please. for the love of god. if i pick a support, at least think about what adc goes good with my support. or specify what kind of support you want me to play. don't pick an adc with absolutely no synergy with my support. its hands down the most annoying thing i deal with as a support main.
Sukishoo10 votesPSA TO SUPP PLAYERS: LEARN WHAT A SIGHTSTONE IS IF YOU ARE PLAYING SUPPORT. IT SHOULD BE YOUR FIRST BUY. GET IT. USE IT.
The Bard Dog3 votespsa to everyone else. even if i dont happen to buy sightstone early, vision should never be a problem because IT'S EVERYONE'S FUCKING JOB.
Sukishoo5 votesNever said it wasn't. I main support and 90% of the time when I'm not playing support the support NEVER buys one when they should have bought it as their FIRST ITEM.
ChaoticPinecone3 votesI play mage supports. with 800 gold going back, id rather buy Upgrade+1 pink+2 green+pots than spend it on a sightstone. I get the same amount of vision and combat stats instead of sinking all my money on vision.
Ariel the Cruel1 votes
I prefer tear first.
But then, Maokai is a bit of an edge case since I always have a suicide baby in river bush. (Especially if I'm top side)
[Partial] jokes aside, I don't find that getting sight stone always pays off as well as a lvl 2 gp item. Generally, there are 4 scenarios where I get stone first: 1) The ADC doesn't help ward. (Yet they still manage to complain about vision the moment my trinket expires) 2) One of the junglers is very gank happy. 3) We end up over-extended frequently. 4) Enemy has a blitz.
Otherwise, I find that the 2 trinkets between the ADC and I is generally enough to allow me to delay stone until 2ed item. Now I'll admit those come up more often than not (especially # 1), but stone first isn't a necessity 100% of the time.
But then, I'm just some purple 6 scrub. So what could I possibly know?
Apollocliptic1 votes[{quoted}](name=Ariel the Cruel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=a6ZwHNAF,comment-id=0002000000000001,timestamp=2015-06-12T05:10:50.258+0000)
[Partial] jokes aside, I don't find that getting sight stone always pays off as well as a lvl 2 gp item. Generally, there are 4 scenarios where I get stone first: 1) The ADC doesn't help ward. (Yet they still manage to complain about vision the moment my trinket expires) 2) One of the junglers is very gank happy. 3) We end up over-extended frequently. 4) Enemy has a blitz.
Otherwise, I find that the 2 trinkets between the ADC and I is generally enough to allow me to delay stone until 2ed item. Now I'll admit those come up more often than not (especially # 1), but stone first isn't a necessity 100% of the time.
But then, I'm just some purple 6 scrub. So what could I possibly know?
Maokai Support is real! His peel is on par with Thresh, his vision is almost as high as Teemo's (best vision pre 6 - as he scales with HP so early sightstone actually improves his build too) and his in lane sustain means that with any decent mana item, he can actually NEVER return to base. From around level 4 to level 8 you can stay in lane and maintain an advantage. If you can get 
and sightstone, you have endless sustain as support Maokai, and only need to go back when you have enough gold for your next item.
Anyways, as a main support, I rarely get sightstone first unless I am Braum or Leona. As mana hungry supports like Taric or if I'm lulu (and the team is especially squishy) i prefer ASAP and just buy wards, as I'll earn more gold from my masteries and staying in lane longer, plus always have enough mana for Ulti's and e's.
As Vel I might go an early AP item, usually to maintain an advantage or deal with a lane where my adc isn't very damaging early. If i have Vayne adc, getting early damage I can completely zone out the enemy while Vayne farms, and once she's ready to go back, I'm ready for sightstone (though in most games i get sightstone first with Vel, recently i've gotten 
+ 
or 
) and I've recently started having a lot of success with Anirva support (yes I get flammed every champ select, but I ALWAYS get appologises in game when I am frequently landing double stuns or stopping that gank with an easy W. With her I'lll get first if I can (like if we get first blood) or 
. Either way I get sightstone afterwards, because we normally start getting ahead once I reach 6 and I want to ensure decent vision, but I put mana before even my gold item in these cases.
I know most argue sightstone or Gold item first, but while gold is always my starting item, I often go another item tree altogether before building either gold or sightstone items, because I know I can be more efficient with just one item, so I don't need as much gold with my utility picks, then I get vision, then i build up my gold item. It's less efficient for late game total gold income, but I have a stronger early game, which also means more gold (either by staying in lane longer or securing kills)
Aych Pii1 votesIt always seems much more worth it to me to upgrade my support item to tier 2 first and get a pink+a green or two.
