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Excuse me Riot but... Why is Cait getting nerfed?

Skorch··3 votes·435 views

Caitlyn HP per level increased form 80 to 85 Base HP lowered from 524.4 to 450 Attack speed per level increased from 2 to 4 Base HP regen lowered from 1.1348 to 1.13 Headshot (Passive) attacks for free headshot increased from 6 to 8.

Piltover Peacemaker (Q) damage to targets beyond first lowered from 50% less to 33% less.

Yordle Snap Trap (W) Mana cost increased from 20 at all ranks to 30 at all ranks Headshot damage increase increased from 10/55/100/145/190 to 40/90/140/190/240 Bonus AD changed from 60% to 40/55/70/85/100% Trap ground duration lowered from 90 seconds to 30/40/50/60/70 seconds

Um sure. Q pierce is better... Attackspeed increased... after it was nerfed twice... Trap damage up. But EVERYTHING else is a nerf.

They removed Runnan synergy, then increased number for headshot? Are we trying to Azir Cait? are we bringing her to a 35% winrate where she can rot until a rework?

Excuse me Riot but are you aware that Caitlyn is sitting on a 44% WINRATE? WHAT?

What is this?

Edit: Ah yes i forgot defending garbage champs that are hated is taboo MB boards : ^)

27 Comments

Ahris4 votes

imo Caitlyn should have the lowest base hp in game for how safe she is. She has the longest range autos and traps to secure her position. She has a net to give her a short dash to reposition as well. I consider that Caitlyn should have the lowest health as she is the safest and never needs to go close.

Skorch1 votes

With damage as it currently is I disagree.

Sure you could say that if you get close she can die. But when she is laning against other ranged champions with near 200 base HP on her, it isnt okay.

If damage was 1/3rd of what it is now or every champion started with 150 more Base HP than right now, I would be A-OK with her having lowest Base HP. But since Ez can 4 shot her, Draven can 2 shot her. Im uh gonna say that its too much.

Ahris1 votes

She has more range than both Draven and Ez. She is safer than the two of them as well. She should lose her lane for being too safe. Why does she also have a strong early and also decent late? Champ like Cait needs weak early, average mid, and weak late like Ahri. But Ahri should have stronger late game due to requiring to go 300 range of her target to burst, which cait does not ever need to do.

Skorch2 votes

I disagree on Weak Average Weak. That sounds like its an uphill battle just to survive. You should be GOOD sometime otherwise there is no point in picking that champion.

Ahris1 votes

Riot did that to Ahri and people consider her balanced. So yeah and their reasonings go "Ahri is not supposed to do damage." Funny. VERY FUNNY. HAHAHAHAHAHA.

I really don't care. I rather have all champs ruined like Ahri.

Skorch1 votes

Its because there were 2 patches where she was 53% winrate and people went apeshit.

Solari Fortune1 votes

The is actually a Buff it was worded weirdly Basically it less fall off for everything past the first hit. So more damage when going through multiple targets

Skorch1 votes

"sure. Q pierce is better" I know it was a buff. But so much else is getting nerfed.

Base Stats nerf, Passive Nerf, The trap change is okay, but it only BARELY isnt a nerf.

Overall most of her is getting nerfed when she is already one of the worst champions in the game.

Solari Fortune1 votes

Her Passive also now works on towers btw

Skorch1 votes

Dont see that anywhere. But i still am saying that that isnt fixing much.

Solari Fortune1 votes

https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-leRUVMqi2fg/WbmrWoESM4I/AAAAAAAAuWQ/eXjr1ttrpkspTfrpuMZh4ZXoFne55mU1gCLcBGAs/s1600/DJonDpHVwAAsaGb.jpg

Skorch1 votes

Ah they updated it since i last looked. But i still say that that doesnt justify the other changes on a 44% winrate champion.

Solari Fortune1 votes

Honestly things on Paper can be way different to things in practice so we will just have to see how this actually feels like in game

Skorch1 votes

Not wrong. However considering 75% of this is a nerf. I still am guessing not well.

Luckily some things on PBE DO change so if Caits winrate drops 10% on PBE they will probably change it.

Solari Fortune1 votes

we got 2 weeks and they already noted the HP change was a little harsh

Skorch1 votes

Exactly. But where did they say this?

ZapMyHeart1 votes

Her AS increase doubled per level, which is a pretty huge buff. Hence also the reason to change the Headshot to 8 instead of 6, due to the increased AS.

They are shifting her from being an obnoxious laner into a more late game ADC, as she should have been in the first place. Before, she was an annoying and safe laner, with an okay mid lane, and frustrating late game. Plus with her E, she is an escape/chase artist. Nerfing her base survivability forces her to better position herself rather than get caught, press E, and then retaliate.

The changes is to shift her power towards applying more Headshots with the AS buff and less reliant on enemies stepping on her traps for that burst. The trap burst is still there, but it hurts less and removes the toxic zoning capabilities in early game, while making it more deadly in late game.

Skorch1 votes

They had already nerfed her AS twice, plus removed synergy with Runnans.

