lol nautilus gets damage nerfs before fiora

Danny DeVito·Mar 2, 2016·284 votes·10,322 views

lol riot

289 Comments

DrNovaMar 3, 201679 votes

There are plenty of champs that deserved a look before naut.

Bit Naut goes against the meta Riot is currently enforcing.

La BarbotteMar 3, 201675 votes

Rammus (shivering in panic for the next patches)

HahahahyenaMar 3, 201624 votes

shaky voice "ok"

THEJJSLAYMar 3, 201620 votes

rip rammus, our last defender against the ad overlords

Hello I am BirdMar 3, 20163 votes

Malphite ?

DJ S0NAMar 3, 201614 votes

E had damage nerf

Spaceman5pffMar 3, 20162 votes

IDK Malphite still feels good, and he STILL has a 50% ATTACK SPEED SLOW on his E

50%

HALVES ATTACK SPEED

CubedJusticeMar 3, 201617 votes

I play a lot of Naut, and I can say that he's a bit overbearing. He definitely was a bit too strong. However, Naut is nowhere as near a problem as Corki, Fiora, Kog'Maw, and not even as big of a problem as his cousin, Malphite.

InHaruhiWeTrustMar 3, 201629 votes

Fiora 49% winrate = big problem Nautilus 55% winrate = not that bad Udyr 54-59% winrate since season 5 = not worth mentioning....

bobsenbobMar 3, 201616 votes

I feel like people just exaggerate fioras power out of control every single qq thread. "Fiora is such easy faceroll champion, you just have to spam qq and hit vitals automatically, no skill involved and automatically wins every game she goes into" Her 49% winrate begs to disagree

Robbit MangMar 3, 20166 votes

its a 49% AVERAGE winrate on fiora. shitty new players on her have a garbage winrate of 46%, however EXPERIENCED players have almost a 57% winrate

shes so strong in the right hands its not even funny. the difference between her and ahri even though their winrates are similar in trend is that ahri is easier to play against than her with skillshot dodges etc. you cant dodge fioras autos, and fiora is not squishy if built correctly.

InHaruhiWeTrustMar 3, 20166 votes

experienced players for other champs Udyr have a 60% winrate Graves 60% Pantheon 58% Zed 58% Kayle 60% Quinn 62% Shyvana 62% Rammus 60% Volibear 59% Skarner 57% MasterYi 58% Talon 59% Garen 57% Singed 56% ffs lol Malphite 57% Poppy 59%

so yeah fiora..... lol

B1naryB0tMar 3, 20167 votes

Yorick 87.5% winrate with players of 125 games or more

4 1993Mar 4, 20164 votes

{quoted}

87.5% winrate with players of 125 games or more

This made me spit soda on my laptop.

TotalJerkMar 3, 201652 votes

This circlejerk is getting so obnoxious. Naut's current state in the toplane is totally indefensible. He literally holds the top winrate AND playrate for the toplane at the same time. As a matter of fact, not only does he have the highest winrate toplane. He has the second highest winrate PERIOD.

Odyssey85Mar 3, 201633 votes

That is definitely true, currently standing at a 55.3% win rate for top, with his support at a pretty solid 51.95%. Maybe they could instead nerf the base damage on his E, but could compensate for maybe his jungling capabilities, such as make it so his E does increasing damage as monster get hit by the riptides? Or perhaps stun monsters when hit by the riptide? It would be interesting to see how that would work

Sire HippingtonMar 3, 201620 votes

lux does the same thing mid ever since her Q buff...and still no nerfs. Naut is top win/playrate toplaner for one patch and instantly falls victim to the nerf hammer. Just that nauti mostly is an product of the meta, while lux has seen multiple meta shifts without performing any worse... And janna is **constantly **in the top 3 best performing since YEARS...

...but hey, no doublstandarts for suportive mages(from both, riot and the community)

Tobias BracknerMar 3, 20161 votes

Naut isn't supposed to be a toplane monster asshole.

Lux is designed to be a midlaner.

da gloriousMar 3, 20165 votes

Blitzcrank wasn't meant to be a support. Diana wasn't meant to be a midlander. Just because it's not their intended role doesn't mean riot stops it from happening. They did for top fizz and jg ekko for the most part, but they don't always.

Sire HippingtonMar 3, 20163 votes

the didn't stop top fizz or jungle ekko, they stopped fulltank ekko and tanky ad fizz. Ap fizz still works and always worked top, same with more ap focused ekkos in the jungle

Timely VoidlingMar 3, 201653 votes

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YCitizenSnipsYMar 3, 201611 votes

The sad thing is I don't know why you are trying to be sarcastic.

Naut isn't supposed to be doing damage with how tanky he can get and how much CC he has.

Fiora is supposed to do a lot of damage. What in the hell would nerfing her damage solve if she isn't supposed to be a tank?

