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Doran's Shield is in drastic need of an buff or rework

Tusutaki··65 votes·2,760 views

I'll put my main points in sections for ease of read as to why Shield is objectionably the worst item of the Doran set and has been for the past few seasons. Im only comparing Doran's set because listing out why practically using any other starting sets over Shield are better will make the post way too long. Trying to keep it short and sweet as possible.

Shield Cost and gold efficient: As it currently stands, Shield costs 450 gold while only being is 95.41% gold efficient, without its unique passive. To put it in contrast, Blade is 134.63% gold efficient and Ring is is 184.06% gold efficient even without its passive mana restore on kill. While at the same time, Ring is also the cheapest of the three allowing you to buy two health pots instead of one. In a numbers perspective, Shield is 38.92% less efficient than Blade and 88.65% less efficient than Ring. For a clearer perspective..

Doran's Ring = 736 gold value Doran's Blade = 605 Doran's Shield = 429

With pots included Ring + 2 = 836 Blade + 1 = 655 Shield + 1 = 479

Block Passive Not only Shield provides the worst stats in gold value and but it does not even truly block 8 damage as advertised as it blocks damage before resistances is calculated rather than after. Meaning the actual damage blocked will always be less than 8. It is also the only item in the game that gains less value from it's block passive the more resistances you gain throughout the game. On top of that, the block passive is not only unique but it is also so restrictive that the majority of the time it won't see use as area of effect damage is the primary source of damage.

HP Regen The heath regeneration also discourages from buying shield because of it's flat 6hp regen per 5 seconds (1.2hp per second) and the worst part of it is that it doesnt scale. I say this because over 95% of the champion roster's health regen exceeds 6 at level 3 meaning that you will gain more value from just buying two rejuvenation beads in addition to having three health pots. To further my case, 98 out of 134 (73%) champs has or exceeds Shield's regen passive at level 1.

Suggestions

  1. Make the block passive block 8 damage AFTER resistances as it should and maybe block 4 from AOE.

  2. Make the 6 per 5 passive be unique and have it be added to the champion's BASE regeneration rather than having it as a bonus as it currently is.

  3. If 2 may be too strong then make the bonus regen be 10 per 5 as it was in the past.

  4. If not 3, then x% of maximum or missing health recovered per 5.

What are your opinions? Agree? Disagree? Lets talk about it because I feel that this has been overlooked for way too long.

36 Comments

GigaPube9 votes

funny how someone in support of a defensive item can go to such thorough and rigorous detail and information, and still ask for peoples opinions, while nobody whos ever complained about yasuo or zed have ever presented anywhere near as valuable an argument. take notes kids

i completely agree with this, and the suggestions for change are spot on. its a small scale of a change but its one of the most popular items in the game (or was) and i think this legitimate report on dorans shield should really be read and considered by riot. from another suggestion, i think making it 500 gold would be a good start to a supposedly strong buff, but to have such a decent item for the early and mid game, the sustain overall is probably worth it

Tusutaki4 votes

Oh stop it, you make it sound like this is a rare thing to witness. Lol.

Each Doran item is supposed to serve a purpose. Ring is supposed to help AP users's consistency of spell usage, Blade is supposed to help with harass with a little bit of sustain, and Shield is supposed to be for longevity. But as previously mentioned, Shield doesnt accomplish what it was designed to do and it doesnt help that other defensive starting sets like cloth + 4 being vastly superior in literally every way.

I also have a small problem with Blade as well for being too narrow for the lack of better words. Or less intensive to stack I guess is the right way to put it as I much preferred the old passive of 5hp per hit over 3% lifesteal.

TwinkiePro3 votes

Well it really is a rare thing to witness. Can't tell you how many times I get slammed down for supporting Lee and being a Lee main. It sucks when they use that as an excuse to ignore your stats and such, so good job man.

+1 as well.

