@RiotScruffy Is the Yorick Rework Still a Thing?

Koechophe·Sep 5, 2015·51 votes·46,560 views

In this thread http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=3605329 Xelnath outlined a yorick rework that looked pretty darn sick, and said it would be handed over to you. It's been almost two years, I was wondering if we could get an update on this, even just to say that it's iceboxed, or something. Yorick seems like he'd be a priority because his playstyle is oppressive, resulting in him being pretty weak and binary (win the lane, lose the game). He also seems like he fits the "Juggernaut" fantasy really well (low mobility, high dueling/damage capacity with tankiness). So... can you tell us anything?

Upvote and bump for yorick attention. I'm sure I'm not the only one who wants to see him rise from the dead.

49 Comments

RiotMeddlerSep 5, 201540 votes

The Yorick rework Xelnath was experimenting with did get ice boxed. We do plan to do a full rework (Sion/Poppy level) for Yorick still at some point, at the very least that won't be happening this year though. Yorick's got some major issues, Poppy, and likely Taric, are ahead of him in the full relaunch queue at a minimum though.

In terms of class we do think juggernaut would be a good fit. Given his minion summoning theme the direction we're most likely to go is a juggernaut with strong pushing power (split push, counter push, tower sieger or some combination of the above).

DwarvenGiantSep 5, 20156 votes

Hi Meddler, you didn't mention Urgot. Is Vesh still working on a Sion/Poppy-level update for him?

Also, if you, Vesh, or Scruffy can say, what's the new direction for his kit? What archetype/role will he fill (Not necessarily asking about "Mid/Top/ADC/Jungle/Supp"- cause that can change pretty easily anyways- I'm asking more in terms of "Assassin/Mage/Tank/Light Fighter/Juggernaut", etc)?

WestonbirtSep 5, 20153 votes

Existence is torment.

item 3070 Urgot

And yeah, Juggernault would make the most sense for ol' Yorick.

KingsgraveSep 5, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Hi Meddler, you didn't mention Urgot. Is Vesh still working on a Sion/Poppy-level update for him?

Also, if you, Vesh, or Scruffy can say, what's the new direction for his kit? What archetype/role will he fill (Not necessarily asking about "Mid/Top/ADC/Jungle/Supp"- cause that can change pretty easily anyways- I'm asking more in terms of "Assassin/Mage/Tank/Light Fighter/Juggernaut", etc)?

Probably an ADC. He can't be a Juggernaut because he is Ranged. Ranged Tank really wouldn't work.

RogueWillSep 5, 20151 votes

Do you have date for the poppy reword release? I have been waiting for it since 2012 xD

DwarvenGiantSep 5, 20152 votes

They will probably not give a date because things can easily change, and they don't want to set expectations.

RogueWillSep 5, 20152 votes

I don't want a full date as 10/20/2015.... I just want to know aroudn teh edges of Winter 2016 or fall 2015 sorta thing

DwarvenGiantSep 5, 20151 votes

Oh. Should be soon. Late fall 2015, it seems. :D (My guess is sometime during late October or early-mid November.)

EpichuntarzSep 5, 20151 votes

{quoted}

The Yorick rework Xelnath was experimenting with did get ice boxed. We do plan to do a full rework (Sion/Poppy level) for Yorick still at some point, at the very least that won't be happening this year though. Yorick's got some major issues, Poppy, and likely Taric, are ahead of him in the full relaunch queue at a minimum though.

In terms of class we do think juggernaut would be a good fit. Given his minion summoning theme the direction we're most likely to go is a juggernaut with strong pushing power (split push, counter push, tower sieger or some combination of the above).

Can he at least get a skin, then, since we're looking at probably another year before his update, and he hasn't had one since his release?

TerraRisingSep 5, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Can he at least get a skin, then, since we're looking at probably another year before his update, and he hasn't had one since his release?

I'll play Devil's advocate in this case. I've heard Riot's argument enough to recite it from memory.

Yorick's on the "We will be reworking this champion" list. Before that, he was on the "We don't want to promote him at all for the good of the game (and we absolutely hate him)" list.

