Jinx and Janna have no bad matchups and no reasons to not pick them. (other than inexperiance)

MealReadytoEat·Aug 15, 2015·4 votes·1,647 views

Janna and Jinx are the two highest win rate and second highest pick rate supports and adc's respectively, and are unsurprisingly the highest win rate combination.

But its more than just gross win rate, they literally both have no counter picks as well. Janna has a better than 50% win rate against EVERY ADC, Jinx has a better than 49.88% win rate against every ADC. Janna counters every support except blitz and taric, apparently, but her win rates are still higher than 49.6% against them, with Jinx in a similar boat.

Together, they will manage to win against any other combination more than half the time. This is Strength without weaknesses, this is low risk/high reward.

12 Comments

Kal Vas FlamAug 15, 20153 votes

Jinx is freelo safe-pick garbage that needs a rework or something. Janna is a safe pick into just about any team as you said, but actually requires some skill to play well. Janna is also hard counted by grabs (but of course they have to be able to land them). There is no counter to Jinx.

Karen KujoAug 15, 20152 votes

http://img1.ak.crunchyroll.com/i/spire2/06132008/f/c/5/1/fc5186c35b5260_full.gif

Yep, both are freewin, and together with Annie, I never see any of them losing a game unless one of the other 3 is in the other side.

Sadly you're getting downvoted because, after all, they are both freelo and really popular, so their mains will downvote you, nothing new :(

MealReadytoEatAug 15, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=Haruhi Suzumíya,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aKNBHxNu,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-08-15T19:40:10.355+0000)

http://img1.ak.crunchyroll.com/i/spire2/06132008/f/c/5/1/fc5186c35b5260_full.gif

Yep, both are freewin, and together with Annie, I never see any of them losing a game unless one of the other 3 is in the other side.

Sadly you're getting downvoted because, after all, they are both freelo and really popular, so their mains will downvote you, nothing new :(

Yup

KlubhouseAug 15, 20152 votes

Hmmmm....

I'm not experienced with Jinx, but I do play a bit of Janna, one of my favorite supports.

I think what makes Janna so strong is the fact that she's viewed as the number one peeler in the game. In a game where Tanky-supports who start fights are the top dog style of supporting, Janna's kit is naturally strong against it because thats what she was designed to counter in the first place.

may I ask where you got that information from? I'm not casting doubt on it, I would just like to see it as well it sounds interesting.

as for Janna having "no" counter picks, well, I'm not so sure. I would classify Janna as a sustain/peeler type of support (She "sustains" her adc by stopping fights that are bad for them and preserving health.) She doesn't have too much poke, unless you count her tornado as poke, but people don't/shouldn't think of her tornado as a source of damage by as a way to stop high priority dashes and dives onto the backline, (and in a game where dashes and mobility has become the norm, a spell that could interrupt that would be highly valued.)

I think Janna is weakest to poke-style supporting... oddly enough because her sustain-style of supporting isn't in the traditional sense like heals or anything. She sustains by stopping fights, and well poking is not fighting. Janna can only do one thing in a poke lane: her shield, and she has to have quick reaction times to negate that poke, and if she has to spam her shield a lot just to mitigate that damage. Eventually she's going to go OOM, allowing the opponents to rush in for the kill.

But poke-support style is not all that popular right now, as most supports now a days bring some sort of cc or tankiness to the table. It would make sense for Janna to have a higher than average win-rate because her kit was designed to counter the exact kind of tanky-cc play style thats so prominent right now.

MealReadytoEatAug 15, 20152 votes

{quoted}

Hmmmm....

I'm not experienced with Jinx, but I do play a bit of Janna, one of my favorite supports.

