Playing against Tahm is the most miserable experience I've had in 5 years of LoL

MealReadytoEat··86 votes·6,182 views

Seriously, even if he's not performing too well statistically, playing against him is incredibly oppressive. He doesn't feel like he has any weakness - he's just this giant ball of CC, damage, tankiness, and bullshit that utterly nullifies the kit of half the champions in the game, both against him and his allies.

Devour hard counters every assassin, combo mage, and melee champion in the game. Thresh's lantern is annoying, but at least cc lock prevents them from taking it.

There's a lot of things they could do, but two suggestions are to prevent him from casting q or auto's during devour, similiar to thresh's q, and to remove the MS with an ally inside of while running away.

197 Comments

Lucky Iccy44 votes

For me its not the devour that really bothers me, saving a teammate from death is something many supports can do well and im ok with it( Thresh express foremost). The thing is, there is counterplay that is quite simple, if the support keeps saving the adc just target the support instead. This brings me to my main probably with Tahm.....he's fucking impossible to kill himself

The bastard has pretty decent base health and benefits from going tanky, so already there is decent "I go where i pleaseness" now combine that with grey health, which imo is just OP and you have a tanky ball of not dying. Call me Billy Mays tho cuz WAIT THERE IS MORE, his kit also comes with a movement speed boost and a ranged slow, which means even if u could survive the extremely long period of time it takes to kill him, u also have the challenge of sticking to him.

He is too safe and damn near shuts down pick comps by default, not to mention his ult and the fact that u can usually build mobility boots on him allows him to be everywhere saving everyone in the mid-late game. Watch some of the World games if u need proof, every game he is in he just stops really good solid engages and drags game out longer. Its not even that he is broken or OP...he is oppressive and dull and basically makes the game less fun win or loss

Lauchmelder19 votes

TL.DR.: He is the tanky version of Janna but with a stun, his devour, damage and a teleport ult?

Excitidly Insane5 votes

Let's just say that if Tahm was a ranged champ he'd have completely taken over Janna as the safest support pick.

Hola Hello27 votes

It's always fun having to literally kill a full tank dealing massive damage 2 times because of that shield.

THE RlVER KlNG17 votes

Playing as Tahm against a Morgana-Vayne bot is the most miserable experience I've had in 5 years of LoL.

All these Tahm threads irk me (as a Tahm main). He has a lot of power in his kit, but he also has a lot of weaknesses literally every other tank has- AoE CC, engage, a strong gap-closer, etc. He's like Mundo without AoE damage and can eat people. Just play against it and stop picking easy-Devour all in supports like Naut or CC-ADC'S like Jinx or Draven. I'm tired of these threads.

Remlap122320 votes

I'm tired of people complaining about my cheese champion! I WANT MAH FREELOS DAMMIT!

Seriously. Tahm is not healthy. He's even more overloaded than Ekko, and that's really saying something. He's got more lifesaving potential than Soraka, combined with massive CC, disengage, and damages just for shits and giggles. He doesn't really have any counterplay. It's almost impossible to take him down if the enemy knows what they're doing.

Acceptable counterplay isn't "hope the enemy screws up and get really sad when they don't."

AutoreactiveCD423 votes

I don't see Tahm as more overloaded than Ekko. Ekko's w and ult are overloaded as all hell. In terms of hard CC Ekko's AoE stun is conditional and gives him a shield, Tahm only has single target CC and it is conditional. I think the issue is Tahm's numbers being high right now.

SymbolicFear5 votes

Tahm has literally two health bars, insane % health damage, low cooldown on his Q, he can spit minions at you to AoE slow and deal lots of poke damage, his Q with 3 stacks stuns, he can eat you when spit you out away from tower or just straight up kill you under tower since he doesn't need to care at all cause of his two health bars, and he has his ult which can be a two man tp. Tahm is overloaded and broken, needs massive nerfs to his damage, slight nerfs to his tankiness and a few other numbers need to be toned down.

AutoreactiveCD45 votes

He's got a lot, but relative to Ekko I don't think he's over loaded. One thing people tend to overlook when they say a skill is overloaded is how that skill works. Tahm's w has multiple uses, it is limited by the fact that it can do one of those things at a time. If you look at ekko's w by comparison if he hits it, then it is a stun and he gets a shield, he misses you but is still in it he gets the shield, misses it entirely it is still a slow field. It's a good, better or great skill just like his ult. Tahm doesn't get something like for his w.

Not defending Tahm's balance, just saying relative to Ekko he isn't overloaded.

