PSA: Stop QQing about Annie and asking for stun changes

SnugglePuggle94··20 votes·1,415 views

I am sick and tired of seeing so many posts the last couple days asking for Annie's stun changes or the complete removal of it. Good Lord people, she's a burst mage that's centered all about her stun, they will not remove it. She's supposed to burst squishies quickly, and some of those squishies are assassins. Mains of Yasuo and the like- this is for you. She is the counter to mobility. If you pick a champ like that and a person counters you with her, don't get mad that she's beating you because you picked a champ she abuses.

In response to people who ask for her stacks to fall off, Beluge Whale answered this on her MYMU direction post. This answer also applies to having her stacks fall off completely after not using it:

"This is a neat idea, but it has a few issues:

  • Most other champions with their Ultimates ready already put out the pressure that they could use it at any time
  • This would make roaming or hiding in ambush with Annie a matter of spamming abilities constantly unless the decay time was trivial and it would just get reset in the lane pressure situation."

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/3IXxdZwi-mid-year-mage-updates-annie-direction?show=rundown

To people who want a delay on her ult drop:

"Things we especially like:

  • The flash bear drop. Annie’s bread-and-butter burst combo is a threatening affair that’s more about skirting the edges of Annie’s range than dodging a skillshot. While League benefits a lot from the potential to outplay most abilities in the game, having Champions with reliable abilities is also good for the game as long as they don’t make less-reliable champions obsolete."

AND

"The delay on Tibber's spawn is so short that we don't believe it falls within the window of "dodge this ability". If you predict it and jump out of the way, that's great! But a pre-indicator could send the wrong message of "we expect you to be able to get out of this".

For people who hate her flash ult plays:

"You mean to say that her ability to reliably catch out enemies means she won't be viable outside of solo queue, then this is wrong because a reliable catcher actually has incredible value - especially in coordinated/pro play where players can and will outplay any ability that it is possible to outplay. Reliable output actually has really high value.

This is not to say we are celebrating over the idea of Annie one-shotting you on Flash's cooldown - even small increases in Tibber's persistent power come at costs to upfront burst. Rather this is a defense of her ability to reliable engage on opponents who stray too close to her. Flash is inevitably a natural extension of that threat. Compared to similar in-class champions like Lux/Syndra (or Zyra/Brand/Velkoz for damage support threats) who can cc and delete you from 1000 units away without Flash, the fact that Annie's catch is not dodgeable is what allows her to function while being shorter ranged (not to mention having poor wave-clear when pressured). If Flash allows her to cheat this occasionally, well Flash allows a lot of people to bypass weaknesses built into their kits."

Annie is a squishy, binary, low mobility champion. You know what she's going to do all the time and you have windows to avoid it or to capitalize a kill on her. Honestly, Fizz, Zed, Ekko, Yi, other champions are more OP than her and more frustrating. People, I ask you, **please **stop asking Riot to change her- they won't listen or do anything. They have no plans to affect her stun or her ult.

Just learn to play against her, build MR, use long range champions that can counter her (Zyra gives me a hard time, and so can Lux or Morg), bait out her stun and kill her then. Also, play safely too.

**All quotes taken from her MYMU post. **

I hope to see the amounts of Annie QQ posts drop, but probably won't be the case. I just hope some of you read this and actually learn something. Annie is not that big of a deal, people, honestly.

38 Comments

taleofsonata4 votes

Another Reason, Annie is meant to be simple not mechanics intensive, She is 450 IP and is a champion that welcome new players. Making her too hard could potentially scare new players. Adding a stun bar to her already killed her in High Elo because of telegraph. Forcing her to go into a new build path that focus her on getting Tanky and having 40% soo she can fight Bruiser and juggernaut like Darius. I've Tried 40% cdr Tank Annie and I can tell you, I was suprised that I was able to fight a fed Trundle and Darius by button smashing my skills on cooldown and with the help of Rylais to kite them.

Scary Door3 votes

Ahh Annie mains, next to Riven and Sona mains they are---by far---the most delusional people in the League community.

SkyBlade793 votes

Awww, did you make this because of my little old post?

Either way, I'm not going to debate you here because I've already made my point clear on my thread. I'd just like to say that it's a really bad argument to say "Honestly, Fizz, Zed, Ekko, Yi, other champions are more OP than her and more frustrating". That's such a personal problem and completely off-topic as they are all different classes than Annie.

Also, this is in no way a "Public Service Announcement" (PSA)

Voluug136 votes

Its not like SnugglePuggle is wrong in any case.

Most Annie QQ comes from salty assassin mains, specially Yasuo ones.

