Is Ivern immune to nerfs?

Dreadlocks·Mar 16, 2017·7 votes·1,101 views

Thinking about learning me some ivern because he's been OP all season and has not been touched.

23 Comments

DolasaurMar 16, 20174 votes

V7.3 ◾ Removed: Daisy no longer regenerates 3% maximum health per second while out of combat. ◾ Daisy's bonus resistances reduced to 15 / 40 / 90 from 20 / 60 / 120. ◾ Bug Fix: Daisy will no longer start attacking the ground and teleporting out of control. ◾ Bug Fix: Daisy will no longer become invisible in rare circumstances.

V6.24 December 14th Hotfix ◾ Triggerseed ◾ Shield reduced to 70 / 100 / 130 / 160 / 190 from 80 / 120 / 160 / 200 / 240. ◾ Slow duration reduced to 2 seconds from 3.

V6.24 ◾ Triggerseed ◾ Mana cost increased to 70 from 50. ◾ Slow reduced to 40 / 45 / 50 / 55 / 60% from 70% at all ranks.

Looks like a hefty set of nerfs since the season began, if you ask me. (Copied from the wiki.)

DreadlocksMar 16, 20172 votes

and what about the massive amount of buffs direct and indirect he got before that? he's been 54%+ all season up to nearly 57% right now. and no talk of nerfs. that is my bigger point. he's strong and being passed over.. just wondering for how long if it's worth playing him. a lot of other champs hit 51% winrate and get nerfed immediatly while others drop to 49% and are looked to be buffed.

DolasaurMar 16, 20172 votes

Ivern's kit is full of counterplay. His learn-to-play curve is a lot less steep than many champions (now that the community as a whole largely knows how to play him). He's not crowding out the competition; despite his high win rate, his pick/ban rate isn't sitting at 30%, and I don't hear people saying "I can't play X because Ivern makes X not viable".

Those three points combine to create a champ that is allowed to be "strong" (points 1 and 3) and have a high win rate (point 2).

So to your original question, I'd say he's certainly a champ that's likely to be perceived as viable for a long time. Of course, unless you're at like the top tier of Challenger, your own personal skill is way more impactful than if your champ has a 43% or 56% win rate. So you really should choose to play him based on whether you think he's fun and whether he complements your roster.

DreadlocksMar 16, 20171 votes

so I'm safe to play ivern while he sits at 57% winrate and not worry too much about nerfs because of points u made? (serious question, I rly do want to play ivern if he's that exempt)

DolasaurMar 16, 20171 votes

I don't have a crystal ball. You just have to take that chance yourself. There are other champs (like Janna) that have had really high win rates for a long time but rarely see any nerfs.

DreadlocksMar 16, 20171 votes

same with ahri lol.

DynikusMar 16, 20171 votes

It can't hurt to learn to play another champion. Ivern's pretty fun, too.

DynikusMar 16, 20173 votes

and has not been touched.

you don't read patch notes I take it?

BALDG1VEN BOOMERMar 16, 20173 votes

Your name checks out.

DreadlocksMar 16, 20171 votes

relevance ?

BALDG1VEN BOOMERMar 16, 20171 votes

Not saying Graves is immune to nerfs but never really received a reasonable one for nearly a year now, and yes I'm aware of the ones Meddler said.

Unless your name isn't a reference to Graves.

DreadlocksMar 17, 20171 votes

graves has had his E nerfed patch after patch.. his Q base damage has been nerfed as well. w.o looking at wiki a that's what I remember. I'm not saying graves doesn't deserve nerfs. But clearly Riot is playing favorites if ahri can sit between 51-55% winrate every patch since dfg got removed, and ivern is the highest winrate jungler for many patches now and neither of them are being talked abt as too strong. what's the deal?

EndlessSorcererMar 16, 20172 votes

If you want to stand a chance at jungling, you should probably learn Lee Sin and Ivern.

It is doubtful they will ever stop being dominant junglers.

DreadlocksMar 16, 20171 votes

I'm already decent at lee sin, but yeah I'm looking at ivern sit at the highest winrate patch after patch and not rly being touched. since the season started a fair amnt of strong junglers have been nerfed.. rengar, khazix, lee sin got his r nerf, shaco etc.. but ivern seems to stay out of the spotlight and I'm not sure if it's cuz he impacts the game through utility and not damage or what?

zlumpyMar 16, 20172 votes

Its pretty hard to nerf utility without making a utility heavy cahmp become too hard to get results with or become too much of a hassle to bother playing.

EndlessSorcererMar 16, 20171 votes

Honestly, Ivern's win-rate would drop a decent amount if they removed his ability to share buffs. It wouldn't really impact his personal strength while reducing his team's overall power.

zlumpyMar 16, 20172 votes

That does sound like something that would hit higher elo win rate and not weaken the champ. I don't really play anymore but from what I saw in many of my low elo games over the years is that people usually don't know how to play objectives or use non obvious power. Stands to reason that higher elo players are able to capitalize on sharing power and getting more out of something for nothing.

The only problem is it that it is killing something unique to bring one champ down instead of just bringing other champions up to be more viable. I used to play some Zac jungle successfully but when they added the sling shkt landing indicator it became a lot harder to play him.

I'm more in favor of making other jungles more viable than bringing one guy down. As long as that one guy isn't lee sin. He just outperforms too many people in straight up fights when learned, especially since his hardest counter, targeted cc, has pretty much been removed or made less impactful in too many scenarios.

...sorry about the ramble.

Penta AceMar 17, 20171 votes

I feel like sharing the buff is part of his theme. He wouldn't be the same if they removed that XD

Maybe they could look into only sharing buffs that he smites? Or maybe reducing how easy it is to steal the enemy jungler's camps? Thoughts?

EndlessSorcererMar 17, 20171 votes

I don't really see how sharing buffs is an integral part of his character or gameplay.

It just seems tacked onto his passive.

Penta AceMar 17, 20171 votes

You must not be very familiar with his background/lore. His whole character revolves around be a friendly "giver" after leading a greedy life when he was human. Riot does have a habit of simply "tacking" things onto passives with not much reason, but this was not one.

DreadlocksMar 16, 20171 votes

it's just strange that every high elo streamer says ivern is waaaaay overpowered and yet he's not being nerfed. I wonder if it's a matter of time till he gets his turn because no junglers are really being buffed, it's just nerfs to the strongest ones

FakeGravityMar 16, 20171 votes

actually ivern is more like thresh, he got nerfs, plenty of times, but remain relevant so far. orianna on the other hand is always good competitive, and no one seen to care or complaint

DreadlocksMar 16, 20171 votes

Orianna doesn't have a 56%+ winrate a better example would be ahri who's been 51-56% since dfg removal