Do mages feel weak?

AquariusGine·Dec 13, 2015·12 votes·1,210 views

I don't remember the last time I carried on a mage this preseason. Like once every 30 games?

I main Cassiopeia, who is supposed to be a ''lategame AP hypercarry'', but she feels pathetic compared to the monsters that are Jax Fiora Vayne etc..

Anyways, this thread isn't about Cass. I'm concerned about the state of mages in general. They feel unsatisfying to play.

Mages now seem to have taken on a more supportive role. Frost queen claim is built on mid lane carries and is REALLY good for setting up game changing combos. But I assume the item was meant for supports only. So does that mean Riot will nerf it?

Does Riot intend to keep mages not named Brand at the current power level?

14 Comments

Big LincolnDec 13, 201511 votes

CherysseDec 13, 20153 votes

The pre-season is really unbalanced so far. In the other hand mages can carry, they still do, but it is better if you forget about the Ferocity tree and go full cunning.

SerevasDec 13, 20153 votes

Currently Control and Poke mages are fairly strong, the sustained damage mages like Cassio are in a weak spot, and I'm not sure about burst mages, as the closest thing I play to a burst mage these days is Xerath, Orianna, and Kassadin, who are poke, control, and assassin respectively.

Cassio in particular is in a weak spot as she needs to scale up and games are so fast right now.

Riot will very likely nerf Frost Queen's Claim, they took an already solid item, and added the active from twin shadows, which was sometimes built just because the active was so good despite the item itself being pretty awful itself.

Overall I don't think mages are super weak, they're not in a great spot, but they're still viable if for nothing else than you need magic damage on your team to prevent a tank from taking over the game. It's certainly much more difficult to carry with mages at the moment though. I think because it's more difficult to carry with mages is the exact reason it's more valuable to take champions that offer more than just damage. Orianna offers solid shields, speed buffs, a game changing ultimate. Xerath has nearly unparalleled wave clear, the ability to apply his damage from safety, and major damage. Lulu has so much utility it's insane and she negates any assassin. The list goes on with similar things and similar champions.

Mages who can siege well are extremely valuable, since towers are so squishy, wave clear and poke to get people away from your tower is very effective. Cassio does okay clearing waves, but is not very good a sieging due to her lower range abilities.

ForgiveColourDec 13, 20152 votes

Maybe because youre bad? Mages are like super strong

morris1Dec 13, 20152 votes

Cassio in general has been in a rather bad spot since mana pots got removed and she received no mana compensation + they increased tear's price and nerfed DFT, it just feels like an all around nerf like when Sej and Sion got removed from viability.

Robbit MangDec 13, 20152 votes

mages still 1shot squishies, and actually have their penetration item unnerfed

FatTacoDec 13, 20151 votes

Mages seem to feel weak late game now it is mostly because AP items cost way too much, mostly every AP item costs 3k or over. Unless you're Brand Mages need some help but I think Riot is just waiting until February to update them.

Poop JellyDec 13, 20151 votes

My personal perspective:

Mages are weak to Assassins – Assassins are weak to Tanks – Tanks are defeatable by Mages.

None of this is like 100% accurate, but that's how I view the cycle of 'counter'. ADCs can be unpredictable; they can slaughter anyone or could just be taken out under 2 seconds.

AquariusGineDec 13, 20151 votes

I don't think Tanks are defeatable by Mages, I can barely scratch a tank on any mage.

I feel that Mages now set up fights for bruisers and ADCs while providing somewhat lower than before AoE damage.

Poop JellyDec 13, 20151 votes

I think you meant to reply to my response from below, thank you first for that :).

My perspective, mages have an advantage of range with decently scaled damage. While ADCs provide more damage overall, they are too frail and less survivability, mages act as a second barrier that chips into the damage overall and sometimes including valuable CCs. It's also true of what you say, mages can provide engaging or safe opportunities for ADCs or bruisers to fight. Generally, tanks rarely can touch mages if both are played properly. Deadly mages are the ones who are untouched. So to answer your topic question, I do not think mages are weak, not with the right team.

Brendy BearDec 13, 20151 votes

Well if you're talking specifics. Items like giant slayer and LDR are destroying mages. Mages with around 2500hp will end up taking damage that's intended for tanks from those items. Also there's the CDR problem for mages as well.

CasterGilgameshDec 13, 20151 votes

mages are on an ok spot but they need some help like Lissandra Syndra Zyra Cassiopeia

TotN TitanDec 13, 20151 votes

Your mage of choice is your choice to be weak. Cassio has been in a bad spot for a while. If you were playing the likes of Orianna, Anivia, Malzahar, Lux, Ahri, Xerath, or Leblanc, you're doing a lot of damage and not necessarily playing that "supporty" role you are talking about. Mages are really strong, but late game scaling mages are not going hit their power spikes like those AD champions you mentioned. Some of those AD champs only need 1 and 1/2 items to put their force on the game in this preseason.