Honestly, it feels like there is just one build path for most mages.

xxxMadLionxxx·Sep 12, 2017·47 votes·1,726 views

And if the mage can use any of the highly nich ap items, they may swapping in one/two of the following .

Other than that, its almost always the same.

45 Comments

Bronze DemonSep 12, 201716 votes

item 3165 item 3020 item 3135 item 3089 + X + Y

Sad TyrantSep 13, 20171 votes

usually Zhonya's

FilDaFunkSep 13, 201713 votes

I haven't built Rabadon's for a while. It's usually item 3165 item 3020 item 3135 item 3157 then game finished.

SzGamer227Sep 13, 201713 votes

Let's not forget about item 3027 item 3116 item 3151 item 3135 item 3089 for the 2 or 3 mages that don't build CDR.

Handy Sandy Sep 13, 20179 votes

item 3089 ?

When's the last time you could actually afford to build this item?

SkorchSep 14, 20171 votes

Not gonna lie i build it near every game.

The 35% more AP is SO worth.

rtbf221651412Sep 14, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Not gonna lie i build it near every game.

The 35% more AP is SO worth.

I barely touch that. It's not worth the 35% AP because by the time you get enough for it to matter over utility, defensive items, and cc, the game is already ending.

DrakylonSep 13, 20177 votes

To be honest, item diversity across the board is dying. We have 1, maybe 2, and rarely 3, builds per role, plus a few niche options depending on the champion. Plus, I suppose, a fall-back defensive option for utility mages in case their lane doesn't go so well.

I think the biggest problem is that a lot of the items in the game are really just non-interactive stat sticks. There's always going an optimal way to build stats that gives you the most of the stats you need at the right times -- that's just math. And it doesn't help that the few actives and passives we do have are either incredibly general ( item 3165 ) or incredibly niche ( item 3115 item 3100 ).

Riot needs to make more itemization that has clear uses with clear disadvantages. Something similar to the two Hydras, or the Energized duo (before the most recent buff to Firecannon that removed any choice). Items should be phasing away from being mere stat sticks and having more of their power placed into their passives and actives.

MLDzXnRRRSep 13, 20171 votes

Lol never had imaginative itemization and most of the items were just stat sticks since forever. Actually, now you can buy more niche items with some actives than before (I started season 4)

SpoofghoulSep 13, 20171 votes

Items being stat sticks isn't really new

interesting passives and interactions aside this is their main function

But we could use some more interesting items for sure

Though in large the problem also lies with champion kits as they are often extremely similar, mages ten d to deal area damage and can burst and it scales with ap and they need mana and cdr to do this more often

so all mages who can do this build the same items and those items tend to be the ones who give the most bang for your bucks

ADC does the same

As do tanks

Although for tanks they could have more interesting options but then they still need to itemize against as many different damage types as they have item slots so they tend to be stuck with similar builds as well

Azir kinda breaks the mold for mages for example as he has different options, he can go bursty, something in between or dps, as far as dps is concerned attackspeed is the best stat he can get, it is stronger then magic pen or AP and guinsoo's is actually the strongest item he can get for dps

You can make a million different items for mages for example but most of them still want the same stats due to their kits so you end up with the same problem anyway they again build the same items over and over

ZT XperimentorSep 18, 20172 votes

Doesn't help riot keeps removing interesting options, but keeping worthless ones nobody uses.

CalabokSep 13, 20176 votes

MORE CHEAPER AP

ArakadiaSep 13, 20172 votes

This is a terrible joke.

commit an heroSep 13, 20175 votes

What no one in this meta build item 3089 it's too fucking expensive and the build path blows. If you look at Champion.GG and the most popular builds no one builds it (I know because I went through the 40ish mages and only Annie builds it). Right now the idea is to buy item 3020 item 3151 item 3135 item 3285 item 3165 and rely on your base damages + pen to delete someone. Mages in this current meta are legit garbage and outperformed by an ADC mid.

HaIlMonitorSep 13, 20174 votes

Do other champs not have the same problem? Assassins all build the same 3 items, adc's all build IE, 2 as/crit items, LW, Def item. Tanks just build whatever gives them the best stats at the moment.

