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New Jungle is TERRIBLE

Guy Fox Teemo··2 votes·1,158 views

The new jungle is ridiculous if you aren't a sustain jungler , then your going to almost 100% guranteed to do terrible the new jungle is WAY to difficult to clear.. You get taken to 10% heatlh on almost every jungle camp in the first 5 lvls. The only viable jungle item now isitem 3713 since you are extremlly reliant on smite now or you'll die to jungle mobs. And since you get so low when fighting hte jungle mobs if you aren't a sustain jungler your forced to back. Which means no ganks and since you backed thats time you wasted on not farming or ganking which means less exp, which results and being behind if you dont just sit in the jungle and farm. Which then again means no ganks. At all. THe new jungle focus's on surviving, waiting for drag, clear it, go back to farming until 20mins which makes it very boring and the new jungle doesn't even give more EXP when its harder to clear and it takes double the amount of time to respawn then it did before.... The new jungle items also give you about no sustain at all. Fix it riot.

Discuss?

11 Comments

Seraphic Gospel3 votes

I don't disagree. The new jungle is pretty damn difficult and certain champs which used to be at home in it are now kinda screwed. I just played a few rounds with Rengar and the new jungle is REALLY difficult for him.

In the next update, please look at the following: I. Reducing the damage of non buff camps (Wolves / Razorbeaks / Krugs / Gromp) II. Doing something about the pacing of the whole thing. As a non sustain jungler, it is ridiculous that I now do 3 camps and have to go back. III. If you want to keep current jungle HP and damage, at least buff the exp and gold from the camps. In the previous iterations of the jungle, the purpose was to give at least as much exp as the duo lane and for carry junglers to be viable. Currently, that just isn't the case.

But yes, the new jungle is way too brutal. I can't even play my previous standbys (Rengar, Kha) in it, and I wonder how other, slightly tankier / non sustain types (Sejuani, Jarvan IV) are holding up.

Zeliwin1 votes

Only thing that I don't like about the New Jungle, that if you leave it to try to gank and it fails. You almost now 2 levels behind... So hard to catch up. Gives almost no gold, and very little experience.

Leti the Yeti1 votes

i played rammus just fine and he has no sustain wutsoever

as person below me mentioned, this is wh i play junglers with strong ganks.... *cough warwick and rammus n others

Long Dong Wukong1 votes

Well first of all the best path is basically Gromp/Rockbros, buff, camp, camp, recall(buy jungle item + pots) buff camp. This is what you have to do if you aren't a heavy sustain champion. Weak sustain like Kha'Zix still has to recall. If you don't get a very nice leash, you don't get to do the third camp either, but you'll still have enough money for the item and pots.

What's annoying is that this patch seems basically like a jungle nerf veiled as a map update. No one else really gets affected, but then as a jungler you have much less impact on the game(because you can't do anything) and you make significantly less gold. Dragon doesn't give gold and hurts too much to take at any point early game unless you can cheese it with Panth shield or something. You can kill their jungler and ADC, and all three of you can have half health at 10 minutes, but the dragon will kill all of you, and it's not even really worth the buff to begin with until 30+ minutes.

Baron doesn't matter at all. It's pointless.

I've been doing fine in this jungle once I figured out what the fuck it wanted from me, but that doesn't mean that it's fun. It's pretty not fun, as a matter of fact. The game feels like DotA Lite in its pacing now, slow as fuck as almost boring, and that's why I can't stand playing DotA in the first place. It's boring as fuck and puts me to sleep. So if this game is going to either be "pick hyper sustain or spend 20 minutes wishing there was something to do on the map" then fuck it, honestly.

JevelFaithful1 votes

What's annoying is that this patch seems basically like a jungle nerf veiled as a map update. No one else really gets affected, but then as a jungler you have much less impact on the game(because you can't do anything) and you make significantly less gold. Dragon doesn't give gold and hurts too much to take at any point early game unless you can cheese it with Panth shield or something. You can kill their jungler and ADC, and all three of you can have half health at 10 minutes, but the dragon will kill all of you, and it's not even really worth the buff to begin with until 30+ minutes.

