Tristana 5.7, there was a buff?

Nilok··11 votes·1,596 views

So, was the Tristana buff meant to actually do something or just placate us?

The ability to reduce Explosive Charge's cooldown has increased Tristana's ability to farm slightly, since she is now completely reliant on Explosive Charge, but has not improved her ability to deal effective damage to champions and seems her only use is to push towers.

You have been giving Tristana ways to reduce her cooldowns of Rapid Fire and Explosive Charge without actually touching any stats or scaling which she desperately needs. I have a feeling when you finally do address the underlying problems Tristana has, the ability to reduce her cooldowns that isn't easily controlled (autoattacks) will cause abnormal power spikes that will make it very difficult to balance her.

I recommend taking a long hard look at Tristana's strengths and weaknesses, and buff her stats or scaling accordingly. It will probably be necessary to removed the cooldown reduction for Explosive Charge when you buff her.

I do hope you follow through and produce the Yordle Commando you described, it would be a shame to leave Tristana in the state that she is in.

9 Comments

Gigadick5 votes

Came here to say much of the same. So have a bump.

This first part is venting because I don't post very often and this has been something that's been bothering me since it was changed and I do sincerely hope there are Riot plans for not leaving a job half done.

[vent] Since the reduction in Trist's basic ADC stats (especially AS/level!) it's been like squeezing blood out of a rock trying to fill the role of late-mid to late game DPS carry with her, a role in which she used to reign supreme. The new CDR interplay between her abilities is sort of neat, but not only does this interplay cash out for very little in the duration of an actual teamfight, but it's completely unrelated to the role she _ defined _ for so long in this game, a role that I loved playing her in - the bullet hose timebomb that's just waiting for that last level plus 500 gold before she climbs the proverbial water tower and starts laying players down from halfway across the screen. In the wake of a remake that was meant to give her a stronger mid game she's left with a severely impaired kit for the game after lane phase.

In my eyes she's gone from a slow starting DPS champ to an early game AD mage that can be itemized for dps if you happen to get enough gold from repeated all ins with your mandatory CC support. God help you if you didn't crush your lane because you're getting half of what your opponents are from each level. When patch notes are saying things like 'ghostblade, y'all' to address damage ramping issues with what was once the model champ for late game face melting I just have to facepalm. When I pick Tristana I'm not picking Talon or Zed, my goal isn't to pop a player and then run off into the jungle to wait for cooldowns. That's never been what she's been about unless her first item was a Deathcap and she was rocking a full page of AP runes. The irony for me here is that in the current campaign against 'unintended' AP item routes on champions, her rework has her playing the same as AP players used to. The damage she can do when given the chance to charge a bomb and then jump on it is really great, but pulling that off when you're in the middle of an actual teamfight the other 4 players on your team haven't already won for you is just not likely. Instead you'll be running back and forth at the outskirts of the fight throwing one or two sluggish shots at the passing tank wondering why you didn't pick Jinx or Kog. [/vent]

As for what I would like to see changed? Very much the same as OP, I think that the changes have to start with her base stats and feel. Right now her autoattack animation is sluggish and her projectile speed feels low. I've seen it mentioned elsewhere, but I have never had a problem with autoattack cancels with any champion in the game before the Trist VU, and now it's a real problem for me with her. The attack doesn't fire when I think it should and the projectile seems to float forever. Stack that together with her very low ADC stat scaling and CSing with her in the current afk push lane/all in every level bot lane meta is extremely painful. Her extremely low attack speed scaling and the passive damage from her E (which is now mandatory level priority as it's her only source of lane threat) makes last hitting a mathematical impossibility in an earthshatteringly frustrating number of situations. Getting shoved under tower for the first few levels before active and passive E damage can counterpush the typical push 24/7 adc opponent is equally rage inducing. Q is simply not off cooldown enough for her to fulfill the basic requirements of the role in both lane phase and passed that when teamfighting starts. This is not a problem that should be solved with a lower Q cooldown, instead the better solution would be to make her relevance as a DPS champion revolve less around Q and her abilities in general. I don't know what the point cost of getting Trist's stats back to comparable levels with her ADC peers would be, but I would be happy to foot the bill with her E, to be honest. The bomb is a fun minigame for her but its impact dwindles extremely quickly in a game where you're not already stomping. If, as a champ, you're not able to be a reliable threat to the enemy team over the entire course of a teamfight then you're not worth the pick, IMO. ADCs are meant to pick up the slack after the ability centric champs have blown everything on a fight, you're meant to be what they run towards when they're waiting on cooldowns. If you're running with them then you're doing something wrong.

