If enemies are hit with multiple tentacles, every tentacle after the first does 50% damage.
So if 3 tentacles hitting before did 300% damage, now they do 200% damage.
So early game if 2 tentacles would normally do 180 damage, now they do 135.
Jbels56 votesWhat the actual fuck? Do they not realize that Illaoi is bad enough WITHOUT nerfing her damage? I don't fucking see Darius's ult doing less damage to each target after the last? Or his Q doing full damage to only one target? So I say again, what the actual fuck?
TURBO 5OOO2 votesThat is a bug since release. If the tentacles dont hit at the same time (with double tntacles by W for example) there is a one second window with much less dmg.
tidegate4 votesShe's a lane bully with strong poke, good heals, and can solo anyone. I don't think there's anything wrong with her. In fact she's still pretty overwhelming in lane but falls off hard mid to late when she can't take more than 2 people
Jbels16 votesShe's a lane bully with strong poke, good heals, and can solo anyone. I don't think there's anything wrong with her. In fact she's still pretty overwhelming in lane but falls off hard mid to late when she can't take more than 2 people
But her winrate has been sub 46% her entire league life
It Hertz When IP12 votesThat and the "solo anyone" thing only works if she ults or if she's dueling within her tentacle area.... unless she's had time to set up, she'll need to ult in order to really duel anyone.
APoetCalledLove5 votesWhat's worse is her skillshots are so slow they're really easy to dodge, making her less powerful at higher levels of play, and a lot less of a lane bully. And this is after playing a game against her mid XD
MrWasjig5 votesBut her winrate has been sub 46% her entire league life
http://thecarnivoreproject.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8345295c269e201a5116584a7970c-800wi
Jbels10 voteshttp://thecarnivoreproject.typepad.com/.a/6a00d8345295c269e201a5116584a7970c-800wi
How can you argue that she's broken when her numbers say otherwise? Everything you described Illaoi being can also be applied to Darius. Darius basically makes the laning phase a non-factor for any melee champion, and makes their lives a living hell. He also has a 51% winrate. Does that make him broken?
Maximum Morde6 votesLol no. Most mages/ranged tops can shit on illaoi while also collecting the bonus gold from killing her tentacles. Illaoi isn't very good unless she's used as a counter pick.
tidegate1 votesLol ranged tops, yah bc I've seen one quinn all season and she can 100% take graves bc his range sucks. Mage tops? Ryze just got back into meta and I can't think of a single other top lane except vlad I'd call a mage. Liss is a mid lane bc of zed's popularity so are you talking illaoi mid?
Maximum Morde2 votesNo, but I've been shitting on Illaois with Karma, Annie, and Morgana.
Added bonus that those champs bring more to team fighting than Illaoi does so it's not even a loss in that sense either.
tidegate1 votesLiterally none of those champs should be played top. All are immobile and every time you extend past river you're a free kill for jungle and none of them actually have competitive range with illaoi, her main poke skill is further than all of annie's and most of karma's abilities.
Maximum Morde3 votesMorgana and Karma are both very hard to gank. If a squishy JG tries to gank Morg or Annie, there is a very real risk of said JG exploding and Annie/Morg walking away from Illaoi who can do nothing to stop it. Even should a tanky JG try to gank Annie, a quick stun gives her a reasonable chance to escape without having to burn flash, so while she's not as slippery as the other two, she is not by any stretch of the word a free kill.
Add in the threat that a counter gank for any of those three is likely to result in the enemy JG at least dying, with high kill threat on Illaoi as well.
Illaoi has basically 0 kill pressure on any of those three.
tidegate2 votesFirst of all Morg doesn't burst anyone til about 6 kills and by burst its stun for half health(if they're squishy) then hope they die to aoe. And if you have an ap jg they just burn her shield with damage, cc her, easily dodge skillshot stun and kill. Annie can only stun one person so she's easy to gank assuming her stun is up. Karma has ms steroid and slow so she's much harder to gank but if she's past river and you play any jg with a stun, she's dead af
Maximum Morde2 votesHmm, can see you aren't going to be persuaded by words. I'd just suggest you try it out for about a month then, playing off-meta ranged/mages into Illaoi and see what happens. I picked up Illaoi near her release cause I thought she might be nifty so I do have a decent amount of playtime on her, not just shooting off blind. In my experience, she is extremely vulnerable to that in lane, while at the same time not disincentivizing it because she has weak team fighting and teleganks, unlike many other meta top laners. That is bad news for her in this snowball meta.
tidegate1 votesI'm not saying mage tops can't win. I'm just saying it's unreasonable. Why go Annie top or Karma top to counter an illaoi when almost anyone can outplay her and there's safer and stronger late game picks.
