Looks like Riot can either go back and unban him saying his ban is unfair and they were wrong or they can start enforcing support to be the adcs bitch all game long or risk a ban.
TyrekGoldenspear9 votesThat would be duo jungling. Not supporting. Do not make the mistake of thinking you can ride on Support sympathy when you have 0 intention of actually playing the role.
Carrie Pigeon2 votesThat would be duo jungling. Not supporting. Do not make the mistake of thinking you can ride on Support sympathy when you have 0 intention of actually playing the role.
The issue is how broad the term support really is. You can support other lanes and not strictly bot. Along with it he is playing Nunu and abusing Nunus rather strong counter jungle power. If you look into his OP.GG on his Nunu games you will find a majority of them are victories and with it he actually outlevels the enemy jungler/support while his ADC outlevels the enemy adc. This is a massive way to win games just by raw power as he is giving his team the highest possible expereince lead.
He isn't playing support in the traditional league sense however in more of a Dota esque style where he roams and helps everyone while hindering an enemy player. Should his bot laner not be able to play safe and simply disregard they are in a bad situation it can lead to issues.
Along with this he is forcing the enemy support into an uncomfortable position where they must either roam and make sure they help other lanes like a second jungler or they have to stay bot and know that both them and their ally laner will fall behind in EXP.
In my opinion it is a brilliant strategy.
TyrekGoldenspear4 votesExcept you're not supporting other lanes. That's like saying the Jungler is supporting the other lanes.
Support isn't that broad when you define it as assisting a specific teammate through their time of weakness hit their powerspike unhurt.
By duo jungling he isn't supporting the other lanes, if anything he's just supporting his primary jungler because he's making their job easier.
I don't hate on the strategy, but what I am against is the definition of the role being muddled up. This stratagem is simply duo jungle. Not support counterjungling all game. Now that it is called that, the whole "Nunu off-meta banned Rito Sux" angle of the argument goes out the window. Now we focus on whether or not his team was okay with the role of Jungler #2, not "support" because that is not what he did.
Carrie Pigeon3 votesKeep in mind he clearly hasn't the potential to.
Support can be seen as this yes however it is also aiding one team while hindering an enemy.
He is still supporting someone.
There comes an issue with the current champion selection and any off role type deal such as this is instantly impossible to do as you're clearly limited in what you can and cannot do. There is no feasible way to select yourself as a secondary jungler whose goal is to counterjungle and gank lanes. There is no option for this thus changing the set idea of the support role to a roaming supportive jungler is the only way to even get by with it. Should this of been in the old pick system (You know that mess where pick order was the way to go) it would have been possible but due to Riots change of this system he again cannot play the game in his own method (which clearly works by his 56% winrate).
The biggest issue here is how Riot has handled the meta and it simply can't be changed at the moment as the game has grown around it. While strategies like this do work and can be quite effecient they simply are banworthy as you don't play X role the way X role was formed to be.
TyrekGoldenspear4 votesExcept he can just duo with an ADC that doesn't mind to 1v2. Problem solved.
Support can be seen as this yes however it is also aiding one team while hindering an enemy.
By that logic a traditional bot lane support is supporting the entire team because he is ensuring their lategame ticket to a win is well protected.
Also by that logic a Jungler can be classified as a Support as well.
But that's not how this works. Keep in mind that a support can roam, but there is such a thing as roaming too much.
Also another side of the issue you failed to mention is that the commnuity started this by their crusade against trollpicks and their reporting of this Nunu enough times for the IFS to get him banned in the first place. Riot is literally just upholding this.
IMO, this is proof that Riot can't trust the community to decide what trolling is.
They should bring back the Tribunal to handle trolling cases like this because this is too subjective for an automated system to handle.
MysterQ2 votesBut how do you even queue for duo jungle in Master+? It isn't an option. Fact is if he opens up an easier game for the other lanes, he is supporting his team, even if he isn't sitting in the botlane.
I am not saying his gameplay is perfect. I am just saying he has no other way to even get to play double jungle.
TyrekGoldenspear2 votesHe can easily duo with an guy who plays bot who doesn't mind the 1v2 bot lane. Problem solved.
Also by that logic a jungler supports his team as well.
And I am not saying that this game strategy is stupid or trolling. I am calling it like it is. It is a duo jungle strategy. So we shouldn't call it Support Nunu. We should call it Jungle #2 Nunu and work from there.
MysterQ1 votesEventually he won't be allowed to duo-que. What then?
It is double-jungle, but that isn't an option to queue up as. And queueing as jungle is definitely not the same thing.
jaymc11304 votesThat would be duo jungling. Not supporting. Do not make the mistake of thinking you can ride on Support sympathy when you have 0 intention of actually playing the role.
Just to play devil's advocate:
Sitting around in bot lane is not equal to supporting.
