Would Making Top Harder to Gank Improve Things?

RookPusher·Aug 9, 2018·4 votes·1,946 views

In my experience, there is no hell quite like an enemy top laner with an attentive jungle while you have a mouth breather farming jungle. Or maybe if your jungler is 0/4/0 by 10 mins. But either way, the Top is tipped in one direction or another by a well placed gank.

Since they've nerfed TP, it makes it harder for the Top to roam, and has islanded the lane even further. In instance where you get counter-picked and manage to hold you're own, it's infuriating to have a dumb jungler who read a MOBA Fire guide and now believes you farm until min 17, and you only support failing lanes.

Is there a way to make top less jungle dependent, and is making the run up to the gank more visible, say, by closing off the tri-bush there.

6 Comments

EedatAug 9, 20184 votes

They already did. Jungler is already 1-2 levels behind solo laners in normal circumstances

RekSai CoffeeCoAug 9, 20181 votes

{quoted}

They already did. Jungler is already 1-2 levels behind solo laners in normal circumstances

If not more up to 10 min mark most times (mid game now) and in extreme cases 11-12 mins.

Sona PingAug 9, 20182 votes

{quoted}

In my experience, there is no hell quite like an enemy top laner with an attentive jungle while you have a mouth breather farming jungle. Or maybe if your jungler is 0/4/0 by 10 mins. But either way, the Top is tipped in one direction or another by a well placed gank.

Since they've nerfed TP, it makes it harder for the Top to roam, and has islanded the lane even further. In instance where you get counter-picked and manage to hold you're own, it's infuriating to have a dumb jungler who read a MOBA Fire guide and now believes you farm until min 17, and you only support failing lanes.

Is there a way to make top less jungle dependent, and is making the run up to the gank more visible, say, by closing off the tri-bush there.

How would making top harder to gank, harder for a teammate to go up there and gain an advantage for the team, improve that? I know how frustrating it is when you all in a weaker player and you are going to win that but, oh, the jungler or whoever shows up and now you get to lose. I get that. However, how would making it more difficult and lowering the chances of accomplishing something do anything but make top lane more of an island?

RookPusherAug 9, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Sona Ping,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aA8IrA5T,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-08-09T16:04:52.496+0000)

How would making top harder to gank, harder for a teammate to go up there and gain an advantage for the team, improve that? I know how frustrating it is when you all in a weaker player and you are going to win that but, oh, the jungler or whoever shows up and now you get to lose. I get that. However, how would making it more difficult and lowering the chances of accomplishing something do anything but make top lane more of an island?

I don't have a problem with making it more of an island, so if that's a resolution I personally would be ok with that. But my main problem is, it seems that because top is furthest away from the most players, it's more dependent on a jungler who cares. Since there's no way to account for that ahead of time, then I'm thinking there ought to be a way to balance that disparity.

Automated RivenAug 9, 20182 votes

In all fairness. Top is fine. The problems that stem from toplane is far more to the player not being attentive to the jungle and the map, and as a result not respecting ganks.

Also not controlling minion waves and warding properly.

The mindset that toplaners have, that top is an island, and you won't receive ganks, lead to you getting ganked and losing lane. I have had multiple games where I didn't ward properly and all inned at a bad time because I wasn't tracking the jungler and died as a result. That isn't my junglers fault, that's my fault.

On the flip side I have also had multiple games where I have been ganked repeatedly, and due to warding and map awareness have simply absorbed them. Doung that I wasted the junglers time and allowed my team to simply win the rest of the map.

If you feel like top is 'jungle dependent' then it's likely there are apsects of your own play that need to be improved.

Morgana UltimaAug 9, 20181 votes

{quoted}

In my experience, there is no hell quite like an enemy top laner with an attentive jungle while you have a mouth breather farming jungle. Or maybe if your jungler is 0/4/0 by 10 mins. But either way, the Top is tipped in one direction or another by a well placed gank.

Since they've nerfed TP, it makes it harder for the Top to roam, and has islanded the lane even further. In instance where you get counter-picked and manage to hold you're own, it's infuriating to have a dumb jungler who read a MOBA Fire guide and now believes you farm until min 17, and you only support failing lanes.

Is there a way to make top less jungle dependent, and is making the run up to the gank more visible, say, by closing off the tri-bush there.

If you're losing or going even top lane then the jungler would be better off helping a lane that is already winning. This creates more map pressure.

So let's say you got counter picked in solo queue. Does the jungler know that you're a challenger top lane player who's going to dumpster the enemy? No. So why would he choose jungle pathing to help a lane that is statistically going to lose no matter what?

The best thing you can do is hold your own top. If it turns out to be a 2 v1 the entire game then great! Your teammates will have greater presence on the bottom side of the map and can possibly do dragon and counter jungle.

There is literally zero reason to complain that a jungle isn't helping you when you're going even or losing. That's on you.

On the other hand though. If you're dunking your lane and you are constantly pushing then the jungle should be playing around you. You can get an early tower. You can get herald. You can roam mid. If the jungler doesn't understand that then he's a bad jungler.