Yeah its not a PSA but who cares her message is on right.

SkyBlade791 votes

Hey, I QQ about Annie really hard, and I'm not a salty assassin main. Annie wrecks the playstyle of just about everything except supertanks.

Voluug132 votes

Literally the only things that Annie destroys, in an equal skill match-up, are low range assassins and glass hypermobile melees. Which are those counters in the first place.

Tanks, Juggs and bruisers ignore her burst and dps her down.

Other mages and ADCs outrange and can push the lane way better that her, forcing her to lose farm or waste mana/stun charges.

If she targets you as a support, your adc should be killing her (unless you were stupid enough to hug your adc for a tibbers stun).

And that is it.

SnugglePuggle943 votes

It's not a personal problem. I'm sure many people out there will agree that there are many champions more frustrating than she is. And it's not off-topic. People are complaining about how OP she is, how stupid her stun is, etc. I'm just giving facts that they could be complaining about other OP champs instead of her, because she isn't that much of a problem really.

And yes, it is a PSA.

Reikken1 votes

It is a PSA, but naming other champions as being more frustrating was a mistake. It draws attention away from your main points, and for some people undermines your credibility.

SnugglePuggle941 votes

No it does not. It pertains to the topic at hand. I already explained it. My credibility is just fine.

Voluug133 votes

Hypermobile squishy tears are delicious tbh.

Why do you think Poppy and Cass are hated too? Anti mobility is a gift to this game. Now, if people could adapt like Zed/Yasuo/Fizz mains spam around.

SkyBlade791 votes

I didn't know that people hated Cass XD

I think that she's too weak currently to be hated, but with a little more development she'd be the perfect anti-mobility champion without any bs stuns (her ult is completely fair, imo).

Voluug132 votes

I think that she's too weak

Cass

Pick one.

And no, her anti-mobily is only useful on toplane, on midlane its mediocre at best.

And tell me please how can you have a burst anti-mobility champion without CC. Cass without stuns is OK because she is a sustained damage champion. Annie is very different and absicaly doesnt work without stuns without a massive kit change that could totally destroy her burst champion identity.

Zetto2 votes

Squishy, huh? yeah, after that rod, zhonyas, abyssal, and her % damage reduction shield. Squishy.

Anu3isII4 votes

In terms of base stats, she is squishy.

Also, her Molten Shield has a duration of 3 seconds, and is the last skill she maxes, so she doesn't have an enormous % damage reduction until Late Game.

About items, everyone can buy them. It still doesn't change the fact that a Galio with the same build can tank more than Annie.

BastionKross2 votes

she's a burst mage that's centered all about her stun

Actually she's supposed to be a bear mage that has a simple kit for beginners to learn how to be a mage with. That's why Tibbers got such magnificent buffs for her mini rework, and her stun got more counterplay with you being able to see the charges. The stun could be removed and Annie would still have Tibbers and her simplistic kit so she would still be succeeding in her niche.

However, with point and click becoming more and more rare, Annie's stun will probably stay for the foreseeable future just so there's some counters to hypermobile champs.

ZapMyHeart2 votes

I don't get why people are complaining about Flash Ult Annie. That's pretty much the only thing going for her.

Other champions could Flash Ult as well.

As for a 5-man stun, that's just bad positioning and would be the player team's fault.

Maximum Morde2 votes

Annie has already been openly, and stealth nerfed.

Dububby1 votes

how is this a psa?

SnugglePuggle946 votes

Letting people know they need to stop asking for Annie changes. Simple as that.

Lugg1 votes

I always have to laugh at people who don't think that Annie being able to hold onto her stun forever isn't broken.

Let's put it this way, how would you feel if EVERY other champion in the game could do the same with their abilities? Exactly, they would be broken as hell. It's VERY reasonable to have Annie's stun on a 5-10 second timer. If she doesn't use it in that time frame, she loses it. It's not like she can't have it up again in a few seconds and it gives an actual counterplay window to her.

SnugglePuggle941 votes

It's not reasonable. She would be focused to death when her stun is down, and she has no escapes besides flash. They would have to heavily compensate her for that, and it would probably ruin her identity too. Beluga told you guys why they won't do it. They know it's not reasonable for her and that's it.

Lugg1 votes

That's called counterplay. There really isn't any right now since she can hold on to her stun until you are forced to eat it.

SnugglePuggle941 votes

That is not real counterplay at all. Also, if she's holding onto her stun she can't farm well. So most Annie's don't do that unless they are close to going all in.

