Too much lifesteal in this game.

Saianna··7 votes·1,710 views

[If you are an ADC main, you might not understand frustration other mains have while facing ADC. So, before you smash that downvote just think of how it feels about hitting your forehead against wall, cause that is the feeling soft-CC mage has facing against ADCs]

I'd like to start this with simple thesis:

High amounts of lifesteal is balanced as long as other side [mages] has hard-CC

At first, I was full of rant and hate against how much Lifesteal ADC can get and use. My frustration came from playing soft-CC mage against 3 ADCs. I couldn't do anything. What was truly infuriating is they (or 1 of them) were standing in my full burst combo OUTHEALING all damage. But then friend invited me to a game where I myself, as ADC, couldn't do anything at all due to insane amounts of CC.

So my thesis is quite simple. If you can stop ADCs from lifestealing, then you can win, right? Then what about mages with soft CC? Those who have only damage? And even being soft-CC, their damage is nowhere near stronger than heavy-CC champions?

Well, here's my second thesis:

High amounts of lifesteal is in NO WAY balanced if matched against soft-CC or no CC at all.

And I believe we have some serious problem here.

Lifesteal as a stat was buffed on every occasion Riot touched AD itemization. I don't mind variety. More items the better.

#But maybe.. Just maybe isn't it about time to make life steal as UNIQUE stat?

Or at least hard-capping it at some point?


I understand that ADCs deal most of damage, okay. But why they don't feel glasscannon'ish as everyone says they are?

I by no means believe that a champion who heals 30 ->100 in 3-4 AAs while being bursted by a mage should be called a "glasscannon".

From my POV a soft-CC mage is a glasscannon and quite ineffective one If I could add. Simply because he can't kill an ADC, he can't keep up with throwing damage against an ADC who heals on him. Then what exactly is the point of such mage?


Last thing I find highly unfun is:

For most of champions damage they received can be fixed only by a potion or going back to base, but for ADCs it's just matter of few hits on minions or jungle camp. I even saw ADC heal on... Rammus... With thornmail. i know ADCs job is to destroy tanks, but taking no damage from that? Isn't that the perfect example of stat getting out of controll?

TL;DR

Too much lifesteal makes this stat obnoxious. You are free food if you have no hard-CC versus ADC with lots of lifesteal.

EDIT:

FYI I am not asking riot to make mages stronger than ADC.

I know that in 1v1 I'll most likely lose. But I don't want them, ADC go away with full HP, as if nothing happened. That is super unfun and infuriating.

I also don't want ADC to hits a mob just few times and be full HP. That's also unfun to deal with ADC with "Warmog-Sorakas amounts of heal in 2 ADC items"

21 Comments

Lord Sessshomaru2 votes

Don't know if you have heard, but they have items which can negate the lifesteal/healing almost completely. item 3165 item 3123 item 3033 summoner 14

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

but we dont wanna have to think and figure out and learn the game we just wanna cry and complain

[zombie-nunu-tears]

Saianna3 votes
  1. For Morello to be effective target has to drop below 40% hp. But if he outheals all the damage you do, then this will not happen.
  2. EC for mages?
  3. MR for mages?
  4. If your counterplay lies in summoner spell or active item, then there is no counterplay. I took this statement from topic about "how to counter Zed" where Zhyona and exhaust were 2 most common answers.

And to MrFawknSunshine ADC main spotted~~

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

lifesteal is conditional based on the % of lifesteal , the amount of ad you have and the amount of armor the enemy has that you are life stealing from...

armor which reduces physical damage reduces the amount of hp a champ gets back from lifesteal

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

Life steal (LS) is an offensive stat that restores health to the wielder for a percentage of all on-hit physical damage they deal, except for Corki's basic attacks, which also applies life steal on magic damage. Basic attacks, abilities that apply on-hit effects, and abilities that modify basic attacks all benefit from lifesteal.[1]

Life steal is calculated from the actual damage done to an enemy, after armor and all other forms of damage reduction. All champions have 0% base life steal. It can be increased with items, runes, masteries, and some champion abilities.

Saianna4 votes

Congratz, you have copied wiki.

The point of problem is: AD and LS are waaaaaay too accessible, thus you get an overabundance of LS by simply building anything for ADC. And once that happens, if you aren't hard-CC'd, then you simply cannot die.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

at most some one might have 22% life steal and majority of the champs who get lifesteal are ranged adcs they have no other def stats

and they usually cap about 350-400 ad

so if they hit you for 350 ad at 22% life steal they get back 77hp but if you calculate in armor and all other forms of damage reduction. it is less and if they crit it would be more because crit amplifies physical damage but its on auto attacks or empowered autos... not spells... just like caits Q wont provide life steal

Saianna5 votes

so if they hit you for 350 ad at 22% life steal they get back 77hp

That's some math.. Yet in game ADCs heal for 200 or even 300 with that setup.

Funny, isn't it?

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

not quit true... but lets make stuff up..

Penguin Eclipse5 votes

[{quoted}](name=MrFawknSunshine ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hjOA3L1x,comment-id=000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-13T17:31:25.074+0000)

not quit true... but lets make stuff up..

Crit is so common they do essentially heal 200-300 per AA.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

but life steal is based on the amount of damage you do to a target negated by damage reduction...

also the champs who build lifesteal and crit typically have like 1800hp late game by the time they might crit and get 200 hp back from a crit auto where the champs they are attacking have 3000+ hp and armor and damage

Penguin Eclipse3 votes

[{quoted}](name=MrFawknSunshine ,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hjOA3L1x,comment-id=00000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-13T17:51:15.221+0000)

but life steal is based on the amount of damage you do to a target negated by damage reduction...

also the champs who build lifesteal and crit typically have like 1800hp late game by the time they might crit and get 200 hp back from a crit auto where the champs they are attacking have 3000+ hp and armor and damage

If they attack the tanks. The majority of the champions in the game are not tanks.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

adc jobs with their sustain damage is to take out the tanks... assassins/burst damage is to take out squishies. tanks are designed to sustain the burst and cc and provide hell

Saianna3 votes

This "balance" you speak of became unbalanced after AD itemization got huge buffs.

This time ADC works versus pretty much all.

oSEXYPLATYPUSo1 votes

but adcs have no def no tankyness so they are still subjected to being blown up and focused easily

and ideally your ap mage who has range/burst and typically some kind of cc should blow up the adc considering most adc dont build alot of mr naturally unless vs a heavy ap comp

Need Gold 4 Tent1 votes

As a frequent crit yi player, I do notice the heal from "pretty much dead" to full hp with full build + BT in about 3 hits. I've seen a Vayne heal from half with 1 Q. I think the culprit is Warlord's stacking with other lifesteal though, few other ADC can outheal burst especially not the armor pen types.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

H

Extvia1 votes

Get Morellonomicon. It's called Grievous Wounds.

Saianna1 votes

If I can't drop them below 40% of health (because they outheal my burst).. Then...

Morello won't solve anything.

Extvia1 votes

Hard burst/the soft CC mages that only have damage will always drop you down to 40% or lower even with lifesteal. Either that or murder you before you can start lifestealing without a GA cause things like Syndra exist.

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