CertainlyT left league btw

D357R0Y3R·Sep 17, 2019·49 votes·19,211 views

https://twitter.com/Spideraxe30/status/1173406113020227585?s=20

This surprised me, I guess the boards will burst in joy until they remember that he wasn't responsible for

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

132 Comments

SEKAISep 17, 201949 votes

It won't do anything. CertainlyT's piss stain design "philosophy" is already everywhere in this wretched game, not just from his own output but also many others who are "inspired" by him (by that I mean "so long I pretend to be CT v2.0, I can get away with any sleazy busted design under pretentious guise of "innovation" like he did because no one will want to admit that they were wrong since the beginning").

The sole reason he got shafted is entirely because Riot has already managed to find other broken "designers" to replace him and thus scapegoated him for a cheap PR victory.

It does just as well as removing an organ while in Stage 4 cancer; it does nothing. The damage is now a part of the game. Nothing will change that without a sweeping house cleaning, which will never happen.

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 201914 votes

which philosophy? he isn't the one who decides any philosophy, sometimes I wonder why I bother comming to the boards if $^*=- comments are going to get upvoted like that

CT at any point was never a design leader, he didn't decide any philosophy, and Riot always supported him if you want to be mad be mad at Riot for never stopping him from reworking/designing

they didn't, because CT brought them a lot of money

SEKAISep 18, 20195 votes

{quoted}

which philosophy? he isn't the one who decides any philosophy, sometimes I wonder why I bother comming to the boards if $^*=- comments are going to get upvoted like that

CT at any point was never a design leader, he didn't decide any philosophy, and Riot always supported him if you want to be mad be mad at Riot for never stopping him from reworking/designing

they didn't, because CT brought them a lot of money

By "design philosophy", I was obviously referring to his personal design logic (which has now been adopted by other designers, which my posts was specifically referring to), and not the game's as a whole.

TehNACHOSep 18, 20193 votes

Wow, very specific.

SEKAISep 18, 20193 votes

{quoted}

Wow, very specific.

Which part of my writing of "CertainlyT's piss stain design "philosophy"" doesn't specify that I'm talking about HIS design logic?

Which part of me dedicating almost the entire post to the permeation of CT's design logic through other designers' adoption and its related (negative) implications, including an analogy, not specific enough of the point of my post?

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20192 votes

a design philosophy is something that the entire design team follows, back during morello' and ghostcrawler's era it used to be "window of power" now with meddler it's "counterplay".

Certainlyt doesn't have a design philosophy, he never said himself "champions should be like this" in any of his post in the old forum, and he never led the design team

your statement made it look like ct had his rules and nobody stopped him, I corrected everything with my post because it was full of misleading informations, Riot decided themselves the design philosophy, and they allowed certainlyt to design what he wanted.

SEKAISep 18, 20194 votes

{quoted}

a design philosophy is something that the entire design team follows, back during morello' and ghostcrawler's era it used to be "window of power" now with meddler it's "counterplay".

Certainlyt doesn't have a design philosophy, he never said himself "champions should be like this" in any of his post in the old forum, and he never led the design team

your statement made it look like ct had his rules and nobody stopped him, I corrected everything with my post because it was full of misleading informations, Riot decided themselves the design philosophy, and they allowed certainlyt to design what he wanted.

What? Since when you need to be a lead designer to have a god damn design philosophy?

Designers are not god damn machines there to put on screws. They are hired precisely because they are supposed to have their own input and way about doing things. And indeed, different designers have different mordis operandi and beliefs regarding elements in the game, which will be expressed through their creation. That's their design philosophy.

They may have to work under a larger scope confined by the vision of the lead designers, but it doesn't change the fact they as designers, have the ability to create and influence designs of their own volition so long they are within the scope. And how they do about it would be mostly up to their own. It's quite literally their job. Have you been in any design position or know someone who is in any design position? You don't just sit there and do what you're told, you know?

For Christ's sake, CertainlyT even had an interview where it's dedicated to him discussing his design rationale and philosophy. I'm sorry, did I say "an"? Because it happened at least twice that I am aware of (a long time ago he was filmed discussing on how he designed Thresh, which imho was hilarious because he just copied Blitz but whatever; and then there's the more recent one where he openly discussed his design philosophy). But sure, he doesn't have a design philosophy.

It's like saying no musicians have artistic philosophy unless they're the manager. Yeah of fucking course that's the case.