IcyPepper3 votesFirst buy?
Sometimes I buy it second because I need to upgrade my coin for GP5.
puts on sunglasses
Deal with it. Also, buy a ward. If you can't spend 75 gold early game while farming but expect your 0 cs support to sink 800 gold immediately, you need to work on your last-hitting.
edit: SEMI-kappa
Sukishoo4 votesVision should be much higher priority then your gold gain. Sure if you have to back early and don't have 800 for a sight stone but have 500 for a gold upgrade that's fine but most of the time that's not the case. You should never go for the GP item over the vision, vision will help you far greater.
IcyPepper2 votesI was being semi-sarcastic, hit right with the downvotes yeesh.
I prefer to back when I have 1300+ gold so I can get both, but that only really happens if I can get the adc a double kill or something, otherwise I B for the sightstone because you wait too long and the jungler with chilling smite comes for your tushy
But my main point was that it wouldn't kill the adc to buy a ward from time to time. It's three minions.
ChaoticPinecone3 votes"Vision should be much higher priority then your gold gain."
That applies to the ADC too. Is it really going to delay you that much to pick up a pink ward to place defensively?
adkoralmighty1 votesVision should be much higher priority then your gold gain. Sure if you have to back early and don't have 800 for a sight stone but have 500 for a gold upgrade that's fine but most of the time that's not the case. You should never go for the GP item over the vision, vision will help you far greater.
for me it all depends on the situation.
for example, if i am playing a tank support and i am going against the enemy bot lane that can poke me and the adc i will forgo getting sightstone first and get 
because i need to bring as much sustain as possible to keep my adc from constantly being poked out of lane. i will still have enough sense to make sure i leave shop with at least 1 or 2 green wards.
Most of the time, i don't get sightstone first because i want to get the tier 2 gold item as early as possible so i can generate more gold for myself in the long run. I always make sure i leave the shop with 1 pink and 1 green ward however.
For blue side i will pink the tri-brush and use green in the river bush and save my trinket ward unless the enemy support is using the side brushes too much. As long as the enemy jungler doesn't come through there or if we get pushed back to the tower allowing the enemy support to safely check the tri-brush, it will stay up for a long time.
if i am red side i will pink the river brush and use my green ward in the blue side tri-brush. however i will use the green on our tribrush(behind our turret) if i am going against a mid assassin or jungler that loves to gank through there like 
and 
.
only time i will get sightstone first is if i am going against early ganking junglers like 
and 
. or if we managed to get one or two kills in lane and we are ahead. the second reason may seem counter-productive but, i always expect the enemy jungler to have enough sense to know that you should try to stop lanes that are slightly ahead from snowballing as early as possible. So i expect the enemy jungler to come to try to stop us from potentially snowballing our lead.
Erockandroll7 votesThat is true, yet I should also consider the team as a whole. A Utility ADC might help the team, so I might pick the likes of an Ashe or Sivir regardless. You should also ask your ADC what marksmen the usually main. (I for one cannot for the life of me use Kalista regardless of how OP she is.)
But if your picking support Early on, pick a non tank support. That way the team will bash your top/Jungler to play a tank instead and your team will actually have a Real tank. What gets me is being last pick support. And Being the teams tank with no items.
IcyPepper2 votesI feel the same way when people expect me to be the only tank and support. Sure, Leona and Braum have a bit easier time doing it than some, but...
MAYBE I WOULD HAVE MORE TANK ITEMS IF YOU LET ME USE MY EFFIN' CHARGES
Lugg5 votesThe sad thing is that most ADCs probably have no clue what you are talking about.
Ariel the Cruel6 votes
Ok, Vayne. You pick first.
I'll take "responsibilities" for 100, Bard.
It costs 75 gold, provides vision, and can be killed in 3 AA's. They're invisible unless swept away by the enemy team.
What are scuttle crabs?
No. Crabs provide vision, but don't match anything else.
What are Towers?
No again. And for the same reasons.
What are muh mechanics?
Not. even. close.
Where is Thresh?
Are you even playing?
What is Olaf?
That was a joke, right?
What are supports?
Closest so far, but still no.
Draaaaaaaaaven.
Clever. But, noooooooo.
Draven?
No.