Supporting at a high level requires a good support to constantly roam any time they can push the lane up to secure deep vision and pincer gank mid lane and the enemy jungler. A good support in high level play will leave his adc alone in lane as often as is possible to do safely so that the adc can acquire solo experience.
The reality is that playing support at a high level requires one to understand when to babysit the adc and when to be doing actual support things to control the map.
DemonDrake1 votesDear summoner,
Perfect!!! My sentiment exactly. Too bad I can't honor you for a great comment. Finally an intelectual sentiment.
Thank you.
Have a great day Summoner.
DemonDrake1 votesDear summoner,
The role what exactly are you trying to say? How he plays the role is his choise. It's not about the role, you are mistaken. You only are distress about his smite. Tell me how is this a bad idea sup with buffs mathematically has a better match up against sup without. It's an advantage. If the adc complains then maybe the player should learn to play effectively implying strategy, tactic decisions. It's because adc like to be the drama queen. The adc can literally have 20 kills early on, be fed as hell then non stop flame when someone else takes a kill even accidentaly. Then would you mind please reporting every jungler ? Since this was breaking the original concept till riot implimented this as a role. You are 5 people facing 5 people team. How you play and what you play is your choice. So everything in meta is more of a guideline then actual rules. As if the sup role wasn't bad an antifun as it is marketed - yey play that useless player that can't do anything solo, dies in 2 sec, has small to 0 effect when enemy is stomping, and the same time feeling like a pro when you win and you are ahead. Yet you miss a hook a grab a heal a shield or just misposition a bit get insta blown up?
How about Zyra, Brand, Malphite, MF, Sion, Annie almost all have seen proplay sup, rocking various spells.None of them are sup champs so ban SKT, TSM and so on ?
What you are suggesting has nothing to do with suporting. Lets report every roam, everytime jungl doesnt gank, everytime anyone actually does anything creative that is not highlighted in pro games ??? Might as well bann the pros for playing ouside roles picks spells?
How about this all lanes jung don't gank report him for same reason - jung is supose to gank why not report. Top is not tanky - report. Wtf top comming mid to roam - report. Stay top till 25 min in game. And you have the right for 1 or 2 tps. Mid is roaming - report. Don't like mid pick - report. Mid doesn't hard carry game - report. Mid doest look onceat the map yet expected to organize plays and gets caught constantly - report. Adc you miss one lane minion - report. You are not aggresive enough or too aggresive report?
So would you kindly enforcing your views on others and "Respect their wishes and communicate with your team" ask him how to help. Adapt. Go with your sup for fast fee buffs, regardless of position.
Sup is the most freely diverse role in the game, because you can build anything, be anything. And your main aspect you bring something special to the team. Would be a Mal voidlings, Brand,Mf ulti, destroying enemy jung, bullying lane. Tp for ganking top, burn for added dmg or smite for early dragon, easier baron, ability to contest reguardles jungler is dead alive or on the other side of the map. Making enemy jungl useless.
You have no argument, don't think you are special just because you follow the meta aka "what is most popular". You have no right and no power to effect others choices in game. Like no one has on you.
Try to remember this is a gamr, if you can't handle dif play styles and dif peoples way of thinking play only with friends, hire people to play with you, create your own game, stop playing lol and stop thinking you are playing as a team when clearly you only aprove of your vision of league. Food for thought.
Have a great day summoner.
TyrekGoldenspear2 votesPsst. Check the time stamp. This is 2 weeks old and my views on this has already shifted.
This long rant while relavent to the topic doesn't apply anymore. Also in what world does a buff go to a support rather than a jungler?
420 grams6 votesI don't know much about the smite Nunu, but it sounds similar to the smite singed support issue before.
It's not that they're playing that, it's that they refuse to communicate with the team and play as a team.
HudnofskiBleh2 votesWatching the guys streams, he actually does communicate a lot more than a lot of players I see. And what about those millions of players who literally never communicate in games? Should those people be banned too? Because they're not getting banned. So it's pretty hypocritical of Riot to ban this one guy, who DOES communicate, but not the many other players who refuse to communicate with their teammates.
AeroWaffle6 votesDoes he actually respect their wishes though? Or does he just state what he intends on doing regardless of theirs?
HudnofskiBleh1 votesI watched his stream, and his teammates were having fun. The SInged on his team talked about how fun the strategy was. If anything, I think they rather enjoyed the Nunu playstyle. Even the ADC was having fun. He also communicated with his teammates.
Also, I can respect my teammates opinions without doing everything they say. I was told not to play Volibear jungle because he was "trash." I can understand that they just want to win, but I know what I'm doing.
AbodyHUN6661 votesThen why do you think he was reported so often? I'm pretty sure that his games have a much different mood when he loses and gets caught over and over, and in many of his games I've seen him having so many deaths it could be considered intentional feeding. Like 0/16/3 for 10 games or more.
BeatzBoyFTW1 votesThe SInged on his team talked about how fun the strategy was.
