I have a proposed set of nerfs for Riven that are fair

HateDaddy·Jul 12, 2015·223 votes·7,779 views

delete her

190 Comments

3tysonJul 12, 201571 votes

i only agree with the first one

Rew711Jul 12, 201511 votes

But that second one seems so much safer.

YOU BEEN WARNEDJul 12, 201550 votes

Or remove her ability to animation cancer.

MadraJul 12, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=YOU BEEN WARNED,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hyLEiQWr,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2015-07-12T13:39:44.985+0000)

Or remove her ability to animation cancer.

This would be a good place to start. Having high AD scaling on her offensive abilities combined with an AD shield would be another good place to look at.

MohawkBirdJul 12, 20155 votes

And 2 AoE CC abilities... and extreme mobility... and an long range AoE execute... and a huge AD steroid with her ult... all on top of having some of the lowest cooldowns in the game. Nice job Riot!

MeesterMooJul 12, 20159 votes

You can literally make any champ sound op like that.

Doesn't have costs Gets free crit chance Self heal Reduces AD WHILE slowing A free dash that does damage scaling on his AD 5 seconds where he CANNOT die

Is Tryndamere op? No not really. An even better example is Galio but I don't remember what all of his abilities do exactly.

MohawkBirdJul 12, 201510 votes

Except that the sheer number of things on the list would be far longer with an OP champion. I can name probably 10 things with Riven and other overloaded champions, like Ekko, while someone like Galio would have such a tiny list.

And honestly Tryndamere is cancer too.

MeesterMooJul 12, 20151 votes

I'm saying that you can list the raw abilities and on pen and paper it sounds OP, like Galio's ult. But unfortunately Galio is simply not very unique and there is no reason to pick him over anyone else.

Avios1Jul 12, 20156 votes

Has low mana costs till level 11 has a free DoT on attack Map Control that slows and does damage over time passive speed steroid that can double itself when activated passive that allows stealth and grants atk speed steroid on moving

And that, is my main, who is Teemo , I shall play him till the end my lovely friends.

Kuroi86Jul 12, 20155 votes

Free minions On hit magic damage On hit heal % current health damage AoE AP nuke Long range stun skill shot Bonus move speed % missing health damage Passive attack speed steroid Massive active attack speed steroid Free item 3157 active that can jump you onto any enemy

Tannhäuser GateJul 13, 20152 votes

And she was disgustingly strong at a competitive level until they nerfed her to the ground

Only Play DariusJul 12, 20155 votes

Tryndamere is actually a balance problem right now, so your example isn't the best.

SammystormJul 12, 20156 votes

the problem with this is that animation cancelling is not unique to Riven. Many champions can do it. Jayce for example.

SouL1essJul 13, 20159 votes

So fix them all.

Cast points exist for a reason and is one of the balancing aspect of an individual skill / mechanism.

Just because multiple champions can animation cancel doesn't mean animation cancelling is not abused to bypass integral game mechanics.

Balancing a champion around the player's ability to abuse a bug is even worse.

JasiwelJul 12, 201510 votes

[{quoted}](name=YOU BEEN WARNED,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hyLEiQWr,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2015-07-12T13:39:44.985+0000)

Or remove her ability to animation cancer.

I think cancers in general should be removed.

UltîmaJul 12, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=YOU BEEN WARNED,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hyLEiQWr,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2015-07-12T13:39:44.985+0000)

Or remove her ability to animation cancer.

This. She already has an ungodly amount of burst. Why is she allowed to supplement that by auto-attacking faster than Yi due to animation cancelling?!

HauntJul 12, 201545 votes

Well shit how am I gonna downvote a post by a fellow Diamond player

lol jk as if i was gonna do it anyways give riven nerfs pls

FadedpfJul 12, 201527 votes

Or just give her cooldowns.

TheorcheroJul 12, 201520 votes

[DIAMOND POST] [MUST UPVOTE]

Soda PopkillskiJul 12, 201519 votes

This community is so dumb, looking at rank before good arguments. Delete the entirety of these damned boards, riot.

HateDaddyJul 12, 201516 votes

That's because everyone knows higher elo = automatically better arguments

ArkenStormJul 12, 20158 votes

That better be a joke :P

IpolsJul 12, 201514 votes

Even better: Delete her and permaban every Riven player.

IcyPepperJul 12, 20159 votes

Agreed.

Gut Kalista.

pE4CbxDPQOJul 12, 20156 votes

As long as we take flora with her. Or really any champ that can come back to lane and randomly 100-0 you after you made them start 0-2. Oh boy they hit level 6 better get some lube!

Gregor GysiJul 12, 20154 votes

[{quoted}](name=fght ff yr dmns,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hyLEiQWr,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-07-12T08:01:27.942+0000)

As long as we take flora with her. Or really any champ that can come back to lane and randomly 100-0 you after you made them start 0-2. Oh boy they hit level 6 better get some lube!