SkelenthSep 13, 20174 votes

The problem here is that mages aren't a subclass of sorts. These are the builds for most AP users. AD itemization can be classified into Lethality, Crit/Attack Speed, and Flat. AP itemization doesn't have that variety because they only have one or two primary stats they invest in.

HaIlMonitorSep 14, 20171 votes

All of the AD stats are "unique" though. Some items like defensive items are good for everyone, but I dont build attack speed on Kha, and I dont build leathilty on Trist. I might just be bias, but I really dont see what new cool items AP needs to have outside of maybe a last whisper style item for AP.

Like what special and unique items do you even want for mages that they don;t already have a really get alternative. For example: GA doesn't really work because Zhonya's is arguably better.

KloqdqSep 13, 20174 votes

AP itemization is in a terrible spot. I really hope we see it get changed sooner rather than later because I love AP mages but hate these shitty build options.

DragonSheaSep 13, 20173 votes

Mages need more, I am not a mage main so I can't really tell what should be done.

PrinceOfStormsSep 13, 20172 votes

As a mage main, what should be done is a gutting of AD itemization, which is already out of control.

2Charmnot2CharmSep 13, 20173 votes

item 3089 When does the game ever last that long for you to get this item?

AhrisSep 13, 20173 votes

Because all other ap items were nerfed.

Tik115Sep 14, 20173 votes

It's because all the alternatives have been nerfed to hell

Mana regen? Well item 3070 Takes too long to stack item 3027 Takes too long and loses to Morellos instant stats and item 3174 is a pure support item...which loses to Ardent and MIkaels hard.

Utility? Yeah a nerfed slow on Rylais and Abysalls aura went onto a tank item

At this point its just brute force damage outside of like 4 mid laners

koshkyraSep 13, 20172 votes

item 3285 will sometimes replace item 3102 but other than that its the same thing 99% of the time

FilDaFunkSep 13, 20172 votes

Rabadon's is very rarely built. I end to go for item 3285 for poke mages, item 3146 for assassins (Ahri/LB)

crzymdscntstSep 13, 20172 votes

The things I think: Defensive items are lacking on the defensive focus, which is a weird complaint maybe, but compared to Marksman defensive options, you'll see a weird gap between options and potential applications. It'd be nice to be able to utilize those various health items in junction with a SR version of item 3170 .

Unpopular opinion of mine, but I think item 3157 as a defensive option is mechanically just bad, rather than creating interesting situation, it just becomes a stall. It fulfills a purpose, but not necessarily an interactive defensive one. I don't think it has really ever been actually healthy gameplay. (Think how annoying people find Vlad pool and Troll-pole Fizz.) The cases where it's used as what would be considered skillful gameplay are quite few when compared to general usage. (Hurr durr Karthus is using ulti.)

item 3165 has too much power for you to buy anything else.

item 3020 have almost never really changed, that magic pen being so core to actually dps'ing for anything else to be a reliable alternative choice.

item 3145 has the issue where it's on-hit becomes an active in EVERY SINGLE upgraded version. One for a dash and the other for a slow. (why slow?) The third is hybridized building with a high price. This doesn't create a fluid upgrade or an interesting change, but instead just trading one trick for a completely unrelated other trick.

And then: item 3070 item 3003 item 3040 When mana regen was a core thing for mages to really build around... These were a viable options. They went out of style, because Morello's provided a more sustainable option. MANA RUNS OUT. (Doesn't happen often, but you'll notice when it does.) Still work on certain champs, but doesn't really pinnacle in use until maxed out. CONGRATULATIONS... at this point it's mid-late game, your power gained is useless to a point and not really cost efficient. Still probably possible to build a late-game Seraph's and RoA, but the point you get there is completely underwhelmed by the point of the game you're actually at.

item 3027 is generally still good/okay, but takes 10 minutes to max out. It scales well up to that point, but becomes literally a stat-stick. Technically has has Eternity but...

item 3010 's eternity CAPS OUT. (15% of damage is gained as mana, 15% of mana spent is healed as health capping at 15/25 per spell cast. This makes it pretty good for sustained cast champs like Singed, Anivia and Swain, but pretty inefficient for anyone else. The cap is not the problem so much as the fact that even in-lane it's pretty underwhelming.