What if the skins team were to release a new Yorick skin that you bought and loved (for instance, Winter Wonder Yorick with a snow shovel and Poro-Ghouls). Then, when the rework comes, Riot pulls a "Trundle" and completely changes Yorick from the "hulking, undead green gravedigger" to the "generically overused fantasy necromancer cliche" champ? You'd get upset, you'd get rightfully upset, and all Riot can do is just give you the finger and say "we think this is a better Yorick for the game." (re: Trundle).

There's also the whole "we don't want to give the rework team additional work," excuse they use (which didn't stop them from making skins for Eve, Morde and Zilean...)

So, yeah... while Yorick could realistically see a rework release of 2017 and a new skin by 2018, there will be no love for the Grave Digger until then.

DrCyanideSep 5, 20153 votes

If he's in a good enough position to have his rework delayed so long, can he be on the free rotation then?

Best Darius KRSep 5, 20152 votes

He is not in the free rotation because he is the definition of an anti-fun champion. He is not fun to play, and makes playing the laning phase against him a horrible experience.

That being said though, he is more playable than Poppy and Taric, since his lane pressure and especially his ultimate can have priceless value in certain teamcomps.

It Hertz When IPSep 5, 20151 votes

I see Taric as being more playable, at the very least far simpler. Support Taric has to be one of the easiest Tank Supports to play: targeted heal, point and click stun, passive armor buff that requires zero thought, and a generic Make-ADC-Better ult. Find a solid build and any halfwit could do well. Yorick actually takes planning and skill to use to any great extent.

SearingspearSep 5, 20152 votes

I don't think he meant playable like that.. Taric is pretty much the worst support in the game, his kit just doesn't work well at all in the current meta. Like, compare him to Braum, a tank support who fills a similar role, and Taric is just worlds worse (braum peels better, initiates better, disengages better, is tankier). Yorick can hold his own in the top lane against pretty much anyone, and does a little in team fights with his ult, as well as a bit of mobility on his q. Basically is think what he meant by "playable" is that in like a ranked game you would rather have a Yorick top than a Taric support. In terms of how easy they are, Taric is definitely easy, Yoricks easy as well.

RalanrSep 5, 20151 votes

While I do believe Taric needs a rework, I don't think we should always compare champion kits based on the current meta. The meta seems to change too quickly for that to be a fair comparison.

SearingspearSep 6, 20151 votes

I mean just continuing with the braum comparison, Braum outclasses Taric in literally any meta i can imagine in a tank meta braum has better engage, assassin meta braum has better peel, adc meta braum has better lock down plus the big ass shield that mitigates massive damage. Although taric doesn't work well in the current meta, he would also not really compete with other supports even if the meta shifted.

impishDullahanJan 29, 20161 votes

I find Yorick immensely fun. Obviously not for the enemy but the way you can a get a double kill from an enemy gank or just calmly walk out I just love. I wish he were on the free rotation so I could see him in game when I don't play him and learn at least a little of how to counter and then I can counter the counters.

TerraRisingSep 5, 20152 votes

{quoted}

The Yorick rework Xelnath was experimenting with did get ice boxed.

Was it because the Xelnath rework would have required a higher level of A.I. programming than the team is capable of producing? It seems that having three semi-intelligent minions rather than the current "get the nearest champion" programmed ones might be above the capabilities of the majority of gaming companies.

We do plan to do a full rework (Sion/Poppy level) for Yorick still at some point, at the very least that won't be happening this year though. Yorick's got some major issues, Poppy, and likely Taric, are ahead of him in the full relaunch queue at a minimum though.

You forgot to mention that Urgot could rise above Yorick as far as rework priorities go, given how the teams and company attitudes might change over time (Urgot might be further on in the planning stages, popularity of the champ, Riot hating Urgot less than Yorick, etc.)

In terms of class we do think juggernaut would be a good fit. Given his minion summoning theme the direction we're most likely to go is a juggernaut with strong pushing power (split push, counter push, tower sieger or some combination of the above).

Is that set in stone, as it were?

TexamusSep 5, 20151 votes

Was it because the Xelnath rework would have required a higher level of A.I. programming than the team is capable of producing? It seems that having three semi-intelligent minions rather than the current "get the nearest champion" programmed ones might be above the capabilities of the majority of gaming companies.