Maximum Morde2 votesA few reasons to do it.
Your JG and Mid both went AD, which is super common >.<, and you want some magic damages for a more balanced comp.
"Stronger pick" is relative. Sometimes having that mage with high control and burst damage is more valuable than a more standard pick, if the enemy doesn't have an answer to it. If durability is a concern, bruiser built mages are still very effective damage wise and survivability.
The only thing safer than Morgana is something with a bunch of dash/blink mobility. Karma isn't quite as safe as Morg, but her speed, shield, root/heal, and slow can get her out of most bad spots.
All three of those specific mages I listed can top/mid/sup, so are reasonable flex picks to throw the enemy off, so long as your team is willing to be flexible as well. So I kinda like them for when I'm first pick and heavily risking a counter pick.
All in all, its the same reason people were taking Lulu top/mid for the longest time. Other mages can do the same thing Lulu does if you have the experience to play the matchups.
RiotMeddler32 votesThis has been mentioned elsewhere, throwing it in here as well just for the visibility though. Damage reduction on multiple tentacles has been on Illaoi since her release. We'll add mention of it to a tooltip at some point.
BetweenSkill7 votesWhy would a a seemingly crucial bit of information like that be left out? I'm just curious as to the choice for that
RiotMeddler10 votesNot 100% certain, it's been a while since we wrote Illaoi's tooltips, so can't recall discussion around them. Could be that it got removed unintentionally when shifting text around between the different tooltips (something like got taken off individual abilities to add it to the passive but never got added to the passive). Might also have been a call not to mention it simply because of the length of Illaoi's tooltips at the time and its lack of impact on in game decision making versus emphasizing other information that does drive play more.
BetweenSkill3 votesGood explanation. Thank you for clarifying!
Quepha22 votesPretty sure this falloff was documented by players several patches ago.
Pyrithegethon1 votesIt happened this patch.
Quepha27 votesIt happened this patch.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Illaoi/comments/4esrt9/found_a_post_claiming_multiple_tentacles_do/ I don't think so.
Pyrithegethon9 votesHoly shit, no wonder i havent been able to win lane as Illaoi in a while. Im dumb for not realizing sooner. Thanks for showing me that.
Hammerpriest5 votesIt's been in there since release. You most likely haven't been able to win lane because pretty much every change post Illaoi's release has been unkind to her metawise.
Astôlfo6 votes"herpderp not being able to dodge skillshot is the champion's fault" "not being able to think logically on how to play against the champ is the champ's fault" Thanks Riot.
MetalGearTeemu5 votesWelcome to Blitzcrank land. Where even though thresh exists, people still hate you more despite being inferior in every important way in high level play.
Xonra3 votesWelcome to Blitzcrank land. Where even though thresh exists, people still hate you more despite being inferior in every important way in high level play.
People can't dodge hooks to save their life.
Obviously this is on Blitzcrank
Jet Sett15 votes"He doesn't need to land every hook, he only needs to land one mid/late game"
MetalGearTeemu5 votesArhi doesn't need to land every charm, she only needs to land one mid/late game
Gangplank doesn't need to land eery barrel, he just needs to land one mid/late game.
the list goes on. Game ending plays are NOT the sole domain of Blitzcrank. This isn't an argument.
Jet Sett12 votesBlitz' is by far the MOST likely to kill you, plus the knock-up and possibly any other cc the team has. Unless Ahri is fed or landed charm on a stray carry she won't be able to blow them up as fast. Blitz brings the party to the whole team, not just himself kinda.
As for Gangplank, I've not seen him one-shot anyone yet with his barrels, and unless his team has engage it simply serves to zone the enemy rather than cripple them for a large opening.
Supreme Senpai694 votesBarrels don't turn fights into 5v4s instantly though lol. Ahri's charm is a bit weaker because it doesn't displace them, it makes them slowly walk.
If there are two groups of 5 and then Blitz grabs someone, there is now a group of 6 and a group of 4. The one that was grabbed was physically moved into the other group almost instantly. In the time it would take for the rest of their team to move to help him he is already dead and it's now a 5v4.
