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A suggested nerf for Veigar, because obviously Riot and the community want it

Lafouboy··56 votes·4,766 views

Make his Q have 100 range and take 5 seconds to reach that range, make his W do 10/20/30/40/50 (.1 AP) magic damage and increase the time it takes to come down to a flat 5 seconds AT CAST (because we want that AMAZING BUFF you did to stick around), make his E not stun the enemy but just tickle them uncomfortably when they pass through it, and remove his ultimate and replace it with an ability that damages himself based on how much AP he's bought.

If you're gonna cripple the little guy, do it all at once. We Veigar mains have seen him suffer enough throughout the seasons, we don't want to watch him have to go through the "balance changes" you tend to do to all FOTM champs that the Bronzies start crying "OP!" to; it'd be like watching a little black kitten being given something it loves (and a bit of kindness) after being abused for so long only to then take that thing away, destroy it in front of it, then beat it with a bat (a NERF bat). Please just end his suffering all at once, we can't stand to watch the cruelty, brought about by low ELO retards, that will obviously unfold.

In essence, don't Kha'Zix/Cassiopeia the little fucker. Just pull the plug immediately so we Veigar mains don't have to watch our favorite champion suffer again.

http://i.imgur.com/fyhZmtS.jpg

43 Comments

A Superb Villain21 votes

http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130321004015/finalfantasy/images/thumb/c/c0/FFIX_Sorrow.jpg/500px-FFIX_Sorrow.jpg

Melledoneus2 votes

I think they should just rework him into an AD bruiser with AP scalings. His ultimate should not deal magic damage but should empower auto attacks to deal 20 (+100% AD) % HP true damage per auto.

I feel this will promote counterplay.

A Superb Villain1 votes

https://media.giphy.com/media/POql6zsXZbmcE/giphy.gif

;)

Melledoneus2 votes

https://media.giphy.com/media/jeXiz1RAvzX44/giphy.gif

Dolina18 votes

I got a better nerf...make him shorter...

Athenes Lulu14 votes

All because the pros touched him.

It's quite a nasty stain, I say.

Sooko5 votes

Meh. When they touched him for the first time, as a support, Riot brought him down to 38% win-rate. As soon as I saw Veigar in LCS (now that he is even stronger than before) I immediately figured it would happen again in no time.

Unlucky Number711 votes

oh my god. people are actually complaining about his e and it's "zone control." old grandpa voice In my day the good veigar didn't bother with whatchamacall it "zone control." It was either you were in range to be stunned or you weren't, and if you were stunned well viegar can dish out the hardest cc of all. It's called death for . but that was nothing In my day in order to get a below 130 ping you had to sacrifice 3 chickens to the verizon gods begging for forgiveness. these days they ask for four. I blame obama.

Squidblimp6 votes

Hi there, Veigar main here. I kind of understand the nerfs on the PBE. When they made him gain AP on his assists, his AP rockets up MUCH faster. The ratio and base damage nerfs on his W are to reduce that a little bit, while keeping the one-shot power on his ultimate.

HOWEVER! I do think the nerfs are a bit too much. I think they tuned the numbers a bit too low. I think they should take it slower.

BeMyFriendPlease4 votes

{quoted}

Hi there, Veigar main here. I kind of understand the nerfs on the PBE. When they made him gain AP on his assists, his AP rockets up MUCH faster. The ratio and base damage nerfs on his W are to reduce that a little bit, while keeping the one-shot power on his ultimate.

HOWEVER! I do think the nerfs are a bit too much. I think they tuned the numbers a bit too low. I think they should take it slower.

So the extra 10-40 ap he gets on average a game from assists until the very end of the game matter so very much he needed to be nerfed?

Good God.

Squidblimp3 votes

Well I don't know about you, but generally I get about 30 kill participation on Veigar in an average game where I do well. Generally that's like, 12 kills and 18 assists lets say (and you get assists just by trapping someone INSIDE your cage, you don't even need to stun them or do damage to get an assist!)

So, originally you'd get AP from those 12 kills, which is 60 additional AP. If you include assists, that's a total of 150 additional AP, just from killing champions, which is 110 AP more than before.

That's more than any item in the game can give you, unless you get Seraph's Embrace and then get a ton of mana.

If you include that fact that his W and his Ult have 100% AP scaling ratios, and his Q has a 60% AP scaling ratio, then that extra 110 AP that you didn't have before converts to 286 extra damage in your full burst combo.