If Trist is stuck at her place in the world as an all in early to mid game champ, then at least don't stretch her range scaling out to level 18, reduce the range a bit but increase the rate so she caps out at 11 or something. If she isn't ahead by then she simply won't be.

Nilok1 votes

Ya, the balance team has been all over the place this season with "compensative buffs". I wonder if they think we wanted Tristana to be played like AP Trist, or just didn't understand those were people abusing crazy AP ratios like with AP Yi.

Yandere Carry4 votes

i literally said stuff similar to this wayyyyyyyy back when trist was considered top tier s4 in regard to all the "little" nerfs they kept randomly throwing her. Knew once the meta shifted all these random nerfs that didn't target why she was currently strong would cause her to drop to trashcan tier as soon as things changed.... She did, then later on her rework came out. (The rework was liking on the drawing boards for a while even before she got popular competitively.)

They nerfed the shit out of her AS, lowered her passive range.... Making it so a lvl 18 trist has lower AA range than like a lvl 8~ jinx/kogmaw. I don't know if you agree with my views, but I do think these buffs aren't addressing what she needs and may lead to her needing to be nerfed immediately after her real issues are taken care of.

Nilok2 votes

A fairly good assessment, and I agree.

I'm honestly not sure if Riot knows what to do with Tristana, or why they have so reluctant to have any qualitative buffs. Is Riot so confident with Tristana's stats they are unwilling to buff them, or is their judgment being shaped by when she was powerful instead of her current state?

Shïfty2 votes

Everybody bump this please.

Nilok1 votes

Thank you sir.

StoicDreamz2 votes

I've been playing Trist a lot because I honestly love her play style. I have been thinking about a lot of the same things that you all have said in this post. Some ideas I've thought of that I think would help her are First and foremost, give her more AS base or per level for sure, I shouldnt have to build BotRK, PD, and still feel like my AS is dismally low, and building her with Bloodthirster is painful, imo. Another Idea that I didnt see mentioned here was about her Ult. I feel like her Ult should "do more damage the lower health the target is." Its supposed to be a finishing move anyway, the amount of times that I have ulted a target to safety so they can walk away with 20hp is sad. It makes me sad. It makes my teamates hate me. I think that having this added to her ult would help quite a bit. Anyway, these are just some of my ideas, hopefully you may agree with me.

Nilok1 votes

Beyond just her ult, her jump is also designed to be used as an execute and also suffers from the same problem of lacking solid finishing power.

SwiftKitten881 votes

same thing happened with the nidalee nerfs. she was never really an issue. they nerfed her traps vs players.. which really hurt thier damage vs players and esentially made them useless. but it is still barely noticable becuase honestly how often you you set a trap down to damage players. the 10% hp shread was only useful about 1 in every 20 games or so it just seemed like somthing they could do to nerf her that would "hurt" her becuase not really have any effect in 95% of games. as her her hp nerf. late games it donest really matter if nidale has 300 less hp. yes it REALLY hurts, becuase nid would die to about 90% of the stuff anyways becuase be again. when people deal 3k damage to you it donest really matter if you have 1.8k hp or 1.5k, 3k damage is still going to kill you either way.

these nerfs did absolutely nothinig other than make people happy becuase people think nid was op and she got nerfed. they didnt do jack shit to stop her jungling issues and really only hurt her laning.

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