SH Azykan6 votesunless he grabs amumu and you also have malphite, then its just a free engage for your team :D
Steelflame13 votesBlitz is the highest winrate support in plat+.
SOooo.... yea. Thresh has been nerfed a rather large amount, blitz hasn't gotten changes in quite a while though.
EDIT: Just checked the stats, only two supports win against him by more than 1% win rate, Trundle, and Alistar. Alistar is eating some big nerfs this patch to his ulti power, so that is going to change very soon, and only 4 supports beat him at all in average win rate in the match up, and these are very close cases in these ones.
MetalGearTeemu1 votesyou better go to the LCS and tell them what they're missing out on then sport.
Certainly your sourced metrics provide a convincing case as to why they should pick an inferior thresh, lacking in ranged harass, utility, CC duration, Late game Tankiness, etc.
Somehow tho i don't see him trending anytime soon, for the reasons above.
Steelflame8 votesIn ranked he is actually trending quite high. Blitz atm has third place of the top playrates for support right now, just behind Thresh and Alistar. And remember, we are talking plat+, meaning yes, this is high elo. Is it the LCS? No. But it is what is currently one of the strongest picks in dynamic queue for the support position (Right now supports are pretty balanced as a whole though, at least, they are not #1 winrate or anything, blitz support is ranked 25 out of 200 in highest win rate champ+position modifier).
devdev4639 votesThis. People say blitz is only good against noobs but the data says otherwise.
Anidan7 votesYep. The higher in rank you go, the better people get at dodging skillshots. However, the higher rank you go, the better people get at aiming skillshots - high elo isn't a wonderful land where skillshots never land because people are really good at dodging them, it's a land of mind-games on both sides because both sides are very good at what they're doing.
Androbarto4 votesIn high elo a late game successful grab means: 2 towers OR 1 drake OR 1 inhib OR game
In low elo people can't prioritize
MetalGearTeemu2 votesthe data also says you can get a 60% winrate with Urgot if you build a specific way.
http://champion.gg/champion/Urgot/Top
Champion.gg stats are garbage, you only make yourself look silly hen you quote them.
The sites basically a joke.
Cosnirak8 votesOf course the sample size is 23 games for runes and 28 games for masteries, which the site tells you clearly if you look. This alone doesn't call into question the much larger (but still not massive) sample sizes for Blitzcrank. The site is just reporting the numbers, it is up to the viewer to understand them in context.
MetalGearTeemu1 votesyou know if you want to flaunt your reading skills you should at least read the correct field. go back and look very closely and actually try using your head instead of your feelings.
You'll find the 70 and the 60%, and then hopefully go take a break from the forums and carefully reconsider your time on the forums.
Its like you guys never get tired of my smug threads after I call the meta a month ahead of time over and over. Never argue with MetalgearTeemu. metal gear teemu is always right.
(you'd almost think I worked in the industry!)
Cosnirak5 votesIn League the term "build(s)" often refers to masteries, runes, and/or items. According to the link you provided the current most frequent and highest win rate item builds for Urgot are undefined and undefined, both in win rate % and sample size of games.
I don't know what craziness you're talking about besides that so.... whatever man. I don't know who you are, pretty sure I've never seen one of your threads before, nor do I care.
Regardless of any of that, the stats on champion.gg are not a joke. Not every bit of data there is necessarily useful, but much of it is. Don't like the way they do things? Make your own site.
CasterGilgamesh4 votesThing is Blitz is in less danger then the others when thresh or naut grab someone they also pull themselves half way so they are now even closer to the enemy.While blitz just pulls the enemy completely into his team also his pull is a maybe just a little faster.Blitz also has a huge silence field that also deals really good burst.
MetalGearTeemu1 votesBoth of these heros are also tankier then blitzcrank, and enjoy AOE CC built into their kits which makes their moving to the target a wanted interaction for your CC.
Blitzcrank stands just as much chance of ruining the game for his team with one hook. His safety isn't an argument. If he was as good as you think he'd be seeing high level play. But he's not. For good supports, see what is picked in tournament.
GayFluffyUnicorn2 votesBut blitzcrank has already been picked in pro play? SKT for example. deadly blitz and kalista comp. Thresh just has much more utility, that's why he is picked over blitz. You can save teammates with your W or even your hook,since you don't immediately pull them to you but rather root them until you decide to go in or let it go.
It Hertz When IP2 votesThresh's hook pulls him to you.
Blitz's Q pulls you to him.
This is a massive fucking difference.
