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Realistic and fair changes to Yasuo that we should start with that even Yasuo mains will agree with.

ChaddyFantome··2 votes·799 views

Okay, i know bashing on Yasuo is the cool thing to do, and I am not gonna bullshit you and pretend I don't hate the fucker, because I freaking do, bbut if we are gonna actually bother doing this, lets take baby steps and actually start with things we should all agree on.

That being: before we decide or even bgin to contemplate any huge changes to Blasuo, why don't we start by making it so Riot are freaking liars.

**First change: His ultimate should correctly activate on Airborn targets, not all displacements. **

This one I think even yasuo mains will agree with. Riot has been lying to the vast player base, Yasuo maisn included about how his ultimate works and have seldom even so much as bothered trying to correct it.

Currently, Yasuo can ult off of anythign that so much as moves a unit even if only a little.

he can currently ult off of:

  • LeeSin ulti (not the actual knock up but the target lee Sin kicks)
  • Vayne Condemn
  • Quin's freaking E
  • Blitz Q
  • Ali W -Shyvanna ulti -Syndra E
  • Tristanna Ulti
  • Jayce Hammer knock back
  • Trundle and Taliya using his Pillar/wall on an enemy unit, christ
  • Enemies getting their Dashed Blocked by Azir wall and Poppy freaking W you get the point.

This is just hidden tacked on power that Yasuo both shouldn't have and that Riot isn't even telling the players let alone the Yasuo players themselves.

Imho, he shouldn't even BE able to ult off anything he didn't knock in the air with his own Q himself, but I am more than willing to at least start with removing shit he shouldn't even have by Riot's own wording.

Second change: His WindWall should not block attacks that blatantly go under the wall via being an attack where the ground splits. ( Braum Velkoz ). or an attack that is clearly flying way over the damn wall ( Soraka Q will be blocked by invisible walls 10 feet in the air when flying over windwall)

This is just stupid and everyone agrees. Again, some say he should not even be able to block every ranged projectile with it or even argue they should give it a damage count before it dissipates and while I would like to discuss something of the nature, I again wanna at least propose something that even the Yasuo players will agree is bullshit and needs to be changed.

Riot argues that they let it do this because of clarity but i call utter dog crap.

Time and time again, people will be confused as to why the fuck it blocks certain spells despite it making no logical sense, if anything, leaving it this way goes AGAINST clarity and only confuses and frustrates the player.

Yes, technically Braum's ulti is a skill shot. That doesn't make it a projectile, nor does it make it okay for windwall to stop a freaking earthquake/fissure that is happening on the ground under the wall.

17 Comments

Banana Nations4 votes

Why the fuck does everyone hate yasuo hes in a fairly weak spot right now... almost all his matchups are skill based if u lose them it means they are better than you... this is coming from someone who hates laning yasuo but can use their eyes and brain

Sona x Rubick1 votes

because board that's why

yasuo has more counterplay than many champions, and yet hate him because he has a lot of mobility in lane, and because they can't wait until windwall expires/going through his windwall "but i'm a squishy adc" wow, you mean you're the kind of champ that destroys everyone and want to be able to DPS through yasuo's wall which should hard counter you? lel k.

Then they tell you about how his windwall shouldn't be on a hypercarry, but they didn't understand that to make a melee viable in league you need all of this.

and they didn't understand that he doesn't have mr/lvl, and gets reduced crit damage.

PS:i'm not a yasuo main

DoktorKaiser1 votes

Reason:

  1. I see him every fucking game, its becoming really really boring to play league because of it

  2. he is by far the most cancerous champion to play against in the entire game

  3. yasuo mains

And btw he isnt op, but he is far far from weak...

Dabrick012 votes

It seems like your changes are more about how the other abilities look like they fly versus what Yasuo's wind wall can actually do.

As for your Knockup changes, i agree with a few of them but not all of them. Blitz's grab for one is definitely a weird one.