Spoofghoul8 votes

Or how about this

500 gold 100 health Unique passive 6 base health regen Unique passiveblocks 8 damage from attacks and aoe damage after resistances

Unique passive after blocking at least 800 damage & 20 minutes have passed the item dissapears and the champion gains it's effects and stats permanently

DunkinNoobs2 votes

I actually played the game back when Dshield was good. It's not getting buffed, and it's a good thing that it's not getting buffed. Right now, it's a good starting option for manaless top laners. It's also a good counter option against champions that use on hit effects and single target spells constantly like Kayle and Yasuo. That is how it should stay. When Dshield is good as a general pickup, the game becomes absolutely awful.

Tusutaki2 votes

So did I and I knew it was extremely strong back then to. But if its not going to see any changes or buffs then there is literally no reason to buy Shield over any other starting items. You can even take it out of the game and literally nothing will change. As I said in my OP, if I were to througholy explain why practically every other starting set is better than Shield (which I have done before in the past) then the post would be obnoxiously long.

On hit effects from autos will only be counted once, meaning the block passive wont be proced twice.

DunkinNoobs2 votes

On hit effects in champion kits count as single target spells, so the damage will be blocked twice. Yasuo's Q will be blocked twice. Kayle's E will be blocked on both the auto damage and the E damage.

Tusutaki2 votes

From Phreak

Basic Attack / On Hit. This is any basic attack, things like Mystic Shot, Double Up, etc. These are really common of course, and interact with Doran's Shield. Note that most of these abilities are rolled INTO the basic attack and thus are only counted once total, as though you had simply attacked your target. You'll typically not see Doran's double-dip an ability like this.

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/tips-tricks/imTTNBRo-dorans-shield-clarification-request-on-certain-interactions

DunkinNoobs1 votes

Well damn. Still feels good against those champs though and I'd still rather not see Dshield be buffed. I still get it quite often and I think it does it's job well: Help protect weak early champions against early aggression.

Tusutaki1 votes

But it objectionably doesnt do its job well at all. There are much better and superior options to help you against early aggression.

Cloth + 4 15 armor and 600 effective inlane health

Ruby + 2 150 health and 300 effective

Boots + 4 25 movement speed and 600 effective

Two Reju Beads + 4 +100% base health regen (which also scales) and 600 effective ^ Two Reju Beads is pretty good start with champs with high base regen like Sion, giving you 20hp per 5 at lvl1

And the best part of them all? You're already investing into hitting your power spike much sooner. And what would you rather have, wait for over 2 minutes to recover 150hp from Shield or 15 seconds from a health pot?

DunkinNoobs1 votes

The difference between Dshield and all those alternatives is that Dshield will actually make you win trades that you would lose with those other items. Yes, going those other items will typically give you more sustain overall. It often won't matter because you'll be losing trades too hard. A Dshield Garen or Mundo can trade with Riven pretty well. Cloth 4? Not so much.

Tusutaki1 votes

No it doesnt make you win trades as I said before, it doesnt even block 8 damage. I've done the math in my past threads that I can link and the only conclusion where Shield does shine is when you're going to all in against an auto attacker at before level 3 when you're both at 100% health.

As for with trades, you will always win the trade with that cloth+4 because as you already mentioned, sustain. So if you happen to have an even trade or even a bad trade, you can just pop a potion and have control of the lane again in 15 seconds than 2 minutes.

And the additional armor gives you 15% more effective health. Lets assume the average health for a top laner at lvl 1 is 570 with 30 armor.

570 * 1.30 = 741 effective 570 + 80 (shield) + 1.30 = 845 570 * (1.30 + .15(cloth)) = 826

That is a 19hp difference at level 1 . That 450 gold investment is so worth that 19hp. Cloth outscales the health Shield provides at 600 base hp. So you have 19 less hp when starting cloth if you have 570 base hp, too bad its not like you have 4 additional pots adding 600hp making your opponent waste resources and their hp dwindle away and youre already making an investment to your powerspike.

