Three things to know when there's a katarina on your team.

Zerenza · 2017-03-20T21:58:52.227Z

She isn't a tank, she isn't a fighter, she's an assassin, she is squishier than an ADC for most of the game and dies really easily when she's camped or alone.(by this i mean she only brings damage to teamfights, just like an ADC which means she needs someone to tank for her, and CC for her. If she doesn't have that, she's the same as telling your squishy jinx to go 1v5, regardless of how fed she is, she'll probably die) She isn't meant to engage for you, not on a 5v5 teamfight, it's not her job, she'll just die and do nothing, then you'll flame her for feeding or split pushing when you haven't been trying to help her. She's a teamfight assassin, if she doesn't have a team, she's nothing. For the love of all that is holy, pick someone with engage, anyone, katarina cannot engage for you, she can't keep going in alone because she'll keep feeding, you need to engage for her so she can finish the fight quickly. ~Your neighborhood Katarina main who can't win a game right now because no one wants to engage.

MarshbouyMar 20, 20172 votes

^

WeissritterMar 21, 201716 votes

See I am okay with this logic until I get a full team of useless carries with no cc lol

NineTailedMysticMar 21, 20175 votes

Same. Had a team comp whose hard CC consisted of Charm and Fling. When the enemy team second picked Yi. And also picked Kog Maw and Fizz. Not enough CC.

DuskDaUmbreonMar 21, 20171 votes

Part of your problem was also 2 assassins and 1 tank. And no utility. That's less CC and more nobody to keep the team alive.

NineTailedMysticMar 21, 20172 votes

My team was Ahri, Mundo, Singed, Lucian and Soraka. I don't see any primary Assassins there. I also only see one Assassin on the enemy team of Yi, Graves, Fizz, Kogmaw, and and Janna. In teamfights, we could only pick one of the three to kill while the other two ran rampant.

Spicy RiceMar 21, 20173 votes

The way you phrased it made it seem as though your team picked ahri, singed, yi, kog and fizz

NineTailedMysticMar 21, 20171 votes

Fixed.

DuskDaUmbreonMar 21, 20171 votes

Oh. ENEMY team picked Fizz. That makes far more sense. So you have Soraka as utility. That's it. You need a bit more than that. However, you've got everything else down. I'd like to mention that Raka's E is hard CC, as well (interrupts all channels, has a silence, AoE, damage, and snare).

And Ahri's basically an assassin, just like LeBlanc. Even if she's a primary mage, she's still basically an assassin. Just an assassin that tends to suck against assassins.

Well. A lack of CC wouldn't have been your primary issue. Singed and Raka both have hard and soft CC, Ahri has hard, Mundo has soft. Their team only had Janna with hard CC, Kog has soft, Grave's smokescreen is just an annoyance, Fizz might have a slow (I honestly just avoid almost everything of his, so I don't find out), and Yi has no CC at all. Your team had more CC, and had actual tanks. All you had to do was lock Fizz down, use exhaust on Yi, slow and kill Kog, kill Yi, Fizz (if he's not already dead), Janna, then Graves. Against that team, one Thornmail would have saved you from 3 of them easily.

And Ahri wouldn't have been stopped by anyone, since they would have had no tank, so she should have been able to carry the game.

Then again, I'm only bronze, so maybe I'm missing something. But it seems, to me, that would have worked. But I also had no idea about any of the scores. So maybe I'm wrong. But you didn't need to CC their entire team at once, only the biggest threat at the time.

If the Ahri had stayed back, harassing with Q, until Fizz dove in (in which case, she should delete him), then focused on Kog (or Yi, depending on if he's already ulted or not), then systematically eliminated everyone. Graves would have been her biggest problem after their burst (Yi and Fizz, specifically. Yes, I count Yi as burst. He's like an auto-attacking assassin, basically) died, assuming nobody on their team was fed, since Graves would have been most of their tank (except for maybe a lifesteal-heavy Yi, if you count that), but Singed and Lucian would have been enough for him.

NineTailedMysticMar 21, 20171 votes

That's assuming equal gold. My Mundo tower dove the Fizz at level 3. when Fizz had E and summoners up. Yes, Mundo died. And then was useless all game.

Meanwhile the Yi was hyperfed. The CC was an issue because we had to pick between Yi, Fizz, or Kog to lockdown and kill. Fizz was the worst choice, he was awful, but he's still Fizz and can throw heat seeking sharks. So that left Yi or Kog and we could only kill one reliably, while the other destroyed everyone. It didn't help that Mundo, Soraka and Singed fed their asses off, whereas Lucian and I were the only saving grace, but we still can't win against a fed Yi and Kog with just the two of us, let alone a Fizz thrown in the mix.

ZerenzaMar 21, 20171 votes

See i only adjust my pick when i'm top, if i'm mid fuck that a team usually has two carries, or should but ya know, meta. And your midlaner is usually your second carry, its the easiest place to get fed from, but if you don't help them get fed like you do your ADC they won't get fed and might fall behind.