BUT

Some of those abilities are massive displacements like Lee and Trist Ults. Some of these are coded as knock ups because of what they actually do, like Azir's Ult and Jayce Hammer.

So before you say we all agree with these, talk to a Yasuo main.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

It seems like your changes are more about how the other abilities look like they fly versus what Yasuo's wind wall can actually do.

As for your Knockup changes, i agree with a few of them but not all of them. Blitz's grab for one is definitely a weird one.

....okay?

Some of those abilities are massive displacements like Lee and Trist Ults.

I fail to see why this is relevant. They are still not knocked airborn.

Some of these are coded as knock ups because of what they actually do, like Azir's Ult and Jayce Hammer.

No. What it is is that all displacements hav the same "coding" which is why Yasuo can ult off of all of them. it's just Riot being lazy.

So before you say we all agree with these, talk to a Yasuo main. Excuse me , you ere right. It is too much of me to give Cancersuo mains a chance and being reasonable apparently. My mistake. :/

Dabrick012 votes

Ok, have you ever seen a Lee or Trist Ult before? A Jayce hammer? Have you ever tried to dash over an Azir ult?

I'm willing to bet you have since you probably have never even played any champ with a dash.

I'm sorry you think of Yasuo mains like that and I'm sorry you are salty because you can only play support.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

Ok, have you ever seen a Lee or Trist Ult before? A Jayce hammer? Have you ever tried to dash over an Azir ult?

I'm willing to bet you have since you probably have never even played any champ with a dash.

I'm sorry you think of Yasuo mains like that and I'm sorry you are salty because you can only play support.

Is this a joke post or?

And for the record, i play every role and main mid/support.

looking up peoples pages to shit talk them when u have nothing worthwhile to post is lol babby tier behavior tho.

Theorex2 votes

Yasuo should also have a fucking dash limit. I would say 5 so that it is alright. I don't like seeing me set up a gank that needs Yasuo to get 100% all in on me from his tower to my tower (Top Lane). Uses 4 Dashes to get into me and then realizes "Oh Shit theres the enemy jungler with no CC". Dashes 4 more times through different minions After flashing. 8 Dashes in 4 Seconds.

If yasuo gets 8 dashes in 4 seconds. Then I want Ekko to be able to blink 4 times. LeBlanc to W/R 4 times each. Zed to shadow 4 times. Lucian to dash 4 times. Master Yi Q 4 times. Talon to blink 4 times. Kha to jump 4 times. Akali to dash 6 times (not including resets). Kata to blink 6 times.

I think now that we think about it. Dashes are way too strong. Dashes and blinks. The thing that makes ALL of these other champions tolerable is the number of times that they can dash/blink in a span of 4 seconds. (Taking awaky Akali, Kata, and Kha Resets and Master Yi Auto Attacks)

The point is. Make Yasuo have to think about how he wants to use his fucking dash. Not. Lets See if I can harass him on these 2 minions with this Q + the increased damage. Oh time to wait 4 seconds and do it on 2 other minions. Wait 4 more seconds and do it with a ulti this time. Oh he is dead and because I have a windwall 90% of everything that would CC me is nullified.

I could care less about the damage amp. The 50% armor pen on his ulti. The crits on his ulti. His Q counting as a Auto attack. The fact that his W is complete horseshit.

What I care about is. I set something up. And because he had flash he could dash 2-3 times to get to safety (even If I were to use my flash). Oh you say bring hard CC? He can build Merk treads because it doesnt actually hurt him to build those. Because he needs him to live. Where as a mage, unless you have Extremely low cooldowns like Cass or Ryze. You realistically can't build them because, you are looking for the most damage. Where as Cass and Ryze can spit out spells like no tomorrow. Yas doesnt need to spit out spells to do damage. Because he builds AD, so even his autos do damage [This only gets into the options that ADC/AD bruisers/AD anything have over AP champions] Oh wait. Cass can't build boots. She can't build Tenacity. At All. She can buy it in the form of Elixir. But heyyy.