Lavaniel3 votes

You know, I've been one-shotted by Ekko. Not once have I been one-shotted by Tahm. A guy just told that Tahm has weaknesses, and its true. He has more weaknesses than Vayne, Jinx, Ekko, hell, even MasterYi-sus. Expect when he will tongue-lash, count down the cooldown (its a flat six seconds), and orb-walk. You have a chance to get away from him. When he gets low, CC-lock him. He can't use his shield. Instead of complaining, look at ways you can counter him. He's much easier to counter than %max health true damage garbage CT loves to pump out.

Lucky Iccy13 votes

Flip it around, I've one-shotted an ekko, You cant even TEN shot a tahm. Comparing ekko to tahm isnt really a valid thing as one in a slightly bruisy AP assassin and the other is a full tank, what they can do and the goal with each ability is full different. While yes ekko's W is potentially AMAZING, its much less reliable than say the pay from devouring an ally or activating grey health.

Voluug133 votes

You cant even TEN shot a tahm

He is a tank, remember? Are people still complaining about not being able to oneshot tanks?

MealReadytoEat5 votes

No, they are complain about tanks being able to kill you in less than 5 seconds, while you are cc'd most of that time, and being unable to kill anyone else on his team too.

kurthl33t13 votes

I'd honestly be fine with Tahm if they'd just nerf his damage. I think it's cool to have a supertank who can rescue his teammates or cc the enemy, but the fact that he can also deal a ton of damage is a real problem.

MealReadytoEat9 votes

I'm bothered that he gets MS for running away with an ally.

Magearna2 votes

Right? You would think increasing your weight would slow you down. I guess allies make him skinny or something.

Kapppaccino3 votes

im more bothered by how long theyre safe inside of him....make it 2 seconds max...

g07h4xf0011 votes

TahmKench is fine and working as intended. At most just reduce his base damages or HP scaling on his ultimate and he's good to go.

He's SUPPOSED to counter pick comps and champions with single-target assassinations. Get gud at champion select.

Vincent Lucius2 votes

Can they just revert his buffs? He was fine before those and I didn't even see any threads crying about him until he got upgraded. It wasn't asked for or necessary. He can do his job of being an auto lantern that's hard to kill without doing as much damage as he currently does.

pinkyblossom5 votes

His win-rate has decreased while his play rate has risen...

Let the changes sink in more.

BlunterMonk10 votes

I love Tahm because he offers some way of dealing with the other oppressive tank supports. Blitzcrank Braum Thresh Nautilus

Saminus Maximus8 votes

Ew tank blitz, everyone knows full ap rabadons lichbane blitzcrank is where its at kappa.

Xerathiel9 votes

his Q hitbox> morgana Q

SpecterVonBaren6 votes

Don't complain about that. You don't want Riot making that hit box smaller because then it will just make it easier to deal with the one true Tahm counter, minions.

lakeyja9009 votes

Of course it sucked for you, Tahm hard counters you because you're just a MealReadytoEat!

5512028 votes

**TahmKench has weaknesses and he is balanced right now imo...

  • His Q is just a skillshot, easy to dodge...
  • His W on enemies: its not like he could instantly devour you, he need to hit u 3 times before and he slowed by 95% while he has an enemy champion in his belly.
  • His W on allies: not op at all, Thresh can make an ally pass through 2 walls with his W and the others supports can shield their adc every 7 secs.
  • His E is fine too because it slowly decays over time and the others supp-tank have abilities to make them more tanky for few secs Braum Leona Alistar .
  • And his R is fine too, u have time to react unlike TwistedFate ult.**
Dengeden7 votes

Soraka is "oppressive" in the same sense Tahm is, she hard counters poke comps. Shame that she, like Tahm, needs items to be effective during the mid game, which isn't something a support can take for granted.

Devour hard counters every assassin, combo mage, and melee champion in the game.

Every time an assassin becomes even remotely viable, the community whines about it. So you can't make that point, sorry. I can't think of any combo mage that doesn't have AoE. Devourer only hard counters them if he devoured them before most of the combo hit ... which is kind of hard to do. True, it's pretty strong in 1 on 1 or 2 on 2 scenarios (vs melee champs) but in straight up TFs, melee champs can generally deliver their combo before they get eaten. Considering Tahm has no AoE, that combo is gonna be a lot more effective than whatever he has to offer.

Either way, I have no sympathy for people who want to use the same strategy every game without taking the enemy champions' kit into consideration.