Apparently, the part where Riot mentioned the amount of reports the Singed & Nunu player got says otherwise.....
MysterQ1 votesDo you have to change your will based on your team? I didn't know that was part of the ToS.
Great teamwork of course helps make "better" games. But the guy said he is a Nunu one-trick. He said so himself his style works much more than him picking a bad support. And I prefer winning much more than losing. Granted when you lose with such a strange pick, you may complain. I wonder who winning complained, was it the ADC or others saying it was lame,
DemonDrake1 votesDear summoner,
I would like to point out that this is a team game played by many and different people.
Would you respect my wish if I say anything but Urgot top is unacceptable, or maybe I don't like adc in a normal league manner "Omg Varus adc... pls report gg, useless" since most people I've encountered were angry teenagers.
Respecting once opinion and having a slave mentality you see no difference ?
Would you jump of a bridge ? Would you respect that whish ? No, well ask yourself why, apart from the obvious. People choose for them selves and since you are not the boss, you are not the owner. This people are not working for you let alone know you why would or anybody demand someone to play in a specific way, how to play or prefered pick??? Respect his choise his freedom, if you don't like it I suggest growing up. It's not your job to like it, you have no right to femand his freedom of choise be taken away, like you wouldn't want your own.
Even though this is an argument, ask your self why didn't respect his choise ?
But if this is your problem the Meta, pleasr riot Ban all players in the last Lol worlds tournament. Faker for playing Master Yi mid, olaf Mid or generally doing all sorts of crazy stuff in solo q on stream ??? Or how about all the mid lane mages turned sup - brand zyra even cass is played. Or sup Naut?
No, does it all sound illogical. Well so is every argument "Didn't cooperate with team." Seriously disrectful. I dare you to show me once game that goes all good with random people in solo que. If this was reportable than more than 1000 should beperma banned for refusing to cooperate & communicate. FYI you can't force people especially online.
What you are leading to is cyber bullying. Cyber slavery. If you want a game with no free choise make position with limited choice, no more all spells available depending on role preset summoner spells. I imploy riot to do that, then maybe they will take intelectual decisions. You wanna see how quickly this game will die to Dota2, Smite and such ?
Afther the comments continue with such uninformed, unintelectual manner.
I hope you enjoyed the read. Good day summoner.
AeroWaffle1 votesIf you intend on lacing your post with insults, I'm not going to bother to give your argument any thought.
Ratpocalypse1 votes[{quoted}](name=420 grams,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=j9PmK85g,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2017-02-28T22:01:04.829+0000)
I don't know much about the smite nun, but it sounds similar to the smite singed support issue before.
It's not that they're playing that, it's that they refuse to communicate with the team and play as a team.
They do communicate and play as a team, you should ban the people he's playing with as well too with this logic.
He has to play THEIR way, but they don't have to play HIS way? To be even more blunt he isn't telling them to play a certain way, he is just playing the way he believes gives his team the highest chance of success.
The support role doesn't say "Support Bot Lane" therefore he should be allowed to play support from either Top, Mid, Jungle, or Bot.
His teammates should be punished for refusing to communicate with him, as they are communicating AT him. As we all know he communicated his intentions, but his teammates whined about it.
Riot has stated that breaking the meta isn't a bannable offense, they've also stated that you cannot be banned for not using the chat function, as pings are sufficient enough form of communication.
In the video linked below you can see that if your teammates actually communicate with you instead of AT you various other strategies can work!
Danny DeVito6 votesHonestly, if this were the case you would be seeing people like Tilterella get banned for maining ADC Bot lane Sion.
He doesn't talk to or communicate what he's doing with his team, and that's why he got punished. Not for his pick.
Ralanr6 votesHell, if it was true, adc Ziggs would have never happened.
vOmvbrawfU1 votesYou can't explain it to dumb dumbs.
ShriekMauler3 voteshonestly i play stuff my adc's never want me to play but i just prove to them thru communication and a positive attitude that i know what i'm doing and just relax... ziggs/shen/sej/MF/maokai support all work if you know how to play the enemies. i just put on music and do what the team tells me no matter how much the adc bitches and threatens. this is your game as much as it is theirs. just think, who's gonna heal/shield/CC for you if you keep flaming the only person who's sole job is to keep you alive..?
warpenguin5551 votesMaokai support is really fun
Dafckingman3 votes"who's gonna heal/shield/CC for you if you keep flaming the only person who is trying to keep you alive..?"
That hit the nail right on its head. ADCs are entitled, whining brats, all everybody knows that especially the support mains. It's a given and it's what we've come to expect of them, it still doesn't make it an ok attitude. They think the world revolves around them and try to make their needs and wants the team's responsibility. Kids gotta chill out sometimes.
Had to login after I saw that line
DemonDrake2 votesDear summoner,
Great sentiment. I comeplitely approve and sup this statement. Good job.
Have a great day summoner.