I dont know if you play Cait, but after the nerfs her AS is AWFUL. Like Insanely slow. Her AS was damn near 1 of her autos taking the time for 1.5 of most other ADCs.

Dont get me wrong i am a-ok with the nerf to her trap duration. However i dont know why you are giving her a 40% Buff and a 60% nerf on an already garbage champion.

And correct me if Im wrong. But isnt she SUPPOSED to be an annoying and safe champion? Isnt that the entire point of her E.

Im not saying she was perfect before. But these changes arent right for how well she is doing right now.

She doesnt need a strategy switch to everything every other ADC already does (currently better) She needs a flat buff, plain and simple.

2 AS growth per level doesnt make up for 2 more AAs AT ALL.

ZapMyHeart1 votes

{quoted}

They had already nerfed her AS twice, plus removed synergy with Runnans.

I dont know if you play Cait, but after the nerfs her AS is AWFUL. Like Insanely slow. Her AS was damn near 1 of her autos taking the time for 1.5 of most other ADCs.

Dont get me wrong i am a-ok with the nerf to her trap duration. However i dont know why you are giving her a 40% Buff and a 60% nerf on an already garbage champion.

And correct me if Im wrong. But isnt she SUPPOSED to be an annoying and safe champion? Isnt that the entire point of her E.

Im not saying she was perfect before. But these changes arent right for how well she is doing right now.

She doesnt need a strategy switch to everything every other ADC already does (currently better) She needs a flat buff, plain and simple.

2 AS growth per level doesnt make up for 2 more AAs AT ALL.

They are returning her bonus AS that they nerfed a few patches ago, which would make her a lot better. The Q damage increases also plays into her long-range theme.

Runaans should have never interacted with her in the first place, due to how strong her passive is to deal extra damage.

If she wants to be an annoying and safe champion, then we can nerf her to the point where she doesn't do any damage. She can stay annoying and safe by doing small pokes instead. You don't get to be annoying, safe, and deal burst-like damage at the same time. Something has to give.

Look at the changes after they are implemented for awhile before demanding a flat buff. As it stands on paper, she'll be less annoying in early game, while still having a godly late game.

Skorch1 votes

Excuse me but doesnt EVERY Marksman have a godly late game? What does this do?

But you know what. Fine i will sit for another patch and watch her winrate drop more. I am not a Cait main so its not do or die for me. I am A-OK with a champion being gutted for people to learn what balancing is.

Cause i am telling you right now either she will become even more of a right-click bot like every other ADC and manage 50%, or she will be even worse. Those are the only 2 options. No more counterplay or anything that people actually want.

ZapMyHeart1 votes

{quoted}

Excuse me but doesnt EVERY Marksman have a godly late game? What does this do?

But you know what. Fine i will sit for another patch and watch her winrate drop more. I am not a Cait main so its not do or die for me. I am A-OK with a champion being gutted for people to learn what balancing is.

Cause i am telling you right now either she will become even more of a right-click bot like every other ADC and manage 50%, or she will be even worse. Those are the only 2 options. No more counterplay or anything that people actually want.

Don't be so dramatic. At least they are looking into her fairly quickly to assess her issues.

The changes curbs her obnoxious early game. Not all ADCs have a frustrating early game like Caitlyn does (except maybe Draven, but even he doesn't come that close either). ADCs are meant to have a strong late game. They aren't supposed to have an equally strong early game as well, which Caitlyn does.

If the changes aren't enough, they will simply buff her. It's really not that hard. Considering that she's getting changes within a few patches, it's not like Rito will leave her in the gutter for very long unlike certain champions (e.g. Morde).

Skorch1 votes

What i am saying is we will 100% see. What upsets me is they are meta-shifting a bad champion. No one can argue she is bad right now. And if they change what she does. She will just become what everyone already complains about. Instead of making her a higher skillcap champion they (as you say) are making her more of a rightclick bot.

Sure I am a little upset. But only because this does nothing. In the end we will see. But i wont be surprised if they need to buff her still.

ZapMyHeart1 votes

{quoted}

What i am saying is we will 100% see. What upsets me is they are meta-shifting a bad champion. No one can argue she is bad right now. And if they change what she does. She will just become what everyone already complains about. Instead of making her a higher skillcap champion they (as you say) are making her more of a rightclick bot.

Sure I am a little upset. But only because this does nothing. In the end we will see. But i wont be surprised if they need to buff her still.

She was always a right-click bot. She's an ADC after all. She was never a caster ADC like Ez or MF. You're just used to the OP burst damage from her Headshot passive via W or E. Her old kit never had that insane power. They are curbing that and returning her more to her roots. But at the same, they are retaining the burst power of her W, but with some counterplay.

rtbf2216514121 votes

Should I take this post seriously?

Skorch1 votes

Did you follow me here?

rtbf2216514121 votes

{quoted}

Did you follow me here?

Nope. And now I am reading it again.

I'm looking at the hp per level. Do you know if that actually is a nerf at level 18?

Serious.

Skorch2 votes

It is a buff of 15HP at level 18. Hardly worth the 75HP drop in laning phase making you much more vulnerable.

Like 1 maybe even 2 attacks more vulnerable.

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