TL:DR
Limit Yasuo Dash to 5. With a recharge time of 12 per each one. Have the cooldown lower by 1 per rank he puts into his W. Yes I said W. 12/10/8/6/4

Increase the base damage of the dash by 20 at all levels.

yas mains if this were to happen. It literally gives everyone else something to have to deal with you. 5 Charges in 1 minute all of your early game is fine with us. Per 2 waves you get 5 charges back is fine.

Dabrick012 votes

That is the reason that there is a 10 second cooldown on one minion before you can dash to the same one. I'm sorry Yas players can style on other champs, but that is no reason to limit something that is balanced and easily countered. You literally mentioned Cass, SHE HAS A FUCKING ABILITY THAT CANCELS HIS DASH. So does a good amount of mages.

Your entire "argument" is based on the fact that he builds AD. What a fallible argument. So many holes.

So what about Zed? Talon? Are they broken. NO. Yasuo has just as much counterplay as Zed does. I'm sorry that countering Yasuo takes a bit more IQ than it does to kill Talon.

My personal tip: If you are going to main Ryze, learn how to use him to counter Yasuo. In the right hands, Ryze can own a Yasuo. Your Q has such a low cooldown that you can chain abilities and get Q up so you can repositioning around his windwall with the Kenyan level speed you end up getting. You main Ryze, you shouldn't have to worry about Yasuos if you do it right and you definitely shouldn't need to complain. You complain that Ryze has a pinot and click root but of course that is balanced. Just like Yasuo's dash.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Meh I'd rather them fix his armor pene before changing anything in his kit.

Dabrick012 votes

They did. Where have you been?

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

They didn't.

When LW was changed to a healthier design it made it less wanted for yasuo.

The rest of his kit is fine since it either has tradeoffs(For the 2x crit he has to build crit and he still suffers a crit debuff) or you can get around it (Windwall has a long CD and Dashing only towards enemies).

Now here's the issue where yasuo's Armor pene comes in, LW isn't wanted that much for yasuo because of his free armor pene which you don't need an investment in armor pene to get, it has no real counterplay because once he gets it armor doesn't mean anything. Another issue with it is since it's a huge amount of it he can turn any tanky/tank item into a free LW(Which is encouraging tankier builds which lowers skill needed to play yasuo).

They didn't fix it at all, it's still giving too much hidden power to yasuo with no proper trade-off unlike the 2x crit, there is no counterplay because of how it guts armor. (On a side note his ulti's counterplay is not to get popped up but that isn't the counterplay to his armor pene.) It was fine back when yasuo was still building LW because LW doesn't offer any tank stats, but again that's changed now that LW is less valuable(especially if you have innate % armor pene)

Overall there really isn't any suggestion for it to be fixed entirely because they can't remove it for something else, because something else will completely buff yasuo in killing squishies. And nerfing the amount won't fix him wanting to turn a tank item into a better LW.

Edit: Actually after some thinking it would be better if ulti provided an additional defensive tool instead of the % armor pene, that alone would enforce yasuo to want the LW item because he won't be able to just ulti and gut any tank anymore, thus pushing him away from his tankier build. Maybe ulti could just enhance his passive shielding in a way.

However as of now his free armor pene is too much of an issue being hidden power and no counterplay.

Dabrick011 votes

So what you are saying is to bring back Tanksuo.

His armor pen is there to keep him dealing damage. Lore wise, a good swordsman would be able to find weaknesses in an enemy's armor and exploit them.

I'm sorry you don't like his armor pen, but it is balanced. You call it hidden power, i call it a bunch of idiots who don't know anything about the game. He's fine in Plat elo, just Bronzies are too stupid to realize that he is balanced.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

His armor pene has too much hidden power because there's really no clear indicator that he still has it and it free ups an item slot since LW is far less wanted. Unlike his 2x crit, he doesn't have to invest into crit for it nor does he suffer any debuff'd damage like crit does. If you'd notice as well he replaces LW of prior builds, when LW was valuable, for a tanky/tank item, if they changed it to a survivability skill he'd have much more incentive to buy a LW because if he wants a tank item he couldn't deal with tanks anymore and his damage would actually be lowered vs an armored target, so you're wrong about tank yasuo returning, because currently it hasn't even left.