Baron doesn't matter at all. It's pointless.

I've been doing fine in this jungle once I figured out what the fuck it wanted from me, but that doesn't mean that it's fun. It's pretty not fun, as a matter of fact. The game feels like DotA Lite in its pacing now, slow as fuck as almost boring, and that's why I can't stand playing DotA in the first place. It's boring as fuck and puts me to sleep. So if this game is going to either be "pick hyper sustain or spend 20 minutes wishing there was something to do on the map" then fuck it, honestly.

I'm mostly replying to the bolded part

It's a change of pacing for jungle, kinda like suports and wards got a change of pacing (albeit in the oposite direction) last season.Maybe it's a matter of adaptation, I know I personally prefer a map where ganks aren't 80% of what I do. In riot's defence, this season they were aiming at jungle specifically. I'll draw the parallel again with last season : most lane didn't really feel anything, but supporting is WAY different now. Other lanes just lost their potential Gp5 item, top got a 2v2 fad before Targon was nerfed and mages/tank now have possibly 1 new niche utility items they can get out of the support item pool.

The new map is the new map, jungle changes are preseason 5 rolling in. Honnestl,y I'd say give it a bit of time untill the new jungle is figured out and riot will drop the difficulty. If they wanted to make things change, they had to slightly overtune the new jungle to force people out of their old jungle mentality.

Zeliwin1 votes

What's annoying is that this patch seems basically like a jungle nerf veiled as a map update. No one else really gets affected, but then as a jungler you have much less impact on the game(because you can't do anything) and you make significantly less gold. Dragon doesn't give gold and hurts too much to take at any point early game unless you can cheese it with Panth shield or something. You can kill their jungler and ADC, and all three of you can have half health at 10 minutes, but the dragon will kill all of you, and it's not even really worth the buff to begin with until 30+ minutes.

Baron doesn't matter at all. It's pointless.

I've been doing fine in this jungle once I figured out what the fuck it wanted from me, but that doesn't mean that it's fun. It's pretty not fun, as a matter of fact. The game feels like DotA Lite in its pacing now, slow as fuck as almost boring, and that's why I can't stand playing DotA in the first place. It's boring as fuck and puts me to sleep. So if this game is going to either be "pick hyper sustain or spend 20 minutes wishing there was something to do on the map" then fuck it, honestly.

I'm mostly replying to the bolded part

It's a change of pacing for jungle, kinda like suports and wards got a change of pacing (albeit in the oposite direction) last season.Maybe it's a matter of adaptation, I know I personally prefer a map where ganks aren't 80% of what I do. In riot's defence, this season they were aiming at jungle specifically. I'll draw the parallel again with last season : most lane didn't really feel anything, but supporting is WAY different now. Other lanes just lost their potential Gp5 item, top got a 2v2 fad before Targon was nerfed and mages/tank now have possibly 1 new niche utility items they can get out of the support item pool.

The new map is the new map, jungle changes are preseason 5 rolling in. Honnestl,y I'd say give it a bit of time untill the new jungle is figured out and riot will drop the difficulty. If they wanted to make things change, they had to slightly overtune the new jungle to force people out of their old jungle mentality.

Problem is, new jungle is such a burden now. It offers A LOT less gold and EXPERIENCE then it did. If I literally Leave jungle to gank a lane I am falling a full level behind of everyone else. but if you don't get a successful gank then you are REALLY behind in gold. I struggle to finish the jungle items. Gold is in ganks for a jungler, but not its 10x more difficult to pull off with all the Barrier/Flash/Heal.

Riot caters to the ADC Roles so much now, they are board line impossible to kill unless you have a Hard CC jungler or a CC filled team. Game is Boring, I'm waiting for something else.

JevelFaithful1 votes

What's annoying is that this patch seems basically like a jungle nerf veiled as a map update. No one else really gets affected, but then as a jungler you have much less impact on the game(because you can't do anything) and you make significantly less gold. Dragon doesn't give gold and hurts too much to take at any point early game unless you can cheese it with Panth shield or something. You can kill their jungler and ADC, and all three of you can have half health at 10 minutes, but the dragon will kill all of you, and it's not even really worth the buff to begin with until 30+ minutes.