Umm hmm.

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20194 votes

{quoted}

For Christ's sake, CertainlyT even had an interview where it's dedicated to him discussing his design rationale and philosophy.

I'm not aware of that, all I'm aware of is that riot has a design leader, and this leader decides the direction league's design takes, if you're not aware of that yourself then you might be from now on. Riot worked like that, and since CT's champions had windows of power they were allowed by Riot, and CT also made massive money to Riot so why would they ever stop him from designing champions, even if people hated CT they didn't leave the game due to that

And try to think why other designers were "inspired" by him, why would you follow a designer who created champions who have massive playerbase around them like Yasuo? If you do that you would get success, AND people won't hate you because they don't know your name if you don't interact with the playerbase like CT. Really can't see why

SEKAISep 18, 20192 votes

{quoted}

I'm not aware of that, all I'm aware of is that riot has a design leader, and this leader decides the direction league's design takes, if you're not aware of that yourself then you might be from now on. Riot worked like that, and since CT's champions had windows of power they were allowed by Riot, and CT also made massive money to Riot so why would they ever stop him from designing champions, even if people hated CT they didn't leave the game due to that

And try to think why other designers were "inspired" by him, why would you follow a designer who created champions who have massive playerbase around them like Yasuo? If you do that you would get success, AND people won't hate you because they don't know your name if you don't interact with the playerbase like CT

Now you're doing an 180 and suddenly change your argument to "CT is good because he has good design vision"? Whatever happened to your previous claim just then that say CT doesn't have design philosophy?

Even then, do you even know how design philosophy works ffs. For instance, I worked briefly in a R&D of an audio equipment company. One of the designers have a tendency to try and fit as much component onto the same side of the IC as he humanly can, because he believes it is neater. It's within the larger scope so he's fully entitled to exercise his design capability in ways he believes is best for the product. That is how design philosophy works. It does NOT require a managerial position to decide everything; if that's the case, they wouldn't need god damn designers.

..........

Using sunk cost fallacy to justify CT not being so bad is a terrible argument. Most people don't leave the game not because they can tolerate CT, but because of sunk cost fallacy.

CT's designs are also equally hated as they are loved. Because the world is not in shortage of edgelords who want to play broken shit and feel good about themselves. CT provides the outlet for that by having the license to shitting out broken champions one after another.

As I've mentioned in my first post, CT is eventually shafted because Riot has new toys to play with now, seeing there are others who take notes from CT and now produce even more broken shit. So Riot just probably scapegoated CT to try and get some PR off the goons who don't know any better or don't really care to know any better, and those are the majority of the playerbase.

The design scene of League is now just a bunch of philosophically broken designers fucking with each other in a rat race to produce the next big broken bullshit that will take the game by a shitstorm. No thanks to CT opening the age of enlightenment showing them that you can get away with busted design so long you can use fancy words to sell them.

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20193 votes

{quoted}

Now you're doing an 180 and suddenly change your argument to "CT is good because he has good design vision"? Whatever happened to your previous claim just then that say CT doesn't have design philosophy?

No...? please don't make it harder for me already All I said is that CT's champions in the past fit with Riot's design philosophy of "window of power" so they allowed him to make the champions, CT himself never had NEITHER DESIGN PHILOSOPHY OR DESIGN VISION

all he did on his own, was trying to create things that never happened before

it wasn't a philisophy, he wasn't encouraging anyone, he wasn't saying "designers should do it like this" he ONLY said "I want to do it like this", that's not a philosophy brother, a philosophy is a thought on how people should generally behave.

SEKAISep 18, 20195 votes

[deleted]

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20193 votes

You can't just go around and tell people that what a designer seeks = philosophy

a philosophy is a general idea of behavior that everyone should follow, you can find that on google. when you say "design philosophy", I said it at minute 1 that it means something every designer should follow CT didn't say anything about that the only thing I remember him saying is that he wants to innovate and create things people never created, that's not a philosophy, that's his own design

he didn't say "designers at riot should create new things", and neither did anyone at riot, the only philosophy they had was "designers should design champions with window of power"

[zombie-brand-clap]

SEKAISep 18, 20194 votes

{quoted}

You can't just go around and tell people that what a designer seeks = philosophy

a philosophy is a general idea of behavior that everyone should follow, you can find that on google. when you say "design philosophy", I said it at minute 1 that it means something every designer should follow CT didn't say anything about that the only thing I remember him saying is that he wants to innovate and create things people never created, that's not a philosophy, that's his own design

he didn't say "designers at riot should create new things", and neither did anyone at riot, the only philosophy they had was "designers should design champions with window of power"

[zombie-brand-clap]

That moment when you have to entirely argue on petty semantics when everyone knows what precisely we're talking about; and the term "design philosophy" is not even used wrong by me nor even a term you think it is in the first place. And of course, you have to immediately follow it up by praising CT's design rationale while simultaneously denying it is a design philosophy.