But, Draven!
{duck tape} ; Moving on.
{eats podium}
Can someone call Malzahar? His dog got off the leash again.
What is my spear? {grins}
No-. Wait, not you! Get away from me!
AAAAAAGGGGHHH!!
We're friends now!
(All jokes aside, F kalista)
Shield Villain1 votes
Aych Pii1 votesGood guy Varus, the only ADC that knows what a ward is. I wonder if they teach that in Ionian schools?
Edit:
: I could use some help with vision in our lane, Cait.
: [W]
Ariel the Cruel1 votesKalista cut them off. Blame her.
Byakuya Kuchiki5 votesum no fuck you.
please. for the love of god. if i pick a support, at least think about what adc goes good with my support.
ori could be smart and pick an ADC i know like vayne and not pick someone like draven just because you picked leona
or specify what kind of support you want me to play.
i do
don't pick an adc with absolutely no synergy with my support.
kk ill first time lucian in ranked
its hands down the most annoying thing i deal with as a support main.
so you want me to play a champ i suck at because you didnt pick a support I can synergize with?
Cows Are Holy4 votesum no fuck you.
ori could be smart and pick an ADC i know like vayne and not pick someone like draven just because you picked leona
i do
kk ill first time lucian in ranked
so you want me to play a champ i suck at because you didnt pick a support I can synergize with?
why are you maining adc with a 1 champ champion pool? Cause thats what you're saying...
Byakuya Kuchiki1 votes[{quoted}](name=Cows Are Holy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=a6ZwHNAF,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2015-06-12T00:17:50.305+0000)
why are you maining adc with a 1 champ champion pool? Cause thats what you're saying...
im maining ADC with quite a large champion pool but i was just using the champs that came to mind first, I dont play any poke supports so i ask my support to not pick any poke supports and when they dont listen then bitch when i play an ADC with next to no poke
insaiyanbacca1 voteswell i mean lucian is pretty easy to play......
Silents4293 votesHow about I play who I know how to play?
Not picking based off of what the damn support chooses.
5512022 votesWhat do u mean by synergy with your support ? Since when there is X ADC "that goes well" with X Support? Tell us more about your "perfect" duo bot lane.
I'm sure you will say goes well with 
because the meta said so... The META is our god anyway. Make me play because u picked , if u can...
The Bard Dog4 votesi mean that some supports are strong early. some are strong later. its best not to pick an adc with a crap early if you see a support with a weaker early picked too.
say i pick nami. why would i want an adc picked who can't close gaps very well like twitch? or if i pick a utility support, 9 times out of 10 i do NOT want kalista picked.
picking a long range adc with a short range support also is something i'd consider poor synergy. the short range has to risk a lot in order to set up chances to harass, and meanwhile long range adc likes to stay max range from minion waves, therefore being too far behind to even do anything if i get hit.
Ghost Bride2 votesWhat is this "No synergy" you talk about?
Sure there are some good combinations, but there are no BAD ones.
Picks dont matter, its down to skill, especially in your elo.
WarlockLaw2 votesActually there are bad support/adc combos. Generally speaking adcs with bad early games dont do well with supports that don't do well being passive in lane. Annie/leona don't want to wait for a kog/vayne to come online
Rinky Dinky1 votesActually, annie provides enough pressure for vayne to get farm
WarlockLaw1 votesIf the enemy bot lane is something like leona/graves you won't be providing enough pressure for vayne, but yeah it is dependant on the entire match-up
SH Azykan2 votesEzreal + Nautilus have very little synergy. Ezreal has rather weak poke and a weak all in early. Nautilus wants to play the lane rather aggressive.
Ezreal works well with supports like Zyra, Karma, Annie, Thresh (though I can't think of any adc that doesn't work with thresh), or sona. He needs a support that helps poke/sustain or can flat out deny engages onto him so that he can farm efficiently and get his mid game spike asap.
Nautilus works well with ADC's that can all in, chain CC, or just poke/bully. He works great with Caitlyn, Jinx, Ashe, Sivir, Draven, Vayne (never underestimate the pull into a wall condemn). Otherwise he is not going to be much of a factor in lane other than just standing there to dissuade all ins/dives from the other team.
ChaoticPinecone1 votesEzreal has some of the highest burst for an ADC. E-W-Auto-Q-Auto is great burst to follow up on a naut Q+auto combo. Naut Ult also provokes enemies to run away, lining up for an easy EZ ult whose damage isnt mitigated from going through minions.