Baron doesn't matter at all. It's pointless.

I've been doing fine in this jungle once I figured out what the fuck it wanted from me, but that doesn't mean that it's fun. It's pretty not fun, as a matter of fact. The game feels like DotA Lite in its pacing now, slow as fuck as almost boring, and that's why I can't stand playing DotA in the first place. It's boring as fuck and puts me to sleep. So if this game is going to either be "pick hyper sustain or spend 20 minutes wishing there was something to do on the map" then fuck it, honestly.

I'm mostly replying to the bolded part

It's a change of pacing for jungle, kinda like suports and wards got a change of pacing (albeit in the oposite direction) last season.Maybe it's a matter of adaptation, I know I personally prefer a map where ganks aren't 80% of what I do. In riot's defence, this season they were aiming at jungle specifically. I'll draw the parallel again with last season : most lane didn't really feel anything, but supporting is WAY different now. Other lanes just lost their potential Gp5 item, top got a 2v2 fad before Targon was nerfed and mages/tank now have possibly 1 new niche utility items they can get out of the support item pool.

The new map is the new map, jungle changes are preseason 5 rolling in. Honnestl,y I'd say give it a bit of time untill the new jungle is figured out and riot will drop the difficulty. If they wanted to make things change, they had to slightly overtune the new jungle to force people out of their old jungle mentality.

Problem is, new jungle is such a burden now. It offers A LOT less gold and EXPERIENCE then it did. If I literally Leave jungle to gank a lane I am falling a full level behind of everyone else. but if you don't get a successful gank then you are REALLY behind in gold. I struggle to finish the jungle items. Gold is in ganks for a jungler, but not its 10x more difficult to pull off with all the Barrier/Flash/Heal.

Riot caters to the ADC Roles so much now, they are board line impossible to kill unless you have a Hard CC jungler or a CC filled team. Game is Boring, I'm waiting for something else.

Now that's a valid problem. Only gotta hope that they'll up the rewards then. In theory, doing that is the point of preseason.

And I have to admit I don't like new adcs designs too.

Long Dong Wukong1 votes

Kalista being the epitomy of their balance issue that they just laughably reinforced is for me to comment on at another time.

The problem is that the jungle is more difficult to the point of having to recall while offering even LESS gold and experience. Also in relation to the jungle being more difficult, since it is more difficult and you are much less healthy for the first 15 minutes, it's very difficult to find opportunities to gank.

Previously, you were more or less always looking for a gank or countergank opportunity(Flare excluded), but in this jungle you're too preoccupied with the jungle to even interact much. Dragons never feel like good ideas, Barons are useless, and if you don't farm enough you fall behind very quickly, especially in items. The gold income just isn't there between the difficulty of the camps and their respawns.

I'm not sure if it's supposed to incentivize counter jungling, but you're far too concerned with managing to clear your own jungle to have time to do anything other than take the occasional Raptor camp. The only champion that can actually do that is as usual Nunu, with Lee Sin being decent too just because he's retarded early.

tl;dr too difficult for too little gain with objectives that aren't doable anywhere near as early as they previously were, resulting in a meh experience

Zeliwin1 votes

Remove Flash and Heal, and I promise you this game would be 10x more interesting, and people would actually SUFFER from THEIR MISTAKES! Instead of being INSTANTLY forgiven for MAKING the big MISTAKES. To hard to get an advantage now cause if you catch someone out of position or making a mistaken engage its "haha, Just kidding... I'll flash and heal away...." This game isn't NEARLY as punishing enough.

Basically, if you don't have a good team comp, then GG. Cause mistakes almost don't matter anymore.

Cenobite Azaziel1 votes

Flash makes some champions viable. Annie, mordekaiser, WW...

New jungle hits too hard and during mid/late game the damage meaningless for the laners that can clear with ease.

JevelFaithful1 votes

Kalista being the epitomy of their balance issue that they just laughably reinforced is for me to comment on at another time.

...

What you say is mostly fixable tought. They probably overtuned the jungle to see how that would change.

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