If you want to win so much. Have it. I don't give a shit about this petty "victory" that you have to fight so dirty for.

Tuu tuu! Congratulation. You won an argument by using textbook sucker punch. Have a good one for yourself.

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20193 votes

{quoted}

That moment when you have to entirely argue on petty semantics when everyone knows what precisely we're talking about;

No they don't, and Yes I'm arguing about semantics wtf made you think that I wasn't?

Since the very first post I told you the only one who have philosophies are Riot, no other designer bothered saying "I think designing a champion should be with this rule, this rule, and this rule" CT just said "I want to do new things" he didn't say that designing a champion should follow a certain rule, he never created a philosophy because it wasn't his job, and no designer has this job except morello/meddler/repertoir, there is only one design leader at riot

idk what you thought I was talking about, I told you that the way you make it looks like, it seems that to you CT decides things at riot if you talk about philosophy

TehNACHOSep 18, 20197 votes

Look, here's what you sound like:

"God has a plan" "What's the plan?" "His plan"

"CT has a design philosophy" "What's the design philosophy" "His design philosophy, and it's bad"

That's all you've said. You know a common design theme in CT's champions? Random stat multipliers. That's a specific example. Use those to bolster your argument instead of screaming how toxic to the game or whatever CT's "Design Philosophy" is, perhaps without using the words CT, Design, or Philosophy. I promise it's a lot more convincing than just getting mad at the issue (okay, it's the Boards, being mad is more effective than being literate when it comes to getting upvotes, but still)

SEKAISep 18, 20194 votes

{quoted}

Look, here's what you sound like:

"God has a plan" "What's the plan?" "His plan"

Or

"CT has a design philosophy" "What's the design philosophy" "His design philosophy, and it's bad"

That's all you've said. You know a common design theme in CT's champions? Random stat multipliers. That's a specific example. Use those to bolster your argument instead of screaming how toxic to the game or whatever CT's "Design Philosophy" is, perhaps without using the words CT, Design, or Philosophy. I promise it's a lot more convincing than just getting mad at the issue (okay, it's the Boards, being mad is more effective than being literate when it comes to getting upvotes, but still)

I've been bitching about CT for years and going into details on his design philosophy and its problems, IN THREAD WHERE THAT MATTERS.

This thread doesn't concern about that, my posts don't concern about that, so why am I obligated to go into details on something even I just mentioned it as a background information?

If you want me to mention some examples, fine. CT is the most influential figure in legitimatising feature overloading in League, the dreaded fake conditioning, and is a long time plagiarist who builds champs by copying existing champs and then shit out a bastardised version of them tacked with the 1 gimmick CT has in mind. It's not even news, it's common knowledge by now. Happy?

TehNACHOSep 18, 20194 votes

No, you used the words CT, Design, and Philosophy.

MiracleMorg94Sep 17, 201920 votes

I really hope whoever made this stupid POS Pyke never makes anymore. What an abomination that was created to cater to the whiny kids who don't like playing support because they don't do damage.

I used to be a major Zed hater but Pyke tops the list now.

Unstoppable MonkSep 17, 20194 votes

It's not a bad concept, but completely overloaded while doing mental gymnastics to make it appear overly easy to do yet claim skill--- exactly like Zed but worse.

USG Street JimmySep 18, 20193 votes

lol ive always said the same thing.. exactly like zed, but fucking worse.

hes basically zed.. as a support. with more teamfight pressure, easier ult, tons more cc.. and somehow tied together with what was it? the first or second highest defensive base stats in the entire fucking game WITH fucktons of regen, stealth, and mobility...

why.. just actually fucking why.. /turned into a rant/rant

KFCeytronSep 17, 201918 votes

So, he went from designing LoL champions to doing something for TFT, and now he's in R&D, which does... what, exactly?

