time you had to play in your limited time you had.

270 Comments

nice table13 votes

so if i get auto filled into marksman role i cant actually play any marksman ... sounds like a good time.

RookPusher22 votes

You've never played 5 games on any marksman?

nice table5 votes

id assume games that took place like 3 years ago wouldn't count, this season i have played exactly 2 games of draven and 1 game of varus in normal games, which doesn't add up to 5 games even if you combine these with the marksman games i have played in ranked.

VvVVvV14 votes

Why would games played a few years ago not count?

People are trying too hard to think of ways to make this bad.

Can you really not see the difference between someone playing a champ they havnt used in awhile and someone playing a champ they have NEVER used at all?

Unless that champ is someone like Taric who got a complete rework on everything......you would still know what your champ does...compared to someone who has no clue.

nice table12 votes

i dont see how me playing couple games of caitlyn at level 10 3 years ago makes me any better at caitlyn than someone who picks her for the first time.

also if i wanted to make this bad i could just say that this would prevent people from trading champions which is kind of a vital part of champion select.

VvVVvV1 votes

Like I said......Caitlyn has been reworked.......not as much as Taric but she has been. But even with that said.....No one said you have to be good....you are completely missing the point. Even if its been a few years since you last played....UNLESS the champ has been reworked.......i know you are not going to be sitting at the fountain or in the middle of the lane dieing because you are reading descriptions of your champs abilities. Or instead of the team discussing a plan they are having to tell you how to play your champ the whole game.

If i have not explained it in a way that you can understand by now then i guess you never will. i dont know any other way to explain it.

And as far as trading champions its simple. You can not trade a champ you do not have. And the way the system should work is if you do not have the minimum games played then that champ doesnt even show up as one you could pick.......just like it wouldnt if you didnt even have the champ.

DatFigtree2 votes

[deleted]

elon wątroba3 votes

I have never played yasuo and i still know, what his abilities do. Honestly it all depends on skill, higher mmr players just go custom to feel the champion then go ranked.

nice table3 votes

yawn im sure everyone is capable of reading champions abilities in the 1:40 and or in queue / champ select, hell you even have plenty of time to look up a guide in the loading screen. also i know the abilities and game style of every champion, yes also the ones i have less than 5 games on.

i don't know how i feel about you suggesting id have to go and play 700 normal games just to be able to trade my team mates the champions they want and i own.

bottom line is dumb people will be dumb and making it so you cant select a champion you don't have at least 5 normal games on wouldn't prevent dumb people from being dumb, it would prevent a lot of other things that should never be prevented though.

VvVVvV2 votes

{quoted}

yawn im sure everyone is capable of reading champions abilities in the 1:40 and or in queue / champ select

yawwnnnn.......so you speak for everyone? Because clearly they do not or else I would of never made this thread. i did not want my post to be really long but if you need more detail I will give it to you.

Game Starts: We are red side.......jungler wants to invade other teams red buff.....they head to red buff and then they realize our top laner is still at the fountain. They ping him and ask him if hes afk and he says "hold on, im reading" So our jungler and mid back off of the invade. Mid leashes gromp....then our jungler did blue (our top is still at the fountain). So our jungler goes to defend the top tower. After many pings finally our top leaves the base.

*So Now not only is our top laner down 1 or 1 and 1/2 levels....our jungler is also behind in his jungling.

So our jungler leaves top and continues to jungle. Almost immediately after top gets top he dies. He teleports top and dies again soon after. Our jungler gets to our red just to see that the other jungler took it because our jungler had to defend top because our top was "reading."

*red was warded but because it took him so long to get there the ward ran out and the other jungler seen him top so it was a free red. So now our top is feeding....our jungler is behind and has no red buff. And now has to go camp top. Which meant mid and bot did not get a gank anytime soon.

So now jungler is camping top.....he pings on the way.....I head top to help with the gank.......we sit in the river bush.......our top is at the tower and the other teams top pushed to our tower. We go in to gank and he flashes but we still catch and kill him but the whole time our top is still sitting at our tower. By this time our jungler is getting pissed and tells him "you suck, we are trying to get you a kill to get you back into the game and you just stand there." Thats when our top tells us that he has never played the champ before and he was seeing how to build him.

*To make a long story short the guy was playing Volibear. He read the description for Frenzy - Voli's E and built a Zeal for more attack speed. We told him he was our only tank,,,we needed him to be tanky. Plus Volis E runs off of health....the more health he has the more damage it does. He continues to finish his Phantom Dancer and accumulate more deaths before he starts building any tank items.