I think what makes Janna so strong is the fact that she's viewed as the number one peeler in the game. In a game where Tanky-supports who start fights are the top dog style of supporting, Janna's kit is naturally strong against it because thats what she was designed to counter in the first place.

may I ask where you got that information from? I'm not casting doubt on it, I would just like to see it as well it sounds interesting.

as for Janna having "no" counter picks, well, I'm not so sure. I would classify Janna as a sustain/peeler type of support (She "sustains" her adc by stopping fights that are bad for them and preserving health.) She doesn't have too much poke, unless you count her tornado as poke, but people don't/shouldn't think of her tornado as a source of damage by as a way to stop high priority dashes and dives onto the backline, (and in a game where dashes and mobility has become the norm, a spell that could interrupt that would be highly valued.)

I think Janna is weakest to poke-style supporting... oddly enough because her sustain-style of supporting isn't in the traditional sense like heals or anything. She sustains by stopping fights, and well poking is not fighting. Janna can only do one thing in a poke lane: her shield, and she has to have quick reaction times to negate that poke, and if she has to spam her shield a lot just to mitigate that damage. Eventually she's going to go OOM, allowing the opponents to rush in for the kill.

But poke-support style is not all that popular right now, as most supports now a days bring some sort of cc or tankiness to the table. It would make sense for Janna to have a higher than average win-rate because her kit was designed to counter the exact kind of tanky-cc play style thats so prominent right now.

Janna is very strong in poke comps though, because she peels. Their is no comp were Janna is a bad pick, although she's not always the best pick. Links are on the name's Janna and Jinx.

If the issue was simply the meta favoring that champion, you'd see a large discrepancy in win rates vs various champions. Look at Vayne for instance - Even though her play rate is #1 and her win rate is currently quite good, she still has many bad matchups for her that drop her win rate to less than 46%.

Jinx and Janna are simply overtunned right now.

DJ Di0Aug 15, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Janna is very strong in poke comps though, because she peels. Their is no comp were Janna is a bad pick, although she's not always the best pick. Links are on the name's Janna and Jinx.

.......You can peel poke?

"Dw lucian I'll knock up that Varus Q for you"

You can shield one person, sure, but against an actual /comp/ that is focused on poking instead of diving she's nowhere as useful.

MealReadytoEatAug 15, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=DJ Di0,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aKNBHxNu,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2015-08-15T20:15:33.846+0000)

.......You can peel poke?

"Dw lucian I'll knock up that Varus Q for you"

You can shield one person, sure, but against an actual /comp/ that is focused on poking instead of diving she's nowhere as useful.

I'm saying if she's in a poke comp, she's good because she can prevent engage.

She also has a huge shield, and very strong heal (although that has a long CD). She's decent against poke comps too.

KlubhouseAug 16, 20151 votes

Janna is very strong in poke comps though, because she peels. <

I am sure Janna is very strong in a poke comp. What I said though was that Janna was weak to poke style comps. As in, if you want to counter Janna, play a poke-style support. Although, as I've mentioned, poke-style supporting is under-represented right now, under tuned, so the champions that naturally "Should" counter Janna don't have the presence they need.

If the issue was simply the meta favoring that champion, you'd see a large discrepancy in win rates vs various champions. Look at Vayne for instance - Even though her play rate is #1 and her win rate is currently quite good, she still has many bad matchups for her that drop her win rate to less than 46%. <

This is indeed true, but take a closer look at some of the other champions that "counter" Janna the hardest. Do you notice a common theme?

50.63 % Sona 52.21 % Zyra 52.4 % Zilean 52.31 % Velkoz 52.35 % etc etc...

Its only by a few percentage, but enough to take notice. All these supports that show a noticeable decrease are poke champs, which, as I've said before, is a play-style that is a bit under tuned at the moment.

Also, with Vayne, the reason why she's so prominent right now is because :

A) A lot of the top jungles right now are devourer, on-hit type champions that synergies extremely well with Vayne (TLDR: Teamwork is OP) pair her with a Shyvana and shred through tanks like paper.

B) The traditional lane bullies like Lucian have been nerfed and under tuned allowing Vayne's greatest weakness: her early game, to go fairly neutral.