D357R0Y3RSep 17, 20193 votes

quotting wikipedia "Research and development (R&D, R+D, or R'n'D), known in Europe as research and technological development (RTD), refers to innovative activities undertaken by corporations or governments in developing new services or products, or improving existing services or products."

not sure if it's right or not

CertainlyT also used to be in a team instructed to exchange feedbacks with players back in 2012/2014 idk if you were in the old forum but for instance :

https://i.gyazo.com/43de89907a46058f2a744a99a191fbee.png

this was written by him when he wanted to tell the community that Riot buffs as much as they nerf

KFCeytronSep 18, 20196 votes

{quoted}

quotting wikipedia "Research and development (R&D, R+D, or R'n'D), known in Europe as research and technological development (RTD), refers to innovative activities undertaken by corporations or governments in developing new services or products, or improving existing services or products."

not sure if it's right or not

CertainlyT also used to be in a team instructed to exchange feedbacks with players back in 2012/2014 idk if you were in the old forum but for instance :

https://i.gyazo.com/43de89907a46058f2a744a99a191fbee.png

this was written by him when he wanted to tell the community that Riot buffs as much as they nerf

I know what R&D means. You don't have to quote me a definition. I asked because champ design is basically already R&D, so it's not clear what the difference is between his old job and his new one.

InfernapeSep 18, 20191 votes

{quoted}

I know what R&D means. You don't have to quote me a definition. I asked because champ design is basically already R&D, so it's not clear what the difference is between his old job and his new one.

R&D in this case would be research and development on non LoL games. IE Riot's upcoming fighting game or an entirely new game.

crippler38Sep 18, 20192 votes

New league single player game since people say CT's champs are better in single player or co-op games when?

DalekZecSep 17, 201916 votes

Everybody knows that he's not responsible of these champs. But none of them are the biggest offenders compared to his champions.

And yeah, I'm pretty much super happy.

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20197 votes

no they don't, if you do then congratulation

and pyke isn't as offending as ct's champion?

lmfao

that being said do you know pyke's designer? because everyone makes pyke rent thread but never mentions endlesspillow who said that he likes mobile supports, he's the designer of rakan and pyke and he's going to create EVEN MORE cancer in the future

Exin0Sep 18, 20192 votes

{quoted}

no they don't, if you do then congratulation

and pyke isn't as offending as ct's champion?

lmfao

that being said do you know pyke's designer? because everyone makes pyke rent thread but never mentions endlesspillow who said that he likes mobile supports, he's the designer of rakan and pyke and he's going to create EVEN MORE cancer in the future

I think hate for CT is unfounded, his designs arent bad per se but its balance team responsibility to put them into context of game and they failed and big culprit is hastening of game. His design big flashy effective moves but these are not kept in check by CD, game phases, game length, etc. anymore and also there is someone who is approving this designs, balance changes and implementation.

Romans VI XXIIISep 18, 20192 votes

Hard to balance completely overloaded kits with #s, and that's all the balance team has permition to do, it's not like they can do mini reworks when ever they wont.

crippler38Sep 18, 20192 votes

Rakan's great though, maybe not super balanced but have you SEEN his cloak?

Zero ShingetsuSep 17, 20198 votes

... Who?

D357R0Y3RSep 17, 201914 votes

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

Zero ShingetsuSep 17, 20192 votes

{quoted}

[zombie-brand-facepalm]

Well forgive me, Green Firehead, if Riot Games hasn't proven a productive enough company for me to learn every single net handle of every single employee over its decade-long lifespan... It might be easier if we ever saw their actual names, but they just have to be too cool for that.

D357R0Y3RSep 17, 20198 votes

He's literally the only one the boards know, because a long time ago he used to interact with players people remembered his name because they hate the champions he made

this is why while people hate Pyke, Yuumi, Ornn, Sylas, or champions like that they never know who made them but if you ask them "who is CertainlyT" they will immediatly give you a list of the champion he made

Zero ShingetsuSep 17, 20191 votes

{quoted}

He's literally the only one the boards know, because a long time ago he used to interact with players people remembered his name because they hate the champions he made

this is why while people hate Pyke, Yuumi, Ornn, Sylas, or champions like that they never know who made them but if you ask them "who is CertainlyT" they will immediatly give you a list of the champion he made

Ahh, I see. I didn't really get on the boards much back then.