Martyrofsand3 votes

You mean like Lissandra does as soon as she turns 6? You mean like Taric does as soon as he puts a point in his E, which tends to be lvl 1 BTW? How about Sona as soon as she hits 6?

Any champ with CC in their kit is holding it forever which the only limit being it's CD. The only difference is Annie actually shows you when her CC is ready while others you have to keep track of their CDs in your head.

Lugg1 votes

Lissandra's is on her ult and doesn't 100-0 you unless she is WAY fed. Taric's stun has plenty of counterplay since it's way telegraphed.

Martyrofsand2 votes

Would you like for me to point out champs like Ahri/Syndra/Brand/Elise/Lux/etc who can lock you down and blow you up? Seriously your complaint for Annie can literally be extended to a large majority of the league line up with the one exception being they don't tell you when their ability to kill is available like Annie does.

Really is it just the fact that Annie makes you feel dumb for being able to see death was coming and still failing to do anything about it? That is really about the only reason I can find so many people hating Annie when so many other champs does what she does, and many of them in better ways.

Lugg1 votes

Ahri's only affects a single target and you can minion block it pretty easily. Syndra's ult pretty much destroys you without any other abilities, so I can give you that one. Brand is like Annie, but once again it's single target. Elise usually needs help to take out anyone like that. Just dodge Lux's snare and you are good.

With Annie, yes you can see it coming, but it doesn't matter 90% of the time. The big thing with Annie is the AoE factor with it that allows her to win teamfights entirely by herself. Letting her stun fall off after 10 seconds is completely fair any way you look at it.

Blåbæret3 votes

Don't take this guy seriously. If he got killed solo by an Elise I'd quit the game if I were him. Annie just clicks on R in a bush and your entire team is dead. She doesn't even need her stun to do it.

There's no champ in the game that can pull off something like that :) Annie is also by far one of the easiest champs in this game and comparing her to high skillcap champs such as Elise and Syndra just shows how arguementation starved people are.

Martyrofsand2 votes

No it's really not. Here let me rephrase the "let it fall off" argument so you can understand how stupid it truly is.

"Syndra should have to cast her E every 10 seconds if she doesn't than it goes on CD."

"Lissandra should have to cast her R every 10 second or it goes on CD."

"TF should have to gold card every 10 second or it goes on CD."

Are you starting to see the stupidity of this argument? There is literally zero difference between Annie holding her stun and other champions doing the exact same thing ASIDE FOR THE FACT ANNIE TELLS YOU WHEN IT'S AVAILABLE.

That is literally it. Annie tells you her stun is ready while no other champ in the game does this. There is no difference and your complaint about it is full of flat out stupidity with zero logic or reason to support it.

Lugg1 votes

Once again you are completely missing the big picture. Annie's stun can be used with her ult. NONE of those other champs can do that. Plus you should pretty easily now when they are off CD if you are an experienced player.

It doesn't matter that you know her stun is up, there is little you can do if she does a flash ult on you. That's what you are completely ignoring.

Martyrofsand3 votes

Um Lissandra's is her ult, and Syndra's ult will increase the width of her stun due to additional orbs, not to mention Syndra can stun roughly about the same area as Annie from a distance about the same as flash+tibbers, without the flash.

Sorry but again you are not helping your case at all with anything that you have said.

Lugg1 votes

Syndra's stun is very easy to avoid compared to Annie. You can avoid being lined up to be hit and it's a skilshot. Annie is just point and click.

If you can't see these differences, there is no hope for you.

Martyrofsand2 votes

Yes one is useable far more frequently, doesn't depend on flash due to higher range, and only gets better as the champions increases with level due to passive providing her with increased width.

Mean while the other remains static through-out the game has outside of very long flash CDs has an extremely limited range.

Yes I can clearly see the differences and it's very clear that Syndra's while harder to hit is significantly superior.

I Go Pew Pew Pew1 votes

Veigar

Blåbæret1 votes

I love it when this guy says "learn how to play against her, build MR" then continues with a post that basically says nothing while being a big wall of text.

THERE IS NO LEARN HOW TO PLAY AGAINST ANNIE. You will get oneshot with her flash ult even if you have abyssal. Your entire team needs to build at the very least 2x MR items EACH to even remotely stand a chance of surviving. At that point you've already sacrificed your best stats so it's a win-win for Annie.

Annie is 100% uncounterable and she can stay in lane forever with her Q mana return. Doesn't help that she's one of the top 5 easiest champs to play in this game.

Niyumi1 votes

She counters everything that isn't Galio or Garen built full MR. There is no reason for her to be so absurdly strong, but she now has the most expensive skin in the game, along with Vayne, and therefor has to be broken in order to be lucrative in a shitty F2P cash grab.

