Is Ancient Coin Still Even An item?

Professor Ward·Feb 1, 2016·2 votes·612 views

Just wondering

13 Comments

RavenhaleFeb 1, 20161 votes

I still grab it on several Utility mages that don't poke enough to justify Spell Thief. I miss the Movespeed bonus of Nomad's. With Nomad getting nerfed and the removal of Twin Shadows, my supports feel so much slower.

Edit: For Math's Sake, Coin will get you 4x6 (24) Gold every 30 seconds simply for standing in a bush. Thief will get you 6 + 8x3 (30) Gold every 30 seconds assuming you proc all three strikes. That's 6 more gold every 30 seconds for a sizable increase in risk. It reduces to 2 more gold for Cannon minion waves. For this reason, I tend to only grab Thief with Supports that can easily get 3 procs with almost no retaliation (Sona and Lulu come to mind).

There's a more notable difference in value for the upgrades. Nomad will get you 6x6 (36) Gold while Fang will get you 6 + 15x3 (51).

AbyssphereFeb 1, 20162 votes

{quoted}

I still grab it on several Utility mages that don't poke enough to justify Spell Thief. I miss the Movespeed bonus of Nomad's. With Nomad getting nerfed and the removal of Twin Shadows, my supports feel so much slower.

Edit: For Math's Sake, Coin will get you 4x6 (24) Gold every 30 seconds simply for standing in a bush. Thief will get you 6 + 8x3 (30) Gold every 30 seconds assuming you proc all three strikes. That's 6 more gold every 30 seconds for a sizable increase in risk. It reduces to 2 more gold for Cannon minion waves. For this reason, I tend to only grab Thief with Supports that can easily get 3 procs with almost no retaliation (Sona and Lulu come to mind).

There's a more notable difference in value for the upgrades. Nomad will get you 6x6 (36) Gold while Fang will get you 6 + 15x3 (51).

Don't forget that after the laning phase, the Coin line typically falls off harder than the Spellthief line in terms of gold income. The lack of passive gold gen on Coin means that any time spent roaming/warding is time when you're not collecting gold, which is untrue of Spellthief's Edge/Relic Shield. Unless you're spending a lot of time sieging in the mid and late game, Coin's income basically falls off a cliff past the laning phase. Relic Shield and Spellthief's fall off too, but they have the 2gp10 passives to fall back on.

RavenhaleFeb 1, 20161 votes

Well, it's not something I notice because of Runes. Since I don't base my Utility mages around poke, there's no Reds that really appeal to me. I end up grabbing Armor Reds and take one Armor Yellow to end up with the usual Armor you get from taking all Armor Yellows. This allowed me to fill my other Yellow slots with GP/10 for an effective 2 GP/10 anyways.

YumifriesFeb 1, 20161 votes

Honestly I wonder the same thing. So far I only found it useful to take on soraka. Spellthief and Relic are used pretty much everywhere else :l

OleandervineFeb 1, 20161 votes

I actually like the Coin line on Tahm Kench. While I understand that the shield directly benefits his R's passive, I find that the mana and HP regen benefit Tahm early game and help him poke more frequently without having to get potions or go back.

GrashnimFeb 1, 20161 votes

It's about 99% useless.

Dominick DestineFeb 1, 20161 votes

It's pretty good now that FCQ has been gutted.

AbyssphereFeb 1, 20161 votes

Only on Soraka. Riot properly gutted the line during the pre-season.

Problem is it's hard to complain about them doing that. Talisman being stronger than Frost Queen's last season was silly and led to stupid stuff like AP poke supports starting Spellthief's, then selling it for Talisman (which is just not gold efficient as a strategy at all). On top of that, Coin is unlike the other gold income items in that there is zero risk whatsoever to gaining its gold. An item with no gameplay or risk attached to it outdoing items that involve actually doing stuff probably shouldn't exist, so it's hard to actually advocate for Coin not being the worst gold income item even though one of them being rubbish is an objectively bad situation.

I know this thread isn't asking for a big debate or anything but I personally feel that Ancient Coin needs a rework. The Talisman active is great and the sustain aspect is great, but everything about its gold generation and complete lack of combat stats is just ugh.

Slamurai JackFeb 1, 20161 votes

People will figure out how good it is again as their obsession with FQC fades.

AbyssphereFeb 1, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Slamurai Jack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c8cqnl0X,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2016-02-01T18:06:35.368+0000)

People will figure out how good it is again as their obsession with FQC fades.

What's good about it though? It's lost stats, it's active has had its cooldown increased and its gold income has been made less reliable. It's a major stepdown from season 5 Coin/Talisman.

Slamurai JackFeb 1, 20161 votes

Gold gain going from 3/4/4 to 4/6/6 is a significant buff to the gold generation of the line and the active is still as useful as ever even with the increased CD. The item's are fine. Build them on the like of Janna and Soraka just like you always did.