WadeWilson1337Mar 3, 201645 votes

Correction. Fiora is supposed to do alot of damage when she builds for damage. She is intended to be a glass cannon, but with how much %hp true damage she has, she can go practically full tank with item 3748 item 3071 and erase squishies and destroy tanks while being quite possibly the strongest duelist in the entire meta right now.

YCitizenSnipsYMar 3, 20169 votes

Then what would be the point of giving her a nerf like what Naut just received. That would just make her use the same build she does now with less success, but be even worse for her to go full damage. Just nerfing Fiora's damage is so ass backwards I can't even comprehend why you think its a good idea.

XicashinaMar 3, 201625 votes

By lowering the base damage on abilities you in turn make it so that while not building damage, the champion deals less damage. If you lower the scaling then you are making it worse for the full damage build. The nautilus changes were a lowering of base damages so I believe that "Wade's" argument still stands.

YCitizenSnipsYMar 3, 20164 votes

Riot is nerfing Nautilus' ability to do damage. That is the whole point of this nerf. To complain that Fiora hasn't recieved the same treatment implies that Riot should also be nerfing her ability to deal damage.

Why would they do that? Since by the upvotes on this everyone is in agreement with OP that a nerf just like what Naut just received is appropriate for Fiora.

KillerKellMar 3, 20169 votes

So what they SHOULD be doing is nerfing her impact to build Tank... with lower starting Armor, Health and MR and their Per Level Counterparts that even 'building tank' isn't going to give her 'enough tank' to matter, thus making buying Full Damage the better option.

But here is the problem I have... I should be able to build as I want. If I want Boots and 5 Defensive Items, cool. If I want Boots and 5 Offensive Items, cool. If I want Boots and 2 Offensive with 3 Defensive, cool. What ever I can make work.

There should be no 'Best Build Path'. There should be Paths that are better than other, but due to subjectivity and situation no 'One Build to Rule Them All'.

CavemanteroMar 3, 20164 votes

dream on. you're talking about 120+ champs.

KillerKellMar 3, 20163 votes

How does that change no 'Best Build Path'?

I'm talking CLEARLY better.

So far, there aren't really many 'Best Builds'. Take Yi... what's his BEST Build?

Depends... how good are you at playing Yi?

Sure you get a ton of Damage out of Glass Cannon, but eat just one CC and you are insta-dead. Even with the emergence of Tank Yi, you still go Sated (that's a lock) but have an option between BotRK or Rageblade.

Or you take both... but now you've lost one of the Defensive Items in the Build.

With Yi, there is no Best Build Path... but there are some Items considered Core to build off of, and this is great.

So I'm not saying there is (much) of an Issue with 'Best Build Path'... but I'm saying pushing things to far in one direction CAN lead to that. So if they do as I suggest... blasting the Fiora Base Defensive and Per Level numbers, it would virtually FORCE players to just go Glass Cannon.

I like having options, not being forced into a certain direction. And this really goes for every Champion. Riot shouldn't shove a Champion so far one way on Base and Per Level as to make it virtually mandatory to invalidate complete item sets.

SuicideJMar 3, 20161 votes

I totally agree with you dude. I'm the same way. Riot feels the need to force us to do what they want, play what they want, and enforce what they want. I hate it. If my buddy and I wanna go voli and sej bottom lane to wreck face, then we want to go bottom to wreck face. Just leave us alone Riot. I hate being limited to the same items every game because nothing else works..

KillerKellMar 3, 20162 votes

People get so caught up in the Meta.

The problem is, the Meta only exists because the Top 1% of the World can squeeze everything out of it. Simply put, the Average Player isn't good enough for the Meta to matter.

No once a player gains enough Mechanical Skill, and once a player is with Team Mates that can Effectively Communicate... Meta starts to really have an impact.

But let's say "Cinderhulk" or "Sunfire Cape" is a 'MUST ITEM' on Champion X. What if I'm not good at sticking to opponents to get more Damage Ticks on them? Then I'm wasting a ton of the reason I got the Cinder or Sunfire. But let's say I'm really good at finding people to pick off. Well now Mobility and perhaps some Burst with it could be helpful... like Deadman's Plate.

So I'm not mechanically skilled enough to pull off that 'Meta' Build, but I can absolutely adapt a build that fits my play style with said Champion. THAT is what should matter.

I had a friend, way better than me (Plat+) and he made a smurf to play with me. Usually we played legit, but his skill level was really high so sometimes we'd go Off-Meta for more fun (yes, we have done Thresh/Blitzcrank Hook City... we also did a Deny CS with Quinn/Teemo). He went Zed ADC. Even I was like... umm... you sure about that? I grab my Leona, he proceeds to crap all over our Enemies in Lane then hard carries with one of the rare 30 Kill Games I've seen, while still hitting objectives with the Team.

The Enemy Lane had no clue how to Duo Lane vs. a Zed that had a Leona. Likely they knew how to Duo against another ADC/Support Lane... but simply going Off Meta completely destroyed them.

If you can dominate as Zed, and your best chance to Win is to play Zed... play Zed, and screw the Meta. But try to ensure your Zed has a positive impact on the Team Comp.