Blumpkin Nation1 votes

They could just make it so that when you sustain damage from champions you gain HP5 for a few seconds. Similar to old Fiora Passive. 8)

Doctor Jarvis1 votes

Yeah. You can tell the item is terrible when the only people who bother with it are Vladimir and Rumble, mana-less mages. It doesn't protect nearly enough for a true tank to consider it (they usually prefer Flask for mana+health sustain) and even tank-y damage dealers are almost always better off with defenses from runes+masteries while taking one of the other Doran's items.

Tusutaki1 votes

I hate to say this but Doran is not even worth buying on Vlad or Rumble as Ruby provides 150 health (70 more than shield) and allows you to buy two pots giving you 300 effective in lane health. Thats 1.2k gold efficiency at the start for 450 HP total before first back. Whats even better is that you already invested into hitting your power spike.

In order for Shield's regen to match the value of a single pot, you would have to be constantly regenerating health for over 2 minutes straight and if you would to ask me, I would rather recover 150 health in 15 seconds than 150 health in 2 minutes. If you happen to get into a bad trade, that 2 minute timeframe your opponent has control of the lane. And thats just assuming you dont take any damage during the said 2 minutes either.

WoonStruck1 votes

Boots+Pots is the superior option, actually. 600 HP added to your pool before first back, plus MS. Can't go wrong with it.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Yes. It has been too long since this item has been dumpster class. It needs help badly, and it would REALLY help out with the whole range v melee problem.

To be clear, I don't think range v melee is this cancerous horror that many in the community claim, but it IS an issue. It's frustrating to play melee v ranged, and d. shield is at the heart of the problem imo.

Tusutaki1 votes

I dont think shield is at the heart of the problem as you can remove it from the game and nothing will change because there are better alternatives if you're against ad range like cloth + 4. However you practically have nothing against a ranged ap like Kennen.

ModKnightsKemplar1 votes

Well, that's the point, though, isn't it?

Shield should be good in those matchups, and it isn't. If it gave anywhere close to decent sustain and health, it would be good for both ad and ap matchups. The trade-off should be that you have no kill pressure. That's a fair trade, imo.

Sire Hippington1 votes

I think the regen is fine enough, it's mostly the block that should get changed to post resistances and also apply to aoe, with reduced effect on damage over time. However, what it really lacks is manasustain, and maybe some bonusdamage vs minions.

Even if it's sustain and block get buffed, i'd still not get it unless it's really broken on most tanks, as the manasustain from flask/dorans ring is just to important for the lane. And on bruisers, i really notice the missing ad from blade when it comes to CSing... Maybe reduceing the cost to 350g and lowering the health or removeing the regen would work aswell, it would allow a shield+refillable start with a flask on first back.

ADC5LUT1 votes

The problem is that the item will always be stronger on range than melee. Until that is fixed it will remain garbage.

If you did something like: gain 1 stack of Defender when an allied melee minion dies within 100 units of you. At 100 stacks gain Defender permanently.

Defender: every stack increases your base hp and base regen by x amount.

This will do two things range can't abuse it and if you're ahead you have to decide being aggressive or stacking defender.

The rest of the stats can be balanced accordingly.

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

make it block double the god damn damage from ranged spells and auto attacks. FIXED

/THREAD

TakaDama1 votes

I think the real problem is that, as a starting item for tanks/more defensive champions, it does not help tanks in the laning phase. Both Ring and Blade help with last hitting/harassing, but shield doesn't.

My suggestion? First either up the base health or make the regen similar to Rejuvenation Bead (i.e. percentage of base) and instead of damage mitigation, have it reflect a set amount of damage (let's say 10 physical or magical damage) when basic attacked or hit with single-target spells.

While it won't help with harassing or farming directly, the above changes should allow the tanky champion to draw minion aggro more safely while being able to benefit to some extent.

Tusutaki1 votes

I disagree with the issue of having no stats to last hit or harass. Shield was designed to help against being harassed but it doesnt even does that well.