Death by Kayn7 votes

Oh the irony in your summoner name

Tortunga6 votes

I have only one problem with Tahm; that he is able to eat a cc'd ally without any consequences. I think it was the second FnC vs AHQ, which just showed how terrible broken this is; jinx got caught 10+ times in the mid/late game with a morg bind and Tahm just ate him, removing the cc and running away with jinx. With any other support jinx would have died half of the time, or started a massive team fight. But no this stupid devour made jinx to be able to play stupidly aggressive, getting caught several times, and out of position, without any consequences and risks. Fuck this ability

ViashinoWizard5 votes

While I hate to admit it, being a Tahm main, there's probably something wrong when I can semi-regularly solo the enemy ADC as the support.

MealReadytoEat3 votes

And ADC's are the only class that can do anything to him :/

2Behold4 votes

I admit that he might need some nerfs to his R passive, but you aknowledge that he is statistically weak. He loses over half of his games, meaning that even if he is oppressive to an individual he isn't carrying his team. So honestly I don't see a huge problem.

Lucky Iccy10 votes

I think a lot of what factors into this feeling is not losing to him. A lot of ppl here(myself included) dont think Tahm is OP or that he can carry game as much as him being in the game changes fundamental tenants we normally see. The main two being 1."I get rewarded for planning and properly executing ganks, picks and dives" and 2. "I can be punished for my bad positioning/poor vision control" while he doesnt 100% make this untrue. The feeling a player can get as 4/5 of his otherwise really well done plays are negated by "simply press W and run....maybe activate 2nd health bar if needed" is quite demoralizing regardless if u win or loss. Imo at least, to counter really well done plays should require really well done counterplay....not a simply rotation of spells that a Wood V elo easily does.

2Behold2 votes

I can see that though I think part of the problem is he is one of the more straight forward champions like Garen or Annie. He does one thing and he does it pretty well. Its hard to deal with someone who specializes in 1 thing, like Heimerdinger with his zone control or garen with his single target nukes. But the key is he only does 1 thing unlike thresh who has a high skill cap but can essentially do everything any other support can.

MealReadytoEat2 votes

What one thing are we talking about? He does so many things, including good damage.

Zair Umbras4 votes

Honestly, Tahm has so much utility, innate tankiness, and huge amounts of damage... It's disgusting. Getting health increases your damage on everything by up to 8% of your bonus health. His Q does a ton of base and scaling damage, plus up to 8% of your bonus health, which is usually around 2kish late game, so that's an extra 160 damage just for building tanky on every single AA, Q, and when you press W. W is a 32% max health, 3s stun that only has one weakness and that's a QSS, but even if you QSS, you still take the health damage on top of the 8% of bonus health, plus 2% max health per 100 AP Tahm has. To make matters worse, Tahm has 'grey health' when he takes damage that's proportionate to the damage he's receiving, so his bubble's scaling in a normal team fight where he starts at full is 100% of missing health. That means you have to virtually kill him twice. To make things even worse, he can choose to grab a carry and whisk them away to safety with a huge speed boost while he negates Zed, Vi, Syndra, Veigar, and many other single targeted ultimates just because he ate them and it's not like he takes the damage despite the projectile, or fist, hitting him in the damn face. Seriously. The balls from Syndra's R, the giant deathball from Veigar's R, and even Vi's fricken fist will hit Tahm in the face still, but it won't do any damage to the one targeted nor to Tahm. Personally, I think Tahm should be hit by what ever the person he snags is targeted by. If Vi is charging at that carry that's eaten by Tahm, I could only imagine she'd just uppercut the carry out of Tahm's mouth or at least uppercut Tahm and if there's a bunch of balls being thrown at a carry and Tahm eats the carry and not the balls, you'd think he'd be smacked in the face by those balls.

Seriously though. If Tahm W's some one who's about to be hit by a targeted ability, Tahm should be hit by instead so he's not a 6s Zhonya's with a 6s CD. I want him punished for trying to save a carry who was about to be punished for being caught, none of this Tahm pressing W, getting a HUGE speed boost to escape.

When Tahm was released, the dev team was all like 'Yeah, he can be used to deliver people and save the carry or eat a high priority target' when in reality he's just a 'Ima eat the carry to cancel out all your CC and damage' and a 'Ima eat this Fiora who's trying to dive into us and 1v1 her with ease'. He's used to save his carry from the few targeted CC's that are left and complete negate targeted nukes, then people defend it saying they don't want assassins in their game making stuff toxic... Just play against a Tahm as anything that isn't Darius, Garen, or a fed as heck Fiora.