BlazinHot62 votesI find the only bad combination in bot lane is with Leona. Some champions as well as some players just arent that agressive, and it doesnt go well.
Byakuya Kuchiki1 votesif im ADCing im not buying a ward till laning phase is over. the only places i need warded are river or tri depending on my team and one of the 2 lane bushes depending on if we push or not after laning phase ill buy wards and make sure to use them but before then no thats your job
Apollocliptic1 votesStill situational. If you have yellow trinket you can probably get away with it, but if you an early ward is still useful, since even if a support DOES get sightstone first, they might not get it before you get ganked (which could happen multiple times since the first one denies gold for sightstone), but this is if you like shoving the lane.
Here are some scenarios
You are being pushed, but avoiding damage, this often leads to staying in lane "longer" which means the support may have run out of wards, and leaving lane might leave you open to dives. I've played as braum or leona, or even vel with 100 hp for almost 5 minutes straight, because i know I will land that cc if the enemy dives, and give my adc a kill, but if I leave and they don't want to, the enemy might get a kill. On the other hand, if you get that kill when they dive, you want some quick farm while you have the chance, if you've been in lane a while, that extra ward might just save a life.
If you are pushing early or if the enemy controls the wave quite well, an extra "early" ward can help you stay out long enough for that BF or level powerspike, as some lanes just stay out longer, and the first to back can be the first to start losing (or second to back depending).
After that early rush, I agree that the support should handle warding from now on, but there's still other possibilities.
the above is about communication, I wouldn't advise both champs building damage, but if you agree it's for the best. Same goes for if the enemy has a troublesome jungler, or a gank happy mid, deep wards might give you more warning. So if as the Support I can ward enemy jungle, river and drake, then my adc just wards the lane brush, we have MUCH more vision, for half the team, not just our lane. I only do this with adc's that naturally buy wards, I wouldn't force it on them as it's a game about teamwork not bullying
tl;dr there are times where buying wards as adc (before mid game) gives a strong advantage, and I'd usually recommend buying ONE ward on your FIRST re, just because it'll really help your support "build" into something useful early, instead of forcing them to build sightstone or buy only wards cause they can't afford anything else yet. In those situations you're usually losing and that tactic only maintains your disadvantage.
ChaoticPinecone1 votesoutside of extremely unconventional supports (teemo, shaco, gangplank) most combos are pretty good. most combos have their strengths and weaknesses (some just have more obvious or easy-setup strengths).
for an example i had a lot playing ranked, I would choose Zyra and my ADC would choose Kalista. it doesnt seem too good on paper, but its easy to proc Kalista's W passive with a ranged support, and Zyra's Root + Zyra Ult + Kalista Ult combo can keep teams locked down for a long amount of time (since Zyra's ult knockup requires some setup). It also allows Zyra to frontline to get a root and be pulled back when she gets too low, or get a Kalista Ult + Root off when youre half a screen away.
i know you commented on the Nami+Twitch botlane - he might not be able to close gaps when you land a bubble, but its hard trading with Nami E + Twitches expunge. Also, as an immobile ADC, your tidal wave can be what sets up for a great twitch ult or your ADC getting jumped on an dying.
DarkDeamonDragon1 votesfor an example i had a lot playing ranked, I would choose Zyra and my ADC would choose Kalista. it doesnt seem too good on paper, but its easy to proc Kalista's W passive with a ranged support, and Zyra's Root + Zyra Ult + Kalista Ult combo can keep teams locked down for a long amount of time (since Zyra's ult knockup requires some setup). It also allows Zyra to frontline to get a root and be pulled back when she gets too low, or get a Kalista Ult + Root off when youre half a screen away.
I feel like this combo would only work with a duo that has excellent communication with each other and has practiced together.
Turlet8111 votesTHIS HAPPENS TO ME WAY TOO MUCH
Lyends1 votesPicks Braum ADC says Urgot or Lucian I say Lucian Picks Urgot
Picks Leona ADC goes Ezreal
10/10 Synergy
cruelworld1 votesPick a champion that synergies with my ADC.
KazaLyn Shao1 votesThe game DOES extend beyond the laning phase. A good bot lane synergy isn't necessarily going to win you the game, or even your lane. You need to pick an ADC that you both A) know and B) know will contribute to the team fights that are going to happen after laning ends. Don't be so short sighted.