No wonder why I never see AD fighters top lane anymore

FalconPawwwwnch·Dec 30, 2014·23 votes·2,423 views

Doesn't matter how fed you are, a 0 cs Janna is more useful than you later since she makes you completely useless

37 Comments

TheRainInSpainDec 30, 20146 votes

Janna is a one trick pony. She is built for one thing, and that is to deny wombo combo teams from womboing your team. Her shield and slow are there to again, keep you away. However, Janna isn't built to defend well against siege/poke teams, and teams that can snipe specific people (pick teams) can get in between her cooldowns and escape. Wombo combo teams are typically built with bruisers and mages that have large, usually team wide ults (five man Lissandra ults, etc).

But, if you decide to use a poke team or protect team, your bruisers have a place and Janna is then the useless one. Janna isn't designed to engage ONTO poke and protect teams, and that is precisely what you need to do to defeat them. For a protect team, you will need a snipe on the designated carry, though, before jumping on top of three to four bruisers.

BrutalCabbageDec 30, 20142 votes

{quoted}

Janna is a one trick pony. She is built for one thing, and that is to deny wombo combo teams from womboing your team. Her shield and slow are there to again, keep you away. However, Janna isn't built to defend well against siege/poke teams, and teams that can snipe specific people (pick teams) can get in between her cooldowns and escape. Wombo combo teams are typically built with bruisers and mages that have large, usually team wide ults (five man Lissandra ults, etc).

But, if you decide to use a poke team or protect team, your bruisers have a place and Janna is then the useless one. Janna isn't designed to engage ONTO poke and protect teams, and that is precisely what you need to do to defeat them. For a protect team, you will need a snipe on the designated carry, though, before jumping on top of three to four bruisers.

Janna is not a one trick pony, she is an annoying wind lady with one purpose any many ways to fulfill it: that is disengaging and her whole kit revolves around it. I agree she's actually weak against poke and siege (even though she can counter siege decently with the tower shield), she wrecks both mobile and immobile melees regardless of the team comp unless you have some form or re-engage. With a Janna on the other team, melees simply can't go in and effectively renders them pretty much full-time peelers. If your ADC is behind you are done for.

VDc0zCqe0wDec 30, 20144 votes

so you're saying a support that can only disengage...is good at doing so

play Rumble or Liss solotop instead of a bruiser, and she's not broken aymore

contrary to popular belief, Lissandra hard counters Janna in every single way

SeargentAnusDec 30, 20145 votes

This is because Janna is overloaded, and everyone seems to ignore it :/

IronChefBoyardeeDec 30, 20144 votes

How is Janna overloaded?

VDc0zCqe0wDec 30, 20146 votes

as long as Thresh exists, no other support has got an overloaded kit

delete Thresh from this game then i'll be fine with Janna nerfs

TarynDec 30, 20143 votes

I'll drink to that! Hate Thresh, and Blitz for that matter. Delete both please and thanks.

Rock RockburghDec 31, 20141 votes

Since people are complaining about hooks, I figure I may as well link this.

http://dota2.gamepedia.com/Pudge

For people who don't want to sully their browser history with a Dota site: Blitz hook, new Sion passive (though only on kill/assist), self-center AOE, 3-second channeled CC with significant damage. (Can be stacked with aforementioned AOE, since that's toggle.) Also, that AOE? It hurts him and is one of the only abilities in the game that allows you to deny heroes-- in this case, yourself. (Though now a Bloodstone serves the same purpose.)

He's like an AD Blitz, but stronger. There was a time when he was one of the best mid picks in high-level play.

Some highlights: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-LsdV7BgL0

Rinky DinkyDec 30, 20143 votes

Janna is overloaded? Ah man i just laughed so hard I shed a tear.

AbyssphereDec 30, 20145 votes

Well of course champs who have a hard time engaging have a hard time engaging on a champ based around disengage. May as well talk about how ranged mages are invalidated by Leona because you can't keep her at 800 range.

I really don't understand how this is a thread. There are a million mages who won't let melee champs engage on them. Syndra will scatter and delete you, Cassiopeia will turn you to stone, Azir will push you back and dash away, etc. Difference between Janna and them? Mages do damage.

I think Janna is arguably a bit too good but this is far from the reason.

VDc0zCqe0wDec 30, 20142 votes

people are butthurt that one champion can counter a class of champions so they whine about that instead of picking according to their opponents picks

Zyra does the same thing with a little less disengage and more damage, but since Zyra is not spammed they don't hate

all of this while Thresh still being the huge piece of dog shit since the release; i won't take anyone asking for Janna nerfs seriously if they don't ask for Thresh nerfs in the same time

AbyssphereDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

people are butthurt that one champion can counter a class of champions so they whine about that instead of picking according to their opponents picks

Zyra does the same thing with a little less disengage and more damage, but since Zyra is not spammed they don't hate

all of this while Thresh still being the huge piece of dog shit since the release; i won't take anyone asking for Janna nerfs seriously if they don't ask for Thresh nerfs in the same time

The thing is that it's not one champion. Mages in general excell against melee. Comparing other supports: Nami will bubble you, kite you easily thanks to E + passive, poke you while healing herself and if all else fails use her ult to knock you up. A Nami that doesn't want you to get close won't let you any closer than Janna. Sona has E and her E Power Chord while poking and sustaining thanks to her other skills, etc. By the time you get to Sona you're half health. And again she has her panic button just like Janna: Crescendo.