So our team basically had a Volibear and still had no tank and he was feeding, our jungler lost a potential invade, got set behind and and had his red stolen. The guy would run away thinking he was about to die even when he still had his passive up. Fights were lost that could have been won.

So with this all fully explained, Do you now see hwo you can not speak for everyone? That not everyone is capable of just simply figuring out how to play and build a champ in the 1 minute 40 seconds you claimed they can? Or maybe it will just take you having a couple games lost due to this happening to you before you realize that playing a champ for the 1st time in ranked you have 0 experience with is not a exactly best for the team.

nice table4 votes

like i said retards will be retards no matter what you do or what you change in the game, you shouldn't be changing the game trying to prevent dumb people from being dumb though.

sure you had someone who was going full retard mode in your game, i've had these people who picked dumb shit in the game and or things they had never played before but when people feel like losing games they will whether you prevent em from picking shit or not.

now the point was that the game offers you plenty of time to figure out what champions abilities do before the game begins and everyone is ABLE to do so, whether someone will actually use that time or not is up to them but its not the games fault if they don't.

  • having games on a champion doesn't seem to reflect the knowledge of their abilities, you have like 1000 games of volibear played and you still don't seem to know which one of his abilities scales with health.
Pierce The Veal3 votes

{quoted}

Like I said......Caitlyn has been reworked.......not as much as Taric but she has been. But even with that said.....No one said you have to be good....you are completely missing the point. Even if its been a few years since you last played....UNLESS the champ has been reworked.......i know you are not going to be sitting at the fountain or in the middle of the lane dieing because you are reading descriptions of your champs abilities. Or instead of the team discussing a plan they are having to tell you how to play your champ the whole game.

If i have not explained it in a way that you can understand by now then i guess you never will. i dont know any other way to explain it.

And as far as trading champions its simple. You can not trade a champ you do not have. And the way the system should work is if you do not have the minimum games played then that champ doesnt even show up as one you could pick.......just like it wouldnt if you didnt even have the champ.

So I have to have 16 different champions with 5 games played before I can even touch ranked? That is the point where I stop even considering playing league. I'm not going to play fucking 80 games to be able to play a single champion in ranked.

Eternus Noctis4 votes

{quoted}

So I have to have 16 different champions with 5 games played before I can even touch ranked? That is the point where I stop even considering playing league. I'm not going to play fucking 80 games to be able to play a single champion in ranked.

Ranked is a game mode designed for players to show their skill. If you haven't played enough games to be skilled at said champ or role. You shouldn't be in the competitive game mode "rank" there is draft and blind pick for casual players. Players like you who lack the discipline to actually get better at the game before jumping into ranked games cost players like me the match .

Pierce The Veal1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Eternus Noctis,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jH3pptAJ,comment-id=00030000000000000000000000020001,timestamp=2016-06-28T03:45:30.228+0000)

Ranked is a game mode designed for players to show their skill. If you haven't played enough games to be skilled at said champ or role. You shouldn't be in the competitive game mode "rank" there is draft and blind pick for casual players. Players like you who lack the discipline to actually get better at the game before jumping into ranked games cost players like me the match .

I like how you immediately direct it at me. I know that I got level thirty playing a couple of champions, namely talon and Nocturne, after which I continued to use them in rankes. You'e too busy trashtalking to realize that most people do not have 5 games on 16 different champions that early on. In fact, with how much I play this game recently, that would perhaps take me just under a year to reach. I am pretty sure I have a lot more than 5 games on 16 different champions, however I'm just trying to be fair to newer players. You? You're just being selfish, trying to take away everyone's priveleges because of a handful of bad eggs.

Eternus Noctis6 votes

New players shouldn't be playing ranked to start with. Again its a game mode designed for competitive players that have skill and knowledge of the game. If you don't have the time to learn the game you shouldn't be playing ranked easy.

NineTailedMystic4 votes

So if someone one-tricks at a high skill level, and knows what every champ does through experience of playing against them, they shouldn't be able to play ranked?

Or they can read online what a champion does such as at Leaguewiki or just the Champion page online.

MonkeyMadness3 votes

Ya you are hardcore missing the point here. This post is also mostly geared to players who just bought a champ and want to play them in ranked immediately. It also applies to that idiot kid that picks his champ based on the best lolcounter entry for his laning match up, regardless of whether or not he/she is comfortable with the champ.

i dont see how me playing couple games of caitlyn at level 10 3 years ago makes me any better at caitlyn than someone who picks her for the first time.