JuhnChanMar 21, 20171 votes

Top Tryndamere 6/5/0 Jungle MasterYi 1/11/1 Mid Leblanc 2/7/3 ADC Jinx 2/9/5 Support 8/8/0

item 3070

UnvictusMar 21, 20171 votes

I wouldn't say it's just with kat. Soloq often leaves people with the mentality that they have to be the one who carries the game, which ends up leaving team comps with no tank or reliable front line. People are too tunneled on carrying that they fail to really strategize and observe during champ select and say "my team doesn't have a frontline" maybe I should pick a tank. Now I understand that people have their comfort picks, and skill and experience on a champ weigh in heavily, but there comes a point where you have to figure out where to draw the line. When you need to decide "hmm picking another squishy into that team might not be the best idea".

Big LincolnMar 21, 20171 votes

im playing juggernauts and i'm not changing for the sake of my """team"""

RavenMagusMar 21, 20172 votes

If you are never willing to change up picks to fit a teamcomp, then you have to accept the inevitable losses that can come from having a really bad teamcomp.

Of course, Juggernauts are actually pretty good at fitting into almost any comp.

StandgroundingMar 21, 20171 votes

Who said juggernaughts cant initiate? summoner 4 item 3142 item 3800 item 3742

SpoofghoulMar 21, 20171 votes

item 3069 juggernauts can make good use of it's stats and give their team a mini sivir ult

used to buy this on darius it's pretty strong option

AtanchanMar 21, 20171 votes

Most of them act more like divers than initiators, with more focus on damage than CC and single target over AoE.

Then again, death is the strongest CC, and the only thing squishier than the carries are sometimes the supports ...

StandgroundingMar 21, 20171 votes

Darius has tons of AoE and CC, and so does Cho Morde has tons of AoE, and so does Garen Nasus yeah, he might be lackluster in terms of AOE and CC, but he can soak CC well so your Kata can jump in and press R to win.

AtanchanMar 21, 20171 votes

Cho's more of a mage / juggernaut, I'd say, and Kat isn't one at all.

As far as Darius, Garen, and Morde, I guess they do have tons of AoE if you only play assassins and Urgot and Darius has tons of CC if you've never seen a tank before. Morde and Darius do have a decent AoE, yeah, but Darius gets it from one ability while Morde's W mostly only gets to shine as an AoE ability vs. minion waves or an enemy team that just got caught by a Malphite ult. The same goes for Garen spin ... except that's his only AoE, meaning he's basically entirely single target unless his team or the enemy team lets him AoE it up.

And for CC ... Darius has a long-cooldown short-distance pull, and a one second slow. Unless you're agreeing with me that death is some really great CC, then I'm not seeing it. Skarner is really what I'd hold up as a CC-heavy juggernaut, since he actually has a kinda spammable stun and his pull, while single-target, can yank someone a loooooot farther. Still, he's only CC-heavy for a juggernaut, and that's kinda his niche in the role. Hell, he doesn't so much initiate as dive, then reverse-dive with someone in tow.

StandgroundingMar 22, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Cho's more of a mage / juggernaut, I'd say, and Kat isn't one at all.

You missed the point by a lot... I meant that juggernaughts CAN and SHOULD initiate for a Kat to follow up. One doesn't have to pick vanguard just for her.

As far as Darius, Garen, and Morde, I guess they do have tons of AoE if you only play assassins and Urgot and Darius has tons of CC if you've never seen a tank before. Morde and Darius do have a decent AoE, yeah, but Darius gets it from one ability while Morde's W mostly only gets to shine as an AoE ability vs. minion waves or an enemy team that just got caught by a Malphite ult. The same goes for Garen spin ... except that's his only AoE, meaning he's basically entirely single target unless his team or the enemy team lets him AoE it up.

And for CC ... Darius has a long-cooldown short-distance pull, and a one second slow. Unless you're agreeing with me that death is some really great CC, then I'm not seeing it. Skarner is really what I'd hold up as a CC-heavy juggernaut, since he actually has a kinda spammable stun and his pull, while single-target, can yank someone a loooooot farther. Still, he's only CC-heavy for a juggernaut, and that's kinda his niche in the role. Hell, he doesn't so much initiate as dive, then reverse-dive with someone in tow.

Focus will be drawn on juggernaughts like Garen, or CC juggs like Darius can easily set up a Katarina ult with his E.

AtanchanMar 22, 20171 votes

Well, yeah, but that's still more akin to what divers do than what initiators do. You don't have any of those guys launching a big CC ability that can then be chained into other big CC abilities while your damage dealers tear into the enemy team - these guys just generate so much threat through their damage alone that they generate a high amount of psychological threat.

StandgroundingMar 23, 20171 votes

Psychological threat is also CC, you know :D

But Darius E or Cho's Q can set up a Kata R very well, even better with Morg support so she can shield her

ZerenzaMar 21, 20171 votes

That's why my champion pool consists of 4 champions, i'm comfortable with them and while two of them such as Illaoi and Katarina have 0 CC and bring only damage the other two Yorick and Ekko have a lot of teamifght potential along with the carry potential they bring so it helps.

MelledoneusMar 21, 20171 votes

I usually alternate my top picks based on my team. If we have few tanks or a hyper carry, Shen. If we need hard engage and we have an aggressive team, Sion. If we need someone to stop those pesky Rengars, Kha'Zixes, or Rivens, Poppy. If we have 0 AP damage and we have CC, Vladimir.

If the enemy top laner picks Riven, I can't help feeling the power rush to my head as I lock in Shen.

Big LincolnMar 21, 20171 votes

that's nice

im playing juggernauts

MelledoneusMar 21, 20171 votes

Yorick is my favorite juggernaut by far.