Meta only matters at the Higher End of Skill and Communication... but you got people in Bronze flaming because some one bought this instead of that or took X Champion to Y Lane.

Just like those crying in Q that they lost in Pick/Ban... Pick/Ban ONLY matters if you know what the Enemy Team is good at or weak against. And since we don't get to see who we are playing until AFTER Pick/Ban and we're loading in, it means it's Blind Luck in Pick/Ban Phase in Solo Q.

NineTailedMysticMar 3, 20162 votes

Yea, but in Fiora's case, not deleting everything while being nearly impossible to kite and never dying, where the damage is only available because of item 3748

Timely VoidlingMar 3, 201625 votes

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YCitizenSnipsYMar 3, 20165 votes

NO I'm not. Nautilus is a tank and shouldn't be doing damage. Fiora is a fighter and should be. Why the fuck would they nerf her damage, tell me what she has that qualifies her as a tank. One conditional CC and no natural tankyness.

Why would they nerf her damage when she is supposed to do a lot of damage. If she is doing a lot of damage while building tanky, then you don't nerf the thing she is supposed to be doing. You nerf the thing she isn't supposed to be doing well, like they did with Naut.

Christ G&B are so biased its fucking unreal. Thank god riot ignores your balancing suggestions.

charcharmunroMar 3, 201622 votes

Tanks SHOULD do some damage, otherwise they're just meatwalls of CC.

QNjixEktAnMar 3, 20163 votes

This is actually what a tank should be. A giant meat wall that only really locks you down but can't kill you unless you stand there for like 2 minutes. But in league this is what tanks really do. 10 seconds later after being cc'd by the 1 tank champion I die without being able to do anything cause the insane amount of cc, damage, and tank stats they have. Malphite is a example of a scum tank designed forced into having crazy burst damage cause riot can't balance classes how they should actually work.

The game has little true strategy to it cause riot games just overloads champions. You just pick the overloaded champions who ever they are in the seasons and you win with them. Then wait til next rebuff and then repick new overloaded champions for that season. Keep repeating and you are a Pro league player now.

charcharmunroMar 3, 201611 votes

Okay, rather, here's my point. Tanks shouldn't do too much damage if they have a lot of reliable CC. Alistar does piddling damage if built full-tank, but he's incredibly reliable and also probably the tankiest tank ever with his ult. Sion has a lot of CC, but it's also unreliable, and so does quite a lot of damage and his defensive abilities aren't too great. Nautilus, I will fully admit, is actually rather out of line with how much damage he does for how reliable he is and how great his defensive abilities are.

Champion SkinMar 3, 20165 votes

Okay... so what you want is force all supports to play tanks as that is the only place tanks would ever work... That is basically what removing tanks damage would do

YCitizenSnipsYMar 3, 20162 votes

Again. Riot nerfed Nautalis specifically for how much damage he does while being a meatwall of CC. This is because Naut shouldn't be doing as much damage as he does while being a meatwall of CC.

Why would the same nerf to Fiora or nerfs to her damage potential even be close to appropriate if she is supposed to do a lot of damage. Hitting her ability to make use of tanky builds seems a whole lot smarter than nerfing the damage of a champion designed to do damage.

charcharmunroMar 3, 201616 votes

Hitting her base values WOULD hit her ability to make use of tanky builds. If she had lower base values, she'd need more damage items to actually DO damage.

YCitizenSnipsYMar 3, 20162 votes

And that would not be a damage nerf since her ability to deal damage would be retained. What you are suggesting is exactly what they just did to Naut, hitting something he shouldn't do to preserve what he can do.

The whole point of this thread is that Fiora should get damage nerfs. That doesn't make since she is supposed to do a lot of damage.

charcharmunroMar 3, 201610 votes

Yeah, she is supposed to do a lot of damage. The problem is her base values are so high that she can build mostly tanky and STILL do an absurd amount of damage. So chunking her base values down means full glass cannon builds are actually... Logical to do instead of just a luxury.

La BarbotteMar 2, 201630 votes

some champions arent allowed to be good

charcharmunroMar 3, 201614 votes

Looking at your name gives me a good idea who you're on about.

La BarbotteMar 3, 201613 votes

no idea who you're talking about (kappa)

TotalJerkMar 3, 20164 votes

Nautilus is statistically the best performing top laner in the game right now. It isn't even close.

La BarbotteMar 3, 20163 votes

yes, and like everysingle time nautilus got good at something (jungler, support, top lane) hes been nerfed, hes played mid in the LCK now so watch rito break his legs

spavinedMar 3, 20164 votes

He isn't just good at something he is the BEST at something, he is not only the highest win-rate top laner but he is also the highest play-rate top laner

La BarbotteMar 3, 20162 votes

well cc and tankieness win games so yeah i agree, yet riot prefer nerfing that before dmg dealer that are meant to be squishies but build tank and still dish out crazy dps