We aren't talking about making you better at a champ, we are simply forcing all players to actually understand the basics of the champs they are playing. I would argue that it take a good 10 games to actually be fully competent with a champ, and to have "mastered" the champ might be 50-100 games depending on the mechanical difficulty. But if you have to alt-tab out to check a build, or ask which ability to start/max, you shouldn't be allowed to play that champ.

also if i wanted to make this bad i could just say that this would prevent people from trading champions which is kind of a vital part of champion select.

Trading champs is only "vital" in high elo, where counter picks actually mean something. In low elo (~95% of the community), counters aren't that important, ergo neither is swapping.

nice table1 votes

well hey if you are only asking for this change in low elo i couldn't care less what happens but when a lcs adc cant trade bard to their support in a lcs game because most of the adc mains on lcs don't have 5 normal games on bard you have a problem and then this idea is shit.

MonkeyMadness2 votes

Dude, the point here is so simple I really can't fathom how you don't see it...

DON'T PLAY CHAMPS IN RANKED UNLESS YOU HAVE PLAYED THEM BEFORE. That's all there is too it. I vote that players who do this regularly should just be banned. Done. Solved that problem. But Riot will never take such an aggressive action, especially now that they've gone and made LoL less competitive than family boardgame night (and I don't care how amazingly competitive your family is, LoL ranked play should be at a higher level). This is the only other way to place restrictions on playing champs in ranked that you are unfamiliar with. Also, LCS is on the tourney client, which is already exempt from a shitload of rules, so I don't see why this would hamstring pro players in the slightest.

nice table1 votes

the lcs point was a example, let me clear this up: even pro players than spend most of their day every day playing the game and getting as good as possible at it dont have 5 normal games played on the champions they need to lock in champion select to have the optimal chance of winning so how can you expect a normal player to have these games?

sure i wont play champions i haven't played before in ranked unless im forced into it but when im forced into it i shouldnt have to play darius adc just because i dont have enough games on adcs, also the fact that some people feel like picking retarded shit should not hinder the ability of good willing players to help their team in champion select.

MonkeyMadness2 votes

Obviously it's a tricky issue to solve, but Riot needs to put a mechanism in place to stop people from doing this. If you think this one is bad then give an alternative. And 5 normals might be somewhat excessive, how about just 1 win with the champ.

nice table2 votes

i cant suggest a alternative way to fix people doing retarded shit as the only thing that would fix it without affecting players that arent doing retarded shit would be to punish the people that are doing retarded shit, which is obviously not going to happen cause tito gaimz.

Bladerunner777713 votes

So I can't trade with my teammates because I haven't played every champion 5 times?

Chake14u2 votes

I would guess that in this situation there would be a way to trade champions you have never played before, but you are told by the system "Hey, you need to trade this champ, not play him"

MagiAladdin8 votes

i feel like lvl 3 champ mastery should be the minimum

TurquoiseYoshi18 votes

Level 3 is a bit far, especially since you would need ~16 such champions to even play ranked. Level 2 is two wins at the quickest, which would at least give a basic knowledge of the champion.

SoryInAdvance3 votes

thats stupid..i've played 4 games of Kassadin lately, one of which i went 22/4 and got an S and still don't even have lvl 2 mastery because of crap teammates and my inability to carry that hard. At that rate it would take me about 12-15 games to get level 3. That is completely unnecessary for a single champ that im now allowed to play in ranked. I have 20 champs lvl 3 or higher and there are not nearly enough for me to play any role effectively besides adc.

PwnKat6 votes

why do people think that they can just grab Vayne and go into Ranked :\

CerealBoxOfDoom4 votes

how do you know how many times ive played a champ?

For some people 5 games with the champ on their account is 5 days because they have an actual life and then another 2 days because no time on the weekend.

Why should they have to never play ranked to play their favorite champ even though they've played it on another account or even their PBE account?

DrCyanide8 votes

  1. If you only have time for one game a day, do you really need another account?

  2. If it's your favorite champion, is it really that much to ask you to play a total of 5 games on them before you take them into ranked?

  3. Riot keeps this thing called a "Match History," which lets them know how many times you've played a champion in the last 3 years or so.

VvVVvV3 votes

Well i only have and only need 1 account but if you need multiple accounts for whatever reason then it shouldnt take long to get 5 games in even if you can only play sparingly.