Reazale1 votes

The ratio nerf that was on the PBE was way over the top and a hit to what Veigar is supposed to be, the new nerfs on the pbe are "better" as it hits his base dmg only on W and Q.

Squidblimp1 votes

Yeah, I just saw that. I think I'm happy with just base damage changes. Veigar's W is hard enough to hit as it is, so it should give a significant reward.

BeMyFriendPlease1 votes

{quoted}

Well I don't know about you, but generally I get about 30 kill participation on Veigar in an average game where I do well. Generally that's like, 12 kills and 18 assists lets say (and you get assists just by trapping someone INSIDE your cage, you don't even need to stun them or do damage to get an assist!)

So, originally you'd get AP from those 12 kills, which is 60 additional AP. If you include assists, that's a total of 150 additional AP, just from killing champions, which is 110 AP more than before.

That's more than any item in the game can give you, unless you get Seraph's Embrace and then get a ton of mana.

If you include that fact that his W and his Ult have 100% AP scaling ratios, and his Q has a 60% AP scaling ratio, then that extra 110 AP that you didn't have before converts to 286 extra damage in your full burst combo.

Any game getting you involved in that many kills should never count for balance, period. That's almost co op vs ai level kills or the game NEEDS to be 50+ minutes.

Poske1 votes

{quoted}

So the extra 10-40 ap he gets on average a game from assists until the very end of the game matter so very much he needed to be nerfed?

Good God.

So you never had more then 8 assists on veigar o.o?

My Waifu Vanilla2 votes

The nerfs are there to keep the one shot on his ult....and not his Q+W which WILL kill squishies currently after like 30 minutes. Him simply being in the game right now makes ADCs have to go 3rd item banshees as well as half the team because he will kill them. He honestly only needs his ult to burst tanks later on since anyone else will die or be kicked out of the fight from his 700+ AP 1.6 ratio Q+W which also has a 580 total base.

Saianna2 votes

Teemo lost 0.3 ap ratio on ultimate for "reasons" (most likely compensation buff) just like that. There wasn't even tryouts "what would happen if we just removed 0.1 ap ratio for now"

They just gone:

  • we gotta nerf Teemo... Johnson gimme number!
  • 3!
  • Tomass, u were good with math in school, divide 3 by my IQ
  • 0,3!
  • Ok prepare patch notes, we doing dis shit Yo!

Reason why am i writing this is:

  1. This nerf won't solve anything
  2. Riot didn't think what was problematic about Veigar
  3. Veigar will be nerfed again
  4. and again
  5. and again..
Squidblimp2 votes

They reverted the nerf, and instead nerfed the BASE damages on Q and W instead of AP ratios. I prefer this.

Decrit5 votes

This is how evil geniuses are born

Penns5 votes

Veigar main crying because his broken champ gets "nerfed" a bit? lelelell

Also its not just "low elo retards" or "bronzies" that complain about Veigar, high elo players do as well. In fact, high elo players started it.

Teklm4 votes

What the hell was the point of this thread? So far the only Veigar nerfs I can find are:

  1. Dark Matter (W) damage reduced to 100/150/200/250/300 from 120/170/220/270/320
  2. Dark Matter (W) AP Ratio reduced to 0.8 from 1 Which is notable, sure, but it doesn't change that Veigar has immense burst and his great zoning from Event Horizon. Besides, plenty of high level players have voiced their concerns about Veigar being too strong right now and leaving a champion in that state (ignoring the fact that Riot has definitely gone too far with nerfs before) is silly. Let's wait and see what happens next before jumping to conclusions.
Lafouboy3 votes

Face it, they're gonna nerf him into the ground. They're going to Akali/Kha'Zix/Cassiopeia/Kassadin (with his Riftlimp) him. History has shown that if a champion is strong and the community complains about it then Riot overnerfs them to compensate. The problem is that Veigar is not overpowered; there are many ways to counter him. He is flavor of the month. There's no arguing that he is powerful at the moment, but not so powerful that he needs lots of nerfs. They are going to overnerf him, which will send him back to a state of utter mediocrity. They will either do it at a medium pace or they will do it very slowly. Either way, history has shown that the most likely course of "balance" Riot will take is over nerfing Veigar, sending him back into the "never picked for a good reason" zone.