Not to mention there is no counterplay to his high amount of armor pene, we're not going to talk about below average yasuo, we're going to talk about yasuo who can actually get their ulti off and actually fight, will your armor do anything? Nope. Will you burst him to death? it'll be harder with his tank item. You trying to say it has real counterplay is completely wrong, his 2x crit has counterplay, it has innate debuffs and omen can trump it. His Q is a skillshot. His W last for 4 seconds with a long CD and you can bait it out, reset a teamfight, or if it's used properly not get impatient and find an opportunity, E only goes towards enemies which can make skillshots land easier if you predict properly.

While his R try not to get displaced which isn't the easiest thing in the world. But once he gets that ulti, no CC will lock him down long enough to lower the value he'll get out of that armor pene. Not to mention since he's going tankier, it lowers the mechanical demand yasuo usually has since you won't be punished as much for misplaying.

Just having ulti modify his shield or any form of survivability instead of granting heavy amount of armor pene wouldn't even return tank yasuo because it actually thrives due to armor pene allowing him to get uncounterable damage which destroys tanks for free.

Dabrick011 votes

Yes it would, that was the entire problem. Of course, he didn't have to invest in Armor Pen even if he built Tank, but the reason it Tanksuo died was because you couldn't take full potential of his kit through his build path. Now, you have to at least buy a few crit items, albeit he does not need much to get 100%.

If we took away the Armor Pen from his ult. That would remove the slight amount of hidden power he has toward people who don't know what Yasuo can do. What it would no though is remove the reason Tanksuo died, people couldn't take advantage of his full power.

I'm going to be honest. If you put anymore power into the other aspects of his kit, he will really become overloaded, not like he is now (Not overloaded at all). Any more survivability would make him too powerful. Any less will kill him. He has the perfect amount of survivability to not be killed the instant you make a mistake.

GiveMeUrMilk1 votes

Airborne is just a form of displacement. It is given a special name yes, but it is not separate. Displacement=knock up/knock back yasuo can ult off of ANY displacement ability. No coding can change this unless they make knock ups and knock backs coded separately. This is listed on the wiki, and you can see it in game by the ult indicator when playing as yasuo.

It is not Riot being lazy it makes sense. When you get knocked back your feet are off of the ground, you are airborne.

Widnwall is coded to block ANY projectile. Height does not exist in league(nor should it). It does not matter if the attack is coded to look like it travels across the ground, or ten feet through the air, it is a projectile and will be blocked. This cannot be changed, it would open a can of worms that frankly I don't think any one would want to see.

The real issue is that certain things are coded as projectiles when players presume that they are not coded as such. But honestly, I fail to see a way to fix this.

ChaddyFantome1 votes

{quoted}

Airborne is just a form of displacement. It is given a special name yes, but it is not separate. Displacement=knock up/knock back yasuo can ult off of ANY displacement ability. No coding can change this unless they make knock ups and knock backs coded separately. This is listed on the wiki, and you can see it in game by the ult indicator when playing as yasuo.

It is not Riot being lazy it makes sense. When you get knocked back your feet are off of the ground, you are airborne.

Widnwall is coded to block ANY projectile. Height does not exist in league(nor should it). It does not matter if the attack is coded to look like it travels across the ground, or ten feet through the air, it is a projectile and will be blocked. This cannot be changed, it would open a can of worms that frankly I don't think any one would want to see.

The real issue is that certain things are coded as projectiles when players presume that they are not coded as such. But honestly, I fail to see a way to fix this.

Yup i gave Yasuo mains too much credit. smh

Thanks for telling me what i already know. If you fail to see how this inconsistency is an issue, then no amount of reasoning will penetrate the bias.

the entire post was about how these things need to be fix'd. Your post can be summed up as < no it shouldn't because it is the way it is".

=-=

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