Mages and mage supports as a class counter melee. Janna is better than the rest because of her MS steroids but she's not unique. Most mages say no to melee interaction unless that melee has a variety of gapclosers.

VDc0zCqe0wDec 31, 20141 votes

Sona is utter shit at peeling TBH, Nami is pretty good, so are Zyra and Lulu

people hate on Janna cuz it's the FOTM

Agent2090Dec 30, 20144 votes

Melee fighters that don't have great mobility or gap closers (looking at you Riven ) seem to have been push out of laning completely now. The jungle is really the only place for them where they don't have an insanely hard time. Wonder how long that'll last...

acepil0tDec 30, 20141 votes

Lack of mobility eh? You ever been chased by riven through the whole lane?

CaeziumDec 31, 20141 votes

I think he was saying she is an exception. As in... Other melee fighters have less mobility than her.

TerminatusOmegaDec 30, 20144 votes

playing darius into gnar is frustrating... to say the least.

JunkοDec 30, 20142 votes

Any melee top that doesn't have more than 1 gapcloser into Gnar is frustrating.

NarasimhaDec 30, 20141 votes

Hey, its the Gnar's fault for getting countered, just hammer him to pieces.

DiostukosDec 30, 20143 votes

This just in; Janna is a good disengage champion, more at 11.

I love how people are saying Janna's kit is overloaded when things like Thresh are still walking around.

Silents429Dec 30, 20142 votes

Odd. Still do Garen, Gangplank, and Trundle top lane and haven't felt useless.

Rinky DinkyDec 30, 20141 votes

I believe.

Go get em mayne.

Spin it to win it.

ZeroAnarchyDec 30, 20142 votes

Remember when Janna was considered a bad support? lol

ImHerVoiceDec 31, 20142 votes

Unless you're like me and play janna top and you heal your whole team :^) muh deathcap

TalamareDec 30, 20141 votes

What is an AD Fighter?

FalconPawwwwnchDec 30, 20143 votes

Darius, Garen, Udyr, Trundle, Jax, Shyvana, Tryndamere

I say "fighter" loosely, basically meant melee autoattacker

TalamareDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

Darius, Garen, Udyr, Trundle, Jax, Shyvana, Tryndamere

I say "fighter" loosely, basically meant melee autoattacker

I agree that most melee auto attackers have it difficult to CC Regardless if its Janna or Alistar or Thresh

... or even Vayne, Caitlyn, Tristana...

VettahnDec 30, 20141 votes

pretty sure he meant this as a joke, since most ad fighters are falling out of favor

DefenderOfFaithDec 30, 20141 votes

Well a lot of your tanks have moved to the jungle (hello Amumu, Jarvan, Nautilus, Rammus, et. al) and the meta seems to open up more interesting top lanes, as like your mid lanes. We see top marksman, mages, and all sorts of wacky stuff.

This is just my opinion of course. Even at the pro level you'll see a top Lulu (TSM vs. SSW) or something unique.

I still like AD champs on a team simply because they can wreck turrets fast and I'm all about getting it done at the Nexus, but beyond that their AP counterparts especially as team fighters are just as good if not more scary.

I really don't like Aatrox, but because he has a poke, he can do the top thing and he's AD and you can transistion him into a siege comp. I haven't seen a Trundle up there in quite awhile.

LordOfTheLeagueDec 30, 20141 votes

Do you mean any melee is useless against janna or only melees that come from top lane ?

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

janna is ridiculous

tons of free stats just for existing and she completely denies anyone if they have somewhat high cooldown on their mobility. even as riven with flash i have trouble killing people when janna is around... you dash in to combo, bam Q to the face and tailwind away. you flash in and stun, bam ult and you're at max range again. now you have to run away because you burned everything trying to gap close and you got poked to hell in the process.

VDc0zCqe0wDec 30, 20141 votes

you sound like Leona and Thresh mains when the trend was the "morgana hate", Thresh mains who would bitch about Morgana being able to counter them

don't play AD bruisers since Janna is made to counter them, not when she is picked at least

Rumble, Liss, Nida (AP), Kayle screw her, and i listed only meta-picks, not to count bottom lane counters

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

you sound like Leona and Thresh mains when the trend was the "morgana hate", Thresh mains who would bitch about Morgana being able to counter them

don't play AD bruisers since Janna is made to counter them, not when she is picked at least

Rumble, Liss, Nida (AP), Kayle screw her, and i listed only meta-picks, not to count bottom lane counters

except leona and thresh are 2 champions... while melee champions constitute half of the roster.

VDc0zCqe0wDec 30, 20141 votes

2 champions of the class with the least amount of champions

Zyra, Karma, Lulu, Sona, Annie, Nami all counter Janna, i gave you a few picks to deal with Janna from top lane, without even counting off-meta

there are not only melee champions in this game

MindspeakerDec 30, 20141 votes

jinx cait ashe mf are all ad and alot of fun to play top lane especially against mele lol

Linna ExcelDec 30, 20141 votes

Some supports don't need much gold to be useful, as long as they have levels. Also, buy move speed items and learn to dodge her tornados. Try baiting out her Q. She's designed specifically to peel melee champs so you are going to have to rely on your teammates to deal with her.

It's a team game learn your roles and weaknesses and let your allies pick up where you need them to.