For crying out loud.
She used to be scary top-tier assassin.
Now she's fucking no-damage garbage-tier tank.
Seriously.
If you don't know how, then I'll do the work for you:
1.) Bring back pre-nerfed (reworked) Evelynn. 2.) Change stun from her invisibility into slow 3.) adjust right numbers so she'll fit current "press gapcloser key to win" meta.
Or just remove her.
(edit: lil typo sneaked in threads title. welp Sorry)
Hayaishi3 votesShe's prob going to be reworked again, and i don't blame Riot for not letting that abomination be viable.
Saianna1 votesWell.. Right now we have Lee. And no matter how i look at it: He's pretty huge abomination roaming in every second game. Or Zed Or Kalista Or Thresh*
WW got too powerfull? In 2 weeks he got his fangs broken and stomped into ground. Evelynn is sorry state for longest time in whole LoL history. And i really wanna make her viable once again. And to do so: no more by crappy excuse of a rework. Just bring back the old pink lady.
*Thresh got fair amount of nerfs. But he's still king of support-tanks.
Mahnigguh2 voteshonestly i would be super happy for 30 seconds flat...i am never stealth longer than that anyways
Skia Asteri1 votesStop being a tank then and build trinity force.
Saianna3 votesDone so. Crap.
She can have ALOT of damage. But her kit isn't of assassins but a f*** BRUISER-TANK.
Kuroi861 votesSwap stealth from passive to W and the on hit movement bonus to passive. W grants three seconds of stealth before ending and procing movement sped boost (or reactivating skill or using another skill to pop stealth early) Viola, no more permastealth, her burst can be raised back up again.
Saianna5 votesI do not want next copy-paste of kha'zixs stealth. 1s + ms. MEH Old stealth was just freaking THE BEST.
Kuroi862 votesI was thinking closer to twitch stealth, but potato potato. Anyways, the issue is that with her current stealth, if you give her assassin level burst... she's going to be ungodly overbearing and need immediate nerfs.
If we want her to be an assassin, she's going to have to give up a little bit of the stealth.
Edit: Just looked at her old stealth, shadow walk. It actually looks really good. I'd trade a bit of the duration for maybe some bonus % damage on first target attacked or % damage reduction but otherwise you're right, it's really good.
Saianna1 votesDepends what you mean by little bit. She used to have 1 minute stealth. So if little bit is somewhere 10-30 seconds, then i could agree on that. But if her stealth time is lower than 29.99s, then hell fucking no!
Kuroi861 votesDon't know, I like to theory craft, but I'm in no way an expert on balancing numbers. Truthfully, thirty seconds is time to get across more than half of the map.
Saianna1 votesCompared to old 1 minute stealth, 30 seconds seems almost unimaginably uber nerfed ;P
Kuroi861 votesHence why I wanted to add something onto it. % resistance or % damage on first target after leaving stealth. Something to make that decrease in stealth more than worth it when you jump into the fight. Could you imagine stealthing up to someone, AAing them to leave stealth and put a % bonus damage on them, then R,E,Q with maybe one or two more Q' thrown in just in case.
Saianna1 votesi think slow would be just fine. Fear would be even better and reasonable. % wouldn't be too bad, but that's just shallow perk.
Kuroi861 votesI don't think a fear would happen. Not if we want Eve to get her burst back. A slow would be more than reasonable.
Saianna1 votesI mean like... In real life (i know it's silly argument for LoL) when someone scares you, then you most likely freeze in panic -> fear.
Slow is just fine though.
Kuroi861 votesSimilar to a root or snare? That could work. I really do loathe that fear was changed to a target running from their pursuer.
Rebonack1 votesGiving Eve true stealth on her W again would be even more crazy as the game's vision is right now.
A better option would be 10 seconds of true stealth on her old Ult active, then turn her W into a Charm.
What would be really neat would be a Charm that removes the target from allied/minion vision and removes the ability to ping. That would really nail the concept of this seductive vampire thing that isolates and destroys lone foes.
Saianna1 votesgame's vision my ass.
She was reworked (nerfed to the ground) because bunch of total morons prefered to spam forum "how mean Evelynn is" instead buying pink wards. Greedy bastards.
Talon stealth copy-paste? NO. Charm? Evelynn ain't Ahri. NO. And your charm suggestion: in teamfights Evelynn would be wrecked to bits. So what if she removes enemy adc presence on map, if everyone is near each other. They'd see u MILES AWAY.
Old Evelynn gave us ability to play in true-ninja mode. We (not sure how many, but at least some of us) loved it.
All you guys suggest is: make her copypaste of x champion. sooner or later someone gonna try to suggest to make her R into copy-paste Zeds R. And i'll say it again. NO.
Skia Asteri1 votesThe two main things I do not want from a rework are long duration stealth that can be used for strategic purposes (and unlike Teemo allows for movement) and for her to have a means of surviving in team fights not tied to stealth. The latter because it is too easy to negate stealth in a team fight if the enemy is organized enough to drop a pink. We already have Shaco to be useless outside of split pushing if the enemy is regularly dropping pinks in team fights.
Saianna1 votesI've played old Evelynn alot. And it was rare case where her stealth could be used as escape.
Shaco is perfect example of beaten kid on meta shift. He used to be very good, but with every season he was pushed back and back till he lost his viability..
Skia, tell me, have you ever played some games where'd have to sneak around? Where only chance of beating the game was to always fight 1v1? Old Evelynn was that kind of champion. Master of duels. Master os sneak attacks. Master of ganks.