Bringing up what ifs like this is just trying to get around the issue. The issue is people playing ranked with champs they have zero experience with........i truly do not see how anyone can defend that.

Anyone can say they have played a champ on another account or PBE but how do you know if they are telling the truth. I can tell you ima pro Ashe all day but once you see me start building full Ap on her you know something wrong.

CerealBoxOfDoom1 votes

{quoted}

Well i only have and only need 1 account but if you need multiple accounts for whatever reason then it shouldnt take long to get 5 games in even if you can only play sparingly.

Bringing up what ifs like this is just trying to get around the issue. The issue is people playing ranked with champs they have zero experience with........i truly do not see how anyone can defend that.

Anyone can say they have played a champ on another account or PBE but how do you know if they are telling the truth. I can tell you ima pro Ashe all day but once you see me start building full Ap on her you know something wrong.

having them play 5 games also doesn't fix this.

having them WIN 5 games also doesn't fix this.

At the end of the day all you can do is inconvenience people with this and hope it helps for a while.

If you want to control what people play and why and how then make a 5 man premade and don't be diamond.

VvVVvV2 votes

I almost get a sense you are trolling here.

THE SISSUE - people playing ranked games with chams they have never played at all in any game mode. 0 experince on the champ.

5 Game Rule - This rule would make it impossible to use a champ in ranked that you have never played before at least 5 times in any game mode.

So slowly read the issue and slowly read the proposed rule.

How can you really sit there and say it will not fix the problem when it %100 eliminates the problem.

If people are no longer able to pick a champ they have never played before and use it in a ranked game how is the problem not solved?

Maximum Morde4 votes

Bad idea is bad. Imposes unnecessary restrictions while simultaneously failing to accomplish the goal of ensuring someone knows how to play their champ before going into ranked.

Adds 3-5(48-80 for all 16 minimum champs) hours of grinding to use a champ. Fuck off. You realize that would take some of us over a month to do?

Aír4 votes

I've had people first time try champs in ranked before numerous times.... and I am in plat....

CEO of Swag Inc4 votes

For people in bronze 3 it might seem stupid to play a champion for the first time in ranked but when you get good at the game you can easily pick up a champion and do well. For example, I bought lux a little while ago and played her for the first time in ranked and won. Turns out I like playing lux now im something like 7/3 with her. You can easily read all the champion info in the 2 minute window between entering game and the minions getting to lane and you can easily look up a guide on mobafire during the loading screen.

Shadòw4 votes

so basicially get forced to counterpick myself in some situations.

There are games i played champs i didn't ever played before just because they were a better decision than my main

and guess what? i still won

theArtifacts4 votes

I disagree. Although the sentiment is in the right place there are players with more than one account. Just cause you haven't played a champ on one account doesn't mean you haven't on another.

Sweet Katarina4 votes

So. There are arguments in this topic pros and cons about it. As I can see, most common argument against your suggestion is "I dont care about others, I want play ranked. Why? Because FU thats why". Lets ignore that argument. Because if someone want just troll own teammates, he can do it anyway.

Lets be more serious. Yes. You need now to have 16 champs to play ranked. It's because there are 6 bans, and 10 picks. And you end up on champion you really bought. In order to pick that champ - you need to play him 1-5 games. For me 5 is fine. Even if it's simple champ, as Lux or Mundo and you easy win first 4 games. Subject is discussable, it can be at least rank 2.

Lets see other arguments, like:

I'm diamond player, and picked Lux first time in ranked and Win.

First, there is 40% chance to win a game even if you really hard lose you lane. Second, platinum and diamons matchups are usually not about champion skill, but about team-play skill, and objective control skill. So Plat/diamond players could do whatever they want. I dont think they need to be restricted. The ability to grab contested picks are really rarely used by players below gold. Ability to swap picks below gold, could possibly be used by premades. So If there are 3+ premades let them pick whatever they want too.

I have 1000 normal games played by Malzahar (insert your rank 7 champ here). Why do I need to play by other champs?

Just because there is small chance that your main character could be banned or picked by other side.

I can play only few games in a week, why I can't play ranked?

You'll end up in Bronse V. Why do you need this?

Why do I need to play stupid 80 normal games? All cool boys go to ranked

Because ranked is place there you need take the game responsibly. 80 games is really nothing. I've played at least 500 before I even try ranked. All your 80 games will be nice experience in matchups. You'll see not only your champ, but also your opponent champ play. Having first 80 games It's like the difference between 1 lvl and 30 lvl player.