Malix FarwinSep 18, 20194 votes

[{quoted}](name=Zero Shingetsu,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hJmRBsZH,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-09-17T18:59:54.370+0000)

Ahh, I see. I didn't really get on the boards much back then.

He has Ghostcrawler syndrome where since he actually spoke with the community he gets crapped on.

The thigh guySep 17, 20194 votes

{quoted}

He's literally the only one the boards know, because a long time ago he used to interact with players people remembered his name because they hate the champions he made

this is why while people hate Pyke, Yuumi, Ornn, Sylas, or champions like that they never know who made them but if you ask them "who is CertainlyT" they will immediatly give you a list of the champion he made

Because the champions he has made have all been incredibly cancerous to a obnoxious degree.

I’d deal with any of those champions over akali.

Minimac2000Sep 18, 20191 votes

{quoted}

He's literally the only one the boards know, because a long time ago he used to interact with players people remembered his name because they hate the champions he made

this is why while people hate Pyke, Yuumi, Ornn, Sylas, or champions like that they never know who made them but if you ask them "who is CertainlyT" they will immediatly give you a list of the champion he made

People hate ornn? Give me a free ornn lane any day! Its like a lane against poppy or shen. You literally can't lose. Especially if you don't die to a jg gank b4 you hit 6. I also think malphite is an easy lane tho, so meh

D357R0Y3RSep 18, 20192 votes

yea I mean ofc people won't hate Ornn after that Riot broke his two legs, but try to remember the early 2018 era where Ornn outdueled a juggernaut, they nerfed ornn so much and so hard it doesn't surprise me that they don't hate him anymore.

MiracleMorg94Sep 17, 201919 votes

The creator of the ever popular shitty POS called Yasuo, among many others.

SweedishGunnerSep 17, 20193 votes

He also did the Akali rework...that has had about 50 different mechanics removed and she's STILL being picked.

Malix FarwinSep 18, 20195 votes

{quoted}

He also did the Akali rework...that has had about 50 different mechanics removed and she's STILL being picked.

Did he do the most banned champion in the game right now? does anyone care? Thats the point. You only care because you know who the developer is.

SweedishGunnerSep 18, 20193 votes

No I care because a man that has no idea about enemy player agency was allowed to keep designing champions.

Malix FarwinSep 18, 20192 votes

{quoted}

No I care because a man that has no idea about enemy player agency was allowed to keep designing champions.

Hmm like the people who reworked Irelia Aatrox

Like the people who made Pyke Kaisa Yuumi

None of which were designed by CT.

The point i am trying to make here is that its a Riot Issue as a whole not just one developer. You are only singling him out because he is the only developer you really know all the champions they made(i mean theres even people who think he helped design Zed when all he did was bugfixes).

preternaturalSep 17, 20197 votes

oh cT is making the fighting game now. ok i'm cool with this.

BrokenRayquazaSep 18, 20193 votes

Man I'ma miss him. I know a lot of people don't like him because his champions are usually overloaded at the beginning and are unfun to play against (at least for a while) but we all have to admit they are fun if problematic. And most people don't even remember his less chaotic creations like Caitlyn Darius and I think a part of Warwick . They only remember Yasuo Zoe Akali

NelsieLisnenSep 18, 20193 votes

Unpopular opinion incoming. I'm sad. I hope he gets back on the creative rudder of a new champ or rework later on. T has overseen some of my favorite champs, my unholy trinity of Zed, Zoe and Yasuo.

Sinister AnubisSep 18, 20192 votes

{quoted}

https://twitter.com/Spideraxe30/status/1173406113020227585?s=20

This surprised me, I guess the boards will burst in joy until they remember that he wasn't responsible for

[slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

Dont forget he was part of the Mordekaiser Akali reworks and you can't forget Zoe either

Malix FarwinSep 18, 20195 votes

[{quoted}](name=Ninja Anubis,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hJmRBsZH,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-09-18T02:42:50.747+0000)

Dont forget he was part of the reworks and you can't forget either

most people who complain about Zoe are just doing it to farm upvotes these days, her ban rate is actually quite low. Aside from Yasuo which is a legitimate complaint most of his other champions are actually less problematic then most recent champions are. The only difference is you know every champion CT releases because its a fixation at this point. Pyke for example is much worse than every champion you mentioned but you probably couldnt tell me who made Pyke without looking it up.