But best part of Evelynn was: if you didn;t se her on map for 1 minute, then you never knew where she'd appear. That gave this feeling of insecurity. Now there is no champion that can do it.
Rebonack1 votesOld Eve was removed from the game because she was literally making new players quite the game because of how frustrating she was. Or at leas that was the justification that Morello made in the big topic about it back in the day.
And 10 seconds of stealth on Malice and Spite would be... uh... pretty much totally unlike Talon, really. Talon is an all-in burst assassin. Something like this would allow Eve to effectively move in and out of combat over the course of a team fight provided she got the kills/assists for it and fit well with her sustained damage focus. Pushing her stealth back to level 6 would also give the enemy team a much wider window to start pink warding rather than Eve having massive lane pressure as soon as the game starts.
The Charm is suggested because, well, have you ever read Eve's lore? She's a vampire succubus thing of some kind and a Charm would be pretty thematic. I mean, sure, you could just make her W a slow. But that's pretty darn bland if it's just a slow without any other component. Damage amplification, maybe? Giving a champion too much damage out of a stealth initiate is really fiddly vaguely waves at Knifecat
Skia Asteri1 votes{quoted} And 10 seconds of stealth on Malice and Spite would be... uh... pretty much totally unlike Talon, really. Talon is an all-in burst assassin. Something like this would allow Eve to effectively move in and out of combat over the course of a team fight provided she got the kills/assists for it and fit well with her sustained damage focus. Pushing her stealth back to level 6 would also give the enemy team a much wider window to start pink warding rather than Eve having massive lane pressure as soon as the game starts.
Stealth does not exist in team fights if the other team knows what they are doing because pink wards are actually useful there.
Saianna1 votesTalon is an all-in burst assassin
All assassins were all-in burst assassins untill reworked Evelynn was introduced. Now assassin world is divided by 2 grooups:
Stealth shouldn't be used to run-away in teamfights, but as tool to hit your foes even harder with huge "surprise m-f*cker" on face. Now, if we'd go with your 10s stealth then she'd have to use it similar to khazix/talon = mostly for escape/chasing.
You know what? i could agree on this stealth if at least 1 of 2 options below would match: a) it was on short cooldown. Let's say 15-20s b) it'd reset on kill or assist (but max cd 30s)
I cold even agree for it to consume 150 mana, so she wouldn't spam her invisibility all the time.
About charm: I think you've watched too much twilight bro... Evelynn with her basic skin as sado-maso enthiusiast wouldn't be very charming. Unless it's vs Urgot (he likes that stuff). I've read her lore looong time ago and tbh i kind of forgotten everything about it. But if you say she's vampire, then maybe go with some kind of vladimir Q proc on going out of stealth? That way it'd feel vampiric.
Like: R - Evelynn after hitting enemy champion slows them for 1,5s and deals 15% max hp (half converts to health) with 0,3 ap ratio. Hitting minions/monsters will restore health from full damage (capped at 200 hp) Feels nukey, thematically correct, and if it weren't R but W for example she could be even viable in new jungle.
If you want i could create Evelynn kit that'd be connection between what she used to be and what she could be without making her into wtf-is-this-pink-shit-tank tier champion
Bears Dont Care1 votesAll assassins were all-in burst assassins untill reworked Evelynn was introduced. Now assassin world is divided by 2 grooups:
Evelynn + Rengar (he got hit just as hard as Evelynn)
rest of assassins
Stealth shouldn't be used to run-away in teamfights, but as tool to hit your foes even harder with huge "surprise m-f*cker" on face. Now, if we'd go with your 10s stealth then she'd have to use it similar to khazix/talon = mostly for escape/chasing.
Errr...her stealth is currently 10 seconds out of combat so, im a bit confused as to why you refer to hers being more of a tool to escape when well...she's the only one that uses it entirely offensively.
Saianna1 votesI was talking about pre-reworked Evelynn. Not current one.
Imo current Evelynn doesn't have stealth, but "mere excuse of a stealth so Eve fanbase wouldn't cry too much" built in her passive.
Rebonack1 votesAll assassins were all-in burst assassins untill reworked Evelynn was introduced.
Your grasp of what an assassin does appears to be tentative at best.
The difference between an Assassin (like, say Zed) and an all-in Fighter (like, say, Pantheon) is that Zed has a means of moving both into and out of combat in order to kill/maim a foe and then get the hell out of Dodge. When a champion like Panth goes all-in he's committed.
In like fashion, Eve needs to commit to a fight once she's in. Previously she could use her Stealth to break focus on herself, get an Ult heal, and then move back into the fray to pick off weakened targets. She really can't do that anymore. At least not effectively.
Look, I would love it if Eve got her long duration stealth back. That would be really great. But unfortunately Riot has made it pretty clear they aren't going to do that. The power it gives her team even in something as simple as providing a great scout is way too high to be balance effectively. 's part of the reason why it got cut.
Saianna1 votesYou are missing my point. But that might be my fault.
Assassins need to have heavy combo/nuke. They go in Throw everything at you And after that they run away.
Currently Evelynn isn't allowed to do it. She lacks nuke. So she has to stay in fight to deal some damage (just like pantheon). That is why i keep on calling her bruiser-tank (or figher. Like it matters anything). I think meta has reched this point where old-kit Evelynn would be best suited to deal with retarded-high amount of gapclosers/disengages without changing her into some kind of monster as she used to be.
Also i've noticed Riot really sucks at keeping their promises. So i really hope their golden fish-like memory will serve Evelynn
Anyways, we seem to agree on this topic (right?) :)