This may seem like a little nerf, but it really isn't. It's about a 220 dmg nerf for Veigar's late game considering he will likely have around 1k AP; which is an AOE nerf, meaning it can potentially be a bigger damage nerf if his W would hit more than 1 person. The worst part is, this is not even going to stop him from being a popular pick, meaning that people will keep complaining about him until he is completely killed (or another "OMG SO OP" pick takes his place on the "RIOT NERF OMG SO STUPID! THIS CHAMP IS THE REASON I AM STUCK IN MY DIVISION!!!!!"), meaning that Riot will keep nerfing him until that happens. He's gonna go through some tough times, eventually becoming around the low 40's winrate again (if not worse than that). Yet again, history has shown this to be true and this will not change for Veigar.

In essence, Veigar is gonna get killed by Riot and the bitchy community. When it happens, I am going to start another thread and quote this exact post of mine to tell you all that I was correct.. that I am ALWAYS CORRECT (seriously, look at my posts. I have predicted throughout the seasons so many things, such as Support Fiddle being OP, Tanky jungle Yi with Titanic Hydra becoming a thing, I predicted Veigar's E would be able to stop dashes the day before it was announced, that Teemo would be able to throw his shrooms in a future update, and so many more things; I EVEN PREDICTED THAT A BUFF TO VEIGAR WOULD MAKE HIM PICK/BAN JUST A FEW MONTHS BACK). This is happening. Veigar's time to die is upon us soon enough.

lB2kGRlc8y2 votes

Veigar was NEVER overpowered. He has always thrived on noobish mistakes and always maintained a balanced play and win rate, but every goddamn time he got featured in LCS, a giant bronze monolith amasses to feed tears into riot's ears in appeal of him being dumpstered.

Lafouboy2 votes

Agreed. That's pretty much what I'm saying. He's powerful right now, but not overpowered. Because I am a Veigar main myself, I have been dumping on the tons of Veigars that have been showing up in games. How? Because I do what none of my other teammates (or anyone else seems to want to) do and buy a Banshee's Veil, Merc Treads, and/or Mercurial Scimitar. Wahla, you just countered Veigar through items alone.

Battlecast Sona1 votes

That word is "Voila!" which I know is kind of counterintuitive. (other languages man)

Honestly the W nerf is better than an R nerf, though. his W at rank 5 is basically another rank 2 ultimate, so tuning the damage a bit is really not the end of the world - it's still gonna chunk, just not as hard as early, which is fine. This nerf is better than removing stuff on his ult, because I think his ultimate is fine where it is (though people wanna complain) - this is something that doesn't REALLY hurt Veigar's seige/push/waveclear/etc but does reduce his ability to burst tanky targets as easily (since a squishy target is still gonna die to Q>R or Q>W>R, even with the damage changes).

lB2kGRlc8y2 votes

No veigar main is worried that the W nerf will break him, they're worried that Riot will take the shit too far like they did in 5.4 and completely ruin him again. Since he's designed to stomp noobs, noobs will always have a problem with him.

Curling Veigar3 votes

never forget s4 veigar

lB2kGRlc8y3 votes

Yes, wood division's most perceptive minds saw that the Veigar that had been forsaken by the LCS gods after his fall from grace had suddenly clawed his way out of the hell that their incredible ineptitude put him in and thought they'd lose the ability to stargaze mid match without punishment. His numbers were increased and a bit of reliability was added but that's not what they bitch about, its his "god mode" E that takes a half second to form and a hundredth of that time to sidestep which wasn't even touched. You know how before he was gutted in 5.4 his E was lackluster in terms of zone control since every one and their crippled grandmother could dash through it? They called for the utility shift and now they're bitching about it once again.

Borbland3 votes

Yeah, sheeps are sheeps.

Just like Lux got nerfed in early S3 after some pro spotligh when they still existed and still could be seen in the launcher. Everyone was like "Too muh damage" and she got nerfed and never seen again. She only started being playd again after the recent buffs and everyone "OMAGAWD too much damage qq" while she havent got a damage change, only a mana cost reduction on Q and, oh i forgot, the damage on the 2nd target you hit is doubled compared to before. Like you hit 2 champions in a row ever time you throw a Q....

Another exmaple, season 4 with Ziggs . I am personnaly a big Ziggs player since season 3, and I got trashtalked alot for picking Ziggs. He got some little buffs, mostly CD reductions on his W in season 4, some pro player picked him "OMG Ziggs lane bully cant do anything qq". Well, dodge the Q's would've been a great option. Then they nerfed his ult cooldown by alot in later ranks, and completly broke his Q's hitbox. I dont play him anymore cause I often miss Q's that would've hitted before, and I cant stand that bs hitbox, when the bomb sometimes jump over something instead of hitting something, cause its hitbox is so small. And ofc, Ziggs was never seen again till this day, even after fairly strong Q mana cost reduction buffs.