Or like every top lane champion that isn't a tank, because fuck diversity.

OrangesilkJul 12, 20158 votes

Chogath Can and will 100-0 you when he hits 6, and he's a tank, so there's that xD.

I Miss CannonJul 12, 20153 votes

He's also broken as fuck and needs to be nerfed to death or deleted right away

OrangesilkJul 12, 201511 votes

You're bad and it's showing.

I Miss CannonJul 12, 20151 votes

idc about your opinion cho'gath main. one of the highest ban rates in high elo should tell you something.

HateDaddyJul 12, 201516 votes

Wtf lol

Nobody bans cho'gath anymore

OrangesilkJul 12, 20153 votes

He had this short time in the competitive limelight when Zed was ridiculous enough to force weird counterpicks against him in midlane like Cho and Urgot. This caused a lot of people to flock to these champions and that was his little spike in pick/ban rate in high ELO (And I do mean little).

The time has come and gone, and he's back to underpickedness. Mainly because 80% of his kits power is loaded on a skill with a delay so long, no competent player not under the effects of CC gets hit by it. If you're getting hit by his Qs, you may need to get better. If you're not getting hit, he's one of the weakest champs.

TheDuelist999Jul 13, 20152 votes

which is why you build rhylais and open with w and then q

Emperor TimeJul 12, 20155 votes

How about they just give a >>>resource?!?<<<

NorthernDruidJul 12, 20151 votes

I could see her being reworked to use flow.

Not any other traditional use though. But it would be interesting to see her have to value her damage up against her shield.

MohawkBirdJul 12, 20152 votes

Flow would be a buff for her. Flow is basically no mana cost + a free shield every now and then. Having flow is better than being completely resourceless.

Icestar1186Jul 12, 20154 votes

Maybe make her use it as a resource cost for her E? If something like that was needed, which in my opinion it isn't.

TransgressorJul 12, 20152 votes

Now she has access to: item 3508 item 3078 item 3042 item 3057 item 3024 item 3110 item 3025

Are you sure?

acepil0tJul 12, 20156 votes

Because it's illegal to buy mana on a champion that doesn't use it. Giving her COSTS isn't a buff.

Icestar1186Jul 12, 20154 votes

Play Maokai.

badoogaJul 12, 20154 votes

Or Singed , just get a few early item 1029 and possibly a item 3082 and get a item 3110 after your item 3027 and item 3070 . It actually can work out, especially with the recent Singed buffs (I.e. the laugh on E).

FrikgeekJul 13, 20153 votes

You're going to need a lot more tears if you plan on playing Singed vs Riven.

O Fallen ScholarJul 13, 20153 votes

Fed Riven is not that scary in long term. In team fights she can be shut down like Master Yi and boom, she suddenly cries in the corner.

She is oppressive and annoying only in lane.

Meeks011Jul 12, 20152 votes

What the fuck dude, hell no. Riven's my main. How will I live without her?

MohawkBirdJul 12, 201520 votes

Play a champion that isn't cancer.

TransgressorJul 12, 20153 votes

Annie Draven Cassiopeia Fizz Heimerdinger Irelia Malzahar all more viable than Riven. All far more cancerous than Riven.

acepil0tJul 12, 201517 votes

Draven ain't cancer, he's just extremely strong in good hands.

Noam BraumskyJul 12, 20153 votes

{quoted}

all more viable than Riven. All far more cancerous than Riven.

Heimerdinger

wat

SaltyKrackaJul 12, 201513 votes

Heimer is preeeeeety cancerous.

TransgressorJul 12, 20157 votes

Put turrets all around you: free protection, reliable harass you don't even have to work for(they target automaticaly without any sort of player interaction), constant dps, free zoning, free damage resource throughout the game.

They automaticaly push the lane for you, granting you cs and free trades, while you sit calmly behind them. Automaticaly render any attempts at harass and jungle ganks pointless because you're just going to out-trade everyone no matter what and good luck being killed when you already have 3 turrets down, and another 2 damaging abilities with CC to boot like you weren't at a big enough advantage already. Even if you do get killed, it takes a braindead player to not get away with a 1for1 trade especialy when you can just R+Q.

As if the "go away or prepare to get fucked while being unable to do anything about it without me having to sweat press 1 button win game ability zones you for the whole laning phase area of control ON DEMAND" zone Heimerdinger's turrets create, you have 2 ranged harass abilities to spare, one of them having CC, the other constant harass at a low cost, both of them being ridiculously ranged considering the fact that you just can't get close to him.

With your ultimate you can further boost your oppressive skillset to the point of disgust, allowing you a guaranteed lane without breaking a sweat and your enemies to have no fun for the whole game. Your itemization solves all your sustain issues despite you not really having any to begin with(unlike Riven who HAS to buy items to get sustain since the nerfs long ago). Mobility is not an issue when you have a mobile fortress whenever your cooldowns are up and you feel like fucking someone's game up.