I also support having the regen passive be % based but there should be more to it than that. Like I would be satisfied to see something like the mastery Perseverance (Grants +50% base health regeneration, increased to +200% while below 25% health.) be built into Shield. But the biggest offender is the block passive not working at advertised and IT GAINS LESS VALUE THE MORE RESISTANCES YOU HAVE which is absolutely baffling when its been like this for a very long time.

BlâckLotus1 votes

i feel like dorans shield needs a buff to keep all those ranged immigrants away from the toplane,but melee autoattack based champions already took a hit through the fervor of battle nerf and the introduction of CoC. it was nice seeing kennen/rumble in the lcs but i dont realy like them in my solo queue games. Make the toplane great again.

Irelia Bot1 votes

Riot we want Doran's shield to be as good as Poor Man's Shield in dota 2 which actually has a reason to be bought early game.

Backup4now1 votes

Make the block passive block 8 damage AFTER resistances

This alone is really all it takes, it's such a strong change. The fact that it currently goes against defensive stats rather than complimenting them is dumb. Building armor plus this modified version of dungle's shield would drastically reduce the constant poke from ranged toplaners, and could even make melee botlaners playable.

Tusutaki1 votes

While i do believe that alone would make a strong change, the cost is still a bit too much. While it will help with trades, sustain is still a problem with that 6hp per 5 thats not even scaled.

Lets say you guys got into a trade, you with shield and them with cloth. Both dealt decent damage and you come out on top. You both pop a potion and repeat the event with the same outcome. However because of you using your only health pot, you're at an disadvantage as they will have at least two more health pots left.

Backup4now1 votes

Maybe as a starting item it wouldn't be any higher-tier, but in combination with some solid armor purchases, after-armor flat reduction can easily make cloth armor look like a diaper in comparison.

Tusutaki1 votes

That argument would hold more weight if armor pen wasnt nerfed. Even before the armor pen nerf, I would still say the cloth + 4 start is much more valuable. While of course you can buy additional items after Shield, you're still going to be 450 gold short from obtaining that much needed powerspike whether it be Sunfire Cape or whatever. As you know with this game, time is the essence. Obtaining Sunfire in 10 minutes with the cloth+ 4 start is a lot more impactful than buying it at 14 minutes with the Shield start.

And getting Sunfire in 14min with Shield wouldnt be an issue either if it wasnt for the fact that Shield is a terrible item itself. In reality, Shield is actually holding you back.

Backup4now1 votes

I was saying that the flat damage reduction from shield, in the theoretical scenario that it should apply after armor rather than before, would be superior when stacked with armor in comparison to another cloth armor, and I also said that it still wouldn't be a starter item; probably more likely a second or third back item, because of how after-armor flat damage reduction scales with good amounts of armor. This is ever more the case since armor pen was nerfed.

HazyCloud71 votes

I kind of worry about this getting abused by tanks like Maokai & Nautilus when paired with courage of the colossus. They are already really strong at the moment.

Need to find a way to help fighters & bruisers to lane against ranged champions without helping these tanks that benefit heavily from CoC.

SpecterVonBaren1 votes

A better way to deal with it is just remove the flat damage reduction entirely and instead give it a passive similar to Spectre's Cowl where you gain increased health regen upon taking magic damage but instead have it do so for any damage then change the flat increased health regen at all times to percentage based and then make the new passive a flat amount so that it's good in the early game.

What this all does is help you deal with poke but since the value is in health regen it means that someone going all in on you can still have results so it won't be impossible to deal with and a must buy for everyone, and since it now has percentage health regen it can scale a bit into the late game so it's not a terrible purchase.

Tusutaki1 votes

bumping this because I want this to be addressed.

Tusutaki1 votes

Can we please get a comment from one of the Riot staff? Shield has been in a objectionably terrible state for several seasons, is a noob trap item, and falsely advertises the player on it's block passive.

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