Low skill floor / ceiling, no counterplay, targeted, mana refund for CSing, all that... yet some of the highest damage in the game, and a game-changing ult. Does that sound fair?

Hige1 votes

I don't think Annie is that oppresive, but her ult is seriously fast. Think of it like this, Cass has the exact same ult as Annie, BUT if you turn around you outplay the stun and she's left with a measly slow, now I'm not saying that annie needs a turn mechanic but Cass has something Annie doesn't even if you can actually outplay her ult, she has a casting time!

I don't think anyone is asking for a Leona's ult type of Tibbers, I personally would like to see an Annie's ult with a casting animation, no target indicator, but she should at least throw her teddy bear instead of insta spawning tibbers as it was shown during the cinematic, for gameplay sake though, I'd think that this casting time shouldn't affect her movements (Think Syndra), so that you can throw the teddy bear while walking. This MISSILE should be pretty fast (Think ZAC), maybe she could throw the bear in the air and then it ignites and rockets towards the ground almost instantly.

It fits thematically and works to lower her frustration points, IMHO.

Slack King1 votes

{quoted}

I am sick and tired of seeing so many posts the last couple days asking for Annie's stun changes or the complete removal of it. Good Lord people, she's a burst mage that's centered all about her stun, they will not remove it. She's supposed to burst squishies quickly, and some of those squishies are assassins. Mains of Yasuo and the like- this is for you. She is the counter to mobility. If you pick a champ like that and a person counters you with her, don't get mad that she's beating you because you picked a champ she abuses.

In response to people who ask for her stacks to fall off, Beluge Whale answered this on her MYMU direction post. This answer also applies to having her stacks fall off completely after not using it:

"This is a neat idea, but it has a few issues:

  • Most other champions with their Ultimates ready already put out the pressure that they could use it at any time
  • This would make roaming or hiding in ambush with Annie a matter of spamming abilities constantly unless the decay time was trivial and it would just get reset in the lane pressure situation."

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/3IXxdZwi-mid-year-mage-updates-annie-direction?show=rundown

To people who want a delay on her ult drop:

"Things we especially like:

  • The flash bear drop. Annie’s bread-and-butter burst combo is a threatening affair that’s more about skirting the edges of Annie’s range than dodging a skillshot. While League benefits a lot from the potential to outplay most abilities in the game, having Champions with reliable abilities is also good for the game as long as they don’t make less-reliable champions obsolete."

AND

"The delay on Tibber's spawn is so short that we don't believe it falls within the window of "dodge this ability". If you predict it and jump out of the way, that's great! But a pre-indicator could send the wrong message of "we expect you to be able to get out of this".

For people who hate her flash ult plays:

"You mean to say that her ability to reliably catch out enemies means she won't be viable outside of solo queue, then this is wrong because a reliable catcher actually has incredible value - especially in coordinated/pro play where players can and will outplay any ability that it is possible to outplay. Reliable output actually has really high value.

This is not to say we are celebrating over the idea of Annie one-shotting you on Flash's cooldown - even small increases in Tibber's persistent power come at costs to upfront burst. Rather this is a defense of her ability to reliable engage on opponents who stray too close to her. Flash is inevitably a natural extension of that threat. Compared to similar in-class champions like Lux/Syndra (or Zyra/Brand/Velkoz for damage support threats) who can cc and delete you from 1000 units away without Flash, the fact that Annie's catch is not dodgeable is what allows her to function while being shorter ranged (not to mention having poor wave-clear when pressured). If Flash allows her to cheat this occasionally, well Flash allows a lot of people to bypass weaknesses built into their kits."

Annie is a squishy, binary, low mobility champion. You know what she's going to do all the time and you have windows to avoid it or to capitalize a kill on her. Honestly, Fizz, Zed, Ekko, Yi, other champions are more OP than her and more frustrating. People, I ask you, **please **stop asking Riot to change her- they won't listen or do anything. They have no plans to affect her stun or her ult.

Just learn to play against her, build MR, use long range champions that can counter her (Zyra gives me a hard time, and so can Lux or Morg), bait out her stun and kill her then. Also, play safely too.

**All quotes taken from her MYMU post. **

I hope to see the amounts of Annie QQ posts drop, but probably won't be the case. I just hope some of you read this and actually learn something. Annie is not that big of a deal, people, honestly.

The issue is, she is a counter to mobility. So if youre a champion without mobility youre a joke to her.she stuns you die. GG. High Mobility? She stuns you die. Let alone she is deceptively bulky

More from Gameplay

More by SnugglePuggle94