And now Veigar, considered prue trash after his rework. As a skillshot mages mid main, I tried him, cause he more skillshots then before. I quite played him a bit befor, but I found him fairly boring to play. After the rework, he was alot more amusing, fairly underpowered but truly viable. I wrote a topic directly after the rework claming Veigar still is good champ, and you can hit E if you play correctly, but no, the community decided to whine instead of actually trying the champ.

Some buffs later, Veigar still not played at all, one small buff afterwards, still no one playing him. Some days after the patch, some pro played him, carried with him, and suddenly he becomes broken and blame the latest patch.

I mean, if Veigar had no counterplay, I could understand, like LB was forgotten for long but became popular after pros playing her, she was still broken cause of her kit that clearly lacked (and still lacks) couterplay. Sometimes, some broken champs arent just meta but if those were to rise, they would get alot of (this time right) QQ. Swain comes in mind.

But Veigar, come on, not only you can counter him by dodging his skillshots, you can punish him extremly hard by buying QSS. You can buy it fairly easy without risks, since Veigars early isnt good, so you have plenty of time getting gold to counteritemize against him.

If that's not enough, you can counter him by buying tenactiy, MR, or going for utility mage items with low AP (Going for exmaple for haunting guise instead of needlessly large rod).

"Its same with Zed, just get Zhonya and he's done". How many times people just said that to people that were complaining about Zed when they clamed he was an unfair oppenent (which he is) ? "But omg, you said I need to get an item to counter Veigar and that hes not broken because of that, but Zed is broken when you get Zhonya QQ ?"

Yes, because first, Zhonya cost about 2.5 times the cost of QSS, secondly, Zed is strong in early, he can tear you apart beore you get your Zhonya, and while you get it, too late, he be feasting on bot lane.

Veigar isnt much of a thread before 6, because his poke is meh before that, and he'll probably farm with his Q instead of poking with it (By a side note, a poke that can be easily dodged)

Phew long post here, hope people finally realise what really a broken champ is and what not.

Lafouboy2 votes

This. 1,000,000 times, this.

Spicy Rice2 votes

Rito pls

Poppyrus2 votes

Veigar is barely a useful champion now that they fucked his stun.

Ackelope1 votes

his stun is still just as good at zoning as it was, and also pretty damn easy to land. An instantaneous, easy to hit AoE stun is a little too strong in my opinion.

Smitty Manjensen2 votes

Actually playing him for a while I could see why they would nerf him, he has a pretty safe laning now cause of q, basically I don't need to be in range of the enemy to farm, if I get blue then I can farm without worries, right now they reverted his w ratio nerf but they nerfed the q base damage by 30 which is reasonable if you ask me.

Saianna2 votes

I honestly though this gonna be next "i know better than rest of players, nerf veigar now!" thread.

I am happy to be wrong :)

Mitsu1 votes

Or just make his ult less point click mkay

nealgoogs1 votes

you can keep the one shot ability but please do something about that stun circle that zones the fuck out of everything

RawChickenInc1 votes

Veigar will always be the true final boss for me whatever may happen next I shall always remember and play him! Veigar mains unite!

euJHINius1 votes
  • Build Magic Resist to counter burst (abyssal, merc, banshees, hex)
  • Freeze wave at Turret so he can't farm well
  • Have a Jungler like Elise to camp a bit (it works so well)
  • Deny him farm (poke or trade)
  • Bait his stun
  • Good Veigars know to just farm at turret. New or Bad ones will try to kill you, but its so obvious when they do (try to stun you) like an Annie with no flash
  • Zhonyas to counter ult (if stunned then ;-;)
  • Don't be close too much in fights, stay in back line if Carry
  • Profit

If he fails laning phase, he is irrelevant. He didn't get enough AP from farming to have high burst. His ult does draw power from the target's AP, but not reliable for him to one shot with if he is already behind.

Miraweave1 votes

It seems like it's the "low elo retards" who are defending him.

Every high elo player I've talked to who doesn't main him understands the fact that he's way too strong right now.

Evewynn1 votes

When I saw veig get played in pro play I knew this was going to happen..Sigh.

But in reality, I think a reasonable nerf would be to set his Q champion AP gain to a flat 2, as opposed to scaling with level. This way super fed yolo-queuers aren't as rewarded for pub-stomping and he is virtually unchanged in higher level play where deaths are less common for the majority of the game.

BoiBoi1 votes

Veigar isn't anything, he's not even scary anyone who says that is a baby that can't counter play against him. The game is balanced stop crying over it.

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