Thinking about this in terms of Janna you see very similar things:

A) A lot of the top supports are tanky-engage supports which Janna Excels at fighting against (Teamwork OP)

B) Janna's greatest weakness: Poke-style supporting is underperforming and don't see a whole lot of play allowing Janna to flourish. (People don't even like upgrading their frost-queen's claim, the poke-support item, They only get the first upgrade and sell it off later for a Nomads or face of the Mountain).

Also, on a side note, why does this web site Cite multiple champions as champions that "counter" Janna, but then show these same champions on the list that Janna counters? trippy.

Rabid HuskyAug 15, 20152 votes

well you can argue the same for almost every adc.jinx main strengths are her e trapping for engage or runnimg, her attack speed/higher splash damage lower attack speed q, with a execution that needs you to be a pretty considerable ways away to do real damage. then you have caitlyn who has the longest early game attack range, with a passive that is close to a free crit, a poke thats quicker than varus' since you can just throw it out, basicly a dash with a slow in front of you that also isnt shown till everythings out, and a root that lasts as long as a teemo shroom that does a bit of dot roots and reveals whoever stands on them,not to mention a unmissable long range ult that needs their teamates paying attention to stop. then theres varus with his hp% magic damage that gives every one of his spells much more value than alot of other adc, a long range poke ,and a root that potentially spreads to everyone else on the enemy team. i really could go on about this for every adc except maybe ashe, graves, twitch, and sivir.

the reason why jinx has a higher win rate is synergy she synergies really well with every support and with her own compact cc she can lead combos to help act off her supports plays or try to make her own. as for janna i think klubhouse got it down to a T and they both do have weakness jinx is higher attack speed but needs to get close if she goes longer range she gets considerable attack speed decrease her w is super telegraphed and her e is just as obvious but works greatly if her support helps and her ult does like 50 damage with 30% missing hp if she uses it in your face remember that .as for janna shes super squishy i once played a game as graves against draven i just focused her and got fed plus her tornado is super easy to read unless your right next to it and her peels for days is annoying but nothing to bad.

i also couldnt help but notice thats plat+ with jinx she has a 24% play rate while someone like vayne has a higher play rate of 35% and a win rate of 52%, 1% difference than jinx with a higher play rate meaning vayne is getting picked more and winning just as hard look at win rate v pick rate, blitz almost has as much of a win rate as janna but isnt picked nearly as much. if you guys hate jinx then get a good support and focus her just like every adc in the game jinx and janna arnt just freelow if you got a issue with them try them out learn them just like every supposed op freelow champ so you can see what to watchout for. im a jinx main looking at all this objectively and while she is strong proofs that vaynes stronger. come on me ragers n haters

MealReadytoEatAug 16, 20151 votes

i also couldnt help but notice thats plat+ with jinx she has a 24% play rate while someone like vayne has a higher play rate of 35% and a win rate of 52%, 1% difference than jinx with a higher play rate meaning vayne is getting picked more and winning just as hard look at win rate v pick rate, blitz almost has as much of a win rate as janna but isnt picked nearly as much. if you guys hate jinx then get a good support and focus her just like every adc in the game jinx and janna arnt just freelow if you got a issue with them try them out learn them just like every supposed op freelow champ so you can see what to watchout for. im a jinx main looking at all this objectively and while she is strong proofs that vaynes stronger. come on me ragers n haters

If you read the article, or my other comments, you'd realize I'm specifically refering to the point that Jinx HAS NO COUNTER PICKS. She's generically overpowered, and has been in the top three pick and win rate ADC's since her release. Vayne has a large dependency in her effectivness vs various other ADC's and Supports (some good, some bad), while Jinx varies from an extremely good pick to a decent one.

Rabid HuskyAug 16, 20151 votes

and thats right there why it seems like your just raging, i pointed out that vaynes picked way more with a 1% difference in win rate thats actually a huge hole in your rant and whats vaynes counter pick? dravens? how about caitlyns? the reason jinx seems so good is the fact she works well with almost every support which im not arguing jinx is a good pick but shes not a over powered pick as you say.