PePsiLemoNNSep 13, 20172 votes

And that's why mage items shouldn't be BUFFED , but changed/more items added.

GrizzlpawSep 13, 20172 votes

AurelionSol item 3030 item 3116 item 3151 item 3742 item 3135 item 3009

Cosmic Dragons don't need no dam meta

ZT XperimentorSep 18, 20171 votes

It's so fun playing him with mobility, though it's a problem going too fast XD

DengedenSep 13, 20172 votes

Replace the word mage with any other class and you'll see the pointlessness of your point.

ZapMyHeartSep 14, 20172 votes

item 3020 item 3165 item 3135 item 3151 item 3157 +1 free slot open.

Yay for diverse builds!

[sg-ahri-1]

DuskDaUmbreonSep 12, 20171 votes

Well, most mages do almost the same thing, so it'd make sense that they all build almost the same thing...

DivewingSep 13, 20179 votes

<MEANWHILE ADCS>

DuskDaUmbreonSep 13, 20173 votes

Most do the exact same thing, and have to build the exact same thing. Your variations are as highly limited for marksmen as they are for mages: The outliers are those that go Lethality/RoA+Tear.

Marksmen get item 3031 , item 3087 / item 3094 / item 3085 (depending on what you can actually use), item 3072 , item 3006 , item 3036 , and a choice between a second Zeal item, a defensive item, or Essence Reaver.

Mages get item 3165 , item 3102 , item 3020 , item 3135 , and a choice of two out of item 3089 , item 3157 , item 3146 , and item 3285 .

Itemization sucks across the board for everyone. Nobody has any choices, really.

Bishasaurus FlexSep 13, 20171 votes

Cept Burst Mages don't do DPS well, DPS/battle Mages have more consistent dmg and less burst, Artillery Mages have more range and good damage.

DuskDaUmbreonSep 13, 20171 votes

Artillery Mages are essentially just longer-range burst mages. There's more of a difference, but that's the core.

DPS/battle mages already buy different sets of items. They run Abyssal Mask or RoA, depending on their ratio of Battle to DPS (Diana wants AM, while Morg wants RoA), and DPS typically pick up Liandry's and Rylai's (items that few other mages use), while ones that are closer to bruisers (hi, again, Diana), will often take Nashor's and Gunblade.

As I said in a different comment, itemization kinda sucks for everyone. Each class has about one option.

WDG DevourSep 13, 20171 votes

Why and how is this a problem?

Sad TyrantSep 13, 20175 votes

because its most optimal, no build diversity or choice in the matter because you won't do as much damage or be as useful otherwise.

Serika ZeroSep 13, 20171 votes

That's why Akali and Katarina are more fun than mages. You need Gunblade on them and after that you can build whatever you want :)

MogarlSep 13, 20171 votes

item 3198 item 3100 [ item 3158 / item 3020 ] item 3135 [ item 3102 / item 3157 ] item 3089

As a Viktor main it's always weird looking at threads like this. I understand the problem, but at the end of the game half my items are not things you would typically see on other mages.

Imo nerf Morello buff Dcap. Any claims of me being biased are false.

Yordle XayahSep 13, 20171 votes

Karthus Excuse me...

item 3020 item 3027 item 3040 item 3135 item 3116 item 3089

Jerry SeinfeIdSep 13, 20171 votes

i prefer item 3020 item 3027 item 3151 item 3135 item 3116 item 3089 tbh, but i really don't like tear items.

CorvidSep 13, 20171 votes

Viktor says otherwise

ÈvilMortySep 13, 20171 votes

3 build paths 1) item 3165 item 3020 item 3285 item 3135 item 3089 item 3157 or item 3151 2) Same as 1 but take out 2 items of your choice to build item 3070 item 3027 item 3003 first 3) item 3152 item 3158 or item 3100 item 3146