I've seen that cool streamer play only ranked. But he mains only 1 champ/role. Why should I go to normals?

First, play for fun. There is no difference between draft pick in normal or ranked. In from region which dont even have draft pick in normals yet. But I play them a lot. Second. That cool streamer probably play few years in LoL. I can name many been like bronse in S3, gold in s4, plat at s5, diamond streamer now. They wins thousands games on their mains. Thats completely different with you.

XLC4 votes

I'd settle for just mastery rank 2.

philosifer2 votes

I posted this in a similar thread a few days ago. I'd also like to add ARAM games (though now that they count towards mastery level it's only valid if you are only arguing for normal games played requirement)

So I like this idea in principle. Im mostly a normals player myself and really only play ranked occasionally and only on a few Champs that I feel comfortable that I know well. However let me play devils advocate.

  1. how does this work with trading champs? Say there is a contested top laner left unbanned and top is last pick. How does mastery requirements affect this if the first pick doesn't have mastery?

  2. reworks. I played vlad a ton before his rework and while it's not drastically different, there are new mechanics to play around. Do I have to regain my mastery level? Some reworks are essentially new champs, while some are simple tweaks.

  3. free week champs. Say I play a champ all week on free rotation while saving the ip to buy him. I could play 15 games with the champ and learn a lot without gaining mastery until I owned the champ.

  4. some champs I haven't played in a while. Maybe I played them a lot back in the day but I haven't played them much since the mastery system was introduced.

  5. counter/situational picks- this one is kind of a side effect to most of the above. But limiting the champ pool when you have an opportunity to play a strong counter just because you don't have the requisite mastery is dangerous. I'll give an exaple. Say I'm qued as jungle and I am last pick. The enemy is all AD and we lack a tank. Rammus would be a perfect pick. I've played him on and off thoughout my career but not really recently and I don't have the required mastery. His kit hasn't changed in a long time and he is not a complex champion to play so I am in little danger of poor performance due to knowing the champion. But if these changes were to go live I would be locked out.

TL-DR I agree with the sentiment but I think that there would be too many times that It would backfire and cause problems

SkyBlade797 votes

I'd just like to say that number 3 is incorrect. Free week champions still earn you mastery; I have Kindred mastery 4 and I haven't bought them.

PhDs Nuts1 votes

What if someone spends a lot of time in customs with a champ to learn it before they take it to ranked? They just get screwed?

VvVVvV1 votes

no..pls read my edits...i only said normals because i only play ranked......so to me when i think of any other game mode i just think normals. i dont care if its customs, rotating game mode or a bot game just play something to know your champ.

Jesus is Savior2 votes

{quoted}

no..pls read my edits...i only said normals because i only play ranked......so to me when i think of any other game mode i just think normals. i dont care if its customs, rotating game mode or a bot game just play something to know your champ.

Riot doesn't track normal games or customs. They only track champion mastery and ranked.

VvVVvV1 votes

They used to track normal games so im sure they have not forgot how.....and of course if implemented then they would have to go back to doing so.

Jesus is Savior2 votes

{quoted}

They used to track normal games so im sure they have not forgot how.....and of course if implemented then they would have to go back to doing so.

There's a difference between "forgetting" and "the data no longer exists in the database, so you have to play those champs again"

VvVVvV1 votes

when i said forgot how i am not talking about forgetting the games you played im talking about they have not forgot how to track it as in they can easily go back to tracking it.

Jesus is Savior1 votes

{quoted}

when i said forgot how i am not talking about forgetting the games you played im talking about they have not forgot how to track it as in they can easily go back to tracking it.

But you're telling me that if I want to have all 130 champions ready for trades I need to play 5 games on them. I need to RE-play 5 games on them, even if I had 5 normal games clocked on them 3 years ago. That's 325 games you want me to play (on champions I don't even like) just to be able to trade.

VvVVvV1 votes

well if you want to look at it just as a trade aspect then yeah. If it keeps people from taking losses just because someone is doing what this guy did that caused me to make this post then yes. i can take a loss....i can take a loss even if my team gets a DC.....but it makes zero sense to take a loss just because someone else doesnt care enough to take the time to have a clue aout their champ.

And why do you feel the need to be the guy to trade with everyone? ive been in plenty of games where just because 1 guy might not have a champ that doesnt mean one of the other 3 does not have them. You can trade more than 1 time you know....its not just a 1 and done thing,

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