No champion should have a good early, mid, and late game while providing as much utility as he does. He's got 2 different stuns on short CD's, a shield that makes him near unkillable in a team fight, and his R has a passive that gives him end game scaling like no other. His kit isn't overloaded, it's hugely overtuned and more toxic than S2 LCS Yorick and trust me when I say it was toxic. Yorick was removed from the weekly rotation and nerfed into the floor because his kit was pure toxicity incarnate. A brick wall in lane that could poke you down and he'd never die. Tahm is becoming that equivalent.

Silents4293 votes

He really isn't that bad, needs minor changes to help make him less annoying.

When he stuns someone with 3 stacks it should be consumed for example.

The movement speed buff he gets from eating someone should be reduced, I don't think it's unreasonable to have it, but he runs really friggin fast.

If he eats someone and it cancels someones ult, Like Vi her ult shouldn't be on cooldown because he ate someone.

C9 Scott Free 3 votes

That interaction is fine because her ult is equally toxic tbh

Silents4295 votes

Typical board attitude.

C9 Scott Free 3 votes

Are you about to pretend Vi ult with the damage in her kit is actually balanced? If she didn't get a guaranteed knockup with percantage health damage and armor shred to just eat squishy targets I would probably agree with you. But that interaction is pretty healthy in my opinon. It makes you save the ult instead of just using it wily nilly. I mean you can lock on to someone after they get lanterned out of your vision so you should be happy with that.

Only Play Darius6 votes

Has to hit you 3 times to get %HP damage. Between her melee range, horrendous attack speed, and her lack of sticking power until Phage/Triforce, you have to be terrible to get hit 3 times by Vi.

You should play Vi next free week and see just how mediocre she is.

Ventira3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Jelly Mac,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=i23MQTrb,comment-id=00140000000000000000,timestamp=2015-10-26T17:44:21.035+0000)

Has to hit you 3 times to get %HP damage. Between her melee range, horrendous attack speed, and her lack of sticking power until Phage/Triforce, you have to be terrible to get hit 3 times by Vi.

You should play Vi next free week and see just how mediocre she is.

Did you forget that all of her abilities apply Denting Blows? It's LAUGHABLY easy to get hit three times by Vi. R>Q>E boom, procced.

GundayMonday3 votes

Kiting, displacement, crowd control, and %hp dmg work REALLY well against him.

Champs with walls like Anivia Trundle make it so he can't really do anything. Champs with slows and %Hp dmg like Gnar Ekko (build a item 3151) chunk him down so his gray health doesn't do anything. You can deal with him, but you can't just pick random champions. Gotta have a plan!

MealReadytoEat3 votes

Yea, I basically can't play blind pick is what you are saying.

FakeGravity3 votes

Tahm feels like old soraka that use to heal herself and build tank y Target someone soraka make them survive super hard Target soaks she heal herself while being so tanky you will hardly hurt her or blow so much on her that her team crush you

Blainezy3 votes

Yea, when he eats a teammate he should have his movement speed reduced, instead of when he eats an enemy. That makes him WAY TOO SAFE when he's trying to save a teammate.

MealReadytoEat2 votes

I think the MS when taking a teammates TOWARDS enemies is cool - I like the idea of an armored personal carrier bringing Galio into battle, for example.

The problem is, this basically never happens. When he devours an ally, he's saving their CC'd ass and running away with them, and running away fast.

Malevolent Metal2 votes

I like Tahm just because he screws with Thresh perfectly if for no other reason... f*ck Thresh , I am tired of seing 95% of supports being Thresh!

Zair Umbras2 votes

You almost never see support Tahm though. It's always jungle or top Tahm since he does so much fricken damage after level 6 that it's disgusting, plus he's near impossible to kill in lane unless you're using a Juggernaut. Even Fiora has issues killing Tahm because Tahm just builds CDR, AA's and Q's to 3 stacks, then eats her for half her health every 6s while it's a 3s stun, so it has 3s of downtime. >> At max ranked, Tahm's W is 10s. 40% CDR, 6s stun. CD starts when he presses it. He can stun some one and do half their health in a single W and do it again 3s later. That's on top of you having to kill him twice in every single fight because all he needs is a Warmogs+Visage late game and you won't be able to poke him down or even get him under 95% health.

Xenohaz1 votes

With your username, I'm not surprised.

I'm sorry...I'll leave now.

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