There's no reason to think that would be the case, It's not near as hard to simiulate intelligence,as you might think. it's just a series of targeting parameters.

For instance targetting

what Yorick is targeting>Champs damaging Yorick>Epic monsters>Monsters>Minions

Probably would have to have more classifications in there somewhere like summoned minions above monsters, and possibly add towers in there somewhere. But it's essentially a slightly more complicated Miss Fortune Q at the end of the day. It has more potential targets, and doesn't hit in a cone, and can hit more than once, but it still works essentially the same way.

TerraRisingSep 5, 20151 votes

{quoted}

There's no reason to think that would be the case, It's not near as hard to simiulate intelligence,as you might think. it's just a series of targeting parameters.

For instance targetting

what Yorick is targeting>Champs damaging Yorick>Epic monsters>Monsters>Minions

Probably would have to have more classifications in there somewhere like summoned minions above monsters, and possibly add towers in there somewhere. But it's essentially a slightly more complicated Miss Fortune Q at the end of the day. It has more potential targets, and doesn't hit in a cone, and can hit more than once, but it still works essentially the same way.

The thing is, from what I remember of Xelnath's rework, the individual ghouls had independent behaviors far beyond targeting priorities.

Insane PyromanicSep 5, 20155 votes

{quoted}

The Yorick rework Xelnath was experimenting with did get ice boxed. We do plan to do a full rework (Sion/Poppy level) for Yorick still at some point, at the very least that won't be happening this year though. Yorick's got some major issues, Poppy, and likely Taric, are ahead of him in the full relaunch queue at a minimum though.

In terms of class we do think juggernaut would be a good fit. Given his minion summoning theme the direction we're most likely to go is a juggernaut with strong pushing power (split push, counter push, tower sieger or some combination of the above).

I think there have been too many siege and pushing champs lately. I also think yorick's theme might be better executed as a "you came into the wrong cemetery" kind of champion. Pushing and siege as a summoning champ puts him too close to Heimerdinger .

WadeTWilsonSep 5, 20152 votes

You're so right man.

warpenguin555Sep 5, 20152 votes

{quoted}

The Yorick rework Xelnath was experimenting with did get ice boxed. We do plan to do a full rework (Sion/Poppy level) for Yorick still at some point, at the very least that won't be happening this year though. Yorick's got some major issues, Poppy, and likely Taric, are ahead of him in the full relaunch queue at a minimum though.

In terms of class we do think juggernaut would be a good fit. Given his minion summoning theme the direction we're most likely to go is a juggernaut with strong pushing power (split push, counter push, tower sieger or some combination of the above).

are any of the 4 reworked ones ( Poppy Taric Yorick Urgot ) planned for a 2015 release?

ExecutorDillSep 5, 20151 votes

Who is working on the shen rework?

LVL 5 POROSep 5, 20151 votes

Or ... we could just let Juggernauts die and never make more of them because they are obviously unhealthy for game balance and Rito has already shown they lack the ability/expertise to pull something like that off. And if not, it should be in testing for at least 2 months before hitting the Rift, or the epic failure that is this patch will be repeated. Especially with a concept like Yorick, who can deal damage with ghouls from far away, making him tanky and powerful with minions will never end well. It'll be a disaster, I promise. So please, drop it.

RalanrSep 5, 20151 votes

How's the Poppy rework coming along? On the champion updates article I saw she was after the juggernauts. Is her rework expected to come out before any other champion reworks/Visual updates?

SkiasSep 5, 20151 votes

{quoted}

The Yorick rework Xelnath was experimenting with did get ice boxed. We do plan to do a full rework (Sion/Poppy level) for Yorick still at some point, at the very least that won't be happening this year though. Yorick's got some major issues, Poppy, and likely Taric, are ahead of him in the full relaunch queue at a minimum though.

In terms of class we do think juggernaut would be a good fit. Given his minion summoning theme the direction we're most likely to go is a juggernaut with strong pushing power (split push, counter push, tower sieger or some combination of the above).

I really hope you remove his sustain if you allow him to take towers. That's super anti-fun if he's going to be a brick wall that heals until your tower is dead.

DaetnasSep 5, 20151 votes

That's a bit disappointing to be honest. I think we already have far enough splitpushers as it is but I always thought the minionmancer concept hasn't been explored that well yet; I mean a champion whose damage mainly comes from the units he controls not his abilities/attacks.

His spells could just be supportive spells with low damage that buy time for his ghouls to get to the enemy or literally throw his ghouls in the enemy's face.

Juggernaut would probably still be a good fit, as he'd need time to cast all his spells required to summon his little horde of minions and then get to the enemy with them.

Maybe even a reworked version of his ult could stay, where he'd summon the omen of himself and resummon all the ghouls that died in the last 10 seconds, and maybe gain a movement speed bonus/damage reduction when leading the ghoul army towards an enemy champion.

Of course splitpusher and minionmancer are not mutually exclusive (and they're a good fit) , but only mentioning ghouls in terms of splitpushing power feels like missing the point of Yorick.

Penta PenguinSep 5, 20151 votes

That honestly sounds really lame, I never saw Yorick as a split-pusher siege champion

VenowolfSep 6, 20152 votes

I think so that Olaf, Shyvanna and Yorick can be good juggernauts, low mobility and great damage but each one of them specialized in different "areas", "categories" and have more "uniquess".

Olaf can be the counter-engage Berseker juggernaut, (if the enemy team start the fight with a strong CC, he can free and "counter-engage" so he need to be strong agains hard engage) he need to be the champ that turn more strong when is near to dead (Malmortius and Sterak can be now some of his main items), these two characteristics need to be his main "strenghtness": anti-cc and berseker. And in the "weakness" department he has: is very kitteable, and don't have AoE, low mobility etc. So Riot need to make more stronger and weaker his "strenghtness" and "weakness", and also give him more "uniquess" in his kit, some things that make him feel more like a Berseker, for example that gains "X" stats when enters in a fight and increase with the duration of Olaf in fight, because he loves fight, and also turn more and more stronger when he is fighting and is very nearly to death too. A new passive that give him stats depend of the amount of time that he is in a fight. Now I think that his E turn more stronger when he is weak (missing health part damage portion). and with these two changes he make more clearly his identity, move his actual passive to his W, and remove the atk spd steroid on his kit. So he keeps Strong 1 vs 1 but weak in AoE fights, have a solid counter-engage juggernaut thematic.

Shyvanna has more problems in the "uniquess" of her kit, because jas a low mobility but she is good in a lot of things and not have a real wealness right now, so Riot need to do somthing that make her feel moew unique and offer to the game, new things.

ZeracanuleSep 25, 20151 votes

Did it get ice boxed because Xelnath got sacked after Riot realized letting him rework Xerath was a horrible idea.... I really had high hopes for rework, followed it every day, every hour, every update. When Morgageddon was brought in (and hired) saying that he'd played a version where the ultimate was a mana draining Locus of Power I was thinking, holy damn, this is going to be a great rework, I'd still be able to enjoy my main. As the posts came in and the fact that there would be no manner of root, and V.5 showed up on PBE I was like, okay, I guess this is fun, but... just, not Xerath. You know who it felt like i was playing, Velkoz..... It felt like Xerath's rework was basically a warm up to making Velkoz. So anyways, I figured okay, maybe V.6 or V.7+ will potentially revert back to being a Locus of Power variation. Maybe Riot will let actual players try and test out the version of Xerath that had actually been spoken up. Then we're on V.9, and it's just fixing up problems with making the E not having an odd slow start with a wind-up to be fast, or adjusting how W actually works, and the numbers on his passive (such as removing the free % magic penetration that QWE were given). And then.... I'm realizing... welp... I guess I won't be able to play ranked next season, or ever again well. And so then it was just a gradual downfall as I stopped caring about even normal 5v5 league of legends, and the only thing that mattered to me was just the stupid fast fun games of ARAM. ARAM ARAM ARAM ARAM and a bit of dominion when my friend got me too. AND THEN that bestfriend of mine who I really enjoyed playing League with is like bro, I can't play League with you if you're going to be like this. And I'm like I'm sorry dude, but I just really get tired of blazing away the day doing nothing with my life but playing bloody aram as I really rather did enjoy the few times of playing ranked, but hey whats the point in playing ranked if the hero I enjoy doing it with will be completely changed, maybe I'll just play the only successful fun rework that is Heimerdinger. And so eventually that friend and I because distanced because he said that the person who I had become "was just a character I was playing as" which was something I obviously knew, and avoided thinking about, because the very character I live my life as is avoiding thinking about anything. So that's the story of how Riot reworking Xerath was in part the catalyst to my life going to shit. If Riot had never suggested the rework then over the summer of 2013 when I reached Plat 2 in 2 months flat just playing a few ranked games a day, I would have spent more time trying to find people to play seriously with (and not eventually said fuck it to living with an elder sibling soberly) instead of obsessing over every when Xelnath would next post an update with actually specifications to rework plans.

D15tr4ct10nJan 8, 20162 votes

What about this year (2016) ;P*[slayer-jinx-wink]*

KingmakerJan 17, 20161 votes

I just want to say, Yorick is one of my favourite champs thematically speaking, so I'm insanely hyped to see him remade and fixed up, hopefully sooner rather than later now that Poppy and Shen have been done.

And the Shakespeare references - lots of Shakespeare pls :3

Godman873Sep 5, 20156 votes

Lets be honest here, Riot has removed Yorick from the Free week rotations, they have nerfed him into the ground and have publicly stated the hate Yorick's kit and find his entire design is antifun.... This is the closest any champion in league has become to outright deleted from the game and Riot just sits on him with the excuse of 'oh, he isn't fun to fight so we don't do anything with him'

And yet when the said they would rework him (two years ago now?) They have reworked so many other champions above him. By this point they may as well remove him from the champ select lobby.

Why is it characters like ashe and Mordekaiser (WHO NO ONE WANTED REWORKED) get reworks before the character kit Riot hates and has sentenced to 10 years in the dungeon? (This isn't the first time they just outright leave a champion into supernerf state either.)

Admit it Riot, if it weren't for all the flack you'd get for just removing Yorick all together you actually would.

(Sorry if I sound aggressive but honestly this is evelynn rework levels of stupidity)

EDIT: And you think Yorick would have been one of the BEST choices to be reworked into this new 'juggernaut' class that you're pushing for.

SteelflameSep 5, 20151 votes

Actually, Beta Jax WAS outright deleted. They fully removed him from League, and put him back in after he was reworked.

AaravosSep 5, 20152 votes

Who is Yorick? New champion?

WhislaSep 5, 20152 votes

Still dont want yorick to get touched at all. Hes my man, perfect the way he is.

WOWyMeSep 6, 20152 votes

item 3070 That day..... when my team was up against a fed Yorick.. made me remember Yorick Mori I had never faced that champ before my god.

SawsersSep 5, 20151 votes

so many juggernauts, next they'll be bringing in the hero juggernaut from dota

Auz the RipperSep 5, 20152 votes

Juggernaut isn't actually a juggernaut though.

SawsersSep 5, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Auz the Ripper,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hOynE5hj,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-09-05T16:22:18.751+0000)

Juggernaut isn't actually a juggernaut though.

As hard to kill as a juggernaut though

OddshotSep 6, 20151 votes

Wouldnt surprise me if he ends up like Mordekaiser. Another melee adc with pets...pls no.

Meep ManSep 25, 20151 votes

I hope they picked up where Xelnath left off. His kits were overall heading in the right direction.

d4rkshockJan 24, 20161 votes

He lacks counter play but is a completely useless champion after the lanning phase. Yes he needs it. Durring s3, he got nerfed by a stellar level (I started in preseason 5 so don't judge me but my friend is s3).

ryancupFeb 7, 20161 votes

So... now that poppy and xerath has been reworked, is yorick coming up soon?

Fizz In My AnnieFeb 26, 20161 votes

So far even riot has not remembered yorick moree

Black Hollow Feb 27, 20161 votes

Ive been playing yorick since his release, i might have over 5000 games played with him over the years. (way more than that.) Mianly because i ddint enjoy being a part of playing the champions that have dashes, or built in armor pen, or attack speed steroids, or ridiculous amounts of cc. His actual main issue is that he has no hard cc. other champions that do seem to have a higher win rate because locking down an individual and doing that over and over seems to work well. Teams that revolve around this have the best teamfights as well. lokcing down your opponent and making sure they cant move or cast spells over the course of 2 seconds, with a gank from a jungler that has good cc (Vi, Udyr) just stack the stun right after the other has worn off and you have yourself a flash or a garunteed FB. Yoricks biggest weakness is solo queue because so many people forget his Zombie Form ULT and often run away or just sit there. its best if you just ult the adc or yourself and benifit from unholy covenants bonus for a much longer duration. Take attention from the enemy team, cast your skills and draw them into your team. If your team is smart enough or nice enough or arent cowardly they should SEE that you just took most of the enemies cooldowns and can counter attack. Like alistar Gaining about 20% dmg reduction with all minions including revenant, you should come out fine healing and with a boost of speed from your kit. find a nearby minion/jungle monster cast e heal and get back in the fight. Now riot hasnt made much changes to yorick i cant believe they hate him too much. They buffed him a bit by giving him a little range for his q which makes a ghoul shower combo easier to get off and the attack reset has never felt better. There are new items that came out this year like Black Cleaver for example that even his ghouls can apply. Another one i enjoy is Death Dance which grants his ghouls an on hit heal and buffs the E ghoul even more since the on hit heal is already its passive. Thorn mail and Sunfire cape are great as well, seeing how thinking of yoricks ghouls are "an aura of dmg" only if they successfully land hits which they do at least land one. The magic dmg from thornmail and sunfire make it like you have 5 ghouls instead of the 3, on top of that your ult and if you build ice born so enemies cant get away. and the new manamune is really nice too. now who uses that item more than anyone else? now yorick is strong but he can be countered by stuns since they prevent him from summoning, he also doesnt have a gap close. His movement speed isnt free either you have to land your auto attack first along with thee worst base attack speed in the game. meanwhile champions like garen and shyvanna have free movement speed buffs upon activation. This game is more than about who you pick to play. ive lost as jungle Vi going 18/2/14 simply because my team had no idea where to be or what to do. and junglers are always stingly about jungle gold UNLESS they are trying to finish devourer then ill understand. Not sure why people complain about wards when everyone starts off with free wards and it takes a fraction of a second to place. TOO many times have i seen people follow pro players in solo queue with like top graves or top quinn or something when you could just pick shen or darius and win the game. Give your team what it needs, instead of being a selfish showoff. Kills matter but to a point same with farming. if games can end potentially at 20 mins now why do they sometimes last for 40? why do master yis stay in the jungle and some udyrs never gank even after devourer has been built. too many people play this game and they either arent as good or just simply dont care or just wanna PVE. No one ever talks about the nexus. Anyways i do agree Yorick needs a rework, change his W to a knock up/slow. (thats not too op cho gath has it.) make his E a skill shot then if he misses no E ghoul/take away the heal and have it just deal damage or apply a DOT or reduce armor/make it a silence instead of a heal. Maybe when his shovel is glowing from his Q activation he can choose to devour one of his ghouls for NOT AN INSTANT HEAL but an over time heal. a HOT if you will, since its such an issue. maybe casting Q E ghouls once they are close together and if you aim W on top of them they become the BLIGHTED GHOULS THAT EXPLODE. Perhaps make is passive a leveling thing/reward. leveling like sunfire where he gains X dmg and X defense times his current level plus a bonus if he buries fallen champions. You guys know how champions dead bodies just sit there? Why cant he just bury them and gain a permanent effect for it like his job title says? There are so many different ways that riot can go about this. Ill be happy as long as hes a tank/fighter. i enjoy defending my mages and adc in teamfights. Denying kills feels better to me than getting kills. also why do tanks/bruisers like garen and darius get executions Rs? Even cho gath has that too and cho gath to me personally is far worse to face. pretty brainless champion too, and if you say "well you gotta aim his stuff and its not target cast." well guess what Those spells cover a lot of area and deal a lot of damage. Silence plus knock up plus slow?! HA talk about easy chow downs on yorick.

KiKer20Mar 27, 20161 votes

I personally find yorick one of the best self-sustained juggernauts in the game due to his ability to get heals and buffs from his ghouls . So it would be cool if he gets a rework that doesn't change his playstyle a lot. Rito pls hurry up .