I find riot's contempt for resolve strange

Towboat421·Jul 7, 2018·41 votes·12,561 views

Every time a resolve becomes overly popular it is immediately nerfed into the ground, is it maybe just maybe its possible that the reason people gravitate toward supplemental defense in their runes is because they are tired of constantly either ending a trade with hardly any hp and being zoned to shit or being sent back to spawn in ribbons by your 200 iq lane opponent who brought both ignite and electrocute for a guaranteed 400+ damage in lane.

Shouldn't the popularity of these runes be a wake up call as to what players need, people instinctively grappling onto the only option that allows them to survive in game shouldn't actively be punished. [zombie-brand-mindblown]

42 Comments

Yets4240Jul 8, 201827 votes

I just want tanks to actually be tanky again. Please.

DanjengJul 8, 201824 votes

Blasphemy. Purge these sick acts of tanks actually tanking from your mind. Thou shalt not reject the damage meta. Methinks thou art a fool for not bending down to expose thy posterior to thy superior assassin overlords.

CodeNightFallJul 8, 20183 votes

{quoted}

a fool for not bending down to expose thy posterior to thy superior assassin overlords.

This made me laugh and cry [sg-soraka]

Eons3Jul 8, 20182 votes

Assasins wish they had the damage of mobile burst bruisers.

JAYCCCCCCCCCCCCEJul 8, 20183 votes

Tanks can be tanky when tanks dont deal so much damage like they do now. I just had a Rammus a few games ago kill a fed zed in 1 q, 2 autos, and a w while building full tank. The rammus took like 3% damage. Malphites can ult and get a squishy to less than half health with full tank. Thats just the main problem right now is damage, once damage is nerfed, tanks will be back. But I dont see that happening till mid season 9 or season 10.

Nea104Jul 8, 20182 votes

That's because Riot is able to make a double mistake about the same thing: making tanks not tanky enough, but allowing them to deal too much damage. What a joke :D

aaaustindestroy1Jul 8, 20182 votes

Then again, Rammus's damage scales with his armor ... He's meant to absolutely punish all-AD team comps, same with Malphite.

RainXBladeJul 8, 20182 votes

And yet he can't 1v1 Yi.

aaaustindestroy1Jul 8, 20182 votes

Yi's a whole different story. He deals true damage no matter what, and will nearly always melt you with the right build, no matter what. If a Rammus can 1v1 a Master Yi and survive then that Yi is either 0-20 or that Rammus is a god.

koshkyraJul 8, 201817 votes

A resolve rune/keystone is good = instant nerfs

40% of the champion roster uses electrocute = no nerfs, but an indirect buff with ignite buff

Riot is so biased towards damage and honestly its funny when people try to defend it

My Waifu VanillaJul 8, 20182 votes

Stats please for 40% electrocute users. Scratch that show me games where 40% of the people involved used electrocute. That's 4 bodies which is about 2-3 more than usual.

Bob the ToastrJul 8, 201811 votes

Totally agree. And can we get a keystone for when you just want to survive lane phase? I like playing Nasus but guardian is useless in a solo lane, aftershock is useless because he doesn't have hard cc, and I really only focus on minions so grasp is just as useless.

I just want to sit there and farm and survive lane and there's no keystone for that, is that too much to ask?

Anu3isIIJul 8, 20184 votes

Yes? You practically ask for a Keystone that encourages Passive play with no interaction at all, which Riot totally tries to avoid.

They have nerfed ADC's sustain recently, nerfed Doran's Shield whenever it provided too much sustain, they reworked Coin to remove its sustain and Passive Gold Generation, removed the old Potion Flask and limited to only one type of Potions in inventory and many more changes against Passive Effects, especially those that offer Sustain.

And don't get me wrong, but Nasus is supposed to be easily punished when playing farm simulator. You give up Early Game for Late Game, which is your personal choice.

While Grasp is the only viable choice from resolve, it is decent when you combine farming with trading. On other pages, only Fleet Footwork somewhat helps passive playstyle, but, again, it was nerfed alongside ADCs.

Bob the ToastrJul 8, 20182 votes

Unfortunately Nasus isn't a late game champ anymore, he gets kited far too easily. He's now a level 6 champ like Akali is. Get to level 6 and you basically auto win. That disappoints me because I really enjoyed when he was a late game champ.

And I realize that Riot tries to avoid passive play, which annoys me but there's really nothing I can do about that lol.

GayFluffyUnicornJul 8, 20182 votes

And why should u be able to just free farm at no costs?

Bob the ToastrJul 8, 20183 votes

It would not be no cost, you give up the damage that grasp provides or the damage that any other tree provides to focus on defense. I'm even fine if it's like a -10% damage to champions for the first 10 mins as long as it helps me stay alive.

TwitchInMyPantsJul 8, 20183 votes

Bone Plating and Chrysalis were broken last time they were picked and even champs with strong early were taking them for the level of efficiency they had

That said removing the resist options was stupid and limits what you can actually use resolve for other than Bone Plating + Chrysalis as a secondary, and splitting the HP with other stats benefits juggernauts and things like adcs/mages but it actually hurts tanks. Pretty much designates Resolve as a secondary tree in power and its only viable as a primary if the Keystones are overtuned.

My Waifu VanillaJul 8, 20181 votes

Except most tanks are going to opt into inspiration secondary regardless. Even before the changes the only tree a tank MIGHT have dabbled in secondary besides Insp was Sorcery and that would have been for the movement speed or transcendence. Don't act like splitting it actually did something to tanks when in reality it made resolve (and other trees such as precision) viable for more of the cast without actually hurting anyone.

WTBeGirl100EUhrJul 8, 20181 votes

Some tanks go precision since quite a few have kits that benefit from attack speed.

EkyonKunJul 8, 20183 votes

It'd be nice if like, half the resolve runes were at least above troll-tier.

Overgrowth in particular. It gives what...40 hp after 10 minutes of afk farming? If that? It's usually less if I'm not mistaken.|

Bone Plating got nerfed to shit, but it's still taken because what else are we gonna use?

Font of Life is pretty okay if you're a cc-oriented support. Leona Braum Nautilus come to mind

Revitalize is only good if you have PHAT heals, or have someone on your team that can give you PHAT heals. It really doesn't help its case that it doesn't affect health regen.

Conditioning would be fine if it gave SOMETHING early game. Or at the very least give more than, what, 30 armor/MR late game on a full tank? And again, competing against Second Wind here.

Chrysalis....For when you want a mildly tankier early game but then by mid game want a little bit more AP/AD? I mean, it'd be okay if it wasn't contesting against Second Wind, the only halfway decent resolve rune there is.

Demolish is nice, but only really if you're winning already. If you can't push to their tower, it does literally nothing defensive-wise.

The Keystones are all fine and serve their own purpose for either aggressive-tanky or defensive-tanky. Or in aftershock's case, a bit of both.

TLDR: Besides Keystones, there are really only 2-3 good runes to take in resolve. And besides bone plating, NONE of them protect against burst. So the default usually comes down to Second Wind/Bone Plating or perhaps Demolish.

remakoroJul 8, 20183 votes

If you didnt notice rito actively nerfing def and buffing dmg. Sooo they cant have such shit like everyone picking resolve. It has to be borderline troll option.

Beacon AcademyJul 8, 20182 votes

Honestly, the whole rune system (And old mastery system) is just impossible to balance.

There are way over a hundred champions and millions upon millions of players for LoL

The chances of at least one person finding a broken build out of the many builds between champions, items, and runes is incredibly high.

Riot is at a point where they're either going to have to continue going down this path of making everything flashy as fuck until the game is run into the ground

They can bite the bullet, admit their mistakes, and go back to balancing just champions and items.

Will people say League is boring without flashy damage effects? Sure.

Will people say its harder to kill people? Sure.

But at the end of day, the game will be easier to balance and the people who actually make up the playerbase can team fight for longer than a few seconds and therefore actually show skill expression in the way they handle their champions is said fights.

Automated RivenJul 8, 20181 votes

it would be fine if they restricted who could do what. It would actually solve alot of problems in the game as well.

Beacon AcademyJul 8, 20185 votes

Then there would be no point to the rune system as it is a system designed to allow player to choose their own playstyles and builds.

Automated RivenJul 8, 20181 votes

you can still do that while restricting which ones people can chose. It isnt the same variety but if they had 6-7 keystones for each class which could not be chosen by other classes, you could still have the same playstyle changes, whithout having to nerf shit for other classes abusing them (cough ezreal cough)

Beacon AcademyJul 8, 20182 votes

Free system with restrictions lol

Automated RivenJul 8, 20181 votes

I don't understand what this is supposed to say. Or the purpose of it. It's no less free if there are 5 adc keystone's, 5 mage keystone's, 5 support keystone's, 5 bruiser keystone's, 5 tank keystone's. Without having the ability to dip into other classes keystone's.

It just allows for easier balancing. You don't have to agree or think it's a good idea. But to insinuate it's less free is rather dumb.

Beacon AcademyJul 8, 20182 votes

I'm just saying a free system is inherently broken and wil always be abused.

It doesn't matter if you limit classes to picking certain trees, there will always be a broken build.

Just thought it was funny you talked about a freedom of choice system while restricting which ones people can choose.

Going back to Champions + Item balancing, would make things easier on the balance team and remove many sources of unnecessary damage from the game.

Automated RivenJul 9, 20181 votes

I don't know what your reading. But I never said anything about freedom of choice. I said to restrict things in an effort to maintain better balance. While allowing specific classes to have shit they want without them getting nerfed to Oblivion because ezreal breaks them. Or adc's break them. Or anything. Ffs riot wanted to give an ap version of conqueror but couldn't because tanks were way to strong with it. However if you simply made it so that tanks were not allowed to take it that would solve the issue.

Riot claims to want to allow off meta builds, however as soon as one is viable they nerf the hell out today it. Class reworks removed damn near every off meta build as well. (ap MF, ap trist, ap sej, ap shyv, and so on) all of this is fine but either go one way or the other. Either allow anyone to do whatever and try to hit balance points or restrict shit instead of nerfing it.

Beacon AcademyJul 9, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=Beacon Academy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=i1vWed3R,comment-id=000400000000,timestamp=2018-07-08T08:23:36.304+0000)

A system designed to allow player to choose their own playstyles and builds.

[{quoted}](name=Automated Riven,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=i1vWed3R,comment-id=0004000000000000,timestamp=2018-07-08T08:44:31.522+0000)

you can still do that while restricting which ones people can chose.

Automated RivenJul 9, 20181 votes

I think we may be talking past each other. Having choices for different playstyles does not mean you have to have access to all the items and keystone's in the game.

For example. Let's say i am a bruiser and I have 5 keystone's available to me. (this is not a suggestion, simply a hypothetical to make a point) Conqueror Predator Phase rush Grasp Glatial augment

I have 5 very different playstyles avaible to me. I have

Over power them with damage
Abuse mobility and roam around the map
A skirmishing fighter playstyles focusing on short poky trades which can then be used to chase them down for then kill.
Beefy sustainy fighter, trying to out sustain the opponent and win that way.
Control the battlefield with soft cc through active items and your auto attacks.

This still leaves me with plenty of meaningful choices but allows for other keystone's like comet, aery, spellbook, aftershock and so on to be strong on their intended classes and I cannot abuse them.

It still leaves choices, however, the choices you can make are restricted in favor of balance.

Quality over quantity.

Beacon AcademyJul 9, 20181 votes

Not every bruiser is the same and that fact leads to the same exact problem where someone out there will find a way to make something broken.

Riot's historically speaking will then nerf broken build and champion(s) abusing said build.

Leading to fucking over the other bruisers who were reliant on the rune to stay viable.

Then another person will find another build that is broken using the now stronger "other runes," repeating the process all over again.

Automated RivenJul 9, 20181 votes

Your not wrong. That's why my personal opinion is that the whole new system is garbage and should be removed/reverted. But riot won't do that, so the next easiest option is balancing class specific runes for similar champions. (let's be honest, riot won't do that either) so we are stuck with this unbalancable cluster fuck which is the current rune system.

RPGZexionJul 8, 20181 votes

I don't like when people act like there is no skill expression in playing against assassins.

Beacon AcademyJul 8, 20183 votes

An assassin now-a-days can 100-0 you themselves with their kit burst, duskblade burst and rune burst.

I do recall that back when I started playing, assassins would be the ones who would flank the fights to pick off people who got low in them after all the CC was blown.

princeblumpkinJul 8, 20182 votes

The problem with resolve is that it functions in such a way that it actually enables more aggression instead of just making you safer. Notice how the biggest abusers of Resolve have been aggressive champions like Leona, who use Resolve to offset their aggressive kit.

Yets4240Jul 8, 20181 votes

Oh no, a tank using the resolve tree specifically designed for them to be able to sustain up for the damage she has to take by throwing herself in melee range just to do anything but ult. Stop the press, such abuse.

Shrek LuigiJul 8, 20182 votes

I don't mean to be argumentative, but I disagree with OP's sentiments about resolve.

In a lot of cases, its the guys with abusively-strong trades who were/are utilizing stuff in the resolve tree- to get ahead--bone plating and chrysalis were the main outliers, but also the synergy between the HP-recovery and damage-at-%hp stuff in precision+resolve and how that affects the stat-checkers of the game.

My opinion is that all the rune trees are pretty dysfunctional because they compound on the stuff that makes OP-champions OP rather than bolstering the inherent weaknesses of the less-OP ones. The phenomenas of this game that people take issue with most are only made worse when you introduce more modifiers for them, like giving champions a LOT of free movespeed across sorcery+domination when there is a pretty clear instance of mobility-creep happening for example. The amount of customization that the new rune-system offers compared to the old one also exists within a smaller scope, so a lot of hardline-counters/cheese strats/whatever you will have effectively been phased-out with nothing to fill the void.

Riot should have been more mindful about reimplimenting such an important system of the game, but I don't blame them for doing it, and I think very few people are actually capable of looking at a game like this and being able to single out every single problem before it occurs so I haven't gone completely off-the-deep-end over it yet. Above all, though,I REALLY don't think trying to weigh one against the other when they're all kinda faulty is the best way to move forward. Sorry for the rant.

InfinitexMortalJul 8, 20182 votes

Riot wants everything to die in one hit.

Glory97Jul 8, 20181 votes

Well if resovle is popular, it's popular on some bruiser/ secondary tree for carries, which makes those champions tanky, when they actually shouldn't have potent defensive options for how much damage they do.

That's somewhat unfortunate for tanks.

DreamspitterJul 8, 20181 votes

Whatever happens you can't remove runes.

It's Runeterra.

TyroneWatermelonJul 8, 20181 votes

Resolve is the only path that actually grants the pathetic durability that is useless anyway... and they want it nerfed too? OH NO THERE'S A RUNE TREE THAT HELPS( a little) COUNTER THE RIDICULOUS BURST AND DPS FROM DOMINATION AND PRECISION QUICK SHUT